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Went back and analyzed both Artanis's and GK's filter. While we can only speculate on why they got shot we do know that they got shot for a reason
People have already tried to get a grip of the GK-shot. Most people had him as townie after D1 IIRC so it makes a bit of sense to shoot him none the less. He was also suspcious of mderg. What I haven't seen someone say (and this may be because I simply missed it, CBA to look through all pages really...) is that he was pushing Release quite a bit. This makes Release look a little worse IMO.
As for Artanis's filter its kinda hard. I think he got shot simply for the fact that he was a town read for basically everyone.
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On June 26 2014 07:59 YouKnowZhou wrote:Show nested quote +On June 26 2014 07:25 Lazermonkey wrote:On June 26 2014 07:13 YouKnowZhou wrote:On June 26 2014 06:51 Lazermonkey wrote:
I actually urge you to look at SlOosh filter. I mean, Also look at my filter and look for stuff about SlOosh. Even if you are 100% sure I'm scum you still need to figure out the other scum. I've explained several times why I think he is scum already, including:
- Defends mderg alot. Yet he gives very weak/no reasoning on why he is defending mderg. It boils down to him saying that he doesn't like the mderg lynch.
- ALL of his major pushes has been on people that are town (Artanis, VE, Bunnies, me) except for YKZ. And since I think YKZ supertown, this also implies that SlOosh has only really pushed town this game. I'm aware of the fact that you don't know my alignment nor do you know YKZ's alignment but keep this point in mind when I flip since this should also increase your townread on YKZ.
- Is very eager to vote YKZ over me D3. Yet now he completly drops his read on YKZ to focus only on me. Isn't this convenient given that I am the number 1 lynch target?
I'd also like to point out, once again, that I think Release's reason for thinking that SlOosh is town is BS. While asking question IS good, it is very non-commital. Telling people to stop creating chaos is also good but once again, non-commital. Look LM what I'm trying to get at here is that if you're dead anyways, let's just make the best of it. I still think you have a decent chance of flipping town, but let's be real here: there's a red check on you. You have to be lynched. So I'm not 100% sure you're scum, but I *am* 100% sure you're getting lynched today. The first step to being productive with the next 24 hours is going to be you accepting that you're getting lynched and making the best of it. So when it comes down to it, your case on sloOsh consists of him pushing townies and defending mderg with faulty reasoning, and on D4 focusing you over me (I'm assuming you're talking about before chez claimed a goon check on you). Does this accurately characterize your reasons for wanting to lynch him? Sure, I'm cool with dying. Yes, that's basically the reason I think SlOosh is scum. Given your response, it seems like you are not sharing my views, am I correct? Some more things: -Snickers, I remember someone giving pretty solid arguments for why he was town. I don't really remember who or where but I remember getting convinced. His reads are just super off but yhea. Probably town here, agree/disagree? -Release, I think his play is also really off. At first I thought that he was pretty confirmed town for his mderg vote but his vote actually came after mderg super wierd vote on Snickers. I'm getting a feeling that Release might have understood that mderg just fucked up too bad to be able to save in a good way at that point. I was summarizing. I'll take a look at the faulty reasoning of mderg defense, which is typically more telling of scum than just happening to push townies imo. The question isn't what a player does, but HOW the player does it. town can be right and town can be wrong, but they are right or wrong for reasons that make sense, at least to a townie. If SloOsh was really defending mderg for reasons that don't make sense then that's a solid reason for a scumread. I did not like release before D3. However, throughout D3 he was willing to engage me and we had many long conversations, when I feel like as scum he just wouldn't have interacted in such a meaningful way. That being said, I'll take a look at my interactions with him and see if anything seemed off. Snickers' chief point against him (in addition to some blantantly anti town play) is that he voted for mderg D1 but not D2, just like you and VE did. I don't like him. Show nested quote +On June 26 2014 07:46 Lazermonkey wrote:
Went back and analyzed both Artanis's and GK's filter. While we can only speculate on why they got shot we do know that they got shot for a reason
People have already tried to get a grip of the GK-shot. Most people had him as townie after D1 IIRC so it makes a bit of sense to shoot him none the less. He was also suspcious of mderg. What I haven't seen someone say (and this may be because I simply missed it, CBA to look through all pages really...) is that he was pushing Release quite a bit. This makes Release look a little worse IMO.
