EPT[M][N] A Mini With Funny Gifs - Page 72
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sicklucker
Canada16987 Posts
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sicklucker
Canada16987 Posts
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sicklucker
Canada16987 Posts
Either way its really not something a mafia does ever. Then again I try not to read shapelogs posts so thats really all im reading him off of | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
But... Shapelog actually dropped a post telling us about the delays. Shapelog had not yet a chance to defend himself. I want to see his defense. And he will have to will all the shit thrown at him. Why waste an day waiting for this? Like I go through various scenarios in my mind and I don't see how this train is helping town right now. 1) Shapelog is scum 1a) He gets lynched in the in end, either because lack of defense, sucky defense or whatever. Easy game. Okay, This is the dream scenario. In this case nothing was done wrong here. 1b) He comes back, defends himself convincingly, now we look for an alternative. As we were fooled by shapelog we most likely get a mislynch here if he deflects it right. - this could be entirely avoided, if we do the scum hunting for his mate before he comes back. Also losing time is certainly bad. 2) Shapelog is town 2a) gets lynched anyway. Again, a dream scenario. Just not for town. We basically circlejerk 48 hours on shlog, then get a mislynch and suddenly the game is really damn wide open 2b) he finally shows up, makes a convincig defense, we move off him. Still... time is lost. My point is: Even if shapelog is scum. There is another scum too. If shapelog comes back, his defense sucks, LYNCH HIM. Don't hesitate a second then. But don't sit here, waiting and praying/assuming the easiest case (1a), which is probably an autowin. This idling around does not even commit his mate to anything. His mate will not magically pop up and be like "HEY GUYS; SHAPELOG CONFIRMED TOWN" Hell, even in scenario one, shapelogs mate profits from this shit. Scum shows when they have to commit. If we autopilot a shapelog kill... Nothing will come from it. So stop being lazy and play. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
On December 02 2016 07:45 Tictock wrote: Shit Koshi you played too well and got yourself shot. Not the worst thing ever though as we seem to have a pretty good handle on this game without extra blue info. This is a post I simply don't like. This does not instantly make TT cuz, but it spreading a mindset I simply have troubles with. You don't lose your cop, tell him he played too well, but no worries, easy win and then turns into idle mode with the Shlog train. | ||
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LightningStrike
United States14276 Posts
On December 02 2016 09:25 mahrgell wrote: First of all. I already said, that the first link for my is ust policy lynch territory. The second one is really not. Like I have no clue how the TL mafia meta goes. But hailing players as such great mafia players, when this seems to be entirely based on them establishing such a bullshit meta and not ever being questioned y anyone else out of some weird kind of respect for it seems fucking weird. Now to the rest: I am not disagreeing with the part that his reads were kinda fluent. Hell, his "advice" to me regarding how to improve my play was actually good. But the point is, that every semi competent player should be able to do fluent reads when he singles out only 2 or 3 people out of 13. Other players(town and scum) make weird stuff. ump on those and score your points. Where scum really trips is when they have to deal those players who are more difficult. When they have to commit to interpretations etc. Again, you tell me this is his meta. If it is, great, then his play is not scum indicative. But it still has to be questioned. Next you say he is not hiding behind it? Really? Are we even in the same game? I'm not in the mood to filter dive right now, but from memory I know that when he was on me, I asked several questions regarding other players, wanted reads on anyone but me, he refused, saying that he is all on me, and doesnt care about anyone els,e because at work. He later came back, and didn't bother one bit to look a bit broader. Later on, he replaced me with you, now all he did was going after you. Again, there were several instances were he actively said that he is not willing to dive other filters and refused to answer questions. Really? He is not hiding behind this bullshit meta you are so willing to accept? Now look at his defenses. Not sure in what world he is living, but nope. Simply nope. His entire acitivity was on a handful players. If we do not udge acitvity by post count (Onegu would also do really well in that category) but how much of the game the person covered, than HF is in deep shit territory. Next