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On January 28 2015 03:26 Half the Sky wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2015 02:40 GlowingBear wrote:
I want every person that is scumreading me to tell me what you're doing so.
I can see only one possible trait and that one is being afk.
I have no fucking idea why you want to lynch me. How long is this going to take me to answer? 1 You took Onegu out of context in a misleading way (pages 14 and 19 of thread) 2 You took me out of context in a misleading way, the read on Toad (pages 14) 3 You took me out of context AGAIN saying I was pushing you based on meta when the opposite was true (page 19) 4 You did not interact with me whilst we were in thread together over an action you thought was scumlike from me, instead you waited to make it as a point just so you could make a point in your notes. Furthermore I INTERACTED WITH YOU. (page 14) 5 VE scumreads you for not solving the game and you don't even give him a good response for how you are (page 17) 6 When I call you out for ignoring my posts you say you are coming up to a random page. I MEAN COME ON. I know you are not new to these games (page 36) 7 Then you go and decide you'll claim scum (page 39). Your lack of activity isn't helping but there is more than enough to scumread you.
i like this summary too. GB drops to lean scum
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On January 28 2015 04:02 GlowingBear wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2015 03:53 VisceraEyes wrote:On January 28 2015 03:11 GlowingBear wrote:On January 28 2015 02:41 VisceraEyes wrote:
GB my reasoning is simple. Your "mind dump" posts looked very much like trying to appear contributory to me. This is exacerbated by the fact that once called out on them you simply stopped doing them. Earlier on in the game your posting had a theme of "BRB guys, I'm reading but I'll BRB I'm doing something else BRB" and since you've returned you've seemed really defensive. You consider risking voting for myself to be defensive? To say that my mind notes posts are forced contribution, I want you to tell me if my reads are fluff. If they aren't fluff, they are actual contribution, so half of your reasons were debunked. ##Vote: GlowingBearI don't have to tell you shit. I don't care if you THINK you've debunked my reasons. Please, tell me again how voting for yourself makes you town. Get lynched, GB. YOU CAN'T SAY I'M FAKING CONTRIBUTION IF I'M ACTUALLY CONTRIBUTING, OF COURSE YOU HAVE TO REASON THINGS WTF VOTING FOR MYSELF IS A RISK MAFIA WOULDN'T TAKE IN AN INSTANT MAJORITY LYNCH WTF AND IT SHOWS YOU THAT I'M NOT BEING DEFENSIVE WHAT'S WRONG WITH YOU?????
can i see how ur reads have developed? You havent been doing much since the first list post...
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Untouchable Votecount
liancourt (2): Toadesstern, Onegu, Eden1892, VisceraEyes
Toadesstern (2): GlowingBear, liancourt, Palmar, Palmar, GlowingBear
GlowingBear (1): Half the Sky, IAmRobik, VisceraEyes, GlowingBear, Palmar, Toadesstern, VisceraEyes
Onegu (1): Eden1892, liancourt
Palmar (0): VisceraEyes, GlowingBear, Eden1892, GlowingBear
IAmRobik (0): GlowingBear, Palmar
Eden1892 (0): liancourt
With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch.
Deadline is in . If no majority is reached before then, the day will be a no lynch.
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On January 28 2015 04:06 Eden1892 wrote:
I have to admit that it's weird that GB would self-vote and retract if he's mafia. You don't self-vote as mafia unless you're planning to have your partner hammer it away to cut off discussion.
please explain more
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On January 28 2015 12:07 IAmRobik wrote:
Eden and Palmar:
I just read pg 50 and am utterly baffled at how you two are analyzing what GB said. He had absolutely no reason to fear being lynched in that spot as mafia and his explanation is total horseshit. "think about the vote" means nothing. LITERALLY NOTHING. You gave him 11 hours to fabricate a reason for the self-vote when it was obvious he was fucking conceding as mafia. Then he comes back with an explataion that is such utter horseshit that I'm amazed that you actually consider it. Am I wrong about you? Are you Adam Sandler from the Waterboy? "I self voted because I knew that mafia wouldn't hammer me" NO SHIT. HE VOTED TO MAKE IT 3 VOTES ON HIM. TOWN IS A BUNCH OF PUSSIES AND ABSOLUTELY NEVER EVER EVER hammer in that spot. It just doesn't hammer. And if someone votes him (like palmar did), he can just unvote mere minutes later. I'm literally blown away by the stupidity in this thread from people whose play I actually respect.