As for Artanis's filter its kinda hard. I think he got shot simply for the fact that he was a town read for basically everyone. In terms of the Artanis shot, it seems very straightforward to me. He was the doc and scum needed to shoot him. The fact that scum shot him and not Chez means they probably didn't have an RB, else they'd have RBed him and killed the cop right away. Also, yes, like literally everyone had a townread on Artanis.
Okay. Totally agree on the part about the difference about defending townies. While you pushing Bunnies to death didn't exactly make you look super good, you could at least look at you and tell what exactly it were that you found scummy with Bunnies.
I'll go to bed now. Will be able to post a bit tomorrow as well. Everyone, I urge you not to just wait for my flip. Use the time wisely. I'd be happy to answer questions also, since I'll be modconfirmed townie in about 24 hours. Don't ask me question about myself though. I know I will be lynched.
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I'm not really sure what to say. If it is true that we have 2 investigative roles + a doctor then I'd say scum are bound to have at least 1 power role to counter act that. More likely they have 2. This is obviously a bunch of speculation but something like goon/GF/framer scumteam would seem very resonable to me, especially since it would fuck with the 2 investigative roles. Otherwise the setup would be very town favoured.
This is IF both claims are true, which isn't necessarily the case. I find Snickers fake-claiming unlikely. Partly because of what YKZ pointed out earlier and partly why would you claim to have a town read on me at this state of the game as scum? Chezinu's claim, on the other hand, could be fake. I'm still unsure of why YKZ was so sure that Chezinu was doctor this whole time so therefore I cannot really go in to far on this issue. But from my PoV it does seem fishy that he claims to have gotten a goon check on me. I can't really argue much with this since I could very well have been framed. However, I DO think it is important that we do not regard Chez as confirmed town unless we have very good reasons to.
If you lynch me, which is still likely, the fact that I flip green will obviously point towards that Snickers is in fact sane. It is, however, possible that he is insane and that I got framed but based purely on probabilty, I don't think this is the case. I would also argue that I'm a pretty bad frame target since I was very likely to get lynched no matter what, thus cops/detectives are more unlikely to check me.
So, who do I want to lynch then? Koshi. By process of elimination I know that YKZ is likely town. Chez and Snickers are likely town (and also are the guys that will get shot, thus wasting lynches on them is bad). SlOosh I dislike but his green check means that he is likely town. This leaves Release and Koshi. The fact that Koshi has been scummier in general this game makes me want to kill him over Release. But I'm obviously willing to kill anyone in order to survive at this point...
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EBWOP: Chezinu was the cop*
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Forgive me trippleposting...
So, what was it that I really wanted to say here? Well, we could argue all day about checks and what not but the fact remains that it is far more likely that a check is correct than incorrect. I know this puts me in a wierd spot since I've got one check on me saying I'm scum and one on me saying I'm town. But yhea. Kill Koshi.
##Vote: Koshi
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Actually, your right YKZ. Goon/GF/Framer would basically mean that the investigative roles are counterproduvtive. But Goon/GF/medic or Goon/Framer/medic all makes sense, especially since there was a town medic.
@Koshi
On June 27 2014 03:52 Koshi wrote:
He does BH. I asked.
Lazer is scum for thinking a greenchecks makes him look good. Especially after his D2/N2. A redcheck would have been actually made him look good.
Snickers is also a sane cop or mafia.
Lewut? Please explain how a red check makes me more town...
