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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 09 2015 07:23 Half the Sky wrote: In a world where Rels is town, does a Xatalos/Artanis/TBD team make sense? Food for thought and for future reference.
Initially I thought the best reason to draw the connection would be his choice to nominate SL over Artanis. Four or five times in a row Xata lists SL/Artanis in the same sentence when discussing nominations. He continues to list them both as null or townish null and states that his choice will depend on their posting. However, in the end he goes with SL without a clear explanation of the preference. Overall they don't interact with each other a ton, but there was this post after nominations. I thought the explanation was kinda lame.
On November 04 2015 21:04 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2015 21:01 Xatalos wrote: You're fine with not being on the mission, Artanis? I townread all three of you and we're going to have to nominate three people that aren't me in all future missions, so why not?
The problem though is the argument falls apart when you consider that a scum Xata would likely choose a town SL as the setup guy, so Artanis's alignment isn't as relevant because he would likely be excluded if he were town or mafia.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 09 2015 07:03 ShoCkeyy wrote: Now for this next mission coming up, I really don't like the fact that Kita has a ton of mafia leans still while never giving his reads fully. Makes me question him at this point, but then there is Artanis too.
I'd say two mafia reads plus a third in a pool of three players isn't a ton, is it? Is there anything that you'd like me to clear up?
Also, it's not totally clear why you voted yes today. Could you go into why you wanted it to pass a bit more?
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 09 2015 22:23 raynpelikoneet wrote: kitaman what do you want me to pick?
Right now I'm at rayn/kita/rels/super
Maybe I could be convinced to replace super with someone else. It would be swell if he could post something.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 10 2015 02:47 sicklucker wrote:lurky lurk
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 10 2015 02:53 Half the Sky wrote: Kita could you please answer why you think SL's erratic posting is alignment indicative? I asked a question of you sometime back....ehh let me find it.
His strategy is essentially to accept any team that includes himself and attack any player that attacks him. I feel this is alignment indicative because it's exactly how I played as spy in resistance 2.
+ Show Spoiler +On November 03 2015 22:20 sicklucker wrote: yo xataloser is a bad guy On November 03 2015 22:24 sicklucker wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2015 22:21 Half the Sky wrote:On November 03 2015 22:20 sicklucker wrote: yo xataloser is a bad guy Why? he failed my omgus test where I omgus people who put doubt on my not giving a fuck. I call it plan no give a fuck On November 03 2015 22:29 sicklucker wrote: No but I figured scum would go out of there way to not let me get away with being a shitty player On November 03 2015 22:36 sicklucker wrote: Note that xata is annoyed trying to convince me otherwise and backtracked later with reasons to townread me. He didnt bring this reason up when he complained to rayn On November 04 2015 19:44 sicklucker wrote: Like do you want me to summarize my filter for you. Ive given my plan. gonna veto any xatalos unless its like me and rayn then ill reread his shit. Taking it day by day. playing the long and underwhelming game On November 05 2015 09:43 sicklucker wrote: like if xata picks the team i want (he did kinda) that proves to me i can probably trust him
He scum reads Xata, explains why, and states that he would reject any team with Xata unless SL is included. Whether or not your scum read brings you along on a mission set up for failure should not influence your read on that player.
Xata + X + Y = Fail because Xata is scum Xata + X + SL = Pass because ????
He later explains that he "didnt think a scum xata would have the balls". He didn't have the balls to bring along a townie? As opposed to bring along some other random townie? Huh?
Next, he calls super scum because super stated that the Xat/rayn/SL team would get rejected and that SL should have been replaced by Artanis. He explains that super wanted to reject the all town team, even though he didn't think Xat was mafia at the time. He then explains that the all town team in reference was rayn/SL/artanis. This doesn't make sense either because the post SL attacked super for stated that he wanted SL replaced by artanis.
On November 09 2015 02:28 sicklucker wrote: xata if your the town in rayn/you your literally losing town the game thinking the way you do. People like shockey/rels who voted no on a mission that failed are not going to be scum very often. you need to adjust your reads as scum bro
Next he uses this explanation to state that shockeyy and rels are town. Yet his scum reads include myself and super, also no voters. He is using the same argument to state that certain players are town, yet ignores his own argument in regards to others. He buddies the players that town read him and attack the players the scum read him.
