EPTI will not spam.
Desert Mini Mafia
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Tutankoopa
United States145 Posts
I will not spam. | ||
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Tutankoopa
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-edited for greenness | ||
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what's the policy? | ||
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1. Sno posted. 2. You voted for him, 4 minutes after his post. 3. Then you say that based on his first post, Sno is town. explain? | ||
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##unvote | ||
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On August 29 2013 08:55 Hopeless1der wrote: I dont think scum could be as stupid as rayn in this regard. Tutan was attempting to justify a sheep onto an unknown policy and has since changed his mind...I'm glad I sheeped Oats. i'm glad you're glad buddy  | ||
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Tutankoopa
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On August 29 2013 08:55 Hopeless1der wrote: I dont think scum could be as stupid as rayn 1 in this regard. Tutan was attempting to justify a sheep 2 onto an unknown policy and has since changed his mind...I'm glad I sheeped Oats. 1. Can you clarify what you found to be stupid about rayn's play? 2. When you saw my vote, did you think I was seriously going to push for rayn's lynch on D1? Also, you say rayn's play is stupid yet you also claim to not understand the policy lynch. Explain? | ||
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Tutankoopa
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On August 29 2013 09:11 sciberbia wrote: @Tutankoopa Please explain your thought process this game with regards to rayn's alignment. Specifically, why did you pose a series of questions to him, and why did you then deem those questions as unworthy of answering? Basically, this: On August 29 2013 08:36 yamato77 wrote: this is now entering stupid territory | ||
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Tutankoopa
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All you need to know is that I'm town. | ||
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My guess at who's mafia is 1 out of, but probably not both hopeless/yamato, and the rest are people that haven't posted. | ||
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On August 29 2013 19:57 raynpelikoneet wrote: Tutankoopa i would like you to explain a couple of things: How does the bolded part make sense? If Hopeless did not understand the "policy", why is it wrong for him to call my play stupid? What did he need to explain? To me his thought process makes sense. 1. He's been acting weird about the policy lynch on rayn, attacking me as if he seriously thought that I was dead set on lynching yamato in my first post of the game. 2. Calls rayn's play stupid afterwards. Calling somebody's play "stupid" while not expressing a scum read on them implies you having a town, or at least not scum read on them. It seemed fake, as if the whole time he's had extra information, and he knows rayn is town and is subconsciously using that to justify his case on people who accuse rayn. On August 29 2013 19:57 raynpelikoneet wrote: What's your thought process between starting and finishing this post? Did you read Oats filter between writing the post? Why? In the start of the post you say something, then you say another thing at the end of it. Why would you not read the whole thread before posting so you are on top of things and not need to change your opinion in the same post? Yes I had read his filter and I changed my mind on a reread. Editing takes effort. I've read everything else in the thread but I don't have anything to say about any of it. | ||
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Tutankoopa
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1) Anyone who claims that I was seriously pushing a lynching with my first post is playing dumb. I don't think hopeless is capable of that logic. He's being ever so serious about his case on a guy's first post of the game and it doesn't feel right. 2) re read what I wrote. You are 100% incorrect about this. 3) you are the one who made it an issue. I've said as little as possible about it and only when asked about by you. | ||
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On August 29 2013 08:19 Tutankoopa wrote: ##vote: raynpelikoneet what's the policy? ...implies a serious intent to lynch. If it doesn't, your entire case against me falls apart. How long are you going to keep pretending like you have a real case? | ||
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On August 30 2013 03:28 debears wrote: When I see a bunch of short posts about different people from different people, I tune out. It's worthless trying to keep that organized in my head. I worry about the main happenings. Who's against who. Who's active and talking to others about actual stuff. That kinda thing. I only zone in when something jumps out (have a feeling) | ||
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On August 30 2013 05:10 debears wrote: Yoyo got some opinions on the scribs case? And the thoughts on sylencia and onegu? I haven't been bothered by scribs so I don't quite get what you're going on about. He's put in a decent amounf of effort and he seems engaged in the scumhunt. I'm getting an innocent vibe from sylencia. Onegu I just need to see more of. Specifically, I'd like to hear his reads on myself and Hopeless. (onegu please answer) | ||
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On August 30 2013 05:52 Hopeless1der wrote: My reasons for voting TK do not (nor have they ever) hinged upon the fact that he sheeped yamato's "policy" vote. Every time TK tries to respond to me, he says "but i wasnt really going to push him". No shit sherlock (insert sarcastic responses here). ?? On August 29 2013 08:55 Hopeless1der wrote: Tutan was attempting to justify a sheep onto an unknown policy and has since changed his mind...I'm glad I sheeped Oats. ???? | ||
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On August 30 2013 06:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: What i am saying is do you think ultima!tunnel!Hopeless is mafia and is ignoring an obvious mistake in his case while it has been pointed out for many people and is so obvious it is ridiculous to call someone out from it in the first place? Why would Hopeless as mafia do that and stick to his argument even when multiple people have pointed out the argument is full of nothing? I don't think he's stuck to his argument at all. It seems to flip back and forth between requiring my opening vote to be serious or not, and I still haven't gotten what I deem an honest answer about if he seriously.... no joking, no irony.... seriously thought that I wanted rayn dead. Actually, looking through my filter I don't think there's any good evidence that I've ever wanted to lynch rayn, and I think that's why I'm so confused about this crazy tunnel. | ||
