EPTSummarize your VE meta and compare it to this game and show me how he's so definitively town. In one post.
Boardwalk Empire Mafia: Pick Your Power - Page 2
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
Summarize your VE meta and compare it to this game and show me how he's so definitively town. In one post. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 06 2013 13:26 ObviousOne wrote: ... Bill we went over this about the spamming -- you've got ~14 posts on this page alone. Summarize your VE meta and compare it to this game and show me how he's so definitively town. In one post. On April 06 2013 13:26 Bill Murray wrote: meta Okay I'm laughing my ass off at this but really, three dot points or something. Substance, please. Who do you want to lynch D1? | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 06 2013 13:37 geript wrote: I figured out why I don't like the case on RestrainingOrder at all. In The Game, I got to watch both Bugs and Kita push absolute bullshit towards town's direct. It was well crafted bullshit, but bullshit none the less. VE's case is an exact example of this type of thing for a few reasons: 1. The townread/lynch stuff + Show Spoiler + On April 06 2013 09:42 VisceraEyes wrote: So RO wants to lynch inside [Caller, Palmar, Decon, VE, Kierathi, Artanis, austin, OO, Vivax, sn0] before D1 starts. That's cool I guess, but some of those names sound familiar. Where have I seen those names before? ... Oh that's right. In that OTHER post where he made a list and said "4/5 are townies", he wants to lynch 3/5 of them. This is the exact type of thing that we as scum would jump on. Any little thing that we could catch where town fucked up, changed reads, etc. It's perfect to attack because it seems so simple and plausible. Town in general are not going to be filtering themselves constantly to see their positions, know where they stood on exact people, etc. Whereas as scum, we were quite often referencing ourselves to see what stances were plausible for us to take. I can't wholly ignore the possibility that RO may just be lazy scum, hell he lurked most of LX until his teammate shot him. However, it's stupid to think that this early on that scum would make a slip this big. It's far more likely to be bad/stupid town. This isn't particularly scummy. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 06 2013 13:54 Bill Murray wrote: town are more likely to flip flop than mafia AustinMCC at this point is betraying his blue meta as a lurker that I've seen He had a plan that would help the mafia, too, in regards to town picking from the mafia role list It wouldn't surprise me at all to see the mafia have taken from more "town" roles than "mafia" ones By that token, I don't expect there is a Godfather So do you know who is mafia or are you saying AustinMCC is a town read of yours? | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 06 2013 14:02 geript wrote: I don't know if he's town or not. I'm saying that from the looks of thread sentiment he looks like a great potential mislynch. I played Scum in The Game. That was the clear reference. Have you not been paying attention? I didn't read most of The Game (I did read some of it, first couple days I guess?) and I honestly don't care to at the moment, but I didn't call you scum for that, I just pointed out an opportunity you left open. That actually speaks well to you that you don't feel self-conscious about saying it. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 06 2013 14:07 geript wrote: Please clarify the opportunity I left open. I'm not sure what you're saying here. It's easy to pick out something innocuous and run with it (especislly given the unfamiliarity with context: The Game in this case) and since you've already announced you were going to bed I don't want to see it come out later and waste time talking about it / whether or not it was a legit slip while you were gone. Now we addressed it and it makes sense to me. That was my point. Maybe it doesn't make sense to everyone else but I make weird observations sometimes. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 07 2013 15:13 yamato77 wrote: Going to bed. When I wake up tomorrow, I'm taking a look at this list of people: VE PALMAR SINANI MEAPAK AUSTIN One of them will get lynched. Not down with a Sinani lynch today, Sinani's post in on the money to me (at least up until SNB). I need to review SNB for myself with gratuitous coffee. Green highlight makes sense to me. On April 07 2013 14:48 sinani206 wrote: I first want to say that this thread is spammed up to almost the point of unreadable... This is not how Town wins games. Secondly, out of the current lynch candidates, here are my opinions: VisceraEyes: I was leaning scum before and he hasn't really done anything to change my mind besides participating a little bit more. To be on the safe side, I'll say null with a red tinge. Keirathi: Null atm, nothing pointing him at being scum, but don't want to say definitely townie so soon. I just played in RTP with him and he seems to be playing rather similarly, so if I had to pick I'd say town. Restraining Order: Very difficult to read, so I'll wait to see more of him and on him. StrongandBig: Actually looks like he could be scum. Playing very differently than he did in RTP and I agree with the cases made on him. He seems to be playing a typical earlygame conservative scum strategy, skirting discussion and leading people in the wrong direction. I'll slap my vote on him for now. ##Vote: StrongandBig Added notes: VE: I've been aware he's in two games since I am/was on the replacement list for his other game (Noir Mini I) so I expect this game to suffer more due to the nature of Noir being instant majority. I'll review him as we approach the midpoint of day so there's hopefully something more there. Keirathi: I'm more green than null on Kei, but that's more bias based on how I perceive him as a person than a player so now that he's finished