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off topic: i didn't closely watch shadow mafia but man if marv plays that way then a scum marv+suki team would be unstoppable o_O
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hypothetically. It's actually been a few games since I rolled scum and I'm not sure if I could emulate my town mannerisms and attitude. The game that everyone is praising me to be scum I was very calculating and 'robotic', as one person put it. these past few town games not so much.
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Hm...
Call it a hunch, but I'm going to go with Hopeless. I think Oats is town and I he's convinced me that sidesprang is the better lynch for today. I also feel like trusting his meta read on Coag.
I also buy the 'sidesprang's reasons are all bad' argument as when sidesprang was town he actually had some decent arguments on why someone is scummy. This game it's all meta reads and kind-of vote analysis.
##unvote
##vote Sidesprang
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errr
EBWOP: Call it a hunch, but I'm going to go with Oats.*
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Yeah sure I can explain why I get a town vibe off Oats:
He is active, and in a way that contributes to town. He pressures people with good questions, has no problem aggressively pressuring people. He's also excited about this game. Note all the caps, the wagon of justice, he seems very vested in the outcome of the game.
His vote against me and the follow up pressure felt very townie. He was trying to expose contradictions or illogical thought process in my play.
He sheeps onto Jonny and straight up states it without providing reasons really. He didn't pressure Jonny either. However, Oats has always been fluid with his reads so I can see him doing it as town. His attitude is good here. Rather than meekly going on the wagon or trying to come up with excuses he just straight up does it and doesn't care.
The hunch part of my previous post just now was based on his defense of Coag. It just feels really townie although I can't really explain it. I do see where Oats is coming from with his line of thought, so, given my town read of Oats I am inclined to trust him.
Also Oat's case against sidesprang makes totes sense.
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Can we get a vote count please oh wise and powerful toad?
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Yay guys  
I think Day 2 went well for us. Everybody contributed. We should be able to root out the last scum from this.
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Hopeless, if I'm scum what do you think my long term plan is by bussing Sidesprang Day 2?
What are your thoughts on Aqua's defense of Sidesprang Day2?
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Some analysis on who Sidesprang and Jonny voted on and were suspicious of:
JonnyLaw's picks for Day 1 : Koshi, LoneMeow, Alakaslam.
Sidesprang's watchlist for Day 1: Jonny, Jay, Oats
Sidesprang's list of people to look into on Day 2: Slam, Hopeless, Oats
- If Sidesprang is asking us to 'look into' them, I'm pretty sure this probably means they're in the clear. After all, scum would not want to draw attention to his teammate.
Sidesprang stated:
On February 11 2014 15:11 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On February 11 2014 03:22 LoneMeow wrote:On February 10 2014 17:17 sidesprang wrote:On February 10 2014 12:30 suki wrote:
##vote Coagulation
I see that Oats has posted a bunch. I want to hear from Sidesprang. Specifically these questions:
1. Who is your number one lynch at the moment for Day 2 and why?
2. Who is scummy to you?
3. Comments on the Jonny lynch and the events leading up to it.
I'll comment on Oats in the morning when I'm not tired and I really hope to see something from Sidesprang. I would prefer to lynch Oats, reasons being. He hardly mentioned jonny, had no reasons for voting him. Has two suspect townreads (hopeless / JayB). He is also not being very helpfull to town. People who is leaning scum to me is Oats, You, Coag, Hopeless. Pretty much in that order I think. Koshi and Balla lead the lynch, they were too me the two guys looking most towny. Koshi prolly died because of it. 3 guys have votes that they pretty much did not explain. You had Jonny as second lynch (I think), but for some reason was very reluctant to get JayB lynched instead. I feel usualy town when having two scumreads are happy lynching either atleast when its such a landslide in votes. The fact that you are no dropping him completly for the day while having gone that hard for him I don't understand. Anyhow, off too school. I'll check in when I got time. There's a few people you don't mention here as either town or scum. What do you think about their alignments and why? I guess it dont hurt to mention the rest of the reads as I think most of the players are on the same page. I'm town on Balla Aqua JayB Balla because he lead the lynch, and I think his play in general have been pretty much towny through and through. He is also posting way more than he is doing in his scumgames (tho I think he is aware of this meta, so might not be that much of a tell). Aqua was also early on the lynch, and made his own case for it. I like his posts in general, feels like he is really trying to solve the game. JayB is town because his blueclaim and his N1 play. People I'm null on LoneMeow Hopeless TBH I have not read up much on you, mostly because I never got any bad vibes. But i've not really gotten any good ones either. You were early on the coag lynch I think, so that might turn out beneficial for you. Altho If coag flips scum I would not be suprised if he was bussed early eiher. But I guess that is somthing we deal with tomorrow. I was leaning slightly scummy towards hopeless, but I think he might be climbing towards null with his big suki post. I at least think its way more likely the scum is in the remaining three.
I think this actually gives us a roadmap to the finish. I doubt Hopeless is scum because Sidesprang was trying to create suspicion against Hopeless. I also doubt LoneMeow is scum because both Jonny and Sidesprang have stated their suspicions on LoneMeow.
No comment on his statements to me, you guys can figure that out for yourself.
Coag is pretty much confirmed town because sidesprang was trying to push that lynch. Plus Coag is now active and contributing so yay.
Thus, I think the final scum lies in Aqua and Jay, based purely on the actions of our flipped scum.
More analysis soon.
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I went into Aqua's filter with the idea 'Aqua is scum' and not even all the way through I just can't see it.
1. His back and forth with sidesprang felt very natural.
2. Day 1 he hard pushes a Jonny lynch, during N1 he comments on me:
On February 09 2014 13:43 Aquanim wrote:On Suki: Trolly and more importantly content-free start to the game set off serious alarm bells for me at the time. I'm not yet sure how much weight to give that phase of the game as opposed to her greater amount of content later. Hopeless said it very well here: Show nested quote +On February 09 2014 07:28 Hopeless1der wrote:
I agree that suki hasnt been playing scummy but I still have this nagging feeling about her. I'll try to look into why later tonight. Suki's been contributing her thoughts to the thread and trying to push a lynch but... something feels a little weird. I should have a better thought-out opinion on Suki later.
He says something seems a bit weird. This is an obvious segway into Suki is scum.