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Tutankoopa
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On August 30 2013 06:14 raynpelikoneet wrote: marv i can understand the thought process as i said. I do not understand why people write posts before being fully caught up on thread? that makes zero sense to me because they base their posts on misinformation (or rather lack of all information). I asked Tutankoopa about it and he did not answer me. That's what's suspicious to me regarding the post you and i were talking about. 2 scenarios. Example 1: A player has X read on Z player. He has not read the thread. He reads the thread changes his mind and then makes a post about how he used to have X read, but now he doesn't. Example 2: What I did. How are those functionally any different? You're getting the same information from me in either case. | ||
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On August 30 2013 07:04 Hopeless1der wrote: Painting my room =\ K question for TK then. Why did you say only one of Yamato/me would be scum? That was because of an interaction between you two on page 7. I wouldn't make a connection like this late in the game, but at the time it seemed reasonable enough. Keep in mind how early in the game my post was. On August 30 2013 07:04 Hopeless1der wrote: Surely you have more than they're weird/shitting on the thread? More recent scumreads perhaps? You never actually stated your own preference when asking Hapa about debears: What are your thoughts on debears atm? I don't agree with much that he says, but I think he's being honest about it and I appreciate the effort he's put into the game post-drunkenness. I wouldn't say I've made up my mind that he's town, but he's never in the group of people I look at when I go filter-diving. | ||
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On August 30 2013 07:08 raynpelikoneet wrote: Tutankoopa wanna lynch Sylencia? No. I already said earlier that his posts seem innocent enough. | ||
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On August 30 2013 07:20 Hapahauli wrote: What posts in particular seem "innocent?" Also, what do you make of the contradiction I pointed out in his filter? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=426387¤tpage=27#522 Are we attacking people for dropping contradictions? Yeah it's odd, but not much more than that. It's not even the most glaring of contradictions. | ||
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On August 30 2013 07:30 Hapahauli wrote: TK, what do you make of Hopeless's tunnel on you. You've been the victim of it so far, but I'm somewhat surprised you haven't commented on your thoughts of his allignment yet. Have I not said I think it's pretty scummy? If not then... yeah. He's my top suspect but that's qualified by my "investigation" on him not quite being over yet. The only times I've gotten any town vibes from Hopeless were a few bits from his latest posts. If not for those I'd probably be voting for him right now. | ||
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On August 30 2013 09:24 sciberbia wrote: 2) Subtle contradiction / shift in emphasis At the beginning of the game, hopeless seems to be trying to make TK's first vote look bad: + Show Spoiler [hopeless] + On August 29 2013 08:55 Hopeless1der wrote: I dont think scum could be as stupid as rayn in this regard. Tutan was attempting to justify a sheep onto an unknown policy and has since changed his mind...I'm glad I sheeped Oats. On August 29 2013 09:14 Hopeless1der wrote: 1) Scum are more than capable of making Sn0's OP, which in and of itself is a stupid reason for rayn to come up with a town read. However, the part that I felt to be most stupid is that if Rayn is scum, he's revealed himself in all of 2 posts. 2) It doesn't matter what you were planning to do, I see your actions as scummy and I've voted accordingly. Your initial vote was not entirely damning. Dropping things off here + Show Spoiler + On August 29 2013 08:49 Tutankoopa wrote: actually nvm rayn ##unvote "Also") Was stupid the policy? Iuno... Hopeless doesn't outright say it, but he went out of his way to mention how TK's vote was a "sheep on some uknown policy" rather than a "troll vote" and then he says the vote post wasn't "completely damning" which implies it is still somewhat damning. But recently he says he had no problem at all with the initial troll vote from TK and that his read on TK was a total null following that vote. It doesn't really match up for me, and this is the type of subtle shift that I believe is a fairly reliable scumtell. I like this the most out of that post. This is something I brought up earlier and it sorta got ignored. This whole time hopeless has not been very forthright about exactly how seriously he was taking my first vote. He's explicitly said that he both did and didn't think that I was trying to push a policy lynch. Is there anything in my filter that makes anyone think that I've ever seriously wanted to lynch rayn? Or even that I've ever thought he's scum? No, so I don't know what the point of the case against me is. I dropped a case that was never actually a case, and because I didn't fully explain why I'm mafia? | ||
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On August 30 2013 09:48 raynpelikoneet wrote: I still do not find your answers to me reasonable but there is no point asking the questions again because for some reason you are not willing to answer me. Well it's a new day, lets try again. Just a heads up, if you keep asking the same questions over and over without reading my responses, this isn't going to work. | ||
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Tutankoopa
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I'm making a big pretty big effort to try and be civil, you know how tit for tat works don't you? | ||
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On August 30 2013 09:58 raynpelikoneet wrote: I can give you an example: Me: "Why do you post before reading the whole thread" You: "I started my post before reading the thread, then read a filter and added something in my post" wtf? That's not an answer to "why", that is telling what you did. The rest of this can be found in my filter. Why does that need explaining? Does me doing that make it hard for you to know my reads? No. Does it push any mafia objective? No. So it's just a playstyle choice. I can't explain that any more than I can explain why I had donuts for breakfast, it's just how things played out. And by the way, this is about that Oats thing right? Something you completely missed in my earlier response was that I HAD read the entire thread when I made that post. I changed my mind about Oats on a reread of his filter, which is something I said a long time ago. So you're entire accusation is based on a misunderstanding which I why I stopped responding to you earlier. | ||