post. Oh, wasn't he just a second ago so certain how great his play was? Suddenly he is getting tunneled on players who scumread him. Sounds like absolutely great mafia play. And yes, I completely agree that sometimes giving each other breathing room is a great idea. But when someone tells you to stop this tone, then going in, escalating it further and then using this as a bargain chip to get your breathing room? Nope! And seemingly this is completely okay for everyone. Okay, not much time has passed. But somehow I feel people are again gonna accept this. He did the same D1 and everybody was fine with it. Today I won't. If this is really all he has to bring, he should die. Like until now I tried to pay respect to what people told me about the meta on TL and in forum mafia in general. But this case I really can not do that, because it reminds me of last game. You were in there. I called out Foreman for exactly the same shit on D1. That he was scum in this case can be called noobs luck on my part. But anyway. I felt my case was reasonable. But then everybody jumped me. "But Mahrgell, him not answering your questions and giving you a finger, this could be part of his character and meta. This is really nothing." And Foreman grinned happily and didn't answer "But Mahrgell, him not caring about large parts of the game and publicly celebrating this arrogant and ignorant attitude, this could be really part of his meta, dont blame him for that" and again Foreman grinned happily and continued. Foreman then went MIA though, so the problem resolved itself. Like I had seen a comparison with Foreman earlier this game. Not sure who it was (CM8?). But really. If there is any Foreman equivalent in this game, it is HF. And people are completely willing to let this happen and it fucking annoys me. He loses nothing as town if he drops this ans finally starts answering and caring. But it makes his scum play pretty damn easy when everyone lets it go. And then I see people telling me "but keep HF alive for the first couple of days, lynch him later, he is a great contributor" Seriously, I was doing this with Koshi. But I have no fucking reason to do that with HF. I simply don't see great contributions. What has he actually done this game? Like if you compare the contributions of yourself(Rels), DF, Koshi, Emp to him... Is HF really the guy who can be called a leading contributor? My answer is no. TLDR: ##vote Holyflare We not lynching HF today unless for some reason something happens that make us lynch someone else. | ||
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LightningStrike
United States14276 Posts
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sicklucker
Canada16987 Posts
On December 01 2016 21:50 Koshi wrote: last time sl bussed somebody unnecessarily it was because that person attacked him. I would look up the game but it was too long ago. this is not remotely true. The only person i remember bussing was half the sky. And I get along with her very well and play dota with her quite often it was nothing personal. Hell I even resisted bussing Jat who at the time I legitimately hated lol. SO bussing is never personal with me. Also in that game I bussed hts so hard that I afked the rest of the game and no noe qeustioned my alignment except Jat. And like rels brought up that was probably the only time I ever bussed. I think I might have bussed once more in a game with rels very slighly but im pretty sure it was his idea and why he knows I hate bussing people this is probably the game were koshi thinks I was bussing someone I didnt like probably the third guy. As mafia I like to make up reasons to have my partners town because I think it makes other people in the game more likely to townread them. People are livestock and very sheepish with reads. So I could argue Im close to lock town after this mafia flip. and tbh I didnt think I would have to this is sad. I buried whats his face and no one even noticed not really fitting the bussing for cred scenario that I used in my bus of half the sky. I Was the first to vote him and I didnt even check the thread after. It was a straight up afk vote. Thats so bad if im mafia because lynches always change so why would I ever afk vote a partner. | ||
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sicklucker
Canada16987 Posts
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