On February 10 2014 06:29 Aquanim wrote:These aren't my best thought-out reads ever, but I have some faith that if I get shot here you guys will be fine anyway. On Suki: + Show Spoiler +Points for town: - Pushed scumreads (Sidesprang, JayB) in the thread
- Seems to be trying to draw information into the thread e.g. here, here
Both of these she did as scum in LI I guess, but I'd be deeply suspicious if they weren't here. Moving on.
- Scumread on JayB was kind of reasonable, his cases on Koshi and Alak definitely looked incredibly sketchy
- Posts feel... well, natural. Suki seemed genuinely aggreived that the thread sentiment was against her point of view. (e.g. here, here)
Points for scum: - Pushed a different wagon to a scum lynch. Pretty basic one here.
- Didn't back off jayB even after the blue soft-claim.
Well, to be honest, those lists didn't help me much. Anyway... I don't feel like the blue-claim argument is a slam-dunk on Suki. In Newbie XXXI I remember pushing a lynch on Oatsmaster, and continuing to push it after he straight-up claimed doctor because I didn't believe him. I was mislynched there, for that among other reasons. Back to the point - I think it's a valid point against Suki but not conclusive. Conclusion: Still not entirely convinced either way, though I have a nagging feeling that she's town. I certainly want to see lynches other than Suki at least considered tomorrow.
This one still feels like it could have scum motivation. Leaving me for later seems reasonable.
On February 10 2014 07:35 Aquanim wrote:Show nested quote +On February 09 2014 11:12 Hopeless1der wrote:
When oats voted suki he found something about betraying a scum mindset. I has likes that a lot at the time. Oats voted for suki twice, I'm not sure to which time you're referring: Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 12:31 Oatsmaster wrote:
yeah oh shit Suki does nothing about the case JayB posted, she never comments on it at all, just says its too tryhard and therefore scummy. Oh thats bad. She literally says nothing on whether the case was good/bad or why and whether koshi is town/scum or why. Just shits on it because its early in the game?
##vote Suki This post is more-or-less accurate. In the hypothetical case where Oats is scum and Suki is town, I can easily see Oats jumping on this though. Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 15:11 Oatsmaster wrote:On February 07 2014 15:07 suki wrote:
Oats why isn't your vote on me?
Jay is objectively scummy and I'm happy where my vote is. what. I think you dont understand the meaning of 'objectively' scummy. You havent explained anything about his tryhardness making him scum or why his case was bad, or why his stuff is forced. Like half this shit is subjective. ##VOTE SUKIWAGON OF JUSTICE THIS post, however, is pretty shitty. Suki had in fact tried to explain why she saw JayB's tryhardness as scummy, and had briefly explained why the Koshi case was bad (not that it needed explaining, hence why I'm comfortable with it being brief). + Show Spoiler +On February 07 2014 13:51 suki wrote:Regarding people's concerns that I'm not scum hunting, I was just having fun at the beginning of the game. So, you can decide if I'm scum hunting or not going forward. Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 12:31 Oatsmaster wrote:
yeah oh shit Suki does nothing about the case JayB posted, she never comments on it at all, just says its too tryhard and therefore scummy. Oh thats bad. She literally says nothing on whether the case was good/bad or why and whether koshi is town/scum or why. Just shits on it because its early in the game?
##vote Suki I skimmed JayB's case and didn't like it. I don't see the point in meta reading someone off of their pre-game content, or meta reading them 2 hours into the game as the game is still getting started. What threw me off was that he put in a ton of effort trying to find every little thing he could in order to paint Koshi as scum. He basically became super sure that Koshi was scum off of a weak case. He had already stated that he was going to scum hunt and he was hunting so hard it just felt forced and contrived. In other words, I didn't care about the case that he made, or the fact that it was made early, I cared about what motivations he could have had when making that case. Does it make more sense for town to hard tunnel someone off a weak case and try to make them look scummy, or does it make more sense for scum? The fact that the case was made so early is just a bonus point against a town scum-hunting mindset. In my opinion, it's more scummy to take this line of action. Thus I voted Jay. On Koshi Koshi has talked the talk. He just needs to walk the walk. His attitude is different in this game than last. He's more confident and more 'willing' to be active and contribute. If he doesn't hold up his end of the deal then he's an easy lynch. Other than that he hasn't done anything so I am waiting for his contributions when he returns. Furthermore, making a subjective case is not a scumtell and I have no idea why Oats would think it is. tl;dr I am not in any way convinced of Oats' towniness by his reasons for voting Suki.
THIS post however, just feels wrong if Aqua is scum. He basically dismantles Oat's case on me when it would have been in his best interest to either support or just ignore it.
Aqua's also been throwing suspicion on Balla which is definitely more of a townie thing. Scum just want to steer clear of the strongest townies and kill them in the night. Aqua has no problems facing Balla head on.
I like how Aqua's always trying to drum up conversation, how he's commented on pretty much everyone. His defense of sidesprang made me suspicious but on it's own it can't be called scummy.
Aqua is still town to me.
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On February 12 2014 09:44 Balla24 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 12 2014 09:30 suki wrote:
I think this actually gives us a roadmap to the finish. I doubt Hopeless is scum because Sidesprang was trying to create suspicion against Hopeless. I also doubt LoneMeow is scum because both Jonny and Sidesprang have stated their suspicions on LoneMeow.
No comment on his statements to me, you guys can figure that out for yourself.
I did not come to the same conclusion about LoneMeow when reading Sidesprangs filter. Sidesprang mentioned him like... 2 or 3 times total.
Noted. I'll take a look at LoneMeow too, then.
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Alright let's talk about Jay.
I said mountains about Jay in Day 1, so how about I steer clear of that and just judge him based on Day 2.
...
...
...
Jay is also town to me, based on his Day 2 play. He's active, he has a different attitude from Day 1. He pushed Sidesprang, then switched to Coag, then back to Sidesprang. I find his reasoning understandable.
On February 11 2014 08:24 jaybrundage wrote:In response to + Show Spoiler +On February 11 2014 02:02 suki wrote:Jay's questions directed at Coag: Show nested quote +On February 10 2014 14:28 jaybrundage wrote:
Let's talk I want you to start posting we can't get a read of you if you lurk.
Why do you think I'm scum? What do you think of Oats, Suki, Hopeless, Sidesprang.
