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[M][N] Presidential Election Mini Mafia - Page 8

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 29 2016 21:09 GMT
#1857
I'm also seriously contemplating just saying fuck it and playing like a normal person
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 14:04 GMT
#1897
On June 30 2016 21:18 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 30 2016 20:35 Jealous wrote:
I can't deny that he played well in D2. However that is pretty WIFOM for me because it could just be a good player under pressure trying to go down the list of "What would a townie do in my case?" or it could be an actual townie under false pressure. The main problem I have is that if Damdred isn't scum, then who is?

I don't think TT is, as of now. I think that the cases on Jean and Superbia are similar from what I've read so far, so that is a confusing ordeal because if one of them is scum then either one of them is playing an incredible scum or one of them is playing a bad town. I think we can assume the former to be true. Superbia has shown himself to be a clever player in both games so far; Jean has shown himself as a much more transparent and open player. If I had to decide between the two of them, I'd go with Superbia. However, I'd really need to dig in his filter to find any evidence to support this inclination because from the D1 filter read I did on him and what I recall from N1/D2, I haven't seen anything overly scummy from him. This is now on my to-do list.

Artanis was my only other pick besides Chezinu. Why? Perhaps there is more than "meta" behind his townreads on people. If Damdred were to get lynched yesterday and he made that long and almost exceedingly townie-toned post about why Damdred would be town, then he would get a lot of credit and whoever pushed Damdred might be in the spotlight. This is the perfect scenario for scum - divide the town between the people who wagoned Damdred and those that did not, with him being the leader of the "did not" party. Of course, only scum or cop would know for certain that Damdred is not scum. If Artanis was scum, it'd be very wise of him to counter-argue a strong case that I built against Damdred with "meta" and nice formatting to basically say "Damdred can't be scum, he is super town," and in this scenario WHEN and not IF Damdred flipped town, Artanis could use this as leverage as both a case against anyone who voted for him (especially me) and as a defense against anyone who questions him ("But if I was scum, wouldn't it make sense for me to allow town to mislynch Damdred?"). This is all circumstantial and by no means confirmed; I still need to lynch Damdred to see how it plays out, but if he does flip green I want everyone to be aware of this possibility.

So, Skynx, who to you is scum then?

So what you're saying is you don't believe I can have as strong a townread on Damdred as I say, therefore I must have TMI? I guess that's a roundabout compliment in a way.

I know you despise meta, but take a little look into my previously played games, please. I have never ever tried this hard as mafia under suspicion, let ALONE when the rest of my team died early. If I was in a team with MD and EC (and I mean no offense to them) I would've just given up on D1 and let the lynch wash over me.

I would not end up having the longest filter in the game.

I have probably written more words than you. I just consolidate my posts.

There's probably a way to figure that out.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 18:42 GMT
#1908
Tonight has drastically changes my thoughts on the game generally and damdred specifically.

I'm back to tictock is mafia
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 18:42 GMT
#1909
I'll respond to questions when I'm at a computer damdred
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 20:16 GMT
#1920
On July 01 2016 00:38 Damdred wrote:
Jean could you tell me what your one reason for wanting to tr ec was? You said you would talk about it during the night but never did

Also why did you move moosey from your ignore list to suddenly Lynch moose last second? His play really hadn't changed much over the day I think.


Yes, the one reason to think EC was town was that he tried to get the presidency. In hindsight he didn't really push for it and thus I should have been far more suspicious of him, but at the time I was looking for anything, even flimsy, to help sort people into categories.

I think I talked about it somewhere in my filter that scum almost never succeed or even genuinely try to win mayoral elections. It's almost always (as this game is a good proof of) townies.

Regarding Moosey, he hadn't been posting while I was around, which sort of faded in my eyes how blatantly trolly and scum-favored his posting direction was. When he came back and started doing it right in front of me I made the logical choice to go after him, I explained it in my post where I announced him as my lynch target.

Essentially, and as evidenced, he was objectively the most scummy player in the thread (could be proven to be playing with a scum agenda), but in my subjective opinion he wasn't the most scummy at the time. My own posting both at the time of announcing him as a lynch target, and prior to his flip, show the thought progression I had.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 20:33 GMT
#1925
On July 01 2016 05:22 Damdred wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 27 2016 05:58 Jean Valjean wrote:
On June 27 2016 05:58 Superbia wrote:
Literally -> I think moosy is scum. I have been pushing on moosy beginning of d1 -> I think super is scum.

This is the guy you all want as pres.

I think you're mafia.

I don't think moosy is mafia.


Idk I know you say your progression on moosey, but here you have it that you don't think moose is mafia.

You also think super is the most guaranteed mafia at the time of the Lynch.

Can you explain why you lynched moose over super exactly and why you didn't think he was scum at the end? A sort of horrid question but just go with it for now.

I don't know how to make it any more clear to you to be honest.

At the time, I felt superbia was genuinely scummy, ie: his posting felt off and I had convinced myself there were good reasons to think he's mafia.

Regarding moosy, he was objectively scummy, but I subjectively thought he was just an asshole who was willingly playing against his win condition as town. That being said, I was not certain on superbia, or anyone else really at that point, so I just lynched the player who SHOULD flip mafia, despite my own personal reservations that me might just be anti-town townie.

Do you understand the difference between objective and subjective scummyness? Moosy, in my opinion, was mafia because he played in a way that was only beneficial if he is mafia. Thus if we assume everyone plays to win, he has to be mafia because there is no town reason for him to do what he did.

Also, the hedging was pretty strong, it's always good to hedge so you can claim to be right later

Either I'm "right" and i lynch mafia, or I'm "right" and lynch a townie who should have been lynched anyway for playing like mafia.