jerking off for 12 hours straight [lol take a nap, dude] should be able to identify if my bias is clouding my perception of him. RO: He's another one I will want to review before the midpoint of day. I believe I mentioned earlier his D0 was more helpful/proactive than he was all game in LX [my opinion, didn't review LX] so he's at least Null. Gonna read SNB and | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 07 2013 16:19 gonzaw wrote: I encourage you guys to read Artanis' filter from British 2 See how "outgoing" he is there. See how he interacts with other people, pressures others, is not afraid to post Now reread my case and check his filter this game. See the "fear" in his posts, for instance those 2 I mention where he's posting fluff and "cramming down too much bullshit". They are 2 completely different playstyles. Artanis was town in British 2 Therefore, Artanis is scum this time. Meapak, why did you suddenly forget about Artanis, when he was actually getting more and more suspicious? I think you said something like "nobody except sinani resembles a decent lynch", so what about the guy you called out for "hiding in plain sight" before, who did nothing to convince you otherwise, is not a decent lynch? Meta rules require you to compare a scum game as well, INB4 Keirathi/Yamato yells at you | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 04 2013 19:33 strongandbig wrote: Afaik pyp games are often determined by "this bullshit". The picking phase strategy is a big part of the game. And I sort of agree with denying scum roles, but we should limit it to one or maybe two roles, because if we have strong consensus townies early in the order then giving them actual good roles could be very powerful. Also oats the draft order is public knowledge. On April 05 2013 05:46 strongandbig wrote: this whole discussion is stupid until we get the drafting list btw On April 07 2013 06:07 strongandbig wrote: Lol when did I consider the number picking strategy to be very important Afaik i haven't posted anything of substance since the game started, but I'm a little confused about what you meant by "concerned about roles" when the game started? I'm not sure how these are inconsistent thoughts, though that's the majority of his contribution towards D0 discussion outside of his demands to pick inventor. Did people misunderstand his first post I selected here "picking phase strategy" to mean number picks was important? He only seemed to feel that the role picking was the important part of D0... I'm not really seeing ANYTHING that is strongly alignment indicative, but maybe that was why people want to vote him? Doesn't look like a great lynch but maybe some votes will light a fire under his butt to do something/anything. I'll take a second look later in day phase, unless someone here wants to point out what exactly about him was scummy. (linking/quoting the case if it was yours or you remember who wrote it, plzthx) | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 07 2013 16:27 gonzaw wrote: There are no "meta rules" So do you agree or not? My case alone stands by itself and I used no meta at all. The fact his recent (I think) town play is so different in an "obvious" way just adds to it. You are also free to check a scum game from his that "discredits" my case or something. Remember that people can play differently as scum at times. For proof check my scum games from Liar Game and Themed Game Mafia That's not what I'm getting at here, though, and I will go take a look at an Artanis scum game after I post this, but you cannot say "IF HE DOESNT MATCH TOWN HE MUST BE SCUM" because that's based on imperfect information. This precise shit came up in RED. You need to show how it more closely resembles a mafia game, not just how it doesn't resemble a town game. BRB after database check. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
Artanis[XP] mafia meta highlights based on his one recorded scum game in the database: Haunted Mafia - Replaced into game at P64 - GG out P116 - Total of perhaps 8 "useful" posts over 50 pages Characteristics I picked out from Haunted [2010]: - Makes summaries {conglomerations of players posts} with blanket statements regarding alignment - I used to do this all the time especially in my earliest games - Feigned/Real inactivity/unavailability - not necessarily a scum tell but a useful scum tool - Offers to be "helpful" for a period of time - not taking the initiative and doing something useful himself - Defensive stance - possibly a product of being under suspicion when being replaced in, but in this game was used to misdirect suspicion on lurkers to non-mafia faction I'm looking for something more recent, but Artanis tends to host games rather than play... search filter only went back to March 2012 and the database shows no scum games other than Haunted. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 08 2013 05:37 deconduo wrote: ObviousOne is another person who is pretty much inactive in this game, compared to his prolific posting in other games. If I could grill and play at the same time I totally would. I see that gonzaw wants me to draw conclusions from my supplement to his meta case (since he done failed at doing it all proper like) so I guess I'll check Artanis' town games too for myself. I know we played together in Fruity. I'll get back with you after I finish grilling and consuming these ribs. Don't hate. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 08 2013 06:48 gonzaw wrote: THEY WILL FEEL MY WRATH EVENTUALLY PALMAR. DO NOT WORRY Okay just sat down to hit up that Artanis meta completion (gotta skim a couple town games, you mentioned British II and I'll check Fruity as well for starters) and make a decision for myself. Also I like the above quote very much. So far this feels like a vanilla game. Pick Your Power? More like Pick Your Nose. =[ | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
