EPTOn May 15 2013 16:53 ObviousOne wrote:
Rayn do you need me to explain why I would say that? You will be around less time = you will ask fewer, but perhaps more poignant questions and I'm used to seeing you questioning just about everything as town. I wasn't seeing that ultra-inquisitive Rayn I'm used to seeing, and your retro-active explanation for not being around to question everything as it's happening changed how I felt from you being potentially scum to null for that reason. Kinda late to be responding to this but I have my mojo back so I'm hitting up everything in the thread as I re-read, so whatevs, there you go.
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On May 15 2013 02:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:
First, Sloosh and your case:
+ Show Spoiler +
1) No it's not. It's an opinion that i expressed as simple as it was possible. I think claiming miller in a setup where the number (or existance) of millers is not known is stupid or scum.
2) The bolded part you quoted; I think as town you should play as pro-town as possible, right? Cops do not check people they think are town right? I didn't understand why DP, at the start of the game, was worried about being checked by a cop. For me it seemed like he was scum who was afraid of being checked. I hope you get what i mean.
3 and 4) As is said, i unfortunately have limited time. I was not interested in kitaman at that time, i did not know what to make of him calling WoS scum that early in the game, so i ignored it. I wanted to hear more from DP, and wanted him to do something else than to defend himself. Everyone was discussing him at that moment, i wanted to know what else than his claim was on his mind.
If i got something else to clarify to you, ask me.
About why i am voting for OO:
What Prome said about OO and OO having an explanation to the DP night kill. In top of that DP was suspicious of OO, makes sense. Another thing that's very very odd from OO:
OO called me out for meta reasons. I then posted in thread that i have a tight work schedule. What does OO answer:
In my opinion this has nothing to do with meta, at all. If i post less i post less, but i still act as i usually do whatever my alignment is. OO is dropping his meta scum-read on me because of my work schedule. How does that make sense? Right, it doesn't, unless he knows i'm town and made up a meta read on me before i was even able to fully contribute to anything but DP-stuff.
shiro: You are saying that if WoS is town i am scum. How does that make sense? Are you saying i am not able to form town reads on people other people think is scum? I have given my reasons why i think WoS is town, are they bullshit? Elaborate please.
First, Sloosh and your case:
+ Show Spoiler +
On May 14 2013 00:55 slOosh wrote:
How can it be both a bad vig shot and a bad scum shot? This makes no sense at all.
In light of the DarthPunk flip I went back and reread people's stances on him. Because he had so much spotlight on him, scum would be compelled to make an opinion on him, or at least comment on him. What is important is to see how people justify their suspicions / read on him - town players have straightforward explanations while mafia try to make stuff up. Out of them, rayn sticks out the most:
(1)This is a classic mafia tactic. Push and lynch people for being bad, not scum.
(2)Here rayn implicitly calls DarthPunk mafia without actually doing so. He is pushing the idea that because it is "not optimal" that he is scum upon a ridiculous premise. "If you are town you shouldn't be checked". Read that out loud to yourself. It's nonsense. If that was the case then cops would always land red checks. Rayn is justifying his vote with bad (read non existent) reasoning.
(3)Avoiding giving opinions on kitaman(!!!) and draws attention back on DarthPunk. Then proceeds to ask a loaded question.
(4)Another loaded question, pushing suspicion on him without any justification.
##Vote raynpelikoneet
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On May 13 2013 13:49 Oatsmaster wrote:
That was the absolutely worst vig shot in the history of mafia
That was the absolutely worst vig shot in the history of mafia
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On May 13 2013 13:49 Oatsmaster wrote:
Or scum decided to kill a dude under pressure.
Or scum decided to kill a dude under pressure.
How can it be both a bad vig shot and a bad scum shot? This makes no sense at all.
In light of the DarthPunk flip I went back and reread people's stances on him. Because he had so much spotlight on him, scum would be compelled to make an opinion on him, or at least comment on him. What is important is to see how people justify their suspicions / read on him - town players have straightforward explanations while mafia try to make stuff up. Out of them, rayn sticks out the most:
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On May 13 2013 04:32 raynpelikoneet wrote:
It's not optimal. It's stupid or mafia.
It's not optimal. It's stupid or mafia.
(1)This is a classic mafia tactic. Push and lynch people for being bad, not scum.
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On May 13 2013 04:36 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I mean it's not optimal to claim miller if you don't know the exact number of delf-aware millers. What Hiro said, it only allows mafia to get away with claiming it right in the beginning. If you are town you should never be checked by a cop.
I mean it's not optimal to claim miller if you don't know the exact number of delf-aware millers. What Hiro said, it only allows mafia to get away with claiming it right in the beginning. If you are town you should never be checked by a cop.
(2)Here rayn implicitly calls DarthPunk mafia without actually doing so. He is pushing the idea that because it is "not optimal" that he is scum upon a ridiculous premise. "If you are town you shouldn't be checked". Read that out loud to yourself. It's nonsense. If that was the case then cops would always land red checks. Rayn is justifying his vote with bad (read non existent) reasoning.