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On June 27 2014 03:30 Snickers wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 03:18 YouKnowZhou wrote:On June 27 2014 03:02 Snickers wrote:
Also just thought about something interesting. I am not 100% sure about this but lets consider something. YKZ hard pushes 27nb on day one. Relatively early. Same thing day two with VE. Now day three he has not pushed anyone yet, but only six hour till deadline? His biggest move so far was defending Lazer. Looking likely those two are scum. > claims to be cop > doesn't know what day it is, or who has been lynched on what day Amazingly, It's not even like he's scum for this, either. I'm sure scum would be keenly aware that it is in fact Day 4. I wish I could call Snickers scum. There just aren't words appropriate for a mafia game for me to say that would adequately define my opinion of a case against me based on the fact that D1 and D2 I mislynched 27nb and VE, and now on "D3" I'm defending LM. Like, not only is it not D3, but on D2 it was mderg that was lynched, and oh my god I can't even deal with this guy lol thats the first decent size mistake i made in this game. A lot of a mistake than all the people that did not even read the roles. Anyway, day one hard pushed 27nb early Day two was hard pushing me I guess, will look into it when I get time before the lynch. Day three hard push ve early. Day four defend lazer early. And it is weird that Lazer says YKZ is town before me and chezinu.
I never said I thought YKZ was more town than you...
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On June 27 2014 04:00 Snickers wrote:
I'm an insane or sane detective And why would I be mafia . I thought u thought I was town.
Ockhams razor tells me that you are sane though. If you are insane it means that you have hit like all the framed dudes in a row and/or hit 2 scum. While it is not impossible, its still the most likely scenario. Especially from my PoV because I know that if you are insane the only way you could've got a green check on me is if I was framed.
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EBWOP: its still the most unlikely scenario*
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Am I retarded or something? I really don't get Koshi's argument at all.
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Okay. What say you about the fact that SlOosh just went away this day? Release also lurks alot this day. This to me would imply scum since they know that they are safe no matter what.
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Release I'm not sure if your stupidly biased as town or just scum.
I've said nomerous times that I'm not interested in defending myself anymore. I'm dead. Even before the checks I was dead. If you disagree, then read my filter and vote Koshi. But all this "Hey, if you want to look town, answer this" when in fact that's exactly what I would do if I was scum.
I'm interested in discussing things though. I will be confirmed townie at deadline so while I may be wrong about some stuff, you'll at least know that everything I said came from a townie. I cba to read all your filter but here are some questions that may or may not increase town chance to win this game.
-What do you think about YKZ? Why?
-What do you think about SlOosh? Why?
-What do you think about Koshi? Why?
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Release, lets play the game when I'm not scum then. Even if you are totaly convinced that I am.
Basically what you are saying is that YKZ's D1 play is what makes you think he is scum. I'm guessing his push on Bunnies is what you are refering to more specifically, right? Is there something else or is this the major reason you think he is scum?
Regarding SlOosh, I've said it in the past and I'm saying it again. Why is it that his anti-chaos play so town-telling? Once again, yes, anti-chaos play does help town but it is very non-commital. His D1 was lacking hard stances as he was more focusing on asking questions and things that didn't put him under the spot-light.
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On June 27 2014 06:25 slOosh wrote:Like look here, Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 03:20 Lazermonkey wrote:
So, who do I want to lynch then? Koshi. By process of elimination I know that YKZ is likely town. Chez and Snickers are likely town (and also are the guys that will get shot, thus wasting lynches on them is bad). SlOosh I dislike but his green check means that he is likely town. This leaves Release and Koshi. The fact that Koshi has been scummier in general this game makes me want to kill him over Release. But I'm obviously willing to kill anyone in order to survive at this point... Lazermonkey is spending time trying to convince Release that his town read on me is flawed. This is totally inconsistent with what he just said a page ago, that he likely finds me town based on checks, and Release more scummy than me. If anything, he should be convincing me why Release is scum. But he isn't, because he is scum and flailing around. I mean, I don't want to cut down on anyone, but I think it's really really super duper evident that Lazermonkey is scum, and I don't need to point out how everything he says indicates so.