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On August 30 2013 14:39 Hapahauli wrote: I really want to see a more complete picture of your reads. Rayn does have a point when he says your body of analysis is lacking so far. I could write up a bunch of stuff about town reads, but do you want to hear that? I've been talking about and to hopeless since the 2nd hour of the game. I have voiced suspicions on other people but they have been varying degrees of AFK. My reads match yours except for one or two differences. (Same for marv's reads I believe, I haven't read his filter lately.) You probably don't need me to tell you my town reads, you should know that from reading my filter. Right now I am working with the idea that all the mafia are in the following group. *Sylencia -Oatsmaster FirmTofu -Onegu **debears --Hopeless1der ***marvellosity * means that I think they're probably town but I need to see their play past D1 to come to a conclusion - means I think they have at least a decent chance of flipping red Hopeless is pretty scummy and the reasons why are public knowledge. When I read Onegu I don't see what he's doing, I don't see the purpose in his play. I asked him a question that hasn't been followed up on. An Oat's lynch is a coinflip and it will remain one until he returns to the thread. He had a weird start with his push on myself, and right as he was picking up steam he left the thread. | ||
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.....  .....But i know it's there. | ||
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I don't know, I guess I'm waiting for you to bring something productive AND original to the thread. | ||
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What happened to your read on debears? I haven't seen anything that suggests a retraction of your scum read, but you aren't talking about him right now. You're saying that hopeless is the scummiest, and you said FT deserves to be lynched but "maybe not today." Earlier it looked like you were pretty set on your debears read. Why is debears not one of your talking points when we discuss lynch options? Your stances on debears throughout this game have been.... confusing. | ||
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Why FT? Do you have any reason to think he'll flip red? What is there in his filter that makes you think he's mafia? Is this some kind of policy thing.... meta maybe? I'm not sure what information you're using to justify lynching someone with has close to 0 posts as makes no matter, compared to picking a candidate out of people who have posted and can therefore analyzed. thx for staying in thread so long btw | ||
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Your FT lynch is looking partly like a lurker lynch based on comments you made about lurkers, but why is this the right way to go about picking out a lurker? I am not against lurker lynches provided the lurker in question is playing scummy enough to warrant the risk of a mislynch and there are no other enticing candidates. At minimum you need to be able to explain why your lurker lynch is the best lurker lynch. | ||
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On August 30 2013 19:57 raynpelikoneet wrote: I have already told you i do not want to ask you anything. I already tried that and it didn't work. I dislike going this route but in regards to all the questions you asked me at the start of the game, I was right and and you were wrong. I don't think you're going over my filter to see if my explanations line up with the thread. Here are some examples, try to read this from my perspective so you can realize how difficult you're being. One of the initial things you harped on for was me making that early post where I dropped Oats as a scum read. Your accusation was that I was scummy for saying shit about Oats without reading the thread. Guess what? I had read the thread in full before that post! How have you managed to remain oblivious to this? I've stated this numerous times. The whole thing is bollocks, because in a hypothetical world where your accusation was correct, there'd be no scum motivation for what I did. Another issue was the smurfing conversation. Here is your direct quote: On August 29 2013 20:26 raynpelikoneet wrote: The way i see it Tutan did attention drawing to his smufiness. That's how i would put it. Why, that's another question. I was drawing attention to it? You're the one who brought up it and kept pressing the issue after I said I didn't care to talk about it. Do you see what I'm talking about? | ||
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Rayn if you can tell me why Oats is scum without meta then I'd rather hear that. I don't know how much I should be reading into things he did in the early game and him being afk makes him harder to read. As stated earlier he seems like a coinflip lynch. | ||
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On August 30 2013 20:50 raynpelikoneet wrote: I am going to give one example of the Oats thingy i pointed out. And this will be the last time i am going to do it. This is what i ask you at first: The bolded part is the ultimate question i wanted you to answer. Your answer is: Is there anyone in the game who thinks that answers the bolded question? Let's break it down. Direct quotes. Rayne: Did you read Oats filter between writing the post?... etc... Why would you not read the whole thread before posting so you are on top of things and not need to change your opinion in the same post? Tutenkoopa: Yes I had read his filter and I changed my mind on a reread. ........ You ask if I'd read his filter. I said I had. Because I had read his filter, I cannot explain to you why I posted without reading his filter. Yet you keep asking about my motivations for declaring a scum read on Oats without reading his filter. What? On August 30 2013 21:00 raynpelikoneet wrote: So someone being unable / unwilling to explain his motives behind his actions makes them town. I clearly do not know how to play this game.. You're asking me to explain motivations for something I didn't do! | ||
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Ok... so I said I had read the filter, but I did not specifically say that I had read the entire thread. That still doesn't justify you claiming that I'm scum for not reading, when that is something I never said or implied. Although it's not directly stated I think it's reasonable for someone to make the assumption that I was fully caught up at that moment. The frustrating part about this is that I don't see your point in a world where I'm wrong. Lets say I hadn't read the thread before starting the post. Where is the scum motivation for that? Most importantly, why would that scum motivation be more likely than believing that I changed my mind about Oats mid-post? If you feel like I wasn't cooperative earlier, it's because I was dealing with this guy (you) who I was town-reading, and he's delving into a pointless line of inquiry about something that didn't even happen. TLDR, FINAL ANSWER: Yes, I had read the thread before that post. I don't see why you were assuming that I hadn't read the thread. Evidence slightly pointed otherwise. I don't see why not reading would be scummy anyhow. Miscommunication is a real, observable phenomenon. Maybe we are both at fault? You lead off the entire line of inquiry by asking if I had read the filter. The question about a thread-read seemed tacked-on, like a restatement of the first question. In that particular circumstance "reading the whole thread" and "reading O's filter" aren't objectively different and don't merit two individual answers. You seemed to think that I was making reads on him without reading his filter, so I stated otherwise. Apparently you were mainly concerned if I had read the thread, but that's not a logical assumption for me to make given that we were talking about Oats and you led off with the question about his filter. Either you failed at writing a coherent series of questions, or I failed at figuring out what information you wanted from me and I'm not keen on starting a flame war over our respective reading comprehension skills. I'd say this whole thing comes down to you thinking I was ignoring your questions, and me thinking I had given you an adequate response. And with that..... I'm done talking about this. Not because I don't want to, but because there's not anything else that can be said. | ||
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On August 30 2013 21:26 raynpelikoneet wrote: Can someone look at what i asked Tutan about his question to Hopeless? I did not understand anything he said and how that was relevant to my question. Am i just being stupid and not able to understand what people say? I'll talk about it if you want but I need a smoke break first. I'd rather have someone else do it because I think I was asking valid questions and I want to see if anyone else agrees before we start deconstructing them. | ||
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uh... same goes for you...  | ||
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On August 29 2013 09:06 Tutankoopa wrote: 1. Can you clarify what you found to be stupid about rayn's play? 2. When you saw my vote, did you think I was seriously going to push for rayn's lynch on D1? Also, you say rayn's play is stupid yet you also claim to not understand the policy lynch. Explain? Rayn, this is a perfect example of how being spammy can be bad, even if you're asking OK questions. You really shouldn't expect people to give you every single reasoning behind their every line of questioning. When I asked those questions I had specific goals in mind, and it is counterproductive for you to ask me to talk about things that I'd rather the mafia team not hear. Even when the theory I'm working with doesn't pan out, I'm still going to want to keep my motives under warp a while longer. As soon as someone fully explains a question, that question and similar strategies lose their scumhunting potential for the rest of the game. You couldn't even wait for Hopeless to respond before you interrupted and started asking questions. However, we're long past that point in the game so I'll give you a full explanation. Much of H's play was him being skeptical of the rayn voter(s). He says that rayn is being too stupid to be mafia. The full picture is that everything he posts and all of his accusations are based off of his page 2 Rayn town read. By asking those questions I was basically fishing for more evidence that Hopeless knew rayn's alignment. If Hopeless did not understand the "policy", why is it wrong for him to call my play stupid? Stupidity is a common target of policy lynchers. Hopeless doesn't have to agree with the policy, but surely if he think's you're being stupid he would be able to understand why people might want to policy lynch you.... or at least have a reasonable idea why. On August 30 2013 22:33 marvellosity wrote: Not really. Got a casual read on Sn0 lying around? Apologies if I missed you talking about him previously Way back in the game I saw him say something like "Nvm, I lied." I thought it was townie and haven't paid attention to him since then. No, it's not the best town-tell.... but it is what it is. | ||
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On August 30 2013 22:43 yamato77 wrote: I have to find a lynch candidate before I sleep. give me bullet point on the case on hopeless, not going to reread to find it Hopeless quotes "Tutan was attempting to justify a sheep onto an unknown policy and has since changed his mind...I'm glad I sheeped Oats" "Your initial vote was not entirely damning." "3) I'd actually chalk that up to early trolling more than anything else." --- I think he's referring to my first vote. "My reasons for voting TK do not (nor have they ever) hinged upon the fact that he sheeped yamato's "policy" vote." I have no idea when or why he thought I was scum during any of that earlier stuff. At times it looks like he knows the early vote was nothing substantial, at other times he is insistent that I was pushing for a lynch. For further reading, I recently made a post about how all of his actions from page 2 onward are built on the assumption that rayn is town. That doesn't ring any alarms? | ||
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On August 30 2013 23:12 raynpelikoneet wrote: Why would mafia!Hopeless not back off from the accusation (regarding your policy-vote) in the (3) point and/or in the point you bolded? Many people pointed out how dumb his accusation regarding your policy-vote was, many people pointed out he is becoming a suspect because of that, don't you think his scummates would have not told him to cut that off and say "yeah i can see that now, i was wrong"? I would have definitely done so if my scumbuddy did something that stupid. I think your second quote is taken out of context because Hopeless also gave other reasons for you to be mafia (your reads post which really was full of nothing). I also think Hopeless has clearly expressed he has a townread on me and reasons for it, why is this more suspicious than let's say sciberbia having a 95% town-read on me? He did in fact back down. He started at "TK is scummily pushing a policy lynch" and later ended up saying "My reasons for voting TK do not (nor have they ever) hinged upon the fact that he sheeped yamato's "policy" vote." It's not only him having a town rayn read on page 2. It's how that town read is the foundation for many of his actions. An easy way to make cases as mafia is to pick on people who are erroneously accusing other townies. I think I'm gonna sit back for a bit and see what's going on with the replacement. | ||
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I think we have a decent amount of time left in Day 1. | ||
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Just to make sure you know, the lynch isn't too far away. Great things are afoot and all of us have a role to play. Even if you are mafia o.0 | ||
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On August 30 2013 23:55 Oatsmaster wrote: Lol I wanna lynch sn0 now, why are we caring about peoples feelings instead of lynching mafia???/ How is it unfair if we lynch alak today Sn0? I don't think it's unfair and I'm still considering it. I really want to hear from Scib and Hapahauli as they are both Hopeless voters who haven't posted in some time. | ||