Right now the policy he is pushing is to fail every team until it is his turn to nominate himself.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 10 2015 06:46 Vivax wrote: I'm vigilant about kita as he's one of the people I can get really paranoid about. I have a history of reading him correctly too so until I get to do that and given that his first posts in the game didn't really scream town to me, I'd prefer to not have him on a mission for now.
I'd be fine with rayn/me/shockey/Rels
How does your paranoia in past games have anything to do with my alignment this game? -_-
If you're going to justify my exclusion, there better be a solid case explaining why.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
Artanis, what do you think about HTS's post? (#2170)
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 10 2015 22:02 Xatalos wrote: Then again, otherwise this will probably go to SL's decision -> fail..... It's like picking between ebola and AIDS....
Just to be clear, am I the Ebola or the AIDS in this metaphor? This is very important.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 10 2015 06:31 Half the Sky wrote: First "the scum xata wouldn't have the balls" that comes from the fact that sicklucker thought xatalos would give himself away too easily with a team of two players that were more obviously read as town. rayn even said sicklucker was obvious town, and though other players were more doubtful on sicklucker (myself included) from his OWN perspective and especially where sicklucker had a more inflated view of himself as town, this would actually make sense.
If you think about it from sicklucker's perspective it would make sense for town sicklucker to think that a scum xatalos wouldn't have the "balls" to reject a mission and given himself away in a 3-man mission team where the other two were more solidly townread.
Why do you say SL was more solidly townread? Of the people who accepted the mission:
Xatalos - Town read rayn/Xat more than SL Half the Sky - Town read rayn/Xat more than SL raynpelikoneet - Town read rayn/Xat more than SL Artanis - Town read rayn/Xat more than SL
Even if you include the rejects votes, there wasn't a huge amount of SL support.
If anything, this points to a scum Xat wanting to bring along SL as the fall guy, not making a "ballsy move".
On November 10 2015 06:31 Half the Sky wrote: He also said something else to the effect of "oh wait maybe I can trust xata if he put out a team I wanted or a team with him on it or what have you" - again I don't remember full context without opening a thousand tabs on my phone but that was another point in his favour.
You suggest that it is a point in his favor, but I'd say that it suggests he prioritizes self-inclusion over mission success.
On November 10 2015 06:31 Half the Sky wrote: From a meta standpoint, (reference Void, Drams) scum sicklucker is concerned about giving away information on his teammates.
A few other people have already pointed this out, but I don't think this applies very well considering voting no unless he is included has the opposite effect. He doesn't have to worry about his teammate's inclusion at all if he can include himself.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 09 2015 07:33 ShoCkeyy wrote: Reason why I say that is because I suggested this team a while back. Not voting yes will look bad on my end anyways
If you wanted the team to pass, why did you include that tid bit about how you would have looked bad by rejecting at the end?
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 11 2015 00:46 sicklucker wrote:Show nested quote +On November 10 2015 19:51 raynpelikoneet wrote: If Shockeyy is town why does he not prove my case on him is wrong? I have posted it days ago. Why does he not do that? BECAUSE HE DOESINT GIVE A SHIT
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And remember folks, when you do find the need to excrete fecal matter, make sure to avoid direct contact with others.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 11 2015 01:27 ShoCkeyy wrote: I just don't care what rayn has to say about me. Big difference. At the end of the game you're all going to feel really shitty when I come out as town and realize rayn was mafia the whole game.
Could be. Unfortunately being right is only half the battle.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 11 2015 08:14 raynpelikoneet wrote: You need to understand. .. HtS, that just because i say "fuck you" to you or to anyone, instead of you telling me "you played bad" in a game where i found all scum it does not make me toxic.. ever.. sure you can try, but when i call out your bs take it, or prove me wrong.
It makes you delusional. I say what i think. Just because you are more sensitive with words or as a person what the fuck ever idc. Get your facts straight and dont feed ppl with bs.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On November 12 2015 03:56 Half the Sky wrote: AT THAT TIME, he mentioned they couldn't possibly stand out as teammates, but both have one major thing in common - the reads on each other were a stretch which is common(ish) when mafia need to discredit each other.
From the first failed mission I am 99.9% Xatalos is the saboteur, and the above plus sicklucker's points on Superbia (prior to the fully afk) lurky game make this combination a bit more likely. Again, let me remind everyone SUPERBIA HAD JACK ALL ON NOMS Day 1.