On December 02 2016 07:49 Tictock wrote: I'm kinda assuming it's setup #3 with a flipped Framer and Cop. Maybe JK decided he had a better TR on someone else, also possibly got RB'd. And this is the second TT post I really don't like. Like to make this post, you have to be either completely passed out (it isn't that late in the US yet, is it?) or you are actively spewing, hoping for a townie to pick it up. First of all, there is no indication of this being setup #3. If he bothered looking at the setups, he should have seen this can be #1 or #3. And then, if he really thinks this is #3. What is he talking about JK being RBed? JK can't be RBed. There is no RB in #3. And there is no JK in #1. Now I know people love to townread for "oh... this slip... naaaahhh, scum would never ever do that, also they know the setup" And this is my issue with this post. This mentality is so common that "accidentally" spewing that is really damn easy. But maybe it is just me... But I can't imagine mytownieself, opening post#1, checking for which setup it is, and then make such a mistake. (okay, maybe I could, when being in the same shape as I was when I did my last filterdives... but not getting those vibes from TT) Combined with the previous thing... This makes me really rethink my judgement of TT. Like still, all his actions can be explained in a townie and a scummy way. So far I sided with his actions being more likely to be townie. But those 2 are imho more likely to come from scum. Brings him back to full neut at this point and pretty high up in my "should certainly check this guy again" priority list. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
CM8 and Shlog can not be scum together. This is simply ruled out. Unless you are saying that they both risked being mod killed for not posting the entire night after being warned for not voting, but somehow submitted a nightkill! There is at least one active scum around. And now if you apply this logic, this is actually making the Shlog train much weaker. Assume you give CM8 a chance of 30% to be scum. This means Shlog has maximum 70% if there is guaranteed to be one scum between those two. And there is still the chance neither is scum. If you now tell me SHLOG SCUM 100%... Okay. Then you have to really convince me why CM8 can't be scum. | ||
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LightningStrike
United States14276 Posts
On December 02 2016 09:48 sicklucker wrote: Ls you should do your little meta thing on me because I want to focus on the issues. I need to get some alternative lynch going What meta thing? The one I had a idea how I going to read in future games? | ||
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sicklucker
Canada16987 Posts
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LightningStrike
United States14276 Posts
On December 02 2016 09:54 mahrgell wrote: And one last thing I would like to remind people of: CM8 and Shlog can not be scum together. This is simply ruled out. Unless you are saying that they both risked being mod killed for not posting the entire night after being warned for not voting, but somehow submitted a nightkill! There is at least one active scum around. And now if you apply this logic, this is actually making the Shlog train much weaker. Assume you give CM8 a chance of 30% to be scum. This means Shlog has maximum 70% if there is guaranteed to be one scum between those two. And there is still the chance neither is scum. If you now tell me SHLOG SCUM 100%... Okay. Then you have to really convince me why CM8 can't be scum. That's a good point it means probably 1 active scum then. Forgot about that portion where nk must be submitted. Probably the last scum would be on the NU wagon. Will check stuff in a little bit. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
On December 02 2016 09:42 LightningStrike wrote: + Show Spoiler + On December 02 2016 09:25 mahrgell wrote: First of all. I already said, that the first link for my is ust policy lynch territory. The second one is really not. Like I have no clue how the TL mafia meta goes. But hailing players as such great mafia players, when this seems to be entirely based on them establishing such a bullshit meta and not ever being questioned y anyone else out of some weird kind of respect for it seems fucking weird. Now to the rest: I am not disagreeing with the part that his reads were kinda fluent. Hell, his "advice" to me regarding how to improve my play was actually good. But the point is, that every semi competent player should be able to do fluent reads when he singles out only 2 or 3 people out of 13. Other players(town and scum) make weird stuff. ump on those and score your points. Where scum really trips is when they have to deal those players who are more difficult. When they have to commit to interpretations etc. Again, you tell me this is his meta. If it is, great, then his play is not scum indicative. But it still has to be questioned. Next you say he is not hiding behind it? Really? Are we even in the same game? I'm not in the mood to filter dive right now, but from memory I know that when he was on me, I asked several questions regarding other players, wanted reads on anyone but me, he refused, saying that he is all on me, and doesnt care about anyone els,e because at work. He later came back, and didn't bother one bit to look a bit broader. Later on, he replaced me with you, now