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I'm not amenable to lynching syl or Oats. FT lynch is meh, who knows. Maybe Onegu? It's going to depend on what each of them do between now and the lynch. | ||
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On August 31 2013 06:58 raynpelikoneet wrote: ##Shoot: marvellosity ![[image loading]](http://memegalore.com/wp-content/uploads/gv0yY.png) | ||
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On August 31 2013 07:15 raynpelikoneet wrote: Hapa, i strongly think they are both town. I have given my reasons for both of the reads. Quickly rehash your hope/slam reasoning. | ||
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scib comes in with a calm and collected town read on a guy who everyone wants to kill, and proposes lynching oats which probably wasn't/isn't going to happen. | ||
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On August 31 2013 07:38 Hapahauli wrote: You know that he's the guy who started the case on Hopeless... right? wtf is your point | ||
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On August 31 2013 07:38 Hapahauli wrote: You know that he's the guy who started the case on Hopeless... right? and no, this is incorrect. he may have been the first to make a formal case but the way you described is not how things went down. | ||
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Slam>FT>IDK. None of the other lynches are compelling. | ||
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You do not handle last minute lynches by claiming everything possible. | ||
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Onegu made the following post about debears at the start of the game. On August 29 2013 20:02 Onegu wrote: Yes I am leaning scum on dabears, guess I should have been more clear on that if I had to choose . Also from the whole sn0 thing and how rayne reacted made me feel town on him. FT needs to get back in here as he has done nothing. I also agree with rayne that sn0s post is townie. Several other things happened after that regarding Onegua and debears, but let's come back to those later. The last thing in this storyline was Onegu abandoning his debears lynch in order to propose a lynch on the 2 post coinflip lynch, FT. Why? Up till that point Onegu had never retracted his stance on debears. When I asked about it, Onegu said he changed his mind on debears due to this post. Well.... there's not much alignment indicative information in that response for two reasons. The first is that the debears post in question (Hapa and I talked about it) had already been a talking point so I can;'t exactly credit Onegue for "making a read." The second reason is that Onegu never said anything about dropping debears as a scumread. I think this is pretty fishy, at best it's null. The second example is far more damning. It relates to yet again, Onegu having a scumread and not considering that read as a lynch option. Here is what Onegu had to say about Hopeless. I think this was around the time when Onegu returned from a moderate posting break. On August 30 2013 15:46 Onegu wrote: Ok I got it, I think you are null to slightly town I dont see what hopeless found scummy in you. I think hopeless has a very good chance of flipping scum. "Hopeless has a very good chance of flipping scum." What do you do when someone has a good chance of flipping scum? You lynch them! What does Onegu do? On August 30 2013 16:16 Onegu wrote: Anyway I have a doctors appointment, and am then going to celebrated my birthday belatedly, when I get back I will look into syl and everyone else. Wtf are you doing FT? Do something or die. ##VOTE:FirmTofu This post happened 30 minutes after Onegu can be quoted saying that "hopeless has a very good chance of flipping scum." What else does Onegu have to say about Hopeless? On August 31 2013 03:38 Onegu wrote: It shouldnt matter he is a replacement, sorry you replaced someone who is scummy tough luck. And why does a FT lynch waste the day? It gets rid of someone who has a good chance at being scum, and its not like everything was wasted the discusion that was made today is still valid. This obviously came after hopeless dropped out. Onegu's point is that we shouldn't give Alakaslam any leeway for being a replacement. If this is truly Onegu's opinion then I would expect him to still be vocal about considering an Alakaslam lynch, which he wasn't. He made several posts about Hopeless's scumminess throughout D1, but he never showed any interest in lynching him. The same thing goes for the debears read, although that is tricker due to Onegu's non-confirmable explanation. Summary: Onegu is not pushing candidates that line up with his scumreads. There was the weirdness with debears, and the multiple instances of Onegu saying that Hopeless is a good lynch, but when it's time to pick a candidate Onegue settles for FT. When Onegu made this decision FT had all of two posts. Why would a townie think one player has a good chance of flipping scum, but then decide to lynch a coinflip lurker who has 2 posts? | ||
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On August 31 2013 10:45 sciberbia wrote: god night-time is no fun I'm here baby, and I'm ready and willing to satisfy all of your darkest, most primal mafia-related fantasies. | ||
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It's night time so obviously there's no rush to force anything if you are ill-prepared... just whenever you get around to it. | ||
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On August 31 2013 11:25 Sylencia wrote: @Tutan, I was saying that before... If so, then sorry. Ever since rayn returned midway through D1 I've had a hard time focusing on anything but him. As a matter of fact, I sorta went over this with Onegu himself, albeit in a condensed format. Anyone who is interested in reading for context should start here. | ||
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On August 31 2013 11:33 Onegu wrote: How am I not pushing my scum reads I also said FT had a good chance to flip scum, then he came back and placed his vote down with no reason, he deserved to die for his play it was scummy. And when I first unvoted him I was decideing between syl and alakaslam. Then FT made the vote with no backup after I said if he comes back my vote will go right back on him. Saying that FT had a good chance to flip mafia is worthless if you don't back it up with an explanation. I asked you for an explanation and you posted things such as: On August 30 2013 16:52 Onegu wrote: I hate letting lurkers into lylo especially ones that are somewhat scummy. But maybe not today for him as I also think hopeless looks bad, and I havent looked at syl close yet. Ill be gone maybe 4-6 hours. But he really needs to do something. On August 30 2013 16:39 Onegu wrote: I think he should be lynched as hasnt done much of anything, this reminds me of DI in NWM when he flipped mafia but I guess that was DI meta. I just want him to do something so we can get a betterread on him. But after rayne had me go and read some of his other filters he looks slightly scummy for his first post. But really not have time to expqnd more on this yet. I don't see your reasoning for thinking that FT had a good chance to flip mafia? How could he have? He had two posts. What was going on in your head at the time? What specific reasons did you have for thinking FT was mafia at that exact moment in the thread? I don't see how you could have possibly been more confident in your FT read than in your Hopeless read or any other read. | ||
