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Watching sgdq bro, am keeping up with the thread but not filterdiving or anything. I'll get a post up before night ends obviously.
Yes, I just admitted to LURKING, omg.
Seriously though, my cases are the same town or scum, you're actually making me doubt the way I make cases though.
I get a feeling someone is scum, I read through all their stuff in context, then if I still think he's scum I try to convince others.
Using their posts and viewing it from a scum/town perspective and explaining which makes more sense seems like the way to do it.
You're using cases that scum have made that have the same building blocks, picking away at posts, but I bet I can find a ton of them made by townies as well so I don't really understand your point. Other than my FT case, do I look like scum to you?
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xrz unless you think he's scum for not looking back at paper please stop shitting up the thread.
If you DO think he's scum for it, explain.
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On July 30 2013 05:10 Vivax wrote:Man, I wish I saw this earlier. Clarity, when there is some break in the show yuo're watching I'd like to talk a little it about the reasons in your case on FT, it has multiple grave issues: Show nested quote +On July 27 2013 19:34 Clarity_nl wrote:On July 27 2013 09:54 FirmTofu wrote:
Yeah, I dunno what you guys are doing fluffing up the thread with fluff and general bullshit but It's be great if we could discuss the game now. FirmTofu would like us all to actually discuss the game, instead of all this fluff that's going on, like everyone talking about the lurker lynch policy! Granted, this post might have been in context with Koshi's 1,2,3 posts, but that was Koshi trying to prove a point. Firmtofu before this point however, did not discuss anything other than lurker lynch policy: + Show Spoiler +On July 27 2013 09:25 FirmTofu wrote:Okay, I'm back on a computer. Show nested quote +On July 27 2013 09:01 Vivax wrote:
Hi guys, I propose that we lynch the lurkiest guy D1.Obviously if someone looks really scummy then we lynch him first, but if that's not the case then we lynch the guy with the least posts. I think scum really likes to post as few as possible.
I know that's gonna look kinda scummy, but I'm going to bed now. Gn! This comes up every game. How scummy does someone have to be for you to want to lynch them over a lurker? You have to consider that lynching lurkers provides very little information whereas lynching scummy people might tell us a lot about how people are related to one another. On July 27 2013 09:40 FirmTofu wrote:
To all of you that are out there...
Do you think policy lynching a lurker day 1 is a good idea? Why or why not? On July 27 2013 09:41 FirmTofu wrote:
Personally, I think we should use it as a last resort. Lynch a lurker only if
1) Half the town is lurking
or
2) All the active people look genuinely helpful/useful and none of them look like good lynches. Shitting on town, regardless of if you're being a hypocrite or not, is something scum love doing. ========================================================================================= If you actually went through the trouble of looking at the context of FT's post at the time, he posted it right after Vayne posted the gif of the gal with the crooked teeth, and Koshi counted to 3 in the thread. He didn't complain about the lurker discussion, he complained about general bullshit posting.========================================================================================= Then there is the useless vote with an easy out, classic scum: On July 27 2013 11:37 FirmTofu wrote:On July 27 2013 11:35 exarezee wrote:
@FirmTofu
I'd rather wait until more posts are made. I think only 6 or 7 of the players in the game have posted so far. If you're going to wait, then I'm going to have to vote you until you do. ##Vote: exarezeeYou can't simply say you have scumreads and not explain them. "I am voting for you, and I will keep my vote on you until you do X!" This is not a vote to kill scum, this is a vote to have a vote on someone, and he backs off the moment his demands are met. On July 27 2013 13:31 FirmTofu wrote:
##Unvote
I'm not sure that the case on paperscraps has much substance to it, but at least it's something. Not only does he back off the moment he's able to, he's also wishy-washy about the case itself. ========================================================================================= That wasn't a vote to kill scum, that was a vote to get XRZ to post his scumreads. And he backed off the moment he did it. Did you really think that made FT scum? You are saying he just did it for the sake of voting. I see a guy using his vote to get information for town, don't you think?========================================================================================= But the most troubling things I found were his last two posts: On July 27 2013 13:39 FirmTofu wrote:
If I had to lynch someone right now, it would be CJS. All of his posts are filled with fluff and he has a random vote on Oats. I'm hating having to decipher all of his wordplay in his posting.
