RED Team's Prize

On March 20 2013 08:19 Palmar wrote:
wtf is an instant deadline lynch btw?

On March 21 2013 01:01 strongandbig wrote:


for like the first five months i was here i had kurumi and katina confused and thought kurumi was a woman.

On March 26 2013 08:05 raynpelikoneet wrote:
What's with the ninja vote marv?

On March 26 2013 08:28 Dandel Ion wrote:

wat wat?

hes doing a chez impersonisation even tho he doesn't have to.
I question the wisdom of that decision.

On March 26 2013 09:53 strongandbig wrote:
so @marv, yes.

that said there's obviously a reason that days are 48 hours long instead of 2. if prplhz shows up and starts posting again, i'm not gonna be like "you scum i ignore you booo". but as things stand now, prplhz should hang.

On January 21 2013 09:46 FiveTouch wrote:

Ok, I can roll with this read. I looked up two of his recent town-games, and in one he lurked and got lynched Day 1 (Mad Men Mafia). In both games (Rock Band, Mad Men) he opened up by asking people to consolidate and not spam, whereas in his mafia games he opens in a more trolly style - in Dwarf he came in laughing that he hadn't read the thread, in Normal mini mafia 2 he spammed votes down. Similar with GSL Open.

On March 26 2013 10:15 raynpelikoneet wrote:
S&B: I never said i wasn't serious with my vote. I asked marