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On November 05 2013 08:43 Cephiro wrote:
I was simply curious of your opinion about ET. Even though I cannot be sure it's from a town point of view, it still helps to hear perspectives of others as well, to ensure one is not too tunneled with their own opinion, whether it's about thinking someone is town or scum. Even though a certain confidence in one's reads is a must.
Ok. So what are your thoughts on this game? You've just now made your first post, but it's somewhat devoid of content which is surprising since you already know who you want to vote for. You've discussed some things with me without really talking about your own views on the game. So far, despite you making a serious vote and having a serious conversation with me about another player, I still have no clue how you're thinking about the game. Why is this and can you fix it?
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On November 05 2013 08:49 hzflank wrote:Show nested quote +On November 05 2013 08:43 thrawn2112 wrote:
Hey hzflank, what do you think about sn0's play so far? Disregard the specifics of who said what or who accused who of what, I want you to casually read his filter and describe to me his tone, attitude, etc. When I read him earlier, his tone was very fun. His attitude was casual, dare I say he seemed to be enjoying the game. At times you might think he has a idgaf attitude, but then he makes a few posts and you reseal that he is in fact invested in the current game.
This is almost exactly what I've been thinking. Don't all of these things hint of green and not red? How do you reconcile his general townie behavior with the things you think he's done that are scummy?
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On November 05 2013 09:05 Cephiro wrote:Show nested quote +On November 05 2013 08:47 thrawn2112 wrote:On November 05 2013 08:43 Cephiro wrote:
I was simply curious of your opinion about ET. Even though I cannot be sure it's from a town point of view, it still helps to hear perspectives of others as well, to ensure one is not too tunneled with their own opinion, whether it's about thinking someone is town or scum. Even though a certain confidence in one's reads is a must. Ok. So what are your thoughts on this game? You've just now made your first post, but it's somewhat devoid of content which is surprising since you already know who you want to vote for. You've discussed some things with me without really talking about your own views on the game. So far, despite you making a serious vote and having a serious conversation with me about another player, I still have no clue how you're thinking about the game. Why is this and can you fix it? Yes, I didn't intend to start off with a case, neither reason my vote on WoS more specificly. If there is someone you want my general or specific opinion on, just ask. I have several reads to a direction or another, as well as many nullreads. I just don't consider most of them to be worth sharing right now. Nevertheless I'm content with joining in like this, and I intend to make my thought process clear regarding my reads to the most extent, excluding possible thingamagics I have a tendency of pulling off. As for a more concise reply: It is because I wanted to not present all my thoughts in the open immediately. I can "fix" it by replying to any queries you might have. I will also be sharing more content when I find it necessary.
hmmm
can't really fault you for this as it's pretty close to how I'm feeling about this game
##Vote:Raynpelikoneet
lol rayn i'd much prefer our constant bickering from last game over our interactions in this one
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On November 05 2013 09:11 WaveofShadow wrote:
Random question---thrawn, who is scum? A lot of poking/prodding from you but no conclusions.
not me 
I'll lay out just about everything I'm thinking. Note that I'm gonna do this WITHOUT going back and rereading filters, so what you're getting is whatever I can remember right now.
Poking/prodding is all I've got right now. My only conclusive reads are town reads. In my notes I've got you, OO, Vanesco, hzflank, sn0, ET, Cephiro, and Syl crossed off as the people I'm not worried about, and that list is in order starting with who I'm least concerned with. Note that not everyone in that list is a town read, there is room for nulls or maybe even slightly scummy people who for various reasons I want to give some more time.
The people not on that list are: gumshoe, Umasi, onegu, and rayn.
gumshoe- came in with long posts that I honestly haven't read completely yet. the only thing I can remember about them is that I thought his targets were awful
Umasi- I haven't paid attention to anything he's said after the start of the game, I tuned out while reading his early post about Vanesco and haven't paid him any attention since so I don't really know what that guy's about. I remember reading someone talking about how his opinions on Vanesco haven't accounted for new evidence so that is worrying.
onegu- not a single thing comes to mind
-rayn - I want to fucking lynch this guy because I know he's capable of doing so much more. I'm not talking about quantity of posts.
That's about it. I don't really have "scumreads" yet but I'm confident about my townreads and I have a pretty good idea of who I want to talk to
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On November 05 2013 09:35 hzflank wrote:
Thrawn, can you go into detail on your ET read? What has he done to put you at ease?
Like I said earlier, he gets town points for tone and null points for content. I don't think any of the specific things he's said are very alignment indicative but he is direct and what I perceive as open with his thoughts.
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rayn what are you about this game? what's the deal?