I have nothing to read you with. Please fix this. Show nested quote +On February 10 2014 15:26 jaybrundage wrote:Hei lonemeow. Lets chat. What do you think of Oats, Hopeless1der and Sidesprang? What is your opinion of me and Suki right now? Is balla too townie to be townie. Should we kill him for the lulz + Show Spoiler + Hi Jay, I notice you're asking about four players specifically. Can you please let me know why these four (I have an idea just want to let you answer it)? Show nested quote +On February 10 2014 14:18 jaybrundage wrote:
So guis we should totes lynch Sidesprang. I looked over Oat's filter briefly leaning town atm. It's not based on anything particularly just feels. It's hard to get a good read on Oats as his post's are mostly one liners.
So I shall join you Oats on Sidesprang.
@Sidesprang. I am gonna policy lynch your ass. There also is a decent chance your scum. So yea. Give me some reason to keep you alive. You voted sidesprang as a 'policy lynch'. First off, why was it a policy lynch? Second, what are your thoughts on him right now? What are your own thoughts on Oats, Hopeless and LoneMeow? Welp as you may have guessed I am not as sure on the alignment of the players I am asking about. I might be leaning on them a certain way in regards to their alignment but not very sure on any of them. So I want other people's thoughts so I can get a better read on them. I think Oats is likely town. Similar style of last game. Doesn't seem to be bothered by the pressure that Aqua and Balla were putting on him. Seems reasonable carefree. Hopeless1der is a player I am not sure on again. A common trait in the people I mentioned. Leaning town because he is playing so differently from last scum game. He seems to be thinking about the game. Doesn't post alot which makes it trickier to read him. Lonemeow is someone I feel that is posting very similar to his last game as town. So stands to reason he is town again this game. Seems to be reading up on the game. Posting his questions and little reads. I wanted to push Sidesprang as a policy lynch because he has the smallest filter atm. I want him to post more he doesn't put enough content in the thread. I have a hard time reading him just because of that. However Coag's terrible play is just screaming for a lynch. So I couldn't proceed with my original play of pressuring Sidesprang. I had no intention to actually try to get people to lynch him. I just wanted him to realize that he can be policy lynch material because of his lurker tendencies this game. My scum reads should be well known. I believe Suki that you are similar to Hopeless1der in that you will be the best scum on the team and therefore the hardest to lynch. You play can read either good town Or good scum and that what makes it difficult. Your play if you are scum is also comparable to scum marv. You don't do overtly scummy things that make you an easy lynch. You play using reasoning and meta and all that good stuff.
This post feels very open.
So yeah. Jay also town.
. . .
Yes I know what I said about conclusions from Sidesprang/Jonny's suspects. I'm just going through these people and saying my comments because I'm too tired to do everything first and then post all my thoughts in a row. If I can't come to any conclusions tonight I'll have a look again tomorrow morning when my mind is fresh.
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Lonemeow doesn't feel as strongly town to me as Jay or Aqua. . .
Run through of his play: + Show Spoiler +Lonemeow was AFK for the first 24 hours of the game (approximately.. I'm going by my post here + Show Spoiler +On February 08 2014 01:32 suki wrote:
What do people think about lynching slam or LoneMeow for pulling the same 24 hour disappearance trick that Hopeless did in the previous game?
I know that slam can check the game from his phone and has no qualms about posting from his phone. This behaviour is not typical of either of them. ). He starts the game off calling Jonny scummy: On February 08 2014 03:30 LoneMeow wrote:
Hello. Had major emergency at work today so I have only done a quick read of the thread so far.
So far I'd call JonnyLaw the scummiest of the bunch. Just compare his posting to the previous game and his newbies.
One liners, off topic, no hostility towards who he thinks is scum.
Proper read commencing now, if there's anything you want me to comment on or pay extra attention to let me know. His immediate follow up puts a few people as null or town and Jonny as the most scummy: On February 08 2014 05:19 LoneMeow wrote:Okay, so: JonnyLawNot playing to his usual aggressive, abrasive town meta (and he was called very town for it in the previous game, so there's no reason to change). Posting a lot of one liners and not volunteering his opinion. Verdict: scummy Balla24Hunting scum, despite the roleplay garbage more or less playing like the last game. Verdict: leaning town jaybrundageEarly posts are terrible. Case on Koshi is absolutely rubbish. I think suki makes a reasonable point here: Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 08:58 suki wrote:
It's not the action but the motives.
Posting a long ass scum case this early just screams try-hard scum look at me I'm hunting scum! Why do you have to prove yourself this early as town, forcing a pure meta "koshi should be happy but he's not" argument to say that Koshi is definitely scum? This is also horribly scummy, why would you narrow lynch between 2 candidates less than halfway through D1: Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 08:51 jaybrundage wrote:
Ok Town I suggest that you read up on Balla and Koshi. Look at there posts and think if it makes more sense that they are town, or if it makes more sense for them to both be scum. I would like to narrow the lynch between these two candidates.
Thank you for your time. I wanna leave soon but might wait around a bit to see if anything juicy pops up. However, this seems like a town reaction to the situation: Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 11:44 jaybrundage wrote:
I can't win with this town. If I give advice and try to make well thought out posts. Then I'm giving advice and I'm not scum hunting enough.
If I actively try to scum hunt and push things I think are scummy. Then I'm scummy for unknown reasons.
Pretty frustrating. Verdict: null-ish, leaning scum sukiI really hated the early game trolling and roleplay garbage, but she started to pressure people and post opinions after a while. Makes some good points such as above. Verdict: null Which is also really hard to believe if he's scum... At this point though, Balla and Oats are pressuring and voting me. I'm hard pushing a case on Jay. Only Koshi is on Jonny. If we assume that scum LM planned to bus Jonny, it may have seemed ok to do at this point due to the chaos that town was in. On February 08 2014 07:10 LoneMeow wrote:
suki, I agree that some aspects of jaybrundage's play seem scummy, but I just can't ignore the very towny-looking things completely at this stage. The frustration-thing seems very genuine to me, and that is towny as heck. So I would not want to lynch him as the #1 choice.