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On August 31 2013 11:45 Sylencia wrote: The one I'm currently worried about though is Slam, look at this filter coming into this game - absolute spam :| Yeah. I think they are both mafia. I also think there's nothing that can be said about Alakaslam until he starts posting reads so I'd rather talk about Onegu until then. | ||
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That's the core of the issue. I mean... I have a hard time believing you had a real read on FT. | ||
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What? No, I've not said this. How is this relevant? | ||
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I don't know if I care if there was any merit to whatever meta reasons you were talking about. (Btw, please explain them because I didn't follow the first time I saw rayn bring them up.) FT had 2 posts. Do you know how many town-explanations there are for somebody posting twice and then afking? Have you never seen that before? Yeah, meta could have meant he was scum, but that was nowhere close to being more likely than any town-based explanation for his actions. | ||
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On August 31 2013 13:14 Alakaslam wrote: BUT I'm vt. So if you don't want me to spam I can slow it down. . It's not frequency, it's content. | ||
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On August 31 2013 18:46 raynpelikoneet wrote: So i fucked up by leaving my keys in when going to smoke a cigarrette and could not get back in.. Okay Onegu's explanations make no sense to me. Especially his reasons for voting FT. better than me. just burnt two holes in my shirt out smoking also what is your stance on marv post lynch. i'm hoping for more than a fakeclaim as a response | ||
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<afk> | ||
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On September 01 2013 10:04 sciberbia wrote: Anything in particular you want to discuss right now while the rest of the thread seems to be afk? onegu | ||
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On September 02 2013 06:19 Hapahauli wrote: What do you make of the Rayn/Dibbers stuff? I wasn't concerned about debears before the claim, there's nothing off putting about the claim so I don't see a reason to examine it further. I don't know why people are putting any stock in anything rayn claims. Is there evidence beyond reasonable doubt that he's telling the truth this time? I don't think his shennanigans make him mafia, the only way I see rayn as mafia is if Oats is scum. Then there would be a legitimate mafia motivation for Rayn claiming mason. I don't think Oats is scum though, so... Hapa I plan on being in the thread for a long time starting later this evening. I'd rather talk then in live conversation. Did you really not understand my onegu case? I read your questions last night but I didn't know how to respond because I didn't know what to make of your post. I'm also curious as to why you are reading me incorrectly. Rayn, I want to know your reads on me from right before, during, and after my posts about Onegu. I also want to hear from anyone that disagrees with my case, or has a different reason for thinking Onegu is town. | ||
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On September 02 2013 09:30 sciberbia wrote: it just doesn't make a lot of sense for him to lie if he is town so are his other claims true? | ||
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On September 02 2013 11:02 sciberbia wrote: @TK/yamato Are you guys still here? Where is everybdoy? @alakaspam You especially need to get in the thread and start posting some reads. @hapa Who would you rather lynch between Oats and yamato? I think they're both scum. Sure lets talk about Oats. People have been questioning his flip flop but there's an explanation he gave in his D1 filter that's currently being overlooked. Did or do you know what it is? | ||
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On September 01 2013 11:09 Hapahauli wrote: TK, what are your thoughts on the claims by Debears and Rayn? As for Onegu, I really don't understand your case against him. Onegu apparently thought FT was scum, and his explanation about it (having played a ton of games with a visibly different town FT) makes sense. What precludes Onegu from finding multiple players suspicious and voting his top scumread (FT)? From reading his D1 filter, does it look like he had legitimate reasons to favor the FT read? Consider the size of FT's filter up till the moment Onegu placed the vote. Does it not seem weird to you that he was confident in that read enough to follow through with a lynch? The story doesn't make any sense to me. | ||
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On September 02 2013 13:36 Onegu wrote: Tutan I had a slight town read earlier but his case on me didnt make much sense to me as I pushed one of my scum reads and he attacked me for that, I am back to null on him. Why do our interactions remind me of the awkward silence of public bathrooms? With how I've been talking about you since N1, it seems like you'd have a lot more to say to me than you have. Considering how I've spent most of my time since N1 trying to get you lynched I expect to see some emotion from you, maybe anger or annoyance. You say you're null on me. What are you currently doing to figure out my alignment? | ||
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On September 02 2013 13:50 Onegu wrote: First I dont get angry in these games much as either alignment, and I thought I posted a bunch on your case against me in our back in forth and then you dropped it not me. And I am going to go everyones filter today and update my reads. I just finished up with my kids so I am starting now with the filter diving. Yeah we talked about it, but I reached a point where I had to either accept that you thought FT was likely mafia, or decide I don't believe you. I don't believe you, so I don't know if that line of inquiry is still productive. Right now I am most interested in your read on me, specifically how it's changed from the very start of N1 until now. | ||
