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On January 07 2014 07:11 Balla24 wrote:Eh, you are misjudging us if you think we're experienced players... we are just experienced with noob games  But rest assured, if you're new we are and SHOULD be taking it into account... but explicitly stating "I AM NEW PLS DONT LYNCH ME MY READS MIGHT BE BAD" is NOT helpful whatsoever. Catch my drift?
/offtopic:Yea i get it. I just felt like a lot of people look into my posts too much thinking there's some sort of link or slip or whatever when in reality i just don't know WTF I'm doing.
/ontopic: I'm gonna ##Unvote onlywonderboy and ##Vote theDragoon. There's no way to get out of this mess, you're all really looking at the wrong guy. I guess without me fucking things up for the town, you'd be better off but this is going to be 2 down for mafia after the first night. I have to head out, I'll be on later.
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I am in class atm waiting for the lecture to start, I will make a bigger post later in about 4 hours when I get home. I had somehow thought the day ends at 12AM EST so I voted for myself to speed things up since pretty much all votes were for me at that point. I'll try to defend myself when I get back.
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Ok, I'm the number one target right now and set to be lynched tonight. Here's my defense.
@JonnyLaw
Then two posts later he calls Chyz town and then votes for him.
Thanks for putting that out of context. In that post, if you read it again, I go over the possibility of TheChyz being a townie and a mafia. I didn't call him a townie then voted for him. I ran through both scenarios in the post. If you want to use that as being contradictory, at least quote the whole post. I voted for him there because he caused confusion at that time. By that logic, you should vote for me for the confusion I have created.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=434723¤tpage=16#313
I don't understand why he keeps contradicting himself in the same sentence. daywlker's bandwagoning but he likes it?
I never said I liked his decision to jump on TheChyz bandwagon, I did myself. It was just a common thing we agreed with, and we weren't the only ones to jump on that bandwagon.
Then talks about my pressure on Asuna and dismisses it completely without reason.
I'm not familiar with this format so I didn't know you were just pressuring Asuna. To me it looked like you just decided to lynch him for reasons I did not agree with.
Excuses, bandwagoning and self doubt in one line.
I'm down to lynch Asuna or OWB at this point.
From that, your reason to lynch Asuna was basically due to his inexperience. Not a good enough reason to warrant being lynched. It was also something I can relate with as I myself am prone to making excuses, bandwagoning and having self doubt, if I don't want to be lynched because I have those traits, I certainly don't want others to be as well.
Fuck, this could all be bad play is my biggest issue with lynching dragoon.
You're goddamn right.
@Derrida
Voting for me without any explanation? You flagged me as yellow earlier and even brought up the possibility of me being a bad player then going straight for me because everyone else is. I get trying to get rid of bad players but the goal of the game is to eliminate mafia through lynching or character powers.
@BigDad
You claim that I put trust in Day_Walker and that's how I got pretty high up on your suspicions list. But I've said many times already I never outright claimed that I trusted Day_Walker, I'm not going to repeat it again here.
@Suki
theDragoon's knee jerk reaction to vote OWB because of an incorrect timeline.
- Attacking his attacker for a slight inconsistency.
I reacted to that inconsistency because he was trying to frame his argument based on the fact that I "changed my mind" about Day_Walker. He said something along the lines of me saying I changed my mind THEN... Day_Walker mentioned something. The only reason why I even mentioned Day_Walker at all is because Balla24 asked me what I thought, then people started putting words in my mouth saying I trusted him.
His flip-flopping on Derrida, first saying his suspicion is 'low' and then on his very next post saying Derrida is higher up.
New information pops up, you reread things you change your opinions. How's that scummy at all?
Suki to me sounds like a scum trying to take advantage of this situation, to get a townie a guaranteed lynch.
there's no way he's not mafia here.
Everyone watch out for Suki, her true nature as a scum will be revealed when I get flipped.
@sidesprang
I know you don't like self voting, but I felt like my vote doesn't matter given the amount of votes I had on me at the time. I was heading out to class at the time so I rushed my post a bit and I guess got a little hot headed at the votes turning to me. I only voted myself because I felt like my vote is useless, given how many votes I had on me.