Paperscraps would not be a bad lynch for similar reasons. I'm not as convinced as I am for CJS, but suspicion is still there.
Right now, exarezee is looking pretty town. Notice how he explains that he's having a hard time reading CJS because of his roleplay, and Paperscraps would be a good lynch too because he's hard to read. That's all well and good, pressure them to be more easier to read, but the mindset is revealed in the part I bolded. He first claims that if he had to lynch someone it would be CJS or Paper because they're currently hard to read, but now he's suddenly saying he's suspicious that they're scum? why? Then he throws a random unsolicited townread into his post, because scum love giving townreads. ========================================================================================= Do scum love giving townreads? I don't know man. It really depends. It usually means they can hardly push suspicion on the guy they townread without having to explain themselves for the townread. In fact, you can catch scum by finding unexplainable townreads.
As for your other arguments, I don't understand why someone can't assume that people who post fluff and make themselves hard to read are scum. How does that opinion make FT scum?Like, what's so scum agenda-like about what he was doing?========================================================================================= On July 27 2013 13:41 FirmTofu wrote:
I want to hear more from stutters and the people who haven't posted yet. For all we know, the entire mafia team could be in that group of people. This post is the epitome of useless. Instead of focusing on the information we do have, Firm decides to point out that there's no point in scumhunting because for all we know all the people who haven't posted are scum. FirmTofu is pretty likely scum and our best lynch right now. ========================================================================================= Did FT exclusively post that and not do anything else? Had that been the case, then this argument might have been valid, but given that Tofu had shown enough effort before, I don't think this applies at all. ========================================================================================= I really don't like this case broski.
Okay, first one I actually included that in the case: "Granted, this post might have been in context with Koshi's 1,2,3 posts, but that was Koshi trying to prove a point."
Second, Yes, votes can have different reasons other than killing people. But when you announce the reason your vote becomes useless cause if your target is scum he'll just do whatever it is to get the vote off, as will town.
Third, yes scum love giving townreads. But you know what's scummy about that townread? No fucking reason for him to give a townread. And no reasons for his townread being town. He just calls someone town for no reason.
Last one, from what I recall, without looking back, yes he didn't do much up until that point. Leaving the thread that way, saying it's useless to do stuff anyway, is scummy.
That said, obviously when he started posting again he explained some stuff, and he contributed some stuff (not saying the contributions are good)
But aren't you doing exactly what you say is wrong with my case? just picking it apart, finding "mistakes"
Could you reply to my earlier post?
On July 30 2013 04:31 Clarity_nl wrote:
Watching sgdq bro, am keeping up with the thread but not filterdiving or anything. I'll get a post up before night ends obviously.
Yes, I just admitted to LURKING, omg.
Seriously though, my cases are the same town or scum, you're actually making me doubt the way I make cases though.
I get a feeling someone is scum, I read through all their stuff in context, then if I still think he's scum I try to convince others.
Using their posts and viewing it from a scum/town perspective and explaining which makes more sense seems like the way to do it.
You're using cases that scum have made that have the same building blocks, picking away at posts, but I bet I can find a ton of them made by townies as well so I don't really understand your point. Other than my FT case, do I look like scum to you?
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On July 30 2013 05:13 Vivax wrote:
Like, you might wonder why I'm posting this, now that the FT lynch is out of discussion for clarity, but that case looks generally really bad, in a scummy way. It seems designed to push a lynch on a guy without genuinely trying to figure out his alignment, and the judgment is too quick for my taste.
Why not bring it up day 1? Like, way earlier.
Also, yes the case comes on stronger than my read was at the time, but that's the point, I pressure FT and see how he reacts, and he WAS my strongest read at the time so I pushed him
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Why wouldn't you go through the entirety of my filter and note everything you find scummy before you criticize a single post I've made? As you know I didn't hammer FT, but I think the way I approached that case I applied maximum pressure to him, which I think gains the most information.
