[M][N] Presidential Election Mini Mafia - Page 5

On June 29 2016 20:35 Jean Valjean wrote:
In addition, that is an extremly weak accusation Artanis, you are a better player to than think that is something that actually makes someone mafia.

Maybe I was right on day 1 after all.

##unvote
##vote Artanis[Xp]

That is so weak, so awfully awfully weak.

On June 29 2016 06:20 Jean Valjean wrote:
Hey guys, I'm partially unavailable today, and probably tomorrow too. I am sorry for that, I should have more time to contribute on thursday.

I will try to make sense of what is going on in a little while, also I'm not particularly bothered about what we kill today.

On June 29 2016 20:55 Jean Valjean wrote:
In order to keep up with my theme of transparency, this is not "just an omgus".

I have had lingering suspicions of Artanis, even in that summary post I just wrote I mentioned how little impact he has had on the game. I voiced my concerns repeatedly on Day 1, and even though I ended up not killing him I felt like he was fading into the background.

I have been struggling with figuring out his alignment and I'm nowhere certain it's town, or mafia, for that matter. The reason I just voted him is very simple.

I mentioned three people who were inactive or not impactful on night 1, and he says "you can be mafia" because somehow that is a contradiction with me not having caught up. Sheer page count or post count is not an indicator of activity. I do not think Artanis is actually dumb enough to think his reasoning here is valid.

Then there's the meta factor. It doesn't help that I feel like Artanis is just about the one player here who has the balls to try to kill me as scum. Go for the big play or go home. This is all subjective and kind of bad analysis, but I'm explaining why it affects my thought process.

---

I wish I had more time to play. Just like on Day 1 I am simply a person who has true real life obligations that I cannot ignore. Sometimes I'm able to contribute a lot and sometimes I'm not.

I am, predictably, going to flip vanilla town (yes, this is me claiming my role) if I get lynched. It greatly concerns me that town is so willing to go along with this.

Just like I repeatedly have extended an invitation and explanation to all the people I suspect this game, clearly detailing why it is I suspect them, I would ask the same of the people who suspect me. Explain why you want to lynch me, and what needs explaining for me to alleviate your concerns.

On June 29 2016 21:01 Jean Valjean wrote:
But yeah, fuck it, I started listing up the reasons I stopped thinking Artanis is mafia and they still kinda hold up, so I'm going back to my Chez is mafia theory.

Artanis' reaction to my pressure yesterday
Artanis' post where he talks about smurfhunting (it shows sort of a.... chill attitude, that mafia might not dare portray)
Artanis' filter length

So whatever, I'm just gonna assume he's a baddie, which wouldn't be that surprising.

On June 30 2016 04:09 Jean Valjean wrote:


Why can I specifically not be allowed to reach lylo Damdred? Also, why are you trying to take care of that problem now.

For someone bitching about how you're one of the best players in the game you're showing a tremendously weak grasp of scumhunting. There is no way I flip mafia, because I have not done anything a mafia would do.

I am helpful
I lynch mafia
I am transparent
I explain my reads
I help push the game
I push buttons on people to make them talk

It is actually amazing that I know in this situation that one of Artanis and Damdred must not be mafia (and if I'm right on chez, neither is). Because those two people specifically should know the very situation that has come up, being very experienced.

I know I have seen this situation before, multiple times. I lynch mafia and then surely I must have bussed on day 2 because people fear me. I am not this good at playing mafia, no one is.

One of the things I would like an input on from other people post-game is how to avoid this specific situation, I thought I did well on day 1, I thought I put myself in a position, yet players who at least claim to be good at this game are literally head up to waist in their asses thinking I surely must be mafia because only mafia would lynch mafia and play like town. That is perfect logic.

On June 30 2016 04:05 Jealous wrote:

I still think it's too much of a risk to take at this juncture, and would prefer to only do it if it is forced upon us as we progress through the D/N cycles. There are still quite a few cycles left until Jean becomes invincible as scum, which means plenty of other developments can occur that would help shed light on Jean and others in the game. Maybe my balls aren't big enough to join you on this wagon or perhaps I tend to be risk-averse, either way I am sticking to my guns (Damdred) on this one because it is the strongest case I've seen developed on a purely logical scale (as in, ignoring meta).

If Damdred flips green, I have some other avenues to pursue but I don't want to reveal those until someone gets NK'd. Maybe scum will eliminate some possibilities and if I post my suspicions now, scum will be less likely to remove them from town's radar.

On June 30 2016 04:26 Jean Valjean wrote:


I'm playing survivalist because that is what I have to do. I don't particularly want to, but I have to. Notice though that in the process I'm still trying to figure the game out. I have laid out reasons for everything I've done.



Some townies are very logical, for example, yours truly.

In fact, almost every townie who is actually consistently really good at this game is logical.

I mean, it's hard to not ridicule you when your thought process is:

Jean wants to stay alive - like a townie
Jean lynches mafia - like a townie
Jean is logical - like townies should strife to be
Jean is transparent - like a townie should be
Jean is helpful and willing to engage and explain - like a townie should be
Jean fought for the mayor role - something mafia NEVER does

Conclusion: Jean is mafia. Q.E.D

I am of course massively frustrated with both myself for not figuring out how to beat sense into you guys, and at you guys for being so immensely stupid to think it's even possible I am mafia.

Show me ONE mafia in the past year on team liquid who has played a game anywhere like what I've done here. Even the best scum players cling to weak arguments, are uncooperative and don't show the leadership I've shown.

You are lynching objectively the most townie player you have ever seen on TL Mafia. No I'm not one of those people who can throw a tantrum or say something dumb and become an innocent child in the process, but I have, for all intents and purposes, played what should be an exemplary perfect town game. I let logic guide me to a scum lynch. I made sure scum had no shot at the mayor role, and I've argued and fought in the reasonable and helpful way we want this forum to work in, and the reward is an inane suspicion from people whose best reasons to attack me is literally "he's trying to survive" and "he's trying to solve the game BUT admits not having read every post".

It is no wonder we have the behavioral issues we have on this site, the only way people will believe anything you say is if you become an emotional trainwreck, something I will not allow myself to do because I am trying to set an example here. Even if it means getting lynched, which I believe should be every town's #1 priority to avoid.

On June 30 2016 04:12 Jean Valjean wrote:
I genuinely think I am being lynched for playing like town. The only argument I've actually seen against me the one Damdred mentioned about me trying to figure out the game with incomplete information.

Everyone, and I mean literally everyone, has at absolutely best skimmed every post in the game. It's much more likely people skim and skip parts of the game. I am just honest about it, because you know... I'm transparent and helpful.