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On September 02 2013 14:28 sciberbia wrote: @TK Can you respond to my last post regarding Oats? + Show Spoiler [last post] + On September 02 2013 12:48 sciberbia wrote: Can you quote the post you're talking about? I don't remember reading anything of the sort. On August 30 2013 22:29 Oatsmaster wrote: Marv who is Tutan dude? On August 29 2013 20:06 Oatsmaster wrote: marv knows who Tuten is. On August 30 2013 22:35 Oatsmaster wrote: So if I can prove that Tutan is town, is hopeless still town rayn? It's not stated explicitly, but the first two posts show that oats was focused on my identity. Going so far as to suggest he can prove I'm town made me wonder if he stumbled upon some tell that made him very confident in his town read. What I quoted strikes me as a town motivated series of posts. | ||
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On September 02 2013 14:43 sciberbia wrote: @TK Also we have reached the crux of the matter regarding your case on Onegu. I find it quite believable that Onegu would think FirmTofu is likely scum based on the posts (or lack thereof) that were in FirmTofu's filter. As stated earlier I'm going to agree to disagree On September 02 2013 14:43 sciberbia wrote: In my last game, Smurf Mini, we lynched JPwertee partially for insisting that another player was almost definitely scum based on the singular post in the filter. JPwertee was town (and he was right). Also I think Onegu is town based off a bunch of other stuff in his filter. Lets go into that. As stated earlier I'm going to agree to disagree | ||
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On September 02 2013 14:46 Tutankoopa wrote: As stated earlier I'm going to agree to disagree Lets go into that. | ||
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On September 02 2013 15:01 Onegu wrote: You mean day 1 I didnt call you town n1, and the reason you became null to me is because your case against me was based on something that I dont really consider a scumtell. And it makes me wonder why you are pushing my lynch on something that isnt really a scumtell. But I more interested in lynching people who just basicly sheeped your case on me, alakaslam and syl. Rayn as sk but he isnt a priority now. What I'm look for is basically a transcript of your brain's inner monologue while you were reading my case against you. Simple saying that it made you read me as "null" is so boring... | ||
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On September 02 2013 15:22 sciberbia wrote: @TK Why I think Onegu is town His posts are blunt and direct. He isn't wishy/washy. When asked something, he doesn't skirt around the issue but addresses the question head on and makes it clear where he stands. + Show Spoiler [examples] + On August 29 2013 20:02 Onegu wrote: Yes I am leaning scum on dabears, guess I should have been more clear on that if I had to choose . Also from the whole sn0 thing and how rayne reacted made me feel town on him. FT needs to get back in here as he has done nothing. I also agree with rayne that sn0s post is townie. On August 30 2013 02:22 Onegu wrote: I actually agree with this post alot, and it gives me heavy town read from yamato, as I have only played with him being mafia and he had zero posts like this. I dont know thier meta as well as alot of people, but I do like how hapa called me out with reasons, while marv just said I would be the second person he would lynch because he doesnt know where I am going. On August 30 2013 14:56 Onegu wrote: Still working on catching up on everything my son woke up so I took a break to feed him. Will go through filters on syl and hopeless and post in depth thought. As for the whole you/marv/yamato thing, seems null all the way around in those posts, could see it all the way from either alignment. So I am keeping my first reads as Yamato as town you null to slight town, marv null to slight scummy. On August 30 2013 15:46 Onegu wrote: Ok I got it, I think you are null to slightly town I dont see what hopeless found scummy in you. I think hopeless has a very good chance of flipping scum. For example this post by you I liked your response and thought you were clear amd agree with the rayne thing. Also when people went after you for posting before being caught up is dumb I do it all the time and had no real problem with it. On August 30 2013 17:56 Onegu wrote: This post got me off of debears as a lynch canidate for the time being, I dont see scum saying they dont read the thread. While its not concrete and I dont agree with his hopeless read. At this point I dont think he is a good day one one lynch as I believe hopeless and FT are better lynches at this point. On September 02 2013 13:36 Onegu wrote: My main two are alakaslam and syl. I liked the case on hopeless then alakaslam has done nothing to change that thought as he has lurked and spammed, and I have made my points on syl and he hasnt responded to them at all. I am leaning town on oats, this is basicly how he has always played as town in the games I have been with him in but its always difficult to get a solid read on him. After the post by yamato that I really liked he has been like the only person to try to figure out your and marvs alignment which makes me lean town on him. That being said everything he has said about you I cant figure out you or marv, null on both of you. Debears I believe and he is the closest thing I have confirmed town I believe his claims and he has played pro town. Rayn is likely SK or town I dont see him flipping scum as he has been playing way out there and he didnt really do that in GoT as scum but made plays like this in NWM as town with fake claims, his vet claim is most likely legit but doesnt mean his alignment. Tutan I had a slight town read earlier but his case on me didnt make much sense to me as I pushed one of my scum reads and he attacked me for that, I am back to null on him. sn0 I would like him to answer the questions I put to him about his alakaslam lynch thoughts. And scib Im not sure going to look at his filter soon. He isn't afraid to take unpopular opinions, call people out for bullshit, or disagree with vocal posters. + Show Spoiler [examples] + On August 29 2013 18:28 Onegu wrote: This post supposed to mean something? You said you were reading the thread then you post this? On August 29 2013 19:19 Onegu wrote: I know you are asking hapa but like I said before, that is just something that can be hidden behind as an excuse for bad posts. Him being drunk shouldnt change the read of him, a bad post is a bad post. On August 30 2013 02:16 Onegu wrote: This is all you got? Either drop the sarcasm and make a response that is actually a counterpoint. Or if not sarcasm move on to something else. Not he got me. On August 30 2013 02:22 Onegu wrote: I actually agree with this post alot, and it gives me heavy town read from yamato, as I have only played with him being mafia and he had zero posts like this. I dont know thier meta as well as alot of people, but I do like how hapa called me out with reasons, while marv just said I would be the second person he would lynch because he doesnt know where I am going. On August 30 2013 15:27 Onegu wrote: @sciberbia 1 Why is this a scum tell? The people you talk about are