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On May 13 2013 05:39 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I dunno what to make of it. Maybe he will explain it, maybe not, i'll judge later. I'm more interested in DP defending his claim as "what only townie would do" and then saying he is a good scum player and would never draw attention to himself like that as scum. If he thinks this is optimal town play, why so defensive?
And calling people who think claiming miller is scummy stupid/scum is ridiculous. I would atm lynch him based purely on that.
On May 13 2013 05:28 Vivax wrote:
Rayn what do you make of Kita calling WoS scum without reason and then more or less disappearing?
Rayn what do you make of Kita calling WoS scum without reason and then more or less disappearing?
I dunno what to make of it. Maybe he will explain it, maybe not, i'll judge later. I'm more interested in DP defending his claim as "what only townie would do" and then saying he is a good scum player and would never draw attention to himself like that as scum. If he thinks this is optimal town play, why so defensive?
And calling people who think claiming miller is scummy stupid/scum is ridiculous. I would atm lynch him based purely on that.
(3)Avoiding giving opinions on kitaman(!!!) and draws attention back on DarthPunk. Then proceeds to ask a loaded question.
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On May 13 2013 05:48 raynpelikoneet wrote:
How about you stop defending your sole action and start scumhunting instead?
On May 13 2013 05:45 DarthPunk wrote:
you don't have to shoot now.... Like obviously I don't want to die. I would RATHER be vigged than lynched though. if it comes to that. Hopefully you can all read my alignment by all the posts I am making clearly outlining the reasons behind my actions.
On May 13 2013 05:38 WaveofShadow wrote:
Only think I don't like about your claim is why N0, DP?
You're calling for us to waste a vigi shot that could be put to possible better use later on in the game.
Only think I don't like about your claim is why N0, DP?
You're calling for us to waste a vigi shot that could be put to possible better use later on in the game.
you don't have to shoot now.... Like obviously I don't want to die. I would RATHER be vigged than lynched though. if it comes to that. Hopefully you can all read my alignment by all the posts I am making clearly outlining the reasons behind my actions.
How about you stop defending your sole action and start scumhunting instead?
(4)Another loaded question, pushing suspicion on him without any justification.
##Vote raynpelikoneet
1) No it's not. It's an opinion that i expressed as simple as it was possible. I think claiming miller in a setup where the number (or existance) of millers is not known is stupid or scum.
2) The bolded part you quoted; I think as town you should play as pro-town as possible, right? Cops do not check people they think are town right? I didn't understand why DP, at the start of the game, was worried about being checked by a cop. For me it seemed like he was scum who was afraid of being checked. I hope you get what i mean.
3 and 4) As is said, i unfortunately have limited time. I was not interested in kitaman at that time, i did not know what to make of him calling WoS scum that early in the game, so i ignored it. I wanted to hear more from DP, and wanted him to do something else than to defend himself. Everyone was discussing him at that moment, i wanted to know what else than his claim was on his mind.
If i got something else to clarify to you, ask me.
About why i am voting for OO:
What Prome said about OO and OO having an explanation to the DP night kill. In top of that DP was suspicious of OO, makes sense. Another thing that's very very odd from OO:
OO called me out for meta reasons. I then posted in thread that i have a tight work schedule. What does OO answer:
On May 14 2013 03:04 ObviousOne wrote:
Oh does this mean you are more busy than last game, Rayn? I'll keep that in mind then.
As far as my comment, it's exactly what it said. You asked a shit load of questions last game as town and it worked very well for a) me seeing that we were having similar thought processes and b) you generated a lot of things to analyze by prodding people. I wasn't seeing that from you so far here but if that's due to a change in your schedule then that potentially changes my expectations of town you in this scenario.
Oh does this mean you are more busy than last game, Rayn? I'll keep that in mind then.
As far as my comment, it's exactly what it said. You asked a shit load of questions last game as town and it worked very well for a) me seeing that we were having similar thought processes and b) you generated a lot of things to analyze by prodding people. I wasn't seeing that from you so far here but if that's due to a change in your schedule then that potentially changes my expectations of town you in this scenario.
In my opinion this has nothing to do with meta, at all. If i post less i post less, but i still act as i usually do whatever my alignment is. OO is dropping his meta scum-read on me because of my work schedule. How does that make sense? Right, it doesn't, unless he knows i'm town and made up a meta read on me before i was even able to fully contribute to anything but DP-stuff.
shiro: You are saying that if WoS is town i am scum. How does that make sense? Are you saying i am not able to form town reads on people other people think is scum? I have given my reasons why i think WoS is town, are they bullshit? Elaborate please.
Rayn do you need me to explain why I would say that? You will be around less time = you will ask fewer, but perhaps more poignant questions and I'm used to seeing you questioning just about everything as town. I wasn't seeing that ultra-inquisitive Rayn I'm used to seeing, and your retro-active explanation for not being around to question everything as it's happening changed how I felt from you being potentially scum to null for that reason. Kinda late to be responding to this but I have my mojo back so I'm hitting up everything in the thread as I re-read, so whatevs, there you go.