From the posts I read from when I was away, I'll have to warn the town about Suki, BigDad, Derrida and possibly Day_Walker (my so called scumbuddy). This is all I'll post for now I'm about to eat dinner and shower. I'll be back on an hour or so. Also, do I get a last word before I get lynched?
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On January 07 2014 15:33 sidesprang wrote:
@theDragoon Who would you vote for now and why ?
Also, why did you change your mind and wanted to defend yourself afterall ?
I felt like I needed to, as simple as that. I just wanted to get something out before I die.
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What will changing my vote do? I'll change it when it's a close vote but at this point changing my vote isn't going to do shit.
Suki called me out for a "scum slip" because I said something about Jonny hiding information. I don't think that's a good basis to put me under the scope. This game is about information, everything needs to be laid out there. Jonny himself claimed that he wasn't willing to reveal info for fear that mafia might use it to adapt their strategy, so why didn't Suki suspect him of that? The reason why I mentioned Jonny hiding something is because I did not understand his decision to lynch Asuna, because to me, his reason against Asuna was because he was inexperienced and it didn't make sense to me to lynch someone because of that.
Also, she said this:
'TheChyz's play is confusing so I'm voting for him'.
I did not say that directly, I was talking about how TheChyz's play created confusion among the town, which is something that mafia would want, hence my initial vote on him. I know I wasn't alone being confused with TheChyz's move.
Then later on her filter she immediately jumps on the lynch theDragoon bandwagon. Before this she was not entirely sure of my alignment, only thought I was suspicious, claiming things like "scum slip" or "voted because confused". The reason why she votes me right away is she saw the opportunity to lynch an innocent town member. I believed I covered a lot about why I think she's scum in my "defense post".
But I think the biggest tell on her being mafia is her absolute certainty of me being mafia.
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The main reason I distrust Derrida is how quickly he jumped on voting for me. Before his vote on me, his top 2 were Suki and sidesprang, he didn't even give a reason as to why he's voting for me. Before that post he didn't even find me too suspicious aside from posting something offtopic and ontopic on the same line, which is a really stupid reason to think someone being suspicious. Maybe I was being lazy and decided not to press enter and type /ontopic before that part of my post, which was something I did later on because of Derrida's accusation.
So the main reason why I think he's scum is because he just jumped on me, providing no reason then leaving the game to sleep. He doesn't give us time to question his decision. I went from mild suspicions to LYNCH HIM. That in itself is shady as hell and I certainly don't trust someone who jumps the bandwagon without providing a reason at all.
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@sidesprang
You know why me and Day_Walker became defensive about BigDad's accusations? Because he was putting words in my mouth. Saying I trusted DW, I have mentioned this multiple times. I have NEVER trusted Day_Walker, and I have never mentioned anything about trusting him, go look at my other posts.
Regarding:Day_Walker
The evidence against Dragoon looked very different to me than the rest of town. When people were talking about me and Dragoon as scum buddies, and then accusing us of trying to distance ourselves, I was the only townie who could read those posts and say "lol no". When Dragoon was defending himself against these accusation, I was the only townie who could read those posts and say "yup, this is 100% a guy defending himself against some false accusations". I think this in turn affected the weight I gave to other accusations against him. For example, I think most other people saw his snap OWB vote as scummy. Since I knew that OWB's scum-buddy accusation was false, I thought "well, I can't really tell if this is a frustrated townie lashing out or a cornered scum lashing out". The way Town has interacted with Dragoon over the last day has made it difficult for me to get a good read on him, because I'm not sure how to tell the difference between frustrated townie and cornered scum.
Before reading that post I was was a bit suspicious of Day_Walker, and this post could very well be mafia play but it is exactly how I was thinking. I know I'm not scum but I'm not sure if Day_Walker is but him having the same thought process as me when we got paired as "scum buddies" makes me lean towards him being a townie. If I flip town, DW will look innocent, but if I flip red then DW will look like he was trying to save me. It doesn't make sense for him to try to save me at this point because he is only jeopardizing his credibility if I do end up red. If we are both mafia, he should be throwing me under the bus at this point instead of trying to save me. This is why I think he will end up green. If I get lynched today, which I'm sure will happen, DW's alignment will be even more ambiguous.