Anyway my goal before the night is over is to look over xrz, FT and rayn.
I can't tell if I'm being stubborn with my townread on FT because of that one moment, but I'm not ready to say I should treat that as null, I really don't see scum doing that.
rayn his list post felt like scum, then he felt like town until we got close to lynch and he made it extremely chaotic, and I gotta figure out if that's because he's scum or not.
Why I'm looking into xrz should be obvious.
On July 30 2013 05:33 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2013 05:26 exarezee wrote:On July 30 2013 05:18 Vivax wrote:On July 30 2013 05:16 exarezee wrote:On July 30 2013 05:01 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 30 2013 04:57 exarezee wrote:On July 30 2013 04:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:
so why am i scum to be exact? I mistyped a little. Didn't exactly read what clarity wrote. I do not have an informed opinion on whether you are scum. You are however part of the group today that have posted theories which is irrelevant upon the information gained upon the end of day 1. I find that to be more scumlike than townlike. So what should we do in your opinion now? Wait and see. Again, I've never played in a game where you can talk N1. I usually have more information to work with at this stage. I have to leave in about 1hr 15 min and will be gone for the rest of N1 phase, but I'm sure I'll be alive tomorrow. And If I do happen to die, it will be a benefit to your eyes. So my plan is to wait and see what happens during the N1 action phase and then contribute D2 if i'm still there. Opinion on my dissection of the clarity case? Do you think that case came from a townie? I remember clarity's case clearly from reading it on day 1. He along with hzflank, I liked a lot of their posts. I even directly told clairty i liked all his posts except one. I think he approached the case from a town perspective. I think you could make your case as a townie or scum. You do the same thing you fault him for. You dissect the case and point out mistakes. He does not really have any logical mistakes. And you do not show insight as to why he would do something as a town and not as scum. Town wants to solve the game and gain information. Scum wants to act like townie and cause mislynches. If someone posts a bunch of summarized reasons without a real conclusive reasoning behind it, drops a vote, and fucks off afterwards cause they feel they just contributed then it's probably scum.
True, but that's not what I did, like, at all.
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Mainly your hard tunnel on Koshi with questionable reasons. I think at the time it felt like you were town who genuinely thought he just found scum, but gotta double check. Plus I don't think you've mentioned or pushed Koshi much this night, which seems strange
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You can phrase it any way you want. Just said I was looking into you among others. chill broski
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On July 30 2013 05:46 raynpelikoneet wrote:
You are not making a lot of sense right now. And how was that chaotic? Especially how was my push "extremely chaotic" compared to others?
That's how it felt, I'll let you know when I get to it.
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2nd post is about FT.
Anyway, I did did change my opinion on him at one point, can't remember why though, I just remember reading his filter and thinking he wouldn't be a good lynch D1.
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I was kinda desperate to find a good lynch at that point, honestly. My saying I wanna lynch koshi was a bit kneejerk
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You should post it before I nk you
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Assuming we have a doc or maybe people are idiots or w/e. The only people who are 100% not getting nightkilled are scum, so he should post his case before night ends.
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Still are. Unless you scum ofc, but I doubt that.
Would be impressive though.
I didn't give xrz enough credit for his day1 towniness btw
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I dunno Vivax, if only I mentioned that in my case on him 
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On July 30 2013 06:28 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2013 06:27 Clarity_nl wrote:I dunno Vivax, if only I mentioned that in my case on him SHUT UP SCUM. STOP PROFANATING THIS THREAD WITH YOUR NEFARIOUS PRESENCE.
sorreh
But you're posting your case before d2, yeah?