In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 20:35 GMT
#1926
Skynx' effort is very useful.

To me the current situation is something like

Artanis, Damdred, Jean, GlowingBear, Skynx, Jealous town

Superbia probably town, but less sure

Tumblewood probably town, but less sure

Tictock most likely scum.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 20:40 GMT
#1928
On July 01 2016 05:37 GlowingBear wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2016 05:35 Jean Valjean wrote:
Skynx' effort is very useful.

To me the current situation is something like

Artanis, Damdred, Jean, GlowingBear, Skynx, Jealous town

Superbia probably town, but less sure

Tumblewood probably town, but less sure

Tictock most likely scum.


Why is Damdred town now?

Because his effort level this night has been extremely high when it doesn't have to be. In addition, his questions about me feel very "right". He's not being superficial or difficult, he's genuinely asking very pointed questions (like the one about me saying there is a reason to townread EC that I didn't want to talk about at the time). It's difficult (but of course not impossible) to come up with that as mafia.

I get the feeling he actually wants to figure the game out. Also, it's fucking damdred, I always think he's mafia and I'm (almost) always wrong. But lynching him is fun though, so it's fine.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 20:41 GMT
#1930
I'm super excited in who the kill will be tbh. Like just from a strategical perspective I'm curious how scum is going to pick their nightkill.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 20:43 GMT
#1931
On July 01 2016 05:40 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I'm pretty sure JVJ is HF btw. Ego, quality of play and playfulness in general fit, plus going into a game as a smurf with an idea like he had at the start here feels a lot like him.

Also also Poland please.

Please, I know we've had our differences but no need to be rude.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 20:47 GMT
#1934
On July 01 2016 05:45 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Unless you were just making the joke that claiming you're HF is rude in itself, in which case if wrong I do profusely apologize

thanks, feels better.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 21:20 GMT
#1952
##vote Tictock

Poe/still scummy

If he flips scum superbia is worst player for not just sticking with the tracker claim.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 21:57 GMT
#1956
On July 01 2016 06:54 Tictock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2016 06:20 Jean Valjean wrote:
##vote Tictock

Poe/still scummy

If he flips scum superbia is worst player for not just sticking with the tracker claim.


My god you Yo-Yo back and forth on me.

Bring it.

No real reason to bring anything, just explain in detail who is mafia if you're not it?
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 22:27 GMT
#1965
On July 01 2016 07:16 Tictock wrote:
Tumble has been the weakest of my townreads and is mostly just floating this game.

But yea mostly PoE.

And no, I'm kinda coming around on Jean probably just being town.

he really doesn't have to do this...
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
June 30 2016 22:27 GMT
#1966
Like that is directly against his interest if he's mafia.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
July 01 2016 08:54 GMT
#2004
On July 01 2016 13:04 Tictock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2016 12:57 GlowingBear wrote:
On July 01 2016 12:53 Damdred wrote:
Both ec and moose were going down hard. Idk


Moosy voted JVJ so he would be lynched instead of EC. If he did something like that we can assume Mafia team considered that EC's role was important. If Mafia team considered that EC's role was important, so we can assume that it is most likely that the last member DIDN'T vote for me day1


No offense to Moosy...

But you are giving his "sacrificial" play too much credit and planning.

Lol Yes.

There very much exists the chance moosy is just... special
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
July 01 2016 10:56 GMT
#2018
can we please talk less about me inevitably getting murdered?

Tumblewood is meh, so whatever. Tictock doesn't really sound like mafia yet. I'm also hoping to clear one of the potentially suspicious people with a blue claim so there's that.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
July 01 2016 11:28 GMT
#2022
On July 01 2016 20:13 Jealous wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2016 19:43 Superbia wrote:
It's not that difficult.

1. Pardon if bodyguard is about to get lynched.
2. Pardon if glowingbear and bodyguard are alive during final 4.

The reasons as to why pardon will be used are not mathematically relevant, it's the fact that to prepare for all possible scenarios one needs to examine both whether it does or does not happen, whether Jean is scum or not scum.

As you said, Jean cannot be in the final 3. My argument is that he cannot be in the final 4, either.

This is a dumb discussion and you should reconsider if you actually think this.

Essentially you're telling the scum "hey, if you get a mislynch today, you'll get a free extra one tomorrow!"

We're not going to default lynch, we're going to keep lynching the most scummy people until the game ends.
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
July 01 2016 12:01 GMT
#2030
On July 01 2016 20:52 Jealous wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2016 20:28 Jean Valjean wrote:
On July 01 2016 20:13 Jealous wrote:
On July 01 2016 19:43 Superbia wrote:
It's not that difficult.

1. Pardon if bodyguard is about to get lynched.
2. Pardon if glowingbear and bodyguard are alive during final 4.

The reasons as to why pardon will be used are not mathematically relevant, it's the fact that to prepare for all possible scenarios one needs to examine both whether it does or does not happen, whether Jean is scum or not scum.

As you said, Jean cannot be in the final 3. My argument is that he cannot be in the final 4, either.

This is a dumb discussion and you should reconsider if you actually think this.

Essentially you're telling the scum "hey, if you get a mislynch today, you'll get a free extra one tomorrow!"

We're not going to default lynch, we're going to keep lynching the most scummy people until the game ends.


True, especially the last bit. However, being short-sighted has already cost us. I don't think it's bad practice to map all the possible roads this game can take.


When did being short-sighted cost us?
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
Jean Valjean
Profile Joined April 2015
France216 Posts
July 01 2016 12:03 GMT
#2031
I am 100% hoping our other blue is a jailor. That'd be grand. He would already have 2 clears
In His name my task has just begun, I will see it done!
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