Regarding: Suki
At this point I'm thinking she's town as well. I did accuse her of being mafia because of her being so certain that I was. But the more I read her posts the more it looks like a concerned townie rather than mafia taking advantage of the bandwagon on me. I still don't agree with her accusations of "scum slip" but for now I think he's a townie and I take back my accusation of her being mafia.
Regarding: dynarri
He did get the ball rolling on me with the help of BigDad's accusation of me trusting Day_Walker. As I mentioned multiple times before, and even debunked that I never placed my trust in Day_Walker. If I recall correctly, dnyarri, onlywonderboy and BigDad were the ones to use the DW and tD are scum buddies card because tD trusted him. They may have conspired together to fabricate that story and that makes them really suspicious.
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@sidesprang do you think I would vote for myself if I was mafia, given I only had 4 on me before I voted?
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I'm not sure why he turned and started defending himself again, I would not be suprised if he got talked into it by the scum QT.
I'm this far down the hole, the least I could do was post stuff to get replies. The town needs something to work with and I thought that would be the best thing I can do to help.
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It's not the act of self voting I'm questioning. It's the intention. Would mafia do that, 4 votes in?
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On January 08 2014 04:32 TheChyz wrote:
Yes
Care to explain why that would be a good strategy for mafia?
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so what happens at night is there still discussion?
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The more and more I think about it the more I start to doubt the Day_Walker/Dragoon pair
That's because there was never a link to begin with. Whoever started that whole scum buddy thing either got a little too excited that they may have found scum or decided to just outright fabricate it because they were mafia and this "link" would help town turn against each other.
I know I recently said that I think Day_Walker is town, but I think he would be the better choice to lynch tonight, if you still think me and him are somehow linked.
Case 1:
I feel like the town would gain more information lynching Day_Walker than me since he is really going out of his way to defend me and even attempting to redirect the lynch votes to another person. If he gets flipped as mafia tonight, then town can be safe to say that I am one as well since he tried so hard to defend me and I'd be lynched day 2. But if he gets flipped as town, I may still be mafia and I would still be the lynch target in day 2 since people rate me so highly on their scum list.
Case 2:
If I get flipped tonight and revealed as mafia, do you really think Day_Walker would risk defending me right now if he was mafia, with nearly all votes on me? That would pretty much guarantee him as the next lynch target on day 2. But if I flip town, what does that say about Day_Walker? It could still mean he was mafia trying to get town cred (as chinstrap mentioned), or he was a townie with the correct read on me.
If you read through the 2 cases I present above, case 2 would be offer the most ambuigity for the town since me flipping as town would still put a question mark above Day_Walker's alignment. Case 1 doesn't have this ambiguity since I will still be the lynch target on day 2.
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@chinstrap, you just voted for me so I'm not sure you read my latest post, I would like to hear your thoughts on the two cases I presented.
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If Day_Walker flips town, am I right in saying that I would still be scum #1?
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I have to go soon, so here's my last word.
I can't tell you guys how to think or how to use the information gained from me dying but I want to ask you guys to question your analysis. You will all be wrong in thinking I am scum, some of you, I feel, tried too hard to make something out of nothing. What I'm mostly referring to here is "scum buddy", defending Asuna, and "scum slip".
I don't think you should target those who made cases against me because I feel like they were just making something out of nothing. My opinion is probably meaningless at this point but here is my scum ranking from most to least scummy:
onlywonderboy, dnyarri, Day_Walker, Balla24, sidesprang, BigDad, Derrida, TheChyz, suki, JonnyLaw, Asuna, chinstrap
This is my first game, really sad that I will die so early. I made mistakes which eventually led to my downfall, it doesn't help the fact that people overanalyzed my posts and made something out of nothing. I may seem scummy to some of you, but that's because you are actively looking for scum and trying to find anything you can use to get someone. I hope you reread my filter from a townie perspective and see that I was just really new to this.
ggwp, gl town I hope you get it right next time.
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I HAVE TO GO IN LIKE 5 MINS EPIC SWITCH TIME
##Unvote
##Vote dnyarri
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i better not miss my bus for staying here too long
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EPT