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On November 05 2013 09:58 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On November 05 2013 09:47 WaveofShadow wrote:On November 05 2013 09:43 raynpelikoneet wrote:
WoS what do you think of thrawn's "scumreads" or rather the reasoning behind them? He's pretty unapologetic about basically having dick all for most of the day thus far. Doesn't strike me as scummy at the moment, since as you well know it is certainly possible for town not to have strong scumreads on the first day. I do see a marked difference in what I did D1 in ## and what thrawn is doing right now and I will be keeping watch. Rayn, are you going to be playing this game? May as well tell me now. I mean two of his reads are "i have not read their posts". And two of them are "they have not done anything". well that's as much reasoning i have given at this point for someone being scum (which is nothing). At least i do not have 4 targets, only one atm. I will be playing the game, i will tell you who is scum. I don't know yet for sure about who is scum. thrawn were you serious when you said you don't remember Sylencia playing scum?
so srs
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On November 05 2013 09:40 WaveofShadow wrote:
Your D1 feels pretty similar to mine in this regard; I don't usually have strong scumreads D1 though this game is proving an exception since there are a lot more people jumping out at me (double entendre!) than usual.
You should read gumshoe's posts. I wouldn't mind hearing what you think about him. (I also would actually like him to comment on my defenses of his 'fake-but-not-really' case on me outside of the reactions that others gave him at some point. )
I follow your thought process but I want to make note of something here. I have a bad feeling (and I can't exactly mention why I think this) that Rayn is not going to actively be playing this game, and as such will essentially be passively pushing us to policy lynch him, as some people are basically doing at the moment.
I would also like the mention that whether this is the case or not, I probably won't be voting for him today because I would at least like to give him the benefit of the doubt. I am certainly confident in my ability to find people scummier than him today. Onegu/Sn0 and now maybe Umasi fit the bill for me atm. I have no idea wtf Cephiro is thinking right now but I don't...think...he's scum?
Usually I start games off by making myself the center of attention but I didn't do that here because 1) there aren't enough people who are familiar with my town play who could bail me out if things go wrong and 2) I think people are mostly annoyed when I do that. Becoming the center of attention usually gives me something to work with, it's very easy to find scum when half the thread is accusing you. Without that tool I'm admittedly a little lost, or maybe bored is the better word. I wanted to roll mafia this game because I roll town something close to 95% (no joke) of the time, so after getting town yet again I became even less interested... add to that how I hardly know anyone on the player list and you should be able to understand my current attitude. I agree with you about Cephero. His entrance was a little awkward but he gave me a straight up answer so I'm cool with him for now.
On November 05 2013 10:02 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Cephiro looks town to me.
thrawn i find that hard to believe because the last game you played here Sylencia was scum in..
lol do you really? I'm not convinced you care at all. Are you wanting to make it an issue or are you only here to make passive accusations?
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yeah
There's a good chance that I'm going to buddy you all game. That shouldn't be a big deal cuz we are both obv town right?
confirmed town circle now accepting applications
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oh my bad you're already the only other guy on my "confirmed" town list
nevertheless, accepted
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rayn where did you go, I just "lied" to you.... shouldn't you be in here spamming the thread trying to get me lynched?
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I promise to talk about onegu or whoever if you'll talk about rayn?
Do you think that town rayn is likely to display the apathy he's showing if he truly thought he'd caught me lying? He hasn't done a single thing this game that's made me think he's town and the way he's passively gone after me all game does not match up to what I remember him doing the last time a town rayn thought I was mafia. Why will you not vote him D1? If you think he's going to be lazy this game why do you want to keep him around?
WoS my town circle posts were pretty sarcastic although they accurately describe my reads.
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On November 05 2013 10:43 ObviousOne wrote:Show nested quote +On November 05 2013 10:34 thrawn2112 wrote:
I promise to talk about onegu or whoever if you'll talk about rayn?
Do you think that town rayn is likely to display the apathy he's showing if he truly thought he'd caught me lying? He hasn't done a single thing this game that's made me think he's town and the way he's passively gone after me all game does not match up to what I remember him doing the last time a town rayn thought I was mafia. Why will you not vote him D1? If you think he's going to be lazy this game why do you want to keep him around?
WoS my town circle posts were pretty sarcastic although they accurately describe my reads. The scum Rayn I remember would be more likely to push for your lynch in some way than what I'm seeing here, considering his opinion from my interpretation of the game state is an unpopular one. You could pin him for not really thinking about the game or participating very much but it's early and from what I'm seeing he's not going out of his way to interact with his scum buddies in the thread which is another thing I expect of scum Rayn. Basically his apathy right now, for D1, and I'll have to reformulate my opinion about him later, is that he's more likely town than scum. Unless his partners are in the inactives and shit but again that's a problem for later.