From a mafia mindset he might not have wanted to give anyone away! Thoughts?
Kita, Kita, Kita, where are you...
When you were on the fence with the day one team between Xata and Super, Xata seemed pretty interested in getting himself included. He didn't discredit the super team completely, but he showed the preference towards being the one you chose. If they were buddies, it wouldn't really matter much which of the two was picked. I suppose he could be trying to emulate how a town player would think there.
Super voting no on the rayn/xata/SL team suggests they aren't buddies, but I guess one of the spies voted no d1 if today fails, unless rayn is the bad guy.
I'll have to do a re-read on super/vivax and Rels if the game isn't over in a couple hours.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On January 22 2014 12:11 kitaman27 wrote:My fellow players, I present to you the greatest advancement in scum hunting techniques since the Mafia Report Card and the Day Three Mayor Election. I am proud to introduce Mafia Combinatorics! In an 11 player setup with three mafia members, there are 165 possible mafia team combinations. However, by attempting to only identify a pair of scum buddies, this number can be significantly reduced. By assuming that you are town*, there are three valid pairs in a group of 45 combinations. If you are able to identify two town players with a high degree of confidence, this number is reduced to three in a group of 28 pairings. Rather than attempting to look for a pair of scum buddies, I shall attempt to identify pairs who are not scum buddies. Even if a valid pair is eliminated due to poor reasoning, there are still two other correct combinations, which allows me to make multiple mistakes before I've eliminated all valid solutions. Through process of elimination, I shall use this list to generate a vote that is slightly better than random, but only with your help! I will attempt to include an updated spoilered list in every post with the cominbations that have not been eliminated based on interactions in the thread, lynch flips, night hits, and strong town reads. If you strongly disagree with a combination that has been eliminated or you believe that I should consider removing a pair for various reasons, let me know! Eliminating yourself because you are town is not a valid suggestion. That only works for me because I'm special. The mafia team is now facing a ticking time bomb. Will they manage to kill me before the game is solved? Will I realize this is a terrible idea that is incredibly time inefficient? Will I be ignored because you guys are unable to appreciate the greatness of my plans? Find out! * Disclaimer: Please keep in mind that this may not be a valid assumption before applying Mafia Combinatorics to a game. + Show Spoiler [Potential Mafia Pairs] +{Foolishness,Marvellosity} {Foolishness,Promethelax} {Foolishness,Austinmcc} {Foolishness,Sandroba} {Foolishness,VisceraEyes} {Foolishness,HolyFlare} {Foolishness,Hapahauli} {Foolishness,Gonzaw} {Marvellosity,Promethelax} {Marvellosity,Austinmcc} {Marvellosity,Sandroba} {Marvellosity,VisceraEyes} {Marvellosity,HolyFlare} {Marvellosity,Hapahauli} {Marvellosity,Gonzaw} {Promethelax,Austinmcc} {Promethelax,Sandroba} {Promethelax,VisceraEyes} {Promethelax,HolyFlare} {Promethelax,Hapahauli} {Promethelax,Gonzaw} {Austinmcc,Sandroba} {Austinmcc,VisceraEyes} {Austinmcc,HolyFlare} {Austinmcc,Hapahauli} {Austinmcc,Gonzaw} {Sandroba,VisceraEyes} {Sandroba,HolyFlare} {Sandroba,Hapahauli} {Sandroba,Gonzaw} {VisceraEyes,HolyFlare} {VisceraEyes,Hapahauli} {VisceraEyes,Gonzaw} {HolyFlare,Hapahauli} {HolyFlare,Gonzaw} {Hapahauli,Gonzaw}
Mafia combinations has returned and is as inefficient as ever! Watch in amazement as I eliminate possible mafia combinations. Which completely unfounded assumption will I use to accidentally eliminate the actual mafia team? Stay tuned!
kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Half the Sky kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Rels kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Xatalos kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Vivax kitaman27 ShoCkeyy raynpelikoneet kitaman27 ShoCkeyy sicklucker kitaman27 Half the Sky Rels kitaman27 Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] kitaman27 Half the Sky Xatalos kitaman27 Half the Sky Vivax kitaman27 Half the Sky raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Half the Sky sicklucker kitaman27 Rels Artanis[Xp] kitaman27 Rels Xatalos kitaman27 Rels Vivax kitaman27 Rels raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Rels sicklucker kitaman27 Artanis[Xp] Xatalos kitaman27 Artanis[Xp] Vivax kitaman27 Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Artanis[Xp] sicklucker kitaman27 Xatalos Vivax kitaman27 Xatalos raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Xatalos sicklucker kitaman27 Vivax raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Vivax sicklucker kitaman27 raynpelikoneet sicklucker ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Rels ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Xatalos ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Vivax ShoCkeyy Half the Sky raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Half the Sky sicklucker ShoCkeyy Rels Artanis[Xp] ShoCkeyy Rels Xatalos ShoCkeyy Rels Vivax ShoCkeyy Rels raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Rels sicklucker ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] Xatalos ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] Vivax ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] sicklucker ShoCkeyy Xatalos Vivax ShoCkeyy Xatalos raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Xatalos sicklucker ShoCkeyy Vivax raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Vivax sicklucker ShoCkeyy raynpelikoneet sicklucker Half the Sky Rels Artanis[Xp] Half the Sky Rels Xatalos Half the Sky Rels Vivax Half the Sky Rels raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Rels sicklucker Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] Vivax Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] sicklucker Half the Sky Xatalos Vivax Half the Sky Xatalos raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Xatalos sicklucker Half the Sky Vivax raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Vivax sicklucker Half the Sky raynpelikoneet sicklucker Rels Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Rels Artanis[Xp] Vivax Rels Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet Rels Artanis[Xp] sicklucker Rels Xatalos Vivax Rels Xatalos raynpelikoneet Rels Xatalos sicklucker Rels Vivax raynpelikoneet Rels Vivax sicklucker Rels raynpelikoneet sicklucker Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Vivax Artanis[Xp] Xatalos raynpelikoneet Artanis[Xp] Xatalos sicklucker Artanis[Xp] Vivax raynpelikoneet Artanis[Xp] Vivax sicklucker Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet sicklucker Xatalos Vivax raynpelikoneet Xatalos Vivax sicklucker Xatalos raynpelikoneet sicklucker Vivax raynpelikoneet sicklucker
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
Assumption 1: Kita is not mafia.
Look at that progress!
Eliminated combinations:
kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Half the Sky kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Rels kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Xatalos kitaman27 ShoCkeyy Vivax kitaman27 ShoCkeyy raynpelikoneet kitaman27 ShoCkeyy sicklucker kitaman27 Half the Sky Rels kitaman27 Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] kitaman27 Half the Sky Xatalos kitaman27 Half the Sky Vivax kitaman27 Half the Sky raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Half the Sky sicklucker kitaman27 Rels Artanis[Xp] kitaman27 Rels Xatalos kitaman27 Rels Vivax kitaman27 Rels raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Rels sicklucker kitaman27 Artanis[Xp] Xatalos kitaman27 Artanis[Xp] Vivax kitaman27 Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Artanis[Xp] sicklucker kitaman27 Xatalos Vivax kitaman27 Xatalos raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Xatalos sicklucker kitaman27 Vivax raynpelikoneet kitaman27 Vivax sicklucker kitaman27 raynpelikoneet sicklucker
Combinations Remaining:
ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Rels ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Xatalos ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Vivax ShoCkeyy Half the Sky raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Half the Sky sicklucker ShoCkeyy Rels Artanis[Xp] ShoCkeyy Rels Xatalos ShoCkeyy Rels Vivax ShoCkeyy Rels raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Rels sicklucker ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] Xatalos ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] Vivax ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] sicklucker ShoCkeyy Xatalos Vivax ShoCkeyy Xatalos raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Xatalos sicklucker ShoCkeyy Vivax raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Vivax sicklucker ShoCkeyy raynpelikoneet sicklucker Half the Sky Rels Artanis[Xp] Half the Sky Rels Xatalos Half the Sky Rels Vivax Half the Sky Rels raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Rels sicklucker Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] Vivax Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] sicklucker Half the Sky Xatalos Vivax Half the Sky Xatalos raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Xatalos sicklucker Half the Sky Vivax raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Vivax sicklucker Half the Sky raynpelikoneet sicklucker Rels Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Rels Artanis[Xp] Vivax Rels Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet Rels Artanis[Xp] sicklucker Rels Xatalos Vivax Rels Xatalos raynpelikoneet Rels Xatalos sicklucker Rels Vivax raynpelikoneet Rels Vivax sicklucker Rels raynpelikoneet sicklucker Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Vivax Artanis[Xp] Xatalos raynpelikoneet Artanis[Xp] Xatalos sicklucker Artanis[Xp] Vivax raynpelikoneet Artanis[Xp] Vivax sicklucker Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet sicklucker Xatalos Vivax raynpelikoneet Xatalos Vivax sicklucker Xatalos raynpelikoneet sicklucker Vivax raynpelikoneet sicklucker
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
Assumption 2: There is at least 1 mafia in rayn, Xatalos, SL
It's so easy!