I don't know if I can even keep reading what happens from pg 51-53 because my hands are shaking that's how mad I am
He got to L-1 with other people going "yeah I could lynch GB." What part of that wouldn't be reason to fear being lynched? I don't follow you.
I do not understand why you're so mad either. What's wrong? There's plenty of time to kill him if you're right and convincing.
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i'm looking at pg 45 and the vote analysis is just...meh it's like total wifom. To bus or not to bus....to hammer town as mafia...having 2 mafia on town pre emptively...it's a really wide specualtion with so many different opinions. Unless someone actually hammers and flips this thing we're doing on pg 45...seems like a good way to make a discussion go in circles.
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On January 28 2015 12:27 liancourt wrote:
i'm looking at pg 45 and the vote analysis is just...meh it's like total wifom. To bus or not to bus....to hammer town as mafia...having 2 mafia on town pre emptively...it's a really wide specualtion with so many different opinions. Unless someone actually hammers and flips this thing we're doing on pg 45...seems like a good way to make a discussion go in circles.
How can you keep making posts that say absolutely nothing with almost all of your posts?
Plus would you have hammered GB?
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On January 28 2015 12:36 Onegu wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2015 12:27 liancourt wrote:
i'm looking at pg 45 and the vote analysis is just...meh it's like total wifom. To bus or not to bus....to hammer town as mafia...having 2 mafia on town pre emptively...it's a really wide specualtion with so many different opinions. Unless someone actually hammers and flips this thing we're doing on pg 45...seems like a good way to make a discussion go in circles. How can you keep making posts that say absolutely nothing with almost all of your posts?
a+
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On January 28 2015 07:53 Eden1892 wrote:
OK, so back to it. I think GlowingBear is town, because:
(a) His lynch has been way too easy. We could have had him already several times if we'd wanted it, and I think if this weren't IML he would have been lynched by now.
(b) I'm inclined to believe him when he says he had a plan with his self-voting. I don't know what the plan is, and he's gonna have to explain it or get lynched, but pending a reasonable-sounding explanation, I'll believe that he's town.
From there I'm gonna go look at the other players. I'm town and I feel pretty strongly that Half the Sky is as well.
The first player I'm looking at is Onegu, because like I said before, if GlowingBear is town, then Onegu is town as well. I explained this early on p46, feel free to look back and see. Onegu is town.
I have a bad feeling about both Robik and Palmar. Robik has been very loud and animated about lynching GlowingBear, who I believe now to be town, and has done very little - nothing noteworthy enough for me to remember, anyway - outside of talking about killing GlowingBear. And from what I recall his original reasoning wasn't very good. Furthermore, I really didn't like the "playing to wincon" part of his accusation against GB. As I noted before, the only way Robik can accuse GB of not playing to win con as confidently as he did is if he knows GB is town, because mafia self-hammering can absolutely be part of the mafia win con (whereas town self-hammering never is part of town win con). Perhaps I'm getting greedy; I don't really believe in "scumslips." But I kinda think this was one.
Palmar, on the other hand, I feel more confident is mafia. I noted on p47 that Palmar seemed like a slightly more exaggerated version of himself in this game; he seemed to be more aggressively trolly/apathetic to start the day and then more aggressively active/ostensibly-helpful once that stopped. In my (limited) experience with Palmar as town, he tends to ease his way into a game; there's very little pushing to the degree he's done here, and his warmup process is slower and smoother. He doesn't go from 0 to 90 fucks given like he has here; it's more of a steady press on the give-a-fuck accelerator. It feels like he dropped a brick on the accelerator this game, like he was trying to make sure no one could question that he was being active and involved now.