So you're saying that his play here doesn't look like his scum play? I have been saying that this doesn't look like town rayn and I think both of us are right. So throw all the meta out the window and judge his play based on this game only, you still think he's townie?
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On November 05 2013 10:43 WaveofShadow wrote:
What did he catch you lying at?
earlier I said I dont remember ever playing with Syl when apparently he was scum in the most recent game I played lol
On November 05 2013 10:43 WaveofShadow wrote:
First of all, when was the last time you've played with Rayn? I'm not a huge fan of people using a heavy meta basis for their reads on someone, especially when they haven't played with said person in a long time.
Rayn has been making a conscious effort not to spam thread anymore in his town games. The passive way he's going after people right now doesn't seem that much different from the poking and prodding you've done thus far, the only difference is yes, I am used to rayn being a lot more active and useful than this even in his 'reduced-spam' state.
Desert mini, he was a pain in my ass all game long
I just looked at Onegu and I'm not seeing it. I can tell you why I think he's town but I'd rather have you tell me why he's not.
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EBWOP
On November 05 2013 10:43 WaveofShadow wrote:
What did he catch you lying at?
earlier I said I dont remember ever playing with scum Syl when apparently he was scum in the most recent game I played lol
On November 05 2013 10:43 WaveofShadow wrote:
First of all, when was the last time you've played with Rayn? I'm not a huge fan of people using a heavy meta basis for their reads on someone, especially when they haven't played with said person in a long time.
Rayn has been making a conscious effort not to spam thread anymore in his town games. The passive way he's going after people right now doesn't seem that much different from the poking and prodding you've done thus far, the only difference is yes, I am used to rayn being a lot more active and useful than this even in his 'reduced-spam' state.
Desert mini, he was a pain in my ass all game long
I just looked at Onegu and I'm not seeing it. I can tell you why I think he's town but I'd rather have you tell me why he's not.[/QUOTE]
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rayn goddammit you cannot play like kushm4sta
only kush can do that and still be readable
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fuck i'm not reading that lol
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On November 05 2013 11:18 Cephiro wrote:Show nested quote +On November 05 2013 11:15 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I am not reading Cephiro's post because even if WoS is scum i can assure you 90% of that post does not make WoS scum. Even if you think that you should read it even for the 10%. I admit there may be points (especially later on the case), where I am simply so sure in my read that they are a bit biased. If you honestly think WoS is not scum and my case is horrible, then point it out. That's why I posted it. I want people to look at it and see my reasoning why I think WoS is scum. If you agree, great, let's lynch WoS and hope that I'm right.
Ceph the real reason I don't want to read the case is because it's simply too long, and at a glance it looks like one of those filter-dive cases that could be made against anyone. Everything looks scummy if you present it the right way so a big list on inconsistencies or whatever doesn't do much to persuade me because honestly I could probably whip up a similarly sized case against anyone if I felt like it. I did sorta skim the case and one thing that caught my eye was...
"Scum is under constant pressure, scum is also more likely to be inconsistent"
I don't know this to be true. In fact I can think of at least two players known for not always having their facts straight as town and both of them are hosting this game. Hapa misreading something or getting his facts 100% incorrect is a staple of his town play. BH has been known to disregard reality and try to get his confirmed town mason partner lynched. Town people forget and misremember things all the time, in fact I suspect that some paranoid mafia players keep track of their statements better than a carefree town player who feels no guilt at all.
That is just one example of why your case doesn't appeal to me.. I don't really agree that certain things are scumreads. I think WoS is pretty obviously town based on how easy it is for him to post. Ask him a question and he has no problem giving you a well explained, seemingly emotionally genuine answer within a reasonable amount of time.
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hey WoS I asked you about Onegu earlier, I read his shit and got ok vibes from it. Why is he mafia?
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Cephiro perhaps I need to be a little more clear.
NOT ONLY do I not accept that scum are more likely to be inconsistent, I wouldn't be surprised if the complete opposite is true. Have you never missed a math question, have you never forgotten anything? Why would you expect someone who rolls town in an online forum game of mafia to be perfect? Townies aren't the ones who are constantly wondering if their story adds up, mafia are. You can point out as many inconsistencies in WoS's play as you like and I will never listen to you unless you can show me how the inconsistencies are specifically scum-motivated. You need to show a clear mafia agenda behind the fuck-ups, otherwise you've just gone and pointed out a bunch of things that can probably be found in every single filter in every mafia game.
The other reason of why I don't like your case is because of the strong town vibes I feel while reading WoS's posts. I sense nothing fake/reserved/malicious/secretive about them.
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EPT