Eliminated Combinations:
ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Rels ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Vivax ShoCkeyy Rels Artanis[Xp] ShoCkeyy Rels Vivax ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] Vivax Half the Sky Rels Artanis[Xp] Half the Sky Rels Vivax Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] Vivax Rels Artanis[Xp] Vivax
Combinations Remaining: ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Xatalos ShoCkeyy Half the Sky raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Half the Sky sicklucker ShoCkeyy Rels Xatalos ShoCkeyy Rels raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Rels sicklucker ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] Xatalos ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] sicklucker ShoCkeyy Xatalos Vivax ShoCkeyy Xatalos raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Xatalos sicklucker ShoCkeyy Vivax raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Vivax sicklucker ShoCkeyy raynpelikoneet sicklucker Half the Sky Rels Xatalos Half the Sky Rels raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Rels sicklucker Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] sicklucker Half the Sky Xatalos Vivax Half the Sky Xatalos raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Xatalos sicklucker Half the Sky Vivax raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Vivax sicklucker Half the Sky raynpelikoneet sicklucker Rels Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Rels Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet Rels Artanis[Xp] sicklucker Rels Xatalos Vivax Rels Xatalos raynpelikoneet Rels Xatalos sicklucker Rels Vivax raynpelikoneet Rels Vivax sicklucker Rels raynpelikoneet sicklucker Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Vivax Artanis[Xp] Xatalos raynpelikoneet Artanis[Xp] Xatalos sicklucker Artanis[Xp] Vivax raynpelikoneet Artanis[Xp] Vivax sicklucker Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet sicklucker Xatalos Vivax raynpelikoneet Xatalos Vivax sicklucker Xatalos raynpelikoneet sicklucker Vivax raynpelikoneet sicklucker
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
Assumption 3: There is at least 1 mafia in rayn, Rels, Vivax,
Pew pew pew
Eliminated Combinations:
ShoCkeyy Half the Sky Xatalos ShoCkeyy Half the Sky sicklucker ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] Xatalos ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] sicklucker ShoCkeyy Xatalos sicklucker Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] sicklucker Half the Sky Xatalos sicklucker Artanis[Xp] Xatalos sicklucker
Combinations Remaining: ShoCkeyy Half the Sky raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Rels Xatalos ShoCkeyy Rels raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Rels sicklucker ShoCkeyy Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Xatalos Vivax ShoCkeyy Xatalos raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Vivax raynpelikoneet ShoCkeyy Vivax sicklucker ShoCkeyy raynpelikoneet sicklucker Half the Sky Rels Xatalos Half the Sky Rels raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Rels sicklucker Half the Sky Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Xatalos Vivax Half the Sky Xatalos raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Vivax raynpelikoneet Half the Sky Vivax sicklucker Half the Sky raynpelikoneet sicklucker Rels Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Rels Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet Rels Artanis[Xp] sicklucker Rels Xatalos Vivax Rels Xatalos raynpelikoneet Rels Xatalos sicklucker Rels Vivax raynpelikoneet Rels Vivax sicklucker Rels raynpelikoneet sicklucker Artanis[Xp] Xatalos Vivax Artanis[Xp] Xatalos raynpelikoneet Artanis[Xp] Vivax raynpelikoneet Artanis[Xp] Vivax sicklucker Artanis[Xp] raynpelikoneet sicklucker Xatalos Vivax raynpelikoneet Xatalos Vivax sicklucker Xatalos raynpelikoneet sicklucker Vivax raynpelikoneet sicklucker
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