Comfortable with 180 when confronted with new information Openly questions his detractors Sarcasm/teeth to his posts Early game attention grabber with BS vote on Marv (wasn't even in the game) - not afraid of the spotlight Direct/engaged mid-lategame One of his post-game posts I believe he mentioned before in this game, that he was trying to change up his playstyle a bit: + Show Spoiler + On March 09 2013 09:26 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Well, just reading the thread and getting reads off that is easy, actually doing analysis on players and posting it and trying to convince others, using meta, etc. is something else and it's not something you bothered with. When I did do so and people barely/didn't respond to it and still happily voted for me, it doesn't particularly make the game very fun. Fruity Mafia [Town]: First major thing that stands out to me is how he formulated this post. He talked about 4 other players then said ObviousOne looked bad (I really did, bee tee dubs): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=17802815 He guilted me out of my scum read on Toad (Zessionar in that game): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=17811235 Full of questions / interactions / poking Was a town power role and got very bold D2 but town confidence overall was high. Otherwise rather similar to British TL Mafia LI [Mafia]: Talks about things mafia would/wouldn't do (his example was scum don't make big slips) Points out a big scum slip (lol see above) Posts in a reassuring tone (regarding his own reads) Attacked inactivity and claims Post-game confessions: On April 13 2012 14:32 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I'm surprised so many people thought I was scum, given that I would've done the same lurking as town given the size of the game. I would've posted more if I could but I simply got lost in all the traffic; def won't be playing another 30 player game. The only post that really tipped me off was the one ghost accurately called out, I don't think I would've made that as town but mafia IRC said it was a good idea. Given my early bus on VE after his claim I'd think after VE flipped I'd get a bit more credit too. Characteristics I picked out from Haunted [2010]: - Makes summaries {conglomerations of players posts} with blanket statements regarding alignment - I used to do this all the time especially in my earliest games - Feigned/Real inactivity/unavailability - not necessarily a scum tell but a useful scum tool - Offers to be "helpful" for a period of time - not taking the initiative and doing something useful himself - Defensive stance - possibly a product of being under suspicion when being replaced in, but in this game was used to misdirect suspicion on lurkers to non-mafia faction THIS GAME: Dismissive in D0, not chasing shadows or anything really Some concept of a plan presented, not really pushed Not very inquisitive Giant poop in the thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=18226316 No real back-and-forth happening Barely here The OBVIOUS conclusion: Scum Spend way more time defending / deflecting than scum hunting, less interactive than his town games. By extension of this, he's missing that edge of sarcasm and incredulity in his voice that is present when he calls people out on their bullshit as town. He doesn't seem interested in getting people to re-factor their reads. Way too defensive to match his town meta in any way. Added note: his filter is barely 2 pages and we've already been active for four real-time days if I am not fucking up my maths. Both scum game filters were short (less than 3 pages each) and showed him hiding by posting just enough to not be considered a lurker. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
Oh, gotta vote too. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 08 2013 09:54 Palmar wrote: I think it's mafia defending me, I look too scummy for townies to defend me. why is there no machine gun role that can kill like 8 people on day 1, I'd have liked that. Also there really is not enough killing this game. Bored Walk Empire Mafiyawn: Pull Your Pud =[ | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
GG no RE | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 08 2013 10:24 Mocsta wrote: Gonzaw Unrelated question. Do you think I spamming up the thread? I am asking because my last couple posts have all been big text walls; and not sure if Im getting my message across succinctly at the moment. Who cares at this point. Give the lurkers a shit load of posts to read when they get back. Let them cry. Let them complain. They will sheep anyway. Your question wouldn't even be relevant if everyone was participating. Be the Mocsta we know and love. Fuck the haters. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
On April 08 2013 10:30 strongandbig wrote: hi sharrant i don't think you are right in interpreting those posts as townie, those are things scum could do as well - both because setup discussion is always fertile ground for scum to grow the rare towncred-flower, and because it was (or at least, it seemed to me) clear that this town was too fractious for a real plan to come together. that said i like that you are taking this seriously and giving real thought to what you're saying it seems like you haven't been commenting much on stuff since the end of the setup phase but that may be because you play more like i did when i was a new player, with a lot of full sentences and capitalization and well-thought-out posts so how about lets talk about a player? I randomly chose obviousone. i wrote up a few sentences about his post about artanis, how about you do the same and then we can both post ours after i finish my next dota game? Commercial break. Come at me bro. | ||
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ObviousOne
United States3704 Posts
Or I'll Do This Just To Explain Why It's Annoying And Difficult To Read. | ||
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