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[M][N] Mini Mafia: The (kinda) Vanilla Experience - Page 2

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 22 2015 21:04 GMT
#608
Ritoky, what's your read on gumshoe now?
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 22 2015 21:17 GMT
#616
On October 23 2015 06:12 Xatalos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2015 06:08 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On October 22 2015 07:26 Blazinghand wrote:
"would you have done this if you were mafia?" --> the answer to this question is always "yes". I'm willing to lie, cheat, steal, doctor photographs, put items in boxes, fake plane tickets, pretend to have depression, a death in the family, etc, whatever it takes to win regardless of alignment. I'm one of the few players that does not pull punches as mafia. So yes, as mafia, I'd be fully willing to RNG if I percieved it to be a good idea (which it isn't; I've outlined why RNG is pro-town this game)

Here is what bothers me Xatalos. You continue to townread Blazinghand fro his rng after he says this.


So? He didn't even seem to realize that RNG-stuff was a "towntell" for him until after we started discussing the topic. What's more, even if he did, it wouldn't be so easy to fake the whole push and argue about it with that kind of conviction if he thought it was counter-productive for his faction (as scum). And well, he has just generally been active and producing posts I like. I don't really feel there's any reason to think he's null, let alone scum.

He's definitely null off of the RNG. Thats the entire point. BH has literally said that you have to look at what he does with it, not the fact that he did it. Once done, he's committed to it, even if (and rayn?) are scum he's trapped. All of his followup with respect to how true and great and protown it is have no bearing on his alignment.

His concern with ritoky pulling up games to draw a conclusion make them both townyish to me, but thats not really much considering the subject matter. BH is firmly null atm.
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 22 2015 21:40 GMT
#634
ritoky, where do you stand on gumshoe?
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 22 2015 22:27 GMT
#694
On October 23 2015 07:19 Vivax wrote:
Everyone shut up I'm hardclaiming cop

hahaha too gud
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 22 2015 22:27 GMT
#697
the salt feels real from ritoky, no?
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 22 2015 22:31 GMT
#703
On October 23 2015 06:38 ritoky wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2015 06:28 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On October 23 2015 06:27 ritoky wrote:
On October 23 2015 06:26 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I have a question. Xatalos do you seriously think Blazinghand - as town - believes that lynching by RNG on D1 has the best chances of hitting mafia? Like do you SERIOUSLY believe that?


depending on the setup of the game and the structure of PRs, yes.

really?
when he himself just argued it's less likely to hit mafia then not rng lycnhing?


it's actually equally as likely, so i disagree with your premise entirely.

it's actually really simple. i mean i guess it's pretty simple for me cuz i read like 10 of BH's games in the recent past so i could accurately impersonate him. here's your guide to reading BH:

Did he RNG immediately @ the start of the game: if yes -> 80% chance to be town; if no -> 80% chance to be mafia

Did he push the RNG target or just leave it there like a dead fish: if push -> 95% chance to be town; if dead fish - 50% chance to be mafia

Did he gather reads from people arguing with him about why they are better than RNG: yes - DING DING DING town; i don't know he hasn't given reads - 75% town; no - 50% town

rayn, was this your turning point on ritoky? They're right when saying that ritoky posted nothing between "(rayn thinks) ritoky is town" and "POE lynch list include ritoky".
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 23 2015 15:50 GMT
#968
On October 24 2015 00:36 GlowingBear wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 00:32 Xatalos wrote:
GB, if you're town, seriously don't just commit suicide here. Looks like it's heading towards you vs rayn and it'd be sad if you caused your own death there, like a certain player in my newbie game....


I'm not commiting suicide, I'm getting angry that such shitty scum read on me based on a read that I find very reasonable and I'm having a hard time believing good players can't possibly see I'm town.

On October 24 2015 00:30 Rels wrote:

Xatalos (1): Chromatically




Tell me more about the "shitty scum" reading you. You obviously have more people in mind, who are your detractors?
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 23 2015 15:51 GMT
#972
On October 24 2015 00:51 Hopeless1der wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 00:30 Rels wrote:
GlowingBear (3): marvellosity, yamato77, Vivax, raynpelikoneet, marvellosity


aww i confused the shit out of myself. However, I think all three of those are town so...

goddamn wrong thread
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 23 2015 15:57 GMT
#980
On October 24 2015 00:52 GlowingBear wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 00:50 Hopeless1der wrote:
On October 24 2015 00:36 GlowingBear wrote:
On October 24 2015 00:32 Xatalos wrote:
GB, if you're town, seriously don't just commit suicide here. Looks like it's heading towards you vs rayn and it'd be sad if you caused your own death there, like a certain player in my newbie game....


