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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 01:50 Vivax wrote: Btw I'll be shooting Vayne tonight, cause he's a jackass. lol, I had the same thought: If I were scum I would so shoot Vayne tonight. Also if I were Vig I would let him survive the night and day vig him 10 seconds into day 2. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
Stutters disagrees with both of Tofu's scum reads. Stutters also says that he is going to check out FT a bit closer. On July 29 2013 04:26 Stutters695 wrote: Reread it, he's so obviously town I find it hard to believe you can't see it. On July 29 2013 04:26 Stutters695 wrote: And on that note, going to check out FT a bit closer. On July 29 2013 04:53 Stutters695 wrote: Also Tofu read page 5 and 6 of his filter. That isn't scum responses at all. Stutters later says he has not yet looked at Tofu but has him as null. On July 29 2013 06:16 Stutters695 wrote: FT: I haven't looked at him too much. I'll have to get back to you on that. I had him kinda null but your post makes sense. Stutters thinks that Paper is scum but is willing to sheep Rayn onto Tofu. On July 29 2013 06:18 Stutters695 wrote: Onto today's lynch, Paper is my choice. Because Rayn has a good track record and we think similarly, if Paper doesn't get traction I'll sheep him onto FT. I don't want a no lynch. Stutters is also willing to sheep Rayn onto Koshi. On July 29 2013 08:01 Stutters695 wrote: Hmm you're right. Tbh I didn't really pay attention to him in I swear because of what I heard in the NWM postgame. His reads were good in I swear. I could get behind this then, he really doesn't have an excuse in that case. Stutters changes his mind regarding a no lynch. On July 29 2013 08:55 Stutters695 wrote: I'm like 99% sure paper is town now. Wouldn't a no lynch be better if people won't switch? Stutters, you obviously had a very strong town read on Rayn as soon as he joined the game. Why? Considering that you disagreed with both of Tofu's scum reads and said that you were going to look into him, why did you not look into him until Rayn prompted you to? You also seemed to completely sheep Rayn as your read on Paper changed. In fact I would say that since Rayn began to participate all you did was just completely sheep him. Would you be a darling and perhaps provide an original opinion in future? Thanks. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 02:04 Koshi wrote: Please comment, rate and subscribe On July 30 2013 02:00 Koshi wrote: FUCCCKKKKK I AM FAILING SO HARD RIGHT NOW I agree. 50%. Subscribed! | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 02:22 VayneAuthority wrote: He doesn't have to be scum. He shot me as vig in carnival cruise mafia but he was town there so thats not alignment indicative. However, the rest of his play is. Read his filter in roulette and compare it to this and please tell me he isn't playing exactly the same  Vayne for president! Vivax obviously scum then. I am playing the same as I did in newbie 44 where I was scum. Stutters is playing like he did in Basterd where he was scum. Rayn plays like this every time that he is scum, in fact for the first 36 hours Rayn played exactly like he did in Roulette where Rayn was scum. Scum team is Vivax, hzflank, Stutters and Rayn. Game is solved. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 02:33 justanothertownie wrote: To hz: I read a few games before I made my account to start playing myself but I cannot be bothered to check exactly which ones - I skimmed through most of them anyway. Stormmafia comes to mind - really cool game. But I guess the goal of your question was the last Newbie game where you were scum. Yes, I read that one. Actually I just thought that you using the phrase 'in the thread' was a little odd if this is your first ever game of Mafia and you are town. But you would of seen scum QT's if you read old games. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
That is my reasoning. If you do not believe that reasoning could come from town that is fine, but I am certainly not going to start to lie about why I did something. Also remember what my opinion of Koshi was and is. Either he is scum who feels the need to tunnel me out of desperation to look town, or he is town who is frothing at the mouth at the thought of catching me in my scummy ways. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 03:53 exarezee wrote: That's not the point. You're trying to twist my argument into something else. The point is NOBODY has looked. And this I find troubling. You mean nobody looked or people did look but did not find anything worth bringing up at this point. Paper was sincere but Paper had no more knowledge than the other 9 town in the game. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
Also, there is a serious problem with your gut. You should see a doctor. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
Conclusion is that the case is not strong enough to stick if Clarity is scum. It might stick if Clarity is town but that's pointless anyway. The case needs to be strengthened to be useful. I like the technical nature of the case. Vivax obviously put some work into it and I had never thought to look at a case in that way before. The problem is that town sometimes write cases in that way also. Particularly at the start of day 1 when Clarity made that case. If Clarity had made that case on Tofu on day 2 then it would look a lot more like scum. At the start of day 1 you do not really expect cases to be good or to really stick. It was probably a case to get a reaction. I would not want to vote on Clarity based on Vivax's case. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 06:26 Vivax wrote: I have a question, what point is there in Malongo sorting people activity wise at all? It doesn't have any relevance for his conclusion. He could simply tell what he doesn't like about hzflank, instead he feels like posting some fancy summary before he does that. I don't know if you think this helps, but the only person that Malongo has pushed as being scum is me, and I think that Malongo is likely town. I can understand him making that read on me from a town point of view, as long as I make a few small assumptions about his personality and experience. I think there is more chance that Malongo just needs more experience than there is of Malongo being scum. Either way, he is not a good lynch target for day 2. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 06:35 Vivax wrote: Hzflank, if I had the ability to vig stutters right now, would you agree on it? Hmm, depends if I knew if there was actually a doc on you. I would prefer a Vig to save his shot until day 2 because I have an awesome conspiracy theory. So if you will 100% survive the night I would ask you to save the shot  If you had to fire now then I would not be against a shot on Stutters as he has a reasonable chance of being scum. I think that JAT has a higher chance of flipping scum, but Stutters is up there. If Stutters flipped red then I would want to lynch JAT next anyway though, so I would say just shoot JAT instead. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