vets, and he has pushed his scum read even though people other people disagree with him, although he hasnt done it well, I have done the same thing as town in GoT, I made a case and when people I considered vets disagreed I didnt push it as hard anymore but I never dropped my scumread on him (he was scum btw :p) I think this should be null On August 31 2013 03:38 Onegu wrote: It shouldnt matter he is a replacement, sorry you replaced someone who is scummy tough luck. And why does a FT lynch waste the day? It gets rid of someone who has a good chance at being scum, and its not like everything was wasted the discusion that was made today is still valid. He brings interesting new insight/analysis to the thread, and has demonstrated that he is reading and analyzing filters. + Show Spoiler [examples] + On August 30 2013 15:27 Onegu wrote: @sciberbia 1 Why is this a scum tell? The people you talk about are vets, and he has pushed his scum read even though people other people disagree with him, although he hasnt done it well, I have done the same thing as town in GoT, I made a case and when people I considered vets disagreed I didnt push it as hard anymore but I never dropped my scumread on him (he was scum btw :p) I think this should be null On August 31 2013 03:34 Onegu wrote: Says he is ok with a FT lynch here. Gives reasons for voteing me here without point out any posts. Again says he is ok with a FT lynch Now look at the second line of why I am scummy. And I gave reasons for him being a good lynch, ie lurking, his scum meta for calling out rayne. Scy looks like he is just comeimg after me as a easy lynch target without any solid reasons other than sheeping what other people have points out about me. I would be ok with a scy lynch, but for the time being FT needs to die, and alakaslam has done nothing to change my read off of hopeless. I am ok with any of these three lynches. On September 01 2013 23:01 Onegu wrote: Sn0 you go from this to. This and then back to Why did you have the middle post? On September 02 2013 12:48 Onegu wrote: Hey I habe been thinking about the rayn and debears thing, and its possible one of then IS the SK. SK normally have one shot immune or green to checks and I have seen them have both also. Somfor example scum shoots SK debears who is immune and SK debears shoots Vet rayn. Doesnt this make a bit moe sense then 2 town vets? And since no one has claimed vig yet its more likely a SK or Maf vig. We should know tonight though. I could probably have found a few more examples but I think I have enough for you to see what I'm talking about. I don;t feel the same away about the first group of posts. His passivity is what's throwing me off. I agree about some of the posts from the 2nd group, but there are a few that look like he's pretending to play bad cop and not doing a convincing job of it. FT's post about 13 guys is just objectively stupid, everyone knows it even FT himself. I don't give people town credit for pointing out the obvious. I agree about the last set of quotes. | ||
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"Waaaaaait just a minute" and then proceed to interrogate someone until you decide they're town? That's your #1 towntell, your tendency to grill a scumread until you reach a conclusion that you're comfortable with. HELP ME HAPA | ||
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On September 03 2013 06:15 sciberbia wrote: Taking a short break to clear my mind and ponder my thoughts. I still think 1-2 out of Oats and Yamato are scum. I've found enough things about Syl that strike me as possible towntells that I don't want to lynch him. I'm not sure what to think about Spam. Some of his posts give me a gut town feel. My gut doesn't want to lynch him even though my brain can't think of a great argument why not. I'm really uninterested in lynching Hapa. I thought his D1 was really town and I don't have time right now to dig through all his past filters and compare it to this one. And I don't trust yamato at all. @TK What do you make of the fact I pointed out that Oats just like Onegu says he thought FT was scum based on his minimal posting? I think the situations are unique because Onegu's decision to lynch FT came long before it was ok to settle on a coinflip lynch. But WHATEVER, because due to Onegu's recent posts I don't want to lynch him anymore. Right now I'm looking for something to sheep cuz I have no idea. | ||
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But I'm also starting to have a change of heart about Oats so idk | ||
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.......... who is here? | ||
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On September 03 2013 07:36 marvellosity wrote: Yes, everything he's done has been anything but talk about scum. He's wove this stupid web of madness and hilarious soundbites and done everything but hunt scum. I get crazy shit can be town, but usually there is SOME WILL to TRY to solve the game. uh, not really. as bad as most of it is, every now and then he says something that both makes complete sense and seems genuine. | ||
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pretty interesting point he makes. you can't accuse alakaslam of not doing ANY scumhunting. there are things like this littered through his filter, hiding within the spam. | ||
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On September 03 2013 08:28 Hapahauli wrote: Well your other point is that "I spent no time discussion lynch targets", which I find to be pretty false given that I led the consolidation at the end of today (even if it was a mislynch). I was on the fence for most of the day because I've been pretty damn lost this game read wise. Normally I can tunnel a player and get the information I want, but players like yourself, Oats, Alakasam, Onegu, and others I need posts from either are horrendously inactive or absent from the thread when I'm here or something. SO yeah, my current view on the game is that scum is somewhere in the lurkers and that we have a circle-jerk of active townies who are willing to post. And that's a problem given how many goddamn inactives there are. I want to +1 this. If you guys knew my name+alignment you'd probably be lynching me on the fact that I haven't been foaming at the mouth for much of this game. People don't seem to care lately with the exception of scib all game long and hapa just recently. I have no idea what's causing this, but discussion in this game has proven to be entirely unhelpful. I'm gonna re-read the entire thread sometime before D3 and if anyone has the time, I'd like them to do the same. | ||
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On September 03 2013 08:36 yamato77 wrote: The game is probably over at the daypost. If nightkills determine points, yeah. That also would mean that if somebody had died N1 and we mislynched like we did D2, the game would have been over with this recent lynch. I'm just gonna hope that the water mechanic isn't that imbalanced. | ||
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