Then there's his vote for GlowingBear... HTS already noted it. It's a policy vote, not a vote for mafia. The problem is that it's a policy vote based on GB martyring that's stayed on GB after GB retracted his self-vote. Policy votes are meant to be done to discourage the behavior triggering the policy vote. For them to be effective, then, there must be an incentive to revoke the behavior - a revoked vote in exchange. Palmar hasn't met GB halfway. If he really cares about the policy being effective, why is he not retracting his vote? On the other hand, if Palmar was just looking for a nice-sounding reason to put a vote down on GB (L-1 no less) and walk away, it makes perfect sense.
Toad and VE are still in my null pile; I don't see myself pursuing either of them as lynches today. liancourt, I still think is probably town because I can put myself in what I project to be his shoes and make sense of it from a townie POV.
##UNVOTE: Onegu
##VOTE: Palmar
eden eden eden...what are you doing man...i disagree with practically everything in this post because this is based on vote analysis. Am I correct in understanding that this is all based on gb self voting and him not being hammered and etc. The thinking behind if gb = town ergo onegu = town...i don't know how you come to this conclusion. If this equation makes sense to you then certainly if gb = scum ergo onegu = scum will make sense to you also. Yes? I don't understand how this post came about.
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On January 28 2015 09:59 GlowingBear wrote:
Eden, I've got home.
Ok, listen.
An idea crossed my mind: if I vote myself, I would be two votes away from being hammered.
Obvious scum would get me lynched quickly if both mafia voted me. If that happened, well, town would figure it out very quickly and game over for them.
If both mafia were already voting for me, all they needed to do was to try to convince the thread to vote me.
But what I think would be the most smart play for mafia would be to be airtime wishy washy but then quickly voting me and finally waiting for a townie to vote for me. The guy who would hammer a town would be VERY suspicious. This way, mafia avoids responsibility and gets a townie mislynched.
You see, if you see someone voting for himself, SPECIALLY in an instant majority game like this, you HAVE to take a step back and consider what's going on. You can't jumping to the lynch too quickly because you risk getting a townie mislynched. You have to think about what's going on.
You understand what I'm trying to say here? I voted myself expecting a mafia behaviour, and I saw that behaviour on Palmar.
gb can you like give us reads instead of explaining your very wifomish play of self voting. It's like a townie/mafia fake claiming cop for no reason.
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On January 28 2015 12:41 liancourt wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2015 07:53 Eden1892 wrote:
OK, so back to it. I think GlowingBear is town, because:
(a) His lynch has been way too easy. We could have had him already several times if we'd wanted it, and I think if this weren't IML he would have been lynched by now.
(b) I'm inclined to believe him when he says he had a plan with his self-voting. I don't know what the plan is, and he's gonna have to explain it or get lynched, but pending a reasonable-sounding explanation, I'll believe that he's town.
From there I'm gonna go look at the other players. I'm town and I feel pretty strongly that Half the Sky is as well.
The first player I'm looking at is Onegu, because like I said before, if GlowingBear is town, then Onegu is town as well. I explained this early on p46, feel free to look back and see. Onegu is town.
I have a bad feeling about both Robik and Palmar. Robik has been very loud and animated about lynching GlowingBear, who I believe now to be town, and has done very little - nothing noteworthy enough for me to remember, anyway - outside of talking about killing GlowingBear. And from what I recall his original reasoning wasn't very good. Furthermore, I really didn't like the "playing to wincon" part of his accusation against GB. As I noted before, the only way Robik can accuse GB of not playing to win con as confidently as he did is if he knows GB is town, because mafia self-hammering can absolutely be part of the mafia win con (whereas town self-hammering never is part of town win con). Perhaps I'm getting greedy; I don't really believe in "scumslips." But I kinda think this was one.
Palmar, on the other hand, I feel more confident is mafia. I noted on p47 that Palmar seemed like a slightly more exaggerated version of himself in this game; he seemed to be more aggressively trolly/apathetic to start the day and then more aggressively active/ostensibly-helpful once that stopped. In my (limited) experience with Palmar as town, he tends to ease his way into a game; there's very little pushing to the degree he's done here, and his warmup process is slower and smoother. He doesn't go from 0 to 90 fucks given like he has here; it's more of a steady press on the give-a-fuck accelerator. It feels like he dropped a brick on the accelerator this game, like he was trying to make sure no one could question that he was being active and involved now.