I'm not commiting suicide, I'm getting angry that such shitty scum read on me based on a read that I find very reasonable and I'm having a hard time believing good players can't possibly see I'm town.

On October 24 2015 00:30 Rels wrote:

Xatalos (1): Chromatically




Tell me more about the "shitty scum" reading you. You obviously have more people in mind, who are your detractors?


I meant "shitty scumreads", not shitty scum reading me.

I think I buy this. Am I crazy?
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 23 2015 15:59 GMT
#984
I'm gonna sheep marv/rayn. Hoping yamato/onegu show up because they said they would eventually.

##vote: Alakaslam
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 23 2015 15:59 GMT
#987
On October 24 2015 00:58 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 00:57 Hopeless1der wrote:
On October 24 2015 00:52 GlowingBear wrote:
On October 24 2015 00:50 Hopeless1der wrote:
On October 24 2015 00:36 GlowingBear wrote:
On October 24 2015 00:32 Xatalos wrote:
GB, if you're town, seriously don't just commit suicide here. Looks like it's heading towards you vs rayn and it'd be sad if you caused your own death there, like a certain player in my newbie game....


I'm not commiting suicide, I'm getting angry that such shitty scum read on me based on a read that I find very reasonable and I'm having a hard time believing good players can't possibly see I'm town.

On October 24 2015 00:30 Rels wrote:

Xatalos (1): Chromatically




Tell me more about the "shitty scum" reading you. You obviously have more people in mind, who are your detractors?


I meant "shitty scumreads", not shitty scum reading me.

I think I buy this. Am I crazy?


No you display basic human intelligence.

yay I did it!
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 23 2015 16:04 GMT
#995
Surefire ways to get lynched:

1) Tell marv he cant do it.
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 23 2015 16:06 GMT
#999
Slam, your filter is really focused on rayn. What else you got cooking?
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 23 2015 16:17 GMT
#1013
On October 24 2015 01:10 Alakaslam wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 01:04 Hopeless1der wrote:
Surefire ways to get lynched:

1) Tell marv he cant do it.

Sure fire way to disappointment: try to lynch an enigma on day 1.

With regard to your other question, there is irony; Marv missed the fact that I don't much like your posting this game either.

In fact, read my pages. Answer my question so that I can answer yours more fully? Would be interesting



So I assume this is the issue
On October 23 2015 16:08 Alakaslam wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2015 06:40 Hopeless1der wrote:
ritoky, where do you stand on gumshoe?

More of this hopeless?

How is this helping your reads?


ritoky had an early "textbook" mafia read of gumshoe (as per chromatically), gumshoe posted more, I wanted to know where ritoky's read ended up because he hadnt updated it and needed to be prompted a couple times. In general, my reads for those three are gumshoe>chromatically>ritoky (in order of townyness)

Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 23 2015 16:28 GMT
#1026
On October 24 2015 01:21 Xatalos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2015 01:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On October 24 2015 01:16 Xatalos wrote:
On October 24 2015 01:08 raynpelikoneet wrote:
For the record, why Xatalos' read on me is shit and why i think he is scum is this:
I mean.... Your merits this game are defending rayn (who's played exactly according to his scumgame so far, and made many unfathomable logical jumps) based on something that never really happened at the start, and some vague "nice posts" he's made. And attacking Slam for posts that I actually really liked about ritoky/rayn.

This is a complete mischaracterisation of my play. I never ever do this. I never do this as town, i never do this as mafia. I have never changed my read on anyone without a reason or a "reason" (as mafia). I always have a reason for why i post the things i do.

I have clearly explained every single read change i have had in this game (which is basically GlowingBear, Xatalos himself and ritoky). I went onto a long conversation about ritoky earlier, and at that time apparently there was nothing wrong with it for him. But now again it is a reason for scumreading me? I have also explained why i changed my read on GlowingBear, at that time there was nothing wrong with it for him? It should be really easy to see why i think Xatalos is mafia - or at least a bit earlier - why i reconsidered my read on him.