What do you think about Koshi? His play is somewhat different from the last game, but is that because he's scum-Koshi and trying to hide it (as we know his meta from the previous game) or because he's town-Koshi? LoneMeow is soft defending Jay and also pushing suspicion on Koshi. He's not actually trying to push JonnyLaw right now who should be his #1 scum. On February 08 2014 07:25 LoneMeow wrote:Show nested quote +On February 08 2014 07:18 suki wrote:I like Lord Koshi of Koshinton this game. His attitude is confident. Like, his whole 'You will know town Koshi' spiel. Completely different from last game where he came in with his 40 post policy and ended up giving it up halfway through Day 1. He's been contributing and pressuring people. Some posts I like: + Show Spoiler +On February 07 2014 19:12 Koshi wrote:Oats. Veteran question. Look at this quote from jayB: Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 13:11 jaybrundage wrote:Ok so this makes alot more sense. You were not saying my initial response to Koshi's vote on my post was scummy. You think my response to him validating the seriousness of his vote was scummy. Ok so let me go thru my reasoning. So Koshi comes back after I dismiss his post and responds with that his vote is "very real" However where he should put a reason about why his vote is real. He instead just says "you feel off." So this is in hindsight perhaps where I may have misread Koshi's intention with that post. It might have been a joke post and he wasn't being serious. But what I thought was that Koshi actually thought I was scum. He said the vote was real... Twice. So I assumed that he was serious and voting me with the intention that he thought I was scum. At this point I believe that I was making up my case on why Koshi's first post not being excited was scummy. So I was already thinking that Koshi was mafia. This just firmed that in my mind. I had brushed off his vote on me as not being serious. So when he does say its serious he gives me the reason why. The reason is "You feel off" That was it. This is a very noncommittal answer and I think it reeks of scum. I had no reason to ask for why he voted me cause he already provided it it was "You feel off." So instead of asking him I dissected why I thought this post was scummy. Does my thinking make sense? And even when I did ask Koshi why he felt i was off. He never expanded on it. Also you confused me originally with what you said in your post If you are town, your reaction to these "fake votes" would be completely different. But you were not talking about my reaction to the fake votes. You were talking about my reaction to Koshi's explanation that his vote was real. On February 07 2014 12:48 Balla24 wrote:On February 07 2014 12:42 jaybrundage wrote:On February 07 2014 12:01 Balla24 wrote:On February 07 2014 11:54 jaybrundage wrote:On February 07 2014 11:51 Balla24 wrote:
Are you guys seriously pushing jay right now?
There's really nothing new. Everybody knows he's made some scummy decisions. He's been pressured to no end, no reason to keep pushing him now because we know almost everything about him. Let him play the game, watch him to see if he redeems himself, but there's no reason to keep pushing him unless there is NEW information.
Let him play unpressed, see what happens. Balla talk to me why do you think my push on Koshi is scummy. I think while it isn't the most amazing case. It is after all an early day 1 case. And I think alot of things I said are completely true. If you are referring to the big "case", I never said that was scummy. I said that it was ok, but I don't really like the fact that it's built off of koshi not being happy. It's new information, which is good, but the information isn't that great, you know? I don't think that case is scummy at all. What I think was possibly scummy was your initial reaction to koshi's "fake vote". I explained multiple times so I don't really want to type it all out again, but it was based on the fact that your initial reaction was more scum like than town like in the fact that you weren't really trying to figure out what koshi was doing, and were just attacking him. You weren't curious, as I expect a townie who is having a WTF moment would be having. After your initial reaction, you calmed down and started displaying more townie traits, but still, the initial reaction is what my read on you is based off of. Everything after that is "meh" to me. Does that not make sense? Ok this is what I don't know what your talking about. Ok. Here is what I said in regards to your reaction, I even quoted the post I was talking about (i think i'm getting pretty good at quoting heuheu). I said more about it in multiple other posts, but this is what I said at first. This is ONLY in response to the initial reaction to koshi, which is quoted within. On February 07 2014 08:01 Balla24 wrote:On February 07 2014 07:51 jaybrundage wrote:On February 07 2014 07:47 Koshi wrote:
Mine is very real. Super real.
you feel off. I feel off. What a non committal post. After you say your vote is real. You make a terrible comment like that. I think what you mean to say. Is that you think I'm scum. BUT your scum so you know that not to be true and your waffling like crazy. Because even when you say the vote is real. Your very next line shows you have no conviction about it. Koshi is scum. I caught one :D In fact, this post is so very scummy. If you are town, your reaction to these "fake votes" would be completely different. You would be confused and curious as to what they find scummy about what you said, or you would just think that it's totally trolly and ignore it. Here you find it is scummy? What cause he thinks you feel off? Your response should have been "what feels off about me then oh wise one koshi" and not "you're scum". The explanation for why I voted for you in the first place is here, they are relatively separate (not relevant to your reaction to koshi): + Show Spoiler +On February 07 2014 07:58 Balla24 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 07:36 jaybrundage wrote:On February 07 2014 07:28 suki wrote:On February 07 2014 07:23 Balla24 wrote:
@jaybrundage, that implies that you were thinking something, so what was it that you were thinking before you came to that conclusion?
Legitimate question. Jay, since you're 0.29% more likely to be scum than me, and since you were the top 2 Day 1 lynch in the previous game, how do you plan to play differently in order to avoid being targeted for lynch this game? It might be a rough game. I tryharded the shit out of last game. And jonny wanted to lynch me cause I was "acting" like town. I guess the first thing would be too not give as much advice this game. 1. Because I said it last game. 2. Because now I can just policy lynch lurkers cause they have been warned :D I want to just say scum hunt more. But its not easy too early day 1. Maybe more pressure less advice for the early day. You're making so many excuses for no reason. Why would you tryharding last game have anything to do with this game or how tough it's going to be? In fact, what are you trying to say when you say you "tryharded the shit out of last game"? What, are you implying you're not going to tryhard the shit out of this game, why not? Scumhunting is scumhunting. Sure there's not much to talk about on day1 but that's where you make stuff to talk about and then scumhunt from there. There has been no effort to do that. Instead, all you have done is called my first post "icky", which was 100% totally intended to do just that, get people to start talking and scumhunting from the get go which should be pretty obvious to everybody, but for some reason you decided it was icky and then make excuses for what I can only assume is going to be bad scumhunting on day 1. Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 07:32 jaybrundage wrote:On February 07 2014 07:23 Balla24 wrote:
@jaybrundage, that implies that you were thinking something, so what was it that you were thinking before you came to that conclusion?