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On July 30 2013 07:00 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2013 06:54 FirmTofu wrote:On July 30 2013 06:51 Vivax wrote:OKAY TOFU. I fell for the usual scumslip bias. Can you explain something to me nontheless? On July 30 2013 06:25 FirmTofu wrote:
I'm not sure if I missed something. Can someone explain to me how and why rayn has a town read on Koshi and Vivax now? What about the Koshi part did you find worthy of explanation since Rayn seems to have reached the same conclusion as you? Sure, rayn had a scum read on Koshi pre-flip when he was "99% sure Paper was town". Therefore, his read on Koshi should not have changed based on the flip, right? I didn't see any post in particular that warranted such a drastic shift from rayn so I'm asking if anyone can procure the post that changed his mind. That's a good question. Upon rereading this night's posts of Rayn, I don't see what happened to his Koshi scumread
IF ONLY SOMEONE BROUGHT THIS UP EARLIER, I DUNNO
You're kind of starting to annoy me Vivax, although I'm glad that you're trying hard
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On July 30 2013 07:03 Vivax wrote:
You better get ready to be annoyed a lot more Clarity.
Especially when me and the town push you off the ship.
Give it your best shot baby.
Or you know, don't, cause I'm town.
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On July 30 2013 07:06 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2013 07:05 Clarity_nl wrote:On July 30 2013 07:03 Vivax wrote:
You better get ready to be annoyed a lot more Clarity.
Especially when me and the town push you off the ship. Give it your best shot baby. Or you know, don't, cause I'm town. Yea sure. I'm sure town feels like shouting how townie they are during the phase where scum picks their targets. You can't fool me broski.
With you doing this I'm obviously not getting nightkilled you dumbass.
This feels like Mario Mini where I was obvtown, people called me obvtown, and then suddenly random townies made cases on me d3 and I died.
Make your damn case so I can explain why you're an idiot and you can move on to better things.
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I don't expect to die tonight, but here's a list anyway.
xrz: Slight town, his little "I figured it out" on day one with him thinking one of FT or Paper HAS to be scum (even if wrong) makes him town in my eyes.
You don't really see this logic from scum, let alone that he kept it up consistently throughout day 1. Also he's had a townread on me with GOOD REASONS for it.
FirmTofu: Ugh, really, I think he's town. Yes, it's mainly because of him going OMG FOUND A SCUMSLIP.
rayn: I think him jumping on Koshi a bit before lynchtime the way he did makes him lean town, regardless of what Paper flipped. His night 1 however makes me very wary.
Oats: Town, spammy oats who speaks his mind is town oats. Sadly he doesn't read the thread before speaking as either alignment.
CJS: He town yo.
Vayne: vigi this fuck, useless. The "day 1 is useless stuff" I can swallow but then going "I told you so" during n2 and still not explaining the shit he's spewing, useless or scum.
Malongo: I'm clueless about him now after learning about his meta.
Vivax: I mean, he's supposed to be playing good but he's pushing me. He also just kinda jumped on everything in the thread when I asked him for the case. Lot of effort to "win" though, leaning town.
Koshi: I really hated his useless lists day 1. Gets heavy pressure and does this:
On July 29 2013 19:52 Koshi wrote:
Did you forget yesterday? Or is it today contradiction day?
On July 29 2013 19:55 Koshi wrote:
IT IS CONTRADICTION DAY!
I mean, who does that?
JAT: Dunno. If my two scumreads are correct I guess he's town?
hzflank: I kind of ignored my gut on day 1 when I had that interaction with him. He felt extremely afraid and he felt like I was targetting him despite me not doing anything close to that.
I think scum are more likely to have this kneejerk defensive response. All the other reasons have been beaten to death.
Yes he has this one part in this one post that looks townie but its less convincing that FirmTofu's thing.
Stutters: Leaning more and more scum on him. It's not about the short filter, I did look and yes, his meta is to not post that much especially day 1.
First, his constant references to his activity always being low, despite when people pressure him they don't mention his activity (except for vivax day 1)
His day 1 "case" on Vivax is pretty atrocious. Wanting to lynch CJS on day 1 because of his ragequit is dumb or scum. Night 1 he jumps on the FT bandwagon but decides he needs to have his own unique reasons (which always smells scummy to me)
My only problem is, obviously, currently hz is calling stutters scum. Doesn't mean they can't both be scum, but I think it makes it less likely.
Regardless, theres my list, Stutters is a good lynch tomorrow.
I'm going to bed nao, night night peoples.
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EPT