Then there's his vote for GlowingBear... HTS already noted it. It's a policy vote, not a vote for mafia. The problem is that it's a policy vote based on GB martyring that's stayed on GB after GB retracted his self-vote. Policy votes are meant to be done to discourage the behavior triggering the policy vote. For them to be effective, then, there must be an incentive to revoke the behavior - a revoked vote in exchange. Palmar hasn't met GB halfway. If he really cares about the policy being effective, why is he not retracting his vote? On the other hand, if Palmar was just looking for a nice-sounding reason to put a vote down on GB (L-1 no less) and walk away, it makes perfect sense.
Toad and VE are still in my null pile; I don't see myself pursuing either of them as lynches today. liancourt, I still think is probably town because I can put myself in what I project to be his shoes and make sense of it from a townie POV.
##UNVOTE: Onegu
##VOTE: Palmar eden eden eden...what are you doing man...i disagree with practically everything in this post because this is based on vote analysis. Am I correct in understanding that this is all based on gb self voting and him not being hammered and etc. The thinking behind if gb = town ergo onegu = town...i don't know how you come to this conclusion. If this equation makes sense to you then certainly if gb = scum ergo onegu = scum will make sense to you also. Yes? I don't understand how this post came about.
Why did you quote this big post with multiple reads in it, dismiss all of it as being about vote analysis when it isn't, and then pick at one point out of these and act like I didn't explain it when I explicitly said "go read on p46 where I explained this" in the post??
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On January 28 2015 10:21 GlowingBear wrote:
Palmar, everything you say enters in contradiction.
You said you could have hammered me.
Then I show you knew you wouldn't
Then you say that you didn't want the day to end
Then I say that it doesn't make sense because if you didn't want he day to end you shouldn't be voting me at the first place
Then you say that if I flipped town it would tell a lot about the person who hammered me, when I clearly stated the opposite: that scum would avoid hammering to deflect attention, and again, this goes against th idea of the day not ending.
you keep elaborating on things that are total wifom.
Mafia can hammer.
Mafia can not vote at all
Mafia can bus
Mafia can vote early.
You aren't convincing me like this using wifomish reasons
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Starting to agree with Onegu tbh. liancourt getting 3 strikes right now:
- I don't get where he's coming from on a lot of his posts and the thinking behind them seems lazy/poorly developed. Unfortunately, and I don't mean this insultingly, but I don't know if he's a better town player than to play like this.
- He's in my POE pile.
- His only targets have been people who suspected him at some point. Combined with me not understanding his reads and I get this vague sense he's just posting to post, like Onegu said.
It's weird 'cause he asks GB how his reads have developed, which is a decent question to ask if you're looking for mafia, but I feel like he would totally fail that question himself because so much of his suspecting people is omgus.
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Also these catchup posts are brutal. Most of them don't seem to have any coherent direction to them.
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On January 28 2015 11:56 IAmRobik wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2015 07:53 Eden1892 wrote:
OK, so back to it. I think GlowingBear is town, because:
(a) His lynch has been way too easy. We could have had him already several times if we'd wanted it, and I think if this weren't IML he would have been lynched by now.
(b) I'm inclined to believe him when he says he had a plan with his self-voting. I don't know what the plan is, and he's gonna have to explain it or get lynched, but pending a reasonable-sounding explanation, I'll believe that he's town.
From there I'm gonna go look at the other players. I'm town and I feel pretty strongly that Half the Sky is as well.
The first player I'm looking at is Onegu, because like I said before, if GlowingBear is town, then Onegu is town as well. I explained this early on p46, feel free to look back and see. Onegu is town.
I have a bad feeling about both Robik and Palmar. Robik has been very loud and animated about lynching GlowingBear, who I believe now to be town, and has done very little - nothing noteworthy enough for me to remember, anyway - outside of talking about killing GlowingBear. And from what I recall his original reasoning wasn't very good. Furthermore, I really didn't like the "playing to wincon" part of his accusation against GB. As I noted before, the only way Robik can accuse GB of not playing to win con as confidently as he did is if he knows GB is town, because mafia self-hammering can absolutely be part of the mafia win con (whereas town self-hammering never is part of town win con). Perhaps I'm getting greedy; I don't really believe in "scumslips." But I kinda think this was one.