@suki, that implies that you think jaybrundage is town, even though I am clearly 2.5% less likely to be scum than he is. That first post. Ugh I'm still feeling icky from it. Before this post I was puzzled about the reasoning of jayB and why he thought he found me scum. It was almost too scummy to be scum. But this post actually made me rethink that and made me think that he actually had a townie mindset going after me. The problem I am having here is that if he actually is town, why wasn't he able to make that shine through faster? This quote is near the end of page 3 off his filter. To me it feels like he finally was able to twist his story into something that could come from town. But why couldn't he do it earlier? That reponse instantly would have made me back off and not think twice, this time I backed off but now that I think about it again I am puzzled. Your opinion? On February 07 2014 19:36 Koshi wrote:
Why isn't he bad town? It kinda looks like LM his cases previous game and you were spot on there.
Also can you comment on the jayB thing I asked earlier? On February 07 2014 21:16 Koshi wrote:Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 08:51 jaybrundage wrote:
Ok Town I suggest that you read up on Balla and Koshi. Look at there posts and think if it makes more sense that they are town, or if it makes more sense for them to both be scum. I would like to narrow the lynch between these two candidates.
Thank you for your time. I wanna leave soon but might wait around a bit to see if anything juicy pops up. This is such fucking bullshit btw. No way a townie says that with what he got. No fucking way. On February 07 2014 23:21 Koshi wrote:
I just think it is too easy coming from Oats. His vote previous game on me was actually based on us playing together and he knew something was off. His vote on Hopeless same story. I don't really know how he ended up on Cake in the end though. I guess we played him and he had no clue anymore.
But this game his vote on jayB was meh. His vote on Suki was meh. His vote on Sidesprang is meh.
And he hasn't called anybody town yet and came in the thread trowing some suspicion on Aqua which I didn't like at all. He's motivated and involved in the game. He's open with his reads. He's active. So yeah I think he's pretty townie. He's definitely not as scummy as he was in the last game, but I'm not so certain about him being town either unfortunately. The problem I have is, I think he's good enough to fake this now that he knows why he was called scum in the last game. I'm not a big fan of things like: Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 18:30 Koshi wrote:
Oatsie, my man. I am totes town right? This is also pretty interesting: Show nested quote +On February 07 2014 18:33 Koshi wrote:
I'll take that as a yes.
Do you think both jayb and Jonny are scum? I doubt it tbh. Show nested quote +On February 08 2014 05:21 Koshi wrote:
I like you Stray Kitten. I like you.
I don't see jayB being scum without Jonny being scum tbh. The other way around is possible.
Can we see a vote already? I wouldn't mind hearing what caused the 180 in opinion. Here again, throwing suspicion at Koshi.. by saying he could be playing a really good scum game. On February 08 2014 23:13 LoneMeow wrote:
And just to make my stance clear:
##Vote: JonnyLaw Wait a sec. LoneMeow was fifth to vote JonnyLaw, which is reallly late. Between his entrance post where he said JonnyLaw was scummy, to the point where he voted Jonny, very little of his activity is pressuring reads from other people on Jonny or explaining why Jonny is scummy. There is one post of mention where he explains that Jonny's usual aggression is missing.. But other than that none. On February 09 2014 06:31 LoneMeow wrote:
JonnyLaw, in case you are actually town you absolutely MUST give us your updated reads as it looks like you're going to be lynched. This just feels odd... I've seen posts from scum like this before. LoneMeow wants to vote Coag after Jonny's flip. He also pressures me, and sets a trap by asking me about Sidesprang's II Titanic game, because right after I posted my comments he says: On February 11 2014 03:03 LoneMeow wrote:The point about him using far more meta seems somewhat valid. The defense point I'd say doesn't fully hold water because the attack on him was very different. And he did not actually comment on the eventual D1 lynch at all in II Titanic, but then again the Spaghetticus train happened late into the day and he seems to not have been around. All in all, pretty these points you made are pretty inconclusive. I'd like to point out that you changed your read on him earlier from scum to null based partially on II Titanic meta: Show nested quote +On February 08 2014 06:02 suki wrote:Sidesprang's meta: + Show Spoiler +Cop in II TitanicOn December 10 2013 09:42 sidesprang wrote:
Ok, so a lot of things going on. I agree we should not let lurkers stay silent, and should poke anyone that stays silent for to long. But there is a lot of value in not spamming down the thread if you are town, that will only make the scummy post harder to see. I'm mainly looking at you Xatalos, as you are on your third page in filter with like half of the post being oneliners. Even if town you will be detrimental to the town if you keep this up! There are others aswell, just used you as an example.
--------
About Cora there are a few things I did not like and caught my eye. His opening post is not good, and if he's mafia hes basically just buying himself an excuse to lurk for day 1 and then come out day 2 and bring chaos onto the town.
He also deflected a lot in his defence and basically just said "look at X he's scummier than me".
And lastly he asked for people to vote for him if they found him scummy, which is very Anti-Town.
I do not feel cora is mafia yet at least, but definetly worth to look at.
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@Kish, can anyone that have played with him earlier say something about how he plays. He is deffo playing the most anti town atm, but he's also doing it on purpose which is frustrating.
This is pretty much his first post in the game. Notice he writes a short thing about policy and then starts scum hunting. Most of his posts in this game are scum hunting, but I didn't find many difficult questions in this one. Town in Newbie Mini Mafia LIOn January 06 2014 08:10 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 07:47 TheChyz wrote:
Why so eager to have people help you achieve your goals? Maybe they don't agree with them. If onlywonderboy is right, then your rules help you if you are scum as well since you seem to be very active in which lynching lurkers would help your cause of staying alive. Also having people fight can cause confusion in the town. So I don't see a reason why people should just help you achieve your goals. You don't see a reason why people should help Bella with creating a "tough environment for mafia to hide in and lynch some mafia" ? Starts the game off with a pointed question trying to find TheChyz's motives. On January 06 2014 08:59 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 08:23 Balla24 wrote:
Let's hear some opinions on some people. Sidesprang what do you think of OWB and thechyz so far? etc etc
Be analytical. I'm already feeling a bit weird with thechyz but it's preliminary obviously and i'm waiting for him to post some more. @ onlywonderboyatm he is just null for me. from his PoV he has only stated obvious things so far. It not really contributing atm, but its to early to fault him for that. And he does say he is going to more active and contribute with meaningfull analysis, so as long as he atleast tries to do this we should be able to read him in the future. @ thechyz,
I don't like him atm. In his first post he says he agrees with you and dont mind lynching lurkers to discourage lurking. But then in his second post he says he see no reason to why people should help you achivieving that same agenda he just agreed with. Feels very much like a contradiction to me. This is his third post in the game and he's pointing out contradictions. On January 07 2014 15:33 sidesprang wrote:
@theDragoon Who would you vote for now and why ?