Am I the only one who thinks this post is super off? It seems like SlOosh still is trying to push me like fuck. Why is he refusing so hard to do any real analysis? SlOosh is justifying him doing absolutely nothing the last cycle.
I gave up trying to save myself sooo long ago. And yes, I'm flip flopping like fuck because guess what? I can say whatever I like. I'm simply being open with what I say and increasing the chance of town winning the game. If I had to guess right now, SlOosh isn't scum and I'd rather say Koshi/Release is likelier. But yhea, I could be wrong.
Also, going to bed soon. If there are more questions please ask.
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On June 27 2014 06:35 Release wrote:
Lazer, forget the checks. Reread YKZ day 1. How do you feel about him and why?
Obviously, pushing a confirmed town over scum IS bad. No matter how you turn it. However, YKZ was always clear with why Bunnies was scum. I didn't agree with him or his case on Bunnies but the point here is that he could very well be a townie that is just wrong. People are wrong. People make stupid cases, gets biased etc.
If we compare that with say, SlOosh. SlOosh defended mderg pretty hard. But it was very unclear why he did that. That is something I think is far more scummy than what YKZ did.
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On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?
I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal. I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys. Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today.
Holy fuck...
Lynch this dude please...
##Unvote
##Vote: Chez
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On June 27 2014 06:50 Release wrote:
What about the fact that others told him that he was wrong and he still insisted that he was right?
Waitwat? Are we talking about YKZ now? This is like how mafia works... I'm don't even understand why you bring up this argument. if I said that you were wrong (about me) would you be wrong about me?
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On June 27 2014 06:25 Release wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 05:49 Snickers wrote:
Release is starting to look scummy again. Someone mentions his name, bam he's in the thread. Because it feels like I make a post then everyone ignores it (and therefore my posts are meaningless). When someone mentions my name, they want my opinion and therefore my posts are not meaningless. Interpret that however you please. Pretty much YKZ's D1 is what makes him scum. Because when the thread is filled with tunneling, OMGUS, and is primarily focused on a single battle, asking questions leads us to consider other options. I agree that his passiveness is noteworthy, but even with that, I do not think that it outweighs what I perceive to be his information-gathering agenda. + Show Spoiler +having said that, if he says absolutely nothing until the end of the day and you do flip town, that would make me feel that he is suspicious to similar levels as that which I felt about Snickers D2 (which in hindsight was just timing issues). Afk complete peace out is not tolerable, even more so than 48 hour dinner since YKZ actually did something prior to D2 deadline
First part seems like you are justifying the fact that you aren't giving out reads in a very bad way. That is at least how I interpret it.
So basically, YKZ being wrong=>YKZ is scum. Do you really believe this logic yourself. Also, have you even considered what he has done since then?`He was the fucking dude that got mderg lynched.
Are you not reading or refusing to understand? I never said that asking questions and such was bad. It IS, however, non-commital. Its at most a sliiight town tell but mostly null.
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Waitwaitwaitwaitwaitwait.
So Chezinu fake-claiming makes my lynch like 1000 times worse. You are basically lynching a green-check. That seems pretty bad the last time I checked.
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On June 27 2014 06:59 Chezinu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 06:50 Lazermonkey wrote:On June 27 2014 06:40 Chezinu wrote:On June 26 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
Wait. Chezinu did you get a goon result from LM? Because that actually means he is town. You lied about the check right?
I just realized that a goon check is most likely a frame job. Scum can't look like a goon. Unless the framer frames himself or gf like a goon. I can't believe 3 powerroles vs 1 powerrole in a normal mini. 3 vs 2 is normal. I never said I got goon back. I'm not even a cop. lol I just know things like... art is medic. When someone hands Chezinu a awesome role to pretend to be.. I couldn't resist... Sorry for pulling a Caller on you guys. Also, sorry for taking a while to respond. Twas busy today. Holy fuck... Lynch this dude please... ##Unvote
##Vote: Chez LOL The luxuries of being confirmed town
Am I missing something? When were you confirmed town?
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EPT