Palmar, on the other hand, I feel more confident is mafia. I noted on p47 that Palmar seemed like a slightly more exaggerated version of himself in this game; he seemed to be more aggressively trolly/apathetic to start the day and then more aggressively active/ostensibly-helpful once that stopped. In my (limited) experience with Palmar as town, he tends to ease his way into a game; there's very little pushing to the degree he's done here, and his warmup process is slower and smoother. He doesn't go from 0 to 90 fucks given like he has here; it's more of a steady press on the give-a-fuck accelerator. It feels like he dropped a brick on the accelerator this game, like he was trying to make sure no one could question that he was being active and involved now.
Then there's his vote for GlowingBear... HTS already noted it. It's a policy vote, not a vote for mafia. The problem is that it's a policy vote based on GB martyring that's stayed on GB after GB retracted his self-vote. Policy votes are meant to be done to discourage the behavior triggering the policy vote. For them to be effective, then, there must be an incentive to revoke the behavior - a revoked vote in exchange. Palmar hasn't met GB halfway. If he really cares about the policy being effective, why is he not retracting his vote? On the other hand, if Palmar was just looking for a nice-sounding reason to put a vote down on GB (L-1 no less) and walk away, it makes perfect sense.
Toad and VE are still in my null pile; I don't see myself pursuing either of them as lynches today. liancourt, I still think is probably town because I can put myself in what I project to be his shoes and make sense of it from a townie POV.
##UNVOTE: Onegu
##VOTE: Palmar your premise for GB being town is completely misguided. Do you not understand why?
yes misguided based on faulty logic
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On January 28 2015 12:07 IAmRobik wrote:
Eden and Palmar:
I just read pg 50 and am utterly baffled at how you two are analyzing what GB said. He had absolutely no reason to fear being lynched in that spot as mafia and his explanation is total horseshit. "think about the vote" means nothing. LITERALLY NOTHING. You gave him 11 hours to fabricate a reason for the self-vote when it was obvious he was fucking conceding as mafia. Then he comes back with an explataion that is such utter horseshit that I'm amazed that you actually consider it. Am I wrong about you? Are you Adam Sandler from the Waterboy? "I self voted because I knew that mafia wouldn't hammer me" NO SHIT. HE VOTED TO MAKE IT 3 VOTES ON HIM. TOWN IS A BUNCH OF PUSSIES AND ABSOLUTELY NEVER EVER EVER hammer in that spot. It just doesn't hammer. And if someone votes him (like palmar did), he can just unvote mere minutes later. I'm literally blown away by the stupidity in this thread from people whose play I actually respect.
I don't know if I can even keep reading what happens from pg 51-53 because my hands are shaking that's how mad I am
i'm liking robok more and more
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On January 28 2015 12:36 Onegu wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2015 12:27 liancourt wrote:
i'm looking at pg 45 and the vote analysis is just...meh it's like total wifom. To bus or not to bus....to hammer town as mafia...having 2 mafia on town pre emptively...it's a really wide specualtion with so many different opinions. Unless someone actually hammers and flips this thing we're doing on pg 45...seems like a good way to make a discussion go in circles. How can you keep making posts that say absolutely nothing with almost all of your posts? Plus would you have hammered GB?
nope but i'd like reads from him before i decide to whether or not vote on him
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ugh please make it stop
this is like watching sandpaper scratch a chalkboard drying
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Town - people i agree with
lian
hts
robik
ve
palmar
null
eden - i dont agree with how he thinks gb and onegu can be town. I don't understand it at all.
toad - What exactly has this guy done lately???
scum
gb - I don't like his explanation of his self vote all wifomy, and he hasnt given a progression of his reads.
onegu - Hasn't done anything townie since my last read on him. Has he been giving reads, I don't think so.
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liancourt: Why are you responding to things that happened hours after the fact seemingly at random with virtually no followup questions to the players whose posts you're addressing?
Specific to me, why do you repeatedly criticize my logic on GB/Onegu without actually (a) asking me about my logic, (b) posting your reasons for disagreeing with my logic or even (c) acknowledging at all that you've actually seen the post in which I explained my logic?
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EPT