Also, why did you change your mind and wanted to defend yourself afterall ? Questioning TheDragoon who was the top lynch candidate of the day. sidesprang was wary that the lynch on theDragoon was going to smoothly and tried getting information from theDragoon before the lynch. Miller in TL Mafia XXHe spends most of the game apologizing for his low post quantity. scum in TL Mafia XVIIILike sidesprang pointed out, this scum game is from 4 years ago, something that I didn't think about as I was just looking through past games and not noticing the date. Regardless, I'll include some posts here to show where my line of thought came from in my case that I wrote up. On February 14 2010 12:00 sidesprang wrote:
I definatly agree that we should not lynch someone based on day one clues, unless someone can make a foolproof case. But they should definatly be discussed and looked through, cause they could help us put the pieces toghter at a later day.
And it also gives us something to talk about, and im pretty sure the more posts there are the more information one could gather from this game and put it togheter. policy talk to start the game On February 15 2010 00:30 sidesprang wrote:
L's point about beeing 20 mafia and that it will take a long time before we get two different clues on a single mafia i dont really think is true.
Last game i was in there was 8 mafia and they had 3kp. meaning at day 3 we in the worst case scenario had 1 mafia with double clues.
In this game there is 20 mafia and 6 KP, meaning in the worst case we would have 4 double clues at day 4. But you with there beeing possible 12 mafia kills and 2 lynces one should think/hope that some mafia would die, and we get double clues at day 3 again.
Two posts later, setup talk. On February 16 2010 08:05 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2010 07:56 DoctorHelvetica wrote:On February 16 2010 07:44 redtooth wrote:On February 16 2010 06:25 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Spamming the thread full of what shit? Posting an objective compilation of everyones arguments? Compiling voting history? Defending myself when redtooth and Ace accused me of being mafia? Finally getting Bill Murray to justify his statements? Don't put me on the same level as BM TT___TT
I guess for the time being Empyrean is our best bet. Ver did a great job of pointing out the inconsistency in his pro-town/mafia behavior from past games and the clue connection is just very very very very strong.
Redtooth did a decent job of defending himself, or at least why it doesn't make sense that he and Ace are both in the same mafia family. His argument for him and ace not being in different mafia families doesn't make sense. "Why would mafia defend a mafia from another family/not mafia"
Unless he wanted to discourage clue analysis because he fears it will hurt his mafia family, or wanted to defend Ace because regardless of Ace's role his argumentation is successfully dividing the town. If redtooth is mafia, he has no way of knowing Ace's role anyway, so saying "i wouldn't defend another families mafia" makes no sense because he doesn't know who those people are. I really doubt the mafia are going to ONLY defend one another, look what happened when I got lynched in the last game. By analyzing who I defended/supported/whose clues I ignored the entire rest of the mafia family was caught.
I'm not accusing you of being mafia redtooth, I'm just pointing out that the argument falls short.
I'm voting for L because so far his arguments have been extremely consistent, he's been trying to get the town moving/discouraging waste posts, and providing excellent clue analysis. Redtooth shouldn't have a problem with this, don't you want L as the other elected role anyway? you're right. actually that's exactly what i want you to do. i want L as mayor and i want to be pardoner. no vigilantes means pardoner is very very powerful if he is mafia. as for my argument in why it's sort of illogical for ace and me to be mafia in separate families is because consider the alternative: i could have silently held back and not brought attention to myself instead of being in the middle of controversy between the town. knowing previous games, L vs Ace was going to become a shitstorm whether i stepped in or not. instead i chose to argue a point, blew my top (admittedly more than a few times), and got into a position where my alignment was pretty damn clear. and if Ace isn't on my team (which would be the case if i was mafia and he wasn't in my family) then i would want him dead regardless of what role/alignment he was. and guys i've said this before but i genuinely believed L was full of shit. now i only think he is half shitty but i've expressed my disdain for day 1 clues enough already. so it's not about mafia ONLY defending each other. it's about a mafia risking his own neck to defend a good player that's not on his team. THAT is something that doesn't make sense. so if it doesn't make sense then that means i'm not mafia. yay we are finally caught up. Fair point, now that is a good argument. Why are we assuming day 1 clues are bad based off previous games? There are 20 mafia. It's highly unlikely that mafia will be getting 6 kills a night, I'd say 4 MAYBE 5 is more likely. Why? 1) Overlapping kills. The mafia are simply going to hit the same targets. Let's say, for example, Player X is green. He's been painted red by a lot of people and thus might be hit by both families. This could happen with anyone who was painted red but is not mafia of either family. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if even 2 kills overlap. 2) Smart medics. While mafia might avoid really big targets early on because they will be protected by medics, medics who are able to anticipate mafia goals will help reduce kills. With 20 mafia, let's assume we get 5 hits a day. We don't see overlapping clues until DAY SIX DAY SIXIf everyone feels uncomfortable with Day 1 clue analysis just based on previous experience, I guess there isnt really anything I can say. But let's please not ignore clues on Day 2. If someone makes an accusation based on clues at you, provide an alternative. Simply saying "day 1 clues are trash" isn't enough, especially when you aren't addressing the point of just how many mafia there are in this game and how strong clues need to be. Also redtooth, I'd like you to clear something up for me. I found a mildly disturbing inconsistency in your arguments. While L was painting Ace red based on clues you said clue analysis on day 1 is trash; that's fine. You also said the clues pointing to ace specifically were shaky and not well thought-out. Then merely a few posts later you said that the clues pointing toward Ace were so obvious/numerous he can't be mafia. Was there a change of heart here? what happened? Man your so wrong about the overlapping clues thing. If we dont see overlapping clues before day 6, it is because the mafia only hits the town. And that is not realistic. The mafia hitting 1/3 each lynch seems realistic if not to low to me. Then we have 6 dead by day 3. And already overlapping clues. Altho the mafia would prolly have overlapping hits. But my point still stands. We will see overlapping hits WAY before day 6, and if we dont we're allready doomed cause we've lost half our town  The next post, more setup talk. On February 21 2010 12:10 sidesprang wrote:
i changed my vote to quickstriker, but i dont see why we should not double lynch tomorrow. Since i feel we have alot of good clues to work of, and we will get more.