I don't think that your take on Koshi and I comes from a town perspective. It does not appear to be a scum-scum relationship in the slightest and I think that you know something that I do not. Look at the very first conversation that I had with Koshi here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=422720¤tpage=34#661 That is not scum-scum. Even if you argue that the later day 1 conversation was, the night conversation was not. If you are going to make such a wild claim then either I need to understand how you arrived at that position or I think that you are scum. On day 1 you were pressured and with the way the game went it turned out that a large number of people defended you by proxy (including me). If we were to Vig one of those people such as Stutters and they were to flip red then I would still think that you are scum and I would still want to lynch you. By the way, regarding Koshi and me: It is going to be a mess on day 2. Regardless of his alignment he is going to push hard at me and I am going to have to make a series of long and possibly boring posts and everyone is going to wish that we would both just stop posting. This is not a scum-scum thing. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 06:51 Vivax wrote: Can you explain the bolded to me though? Do you auto-assume that stutters would flip red if shot? I think that Stutters would probably flip red, but if I approach it in that order then I am setting myself up for a big fail. Attempting to name the entire scum team when we have no scum flips is foolish, but if I did so then Stutters would be in there. I would prefer to go one step at a time. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 07:21 Vivax wrote: Do you disagree with what he just brought up about FirmTofu? He brings up something quite good. I noticed what he brought up at the time that Tofu posted it. I was really tired/unwell at the time so I may have read it wrong, but I had a different take on it to Stutters. Tofu named a 4 man scum team based on Paper being scum and then implied that he would completely re-evaluate it based on Paper's flip. That is not scummy for the reason that Stutters is saying it is scummy. If I want to call it scummy then it would be because the 4 names Tofu put together made no sense as a group, but realistically when anyone names a 4 man scum team on day 1 it is going to be horrible. In fact I do not agree with Tofu's reads in general this game, but they are at least believable so I do not think that makes him scum. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 07:20 FirmTofu wrote: @hzflank What are your top scum reads right now? JAT. There are a lot of things that I do not like about Rayn, but I need to wait until I have a clearer head before I get stuck into it tomorrow, as I expect that it will be a slug-fest. I could totally see Stutters being scum with those two, but I would rather go at JAT and Rayn first. If I am completely wrong about those people then I would think that Koshi is scum. But I need to at least get a better read on JAT and Rayn before I think about trying to lynch Koshi. Koshi being scum does not fit well with JAT and Rayn being scum. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 07:30 Vivax wrote: More specifically, do you think that the point mentioned could have come from a scum stutters? Sorry for the delay, that question requires better analysis than I am capable of right now :p First I will answer an easier question: I think that could totally have come from a town Stutters. If you look at it in thread then Stutters already had a scum-read growing on Tofu when Tofu posted the list then and then Stutters flipped out thinking that Tofu was definitely scum. Considering how things unfolded it does make sense for town-Stutters to bring this up now. As for that coming from Scum-Stutters... It could, but it is not likely. It's still only one post and a single post can be faked. Going over that post thoroughly is making me doubt that Stutters is scum though. It looks so so much like Stutters made that post from a town point of view. I need to think about this more, but I would definitely not want to kill Stutters right now. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 30 2013 07:59 Stutters695 wrote: Here is the problem with that line of thinking. When the PS wagon started rolling, he was against it initially. He concocted two completely association based scumteams to allow himself to get on the wagon without being completely scummy for it. He offers no justification for the associations beyond basic "buddying" nor any explanation for why Mal/Koshi can't be scum if Paper wasn't. He isn't contributing in any meaningful way and is skirting actually contributing in favor of telling us what we want to hear. This isn't the same tofu from I swear 2 Devil's advocate here: Could Tofu not of done that because it is majority lynch and he just really wanted to avoid a no lynch? I am having a hard time getting my head around people who see a relationship between Mal and Koshi. It;s probably because they have both only tunnelled me so I have a unique perspective on them, I really do not think that there is a relationship between Mal and Koshi. I will make sure to go over all of this (Tofu) again tomorrow. Tofu has been null to me for a very long time now so I should probably try to force a refresh. | ||
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