Slam's points on me are literally shit, and as marv pointed out Slam just decided he calls me mafia nad then started quoting my posts and called them scummy. All of his points are unture, what he says i have for example done in the last couple of games -- i have literally did the same thing (which makes me scumread GB too, as he should know Slam's points are shit, yet he doesn't address them -- as i just acted towards GB the same way in the last two games). Somehow Xatalos thinks those points are good? Bullshit. Bull-fucking-shit.

Another thing is he is trying to paint my read on him as OMGUS when there is nothing even close to that. I have actually reasons to think he is scum. He isn't trying to figure out my alignment, and to be honest this is kinda funny because all he says is "he did the exact same thing last time he was mafia and i caught him", funnily enough this is the EXACT case i myself made on rsoultin in that game. He is also not not even re-considering his read in any way when marv, who is the only person who can ever read me correctly all the time, heavily disagrees with his read. Instead he decides that we must BOTH be mafia. I find it almost impossible to believe that's what he actually thinks.

There is basically no way Xatalos thinks i am most likely to flip mafia here. I could understand he thinks i am mafia, but not like this, and not for the reasons he pulls out of his ass. He is basically not a person who "yolo's" a scumread like this without digging further into it. If he did, he would see that:
1) my reads are not actually unexplained, nor are the changes on them, it's really easy to see why i do the stuff i do
2) me acting like "i did as mafia" is a pure mischaracterisation of my play.

The read is wrong and lazy as fuck, and misses all the reasoning for me to do things i do (which btw is there if you read closely).


Well, it is OMGUS. It literally went like "Xatalos is prolly just town" -> "oh wait, he scumreads me?" -> "100% scum" in like... a couple of minutes. Your reads ARE very weird and especially their progression. You've pretty much went against anyone currently "under fire" regardless of your previous stances on them. Whenever thread sentiment turns against someone, you conveniently find some scummy post that you forgot about him earlier and vote for him. The same thing repeated with ritoky, GB and me... Town -> scum because of thread sentiment / OMGUS, not because anything actually changed in reality.

Again, this is just not true.
I decided to look further on GB because of what yamato, marv and Vivax said.
I actually dug myself further into ritoky.
I have thought Slam is mafia all game.

Somehow you are incapable of seeing why i did these things, when it should be very clear from my filter. And that is why i think you are scum. You are just painting it as "unexplained read changes" when it's definitely not.


Well, you just said it like it is... Hard defense -> heavy scumread based on thread sentiment, while finding some sort of justification (a single bad post or something) in their filter. It's just too drastic and the timings are too convenient. Slam has been a PoE read, conveniently always staying in the Poe regardless of all the shifts, and now it's OMGUS.

What do you mean "conveniently". Slam did nothing for a good stretch of time, then spam posted the thread. 80% of which was "hey check out why rayn in scum".
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 26 2015 14:08 GMT
#1984
Sorry for dying over the weekend, I got a new job and everyone insisted on my coming out to celebrate. Getting started on catching up.
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 26 2015 16:42 GMT
#2125
im basically never going to vote for Xata or Rayn (maybe rayn in lylo) they're my top town. Loving gumshoe's and BH's recent posting, like chromatically as well. Kind of null about GB, I'd vote him but more on a PoE basis. Honestly dont remember much of VivaxThink there is some good effort to keep things on track from Vivax, though it was pissed away to tell rayn to fuck off basically. Onegu still feels like he's "testing" me so I'm going to let him be for the time being but I really want to OMGUS him. Association to yamato looks shitty too, and yamato has been about as useful as I have this game, except I'm expected to be trash and he's not.

##Vote: Yamato77

also you guys voting rayn while thinking hes town....you're as bad as him for doing that.
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 29 2015 13:44 GMT
#2917
##vote: Xatalos
Placeholder, no one in their right mind will vote him.
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 29 2015 13:50 GMT
#2919
im filtering onegu and gb for the time being since those are the wagons.
Hopeless1der
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States5836 Posts
October 29 2015 16:29 GMT
#2928
##unvote
##Vote: GlowingBear


On October 30 2015 01:12 gumshoe wrote:
##Vote gb

I dont like the tone of his last posts / : the logic hes proposing is just so bad, paticularly bad considering hes one of the first to jump on your dick if you use "wifom'. I'm not sure a townie wouldn't realize how unconvincing they are with arguments like his.

Agree with this, and onegu doesnt seem as bad as GB after reading through their filters. GB is constantly throwing around "but what about this scummy thing thats just like me", seems like trying to deflect from himself.
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