So you're gonna have to give more reasons for me to take away my double lynch vote. No reason for his vote. On February 26 2010 16:59 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2010 16:00 Scamp wrote:
I'd also appreciate it if Sidesprang and Tredmasta would speak up. Especially Sidesprang in order to explain his last vote. First, my votes are not set in stone. If so i would not have voted so early. But its the weekend coming up and i know im definatly going out on saturday(and the voting closes 1AM(or something like that) in norway. So i had to vote something in case i wont have the time later, ofc i could have abstained but i think scamp is mafia and that L might be and he voting scamp, because of the cluelink towards you. voting L, because he has lead this town on so many wrong turns. And i don't see any real proof of him beeing non mafia, and if he is mafia he has gotten away with far to much allready. reasons for not voting johnnyspaz who i think is definatly mafia, let the other mafia team kill him. And to the clue link from malongo, im not really sure what aristocracy of money means but for the rest of the first bold sentence i feel that is a huge strech. And im not decafchickens friend  And the bold part number two. That has to be a clue to johhnyspaz, i mean he gets turn into a pincushion. And he has a picture of sonic the hedgehog. Basically this is his only scum hunting effort in the game. Again, his filter was super short, but the thing that I noticed is the lack of scumhunting compared to his other town games.
But I missed something big in my meta analysis.. That is, sidesprang was scum in the original Shadowed game.
Scum in Shadowed MafiaOn February 04 2014 10:14 sidesprang wrote:Lol wtf game started today afterall. Anyhow regarding policy shit, not much to say, think it's covered allready. But yeh, look for content instead not postcount. We do NOT want ppl spamming useless shit. Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 09:47 jaybrundage wrote:Jonny as you have had alot of experience with Balla as scum how would you say he plays as a scum player. Whats his tells if you will Guess your not in the database either huh jonny XD If your gonna compile your games you might as well make a post in the mafia database with them listed and a quick review :o Why did you want Jonny to out Ballas scumtells in the thread this early before Balla even had a chance to play into them ? On February 04 2014 12:29 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On February 04 2014 11:25 jaybrundage wrote:On February 04 2014 10:14 sidesprang wrote:Lol wtf game started today afterall. Anyhow regarding policy shit, not much to say, think it's covered allready. But yeh, look for content instead not postcount. We do NOT want ppl spamming useless shit. On February 04 2014 09:47 jaybrundage wrote:Jonny as you have had alot of experience with Balla as scum how would you say he plays as a scum player. Whats his tells if you will Guess your not in the database either huh jonny XD If your gonna compile your games you might as well make a post in the mafia database with them listed and a quick review :o Why did you want Jonny to out Ballas scumtells in the thread this early before Balla even had a chance to play into them ? Sidesprung you asked me a question I responded. There is alot going in the thread right now. I don't just want to see content I want to see some post count too. People are conversing, poking at one another a back and forth. You make one question at me and you disappeared. Don't you have anything else to comment on, or respond to my post or make a comment on another post or give your opinion. Anything really. Dropping one post and leaving the thread is not the environment town should be fostering. Thru discussion like i was talking about earlier we can learn other alignments and discover ulterior motives. Ill give you somethings to post on. What do you think of Balla's early vote on LM? Was it appropriate given LM"s posts? What do you think of my response to your post? Does what I say made sense? Do you agree that I should have questioned Jonny about Balla's scum game or should I have not said anything? Why do you think Suki poke at Jonnys two opinions? Do you think Suki got defensive after Balla inquired about her post? Why do you think Suki would post about jonny if not trying to discern if hes mafia or not? (These questions go out to Suki as well?) Who is your towniest read at the moment? Who do you think is most likely scum? Do you believe in policy lynching lurkers? What is the lowest amount someone should be expected to post? Firstly its Sidesprang, not sidesprung or whatever else ppl think it is. I don't mind Balla voting for LM, because I think if he keeps on playing like this he will hopefully be easy to read. As for why he voted I dont really agree with. LM's stance on koshi's "plan" is kinda like mine. Judge people based on content not number of posts, and also only reason to lynch lurkers is if there are no better options available. I liked your response, you had a reason for asking it and you had logic backing it up. Answer felt honest. Tho I do not agree with your logic. It's nice and all generating discussion, but I dont think going over ppl's meta this early is wise. As I think it would be harder to use meta against players if it's been discussed in thread first. The whole suki / jonny deal requires more thought if I wanna read something out of it. Aka atm I don't really know, and I will read more up on that tomorrow when I got better time. I got some people whom I feel are playing protown atm, but I see no reason sharing townreads at this point. I don't have scumreads atm, tho I got a bit interested in Suki since she disliked your post. A post I liked cause you are doing what I think you should be doing with lurkers (get them to post, so you can read them, not lynch them blindly). People should post enough to be readable and enough to get their scumreads out. I don't belive in a set number. his first two posts in the game. Basically... He doesn't spend time on policy talk and he starts hunting right away. So yeah. Taking this into account my case on sidesprang doesn't hold any water. Based on the games that I linked in my original post, I think that my conclusions were reasonable - policy talk in his scum game and scum hunting in his town games. But taking into account the previous Shadowed game where he was scum it's obvious he's changed (read improved) his scum game quite a bit. Anyways, I suppose I'm null on sidesprang for now. I'll take a closer look at him later. What's different now so that the same meta points at him being scum? So, discrediting my read against sidesprang while also saying I'm contradicting myself. When I reply: On February 11 2014 04:17 suki wrote:Show nested quote +On February 11 2014 03:03 LoneMeow wrote:
What's different now so that the same meta points at him being scum? Sidesprang has contributed more so you can draw more conclusions. He didn't respond or continue to pressure me. On February 12 2014 05:32 LoneMeow wrote:
Balla24, how does sidesprang's D1 posting fit with the idea that he's scum? There's nothing super convincing in your case, I'm not sold yet. Soft defense of sidesprang. And then he reluctantly votes sidesprang. On February 12 2014 05:51 LoneMeow wrote:Show nested quote +On February 12 2014 05:43 Balla24 wrote:On February 12 2014 05:32 LoneMeow wrote:
Balla24, how does sidesprang's D1 posting fit with the idea that he's scum? There's nothing super convincing in your case, I'm not sold yet. His day1 is so null. In every way. Null in the fact that reading it doesn't give me a read one way or another. Null in the sense that all his reads were basically null except for town reads and eventually Jonny. If you look at it, you basically have no idea who he thinks is scum until he votes Jonny because whenever he calls someone scummy he's like "but then there's this that looks good and this -> so I don't know what to think". The fact that he can't stay consistent in day2 from his day1 is bad. That's the important part. Trying to lynch Coag for slam being scummy even though he never called Slam scum is pretty bad. Now that you say it, I see it too. The only thing he has said about Alakaslam before the lynch is: Show nested quote +On February 09 2014 02:41 sidesprang wrote:
Alakaslam: I buy that he has been busy with work and whatnot. As I don't think scum!slam would lurk in any way I dont see a reason for lying about it. That being said I dont think his enterance is very good. Starts by complaining about how Balla / Suki trolled early game, which has been pointed out is something he is very capable aswell. And it was obviously something that was prewritten before Balla got the roles. Why bring that shit up again, its a null tell. His points are just fluff. He then says he is going to try some filters, but looks like he only read JayB, maybe the easiest one to pick on at the time.