all he did was going after you. Again, there were several instances were he actively said that he is not willing to dive other filters and refused to answer questions. Really? He is not hiding behind this bullshit meta you are so willing to accept? Now look at his defenses. Not sure in what world he is living, but nope. Simply nope. His entire acitivity was on a handful players. If we do not udge acitvity by post count (Onegu would also do really well in that category) but how much of the game the person covered, than HF is in deep shit territory. Next post. Oh, wasn't he just a second ago so certain how great his play was? Suddenly he is getting tunneled on players who scumread him. Sounds like absolutely great mafia play. And yes, I completely agree that sometimes giving each other breathing room is a great idea. But when someone tells you to stop this tone, then going in, escalating it further and then using this as a bargain chip to get your breathing room? Nope! And seemingly this is completely okay for everyone. Okay, not much time has passed. But somehow I feel people are again gonna accept this. He did the same D1 and everybody was fine with it. Today I won't. If this is really all he has to bring, he should die. Like until now I tried to pay respect to what people told me about the meta on TL and in forum mafia in general. But this case I really can not do that, because it reminds me of last game. You were in there. I called out Foreman for exactly the same shit on D1. That he was scum in this case can be called noobs luck on my part. But anyway. I felt my case was reasonable. But then everybody jumped me. "But Mahrgell, him not answering your questions and giving you a finger, this could be part of his character and meta. This is really nothing." And Foreman grinned happily and didn't answer "But Mahrgell, him not caring about large parts of the game and publicly celebrating this arrogant and ignorant attitude, this could be really part of his meta, dont blame him for that" and again Foreman grinned happily and continued. Foreman then went MIA though, so the problem resolved itself. Like I had seen a comparison with Foreman earlier this game. Not sure who it was (CM8?). But really. If there is any Foreman equivalent in this game, it is HF. And people are completely willing to let this happen and it fucking annoys me. He loses nothing as town if he drops this ans finally starts answering and caring. But it makes his scum play pretty damn easy when everyone lets it go. And then I see people telling me "but keep HF alive for the first couple of days, lynch him later, he is a great contributor" Seriously, I was doing this with Koshi. But I have no fucking reason to do that with HF. I simply don't see great contributions. What has he actually done this game? Like if you compare the contributions of yourself(Rels), DF, Koshi, Emp to him... Is HF really the guy who can be called a leading contributor? My answer is no. TLDR: ##vote Holyflare We not lynching HF today unless for some reason something happens that make us lynch someone else. Who are we? Speak for yourself. I very willing to lynch HF for what he has shown so far and if he continues doing exactly that. I don't see the much fabled benefit of keeping him around until late. Sure, if shlogs defense sucks, kill him. But until then? HF it is for me. | ||
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sicklucker
Canada16987 Posts
On December 02 2016 09:54 LightningStrike wrote: What meta thing? The one I had a idea how I going to read in future games? well thats why you have to investigate. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/XnT9UOa.gif) | ||
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sicklucker
Canada16987 Posts
On December 02 2016 09:56 LightningStrike wrote: That's a good point it means probably 1 active scum then. Forgot about that portion where nk must be submitted. Probably the last scum would be on the NU wagon. Will check stuff in a little bit. i donno hf had a point. the koshi nk might have been randomed ;p. This is a pretty bad reason. I could argue nk koshi would be done by desperate people like a shapelog or cm8 team or just randomed all together | ||
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LightningStrike
United States14276 Posts
On December 02 2016 09:56 mahrgell wrote: Who are we? Speak for yourself. I very willing to lynch HF for what he has shown so far and if he continues doing exactly that. I don't see the much fabled benefit of keeping him around until late. Sure, if shlogs defense sucks, kill him. But until then? HF it is for me. The majority of us obviously. HF can wait though at least until Shapelog gets lynched. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
I really didn't want to post but I just had to let it out. Wouldn't sleep anyway. | ||
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