@Slam Did you read up on the rest of the players? Do you got any other reads? What are your thoughts on Jonny?
I wish I was more confident on this lynch. ##Vote: sidesprang
Points against LM:
1. He comes into the game really late.
2. He starts off the game with only Jonny being scummy to him, yet doesn't further analyze Jonny throughout the day or try to convince people Jonny's scummy.
3. He is fifth to vote Jonny.
4. He soft defended sidesprang and was reluctant to vote him.
5. Basically he did nothing this game that really furthered the lynches on the two flipped scum.
... I'm kinda tired. my brain is failing me... but yeah someone take a look at this and share their opinions. I'll probably take another look in the morning when I've had some sleep.
LM looks scummy to me.
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I know Jay I'm just as confused about that as you. :\
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Hopeless:
Hopeless is way more active than last game. I was going to say that this points to him being more town but actually thinking about it, he was pretty active at the end of Day 1 last game, active enough to convince people he was town. I was also going to say he's more light-hearted but actually his tone seems about the same (minus the reboot pic that he posted when his wireless conked out which is null imo).
He hard pushes Jay as the lynch on Day 1:
On February 07 2014 10:35 Hopeless1der wrote:
I dont like jayb..so forced and trivial. Like in a too-scummy-to-be-scum way.
On February 08 2014 03:08 Hopeless1der wrote:
is jay TRYING to be scummy?
I actually liked the way he pressured and thought it was townie.
and then he randomly votes Jonny:
On February 08 2014 23:44 Hopeless1der wrote:Show nested quote +On February 08 2014 23:29 Koshi wrote:On February 08 2014 23:17 Oatsmaster wrote:On February 08 2014 23:02 Koshi wrote:
You never sheep.
Was is dis? I sheep all the time, I just dont say im sheeping Not at all. Did.you agree with Hopeless read on you?How sure are you about jonny red flip? Of course he disagrees with me, he's scum Koshi. /sarcasm I may not be back before deadline, family stuff. I'll try to keep updated by phone ##Unvote
##Vote: JonnyLaw
So yeah it's a bit strange. Pushes Jay the whole game, I'm stilll hard pushing Jay. Suddenly he votes Jonny with no explanation.
Hopeless then posts his big scum theory on me, which is the biggest effort he's put all game (and which I felt was a big point in his favour). However, scum COULD have written it so let's look into his follow up...
...
..
He completely forgets about it.
That's really weird. Putting so much effort into calling someone scum and then not even following up. He gets sidetracked on Coag when thread sentiment is headed that way.
He also seems to still be seeing Jay as scummy, reaffirmed that Jay's quote was not a blue claim, but isn't pushing Jay either.
On February 12 2014 08:04 Hopeless1der wrote:
i kinda still like suki for scum because of her meta-reading of sidesprang being so out to lunch.
What about Hopeless' meta read on me? What about my 'bad' case on Jay? What about avoiding Jonny's scum games? About 'wait-and-see' with Jonny? Defending Jonny?
Somehow, Hopeless went from suki is scum I have a huge case with actual valid points to, 'i kinda still like suki for scum' with no explanation in between.
He also didn't talk about sidesprang yesterday and instead of pushing me or Jay just went with effectively a policy lynch.
Conclusion
I agree with Aqua, Hopeless looks a lot more scummy than LoneMeow. He's my number one scum read at the moment.
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Jay, could you please explain your views on me from the start of N1 where you made the case saying I was most likely scum, to the end of Day 2?
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Mmmm.. Something doesn't feel right.
Jay starts out D2 by voting sidesprang, but quickly jumps on Coag. The order of votes at the time was me, then aqua, then lonemeow, then Jay.
If Jay thinks I'm scum N1, why would he vote with me on what is essentially a policy lynch... If I'm scum going for the easy policy lynch wouldn't that set off warning bells?
Hmm.
Jay eventually votes sidesprang, but he is #7 to vote.
That means that in Day 2 his play could be described as a sheep onto Coag, followed by a late bandwagon onto sidesprang.
On February 12 2014 06:52 jaybrundage wrote:
Sidesprang not being in the thread when hes about to be lynched doesn't look so great.
Coag could be town reading up on him. I do find it odd that he asked for a vig shot and then got angry when people were gonna lynch him.
##Unvote
##Vote Sidesprang
Lets hope for the best.
mmmmmmm.. This feels weird. Why is he switching from Coag to Sidesprang? Why does he think Coag could be town all of a sudden?
He voted both Coag and Sidesprang as "policy lynches" Day 2. When he switches to sidesprang as #7th on the vote, he says Coag could be town.
On February 12 2014 06:54 jaybrundage wrote:
I also think Oats is pretty townie sticking his neck out like that. But he had a town read and defended so that looks pretty good on him. I'm not sure about Sidesprang being scum or not. Difficult to read him.
He's not sure about sidesprang either.
So basically, his vote on sidesprang was weak as hell and seems to have been made only because everyone else was on Sidesprang. Unlike other people, who he provides reasons for why they're scummy or townie to him, he basically says nothing about Sidesprang.
. . .
I'm also really really curious to hear what exactly was up with his 'blue claim' on Day 1. I want an answer on this tonight.
Also, Jay you haven't stated who is suspicious to you right now after Day 2. Me, Coag and Sidesprang were the only people you commented on as being scummy. Who are you looking at for Day 3?
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If Jay is scum by the way I want you all to apologize for saying my tunnel on Jay was horrible!!!
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I agree with Balla that Hopeless and Jay look the worst going into Day 3.
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is the deadline up yet? can I still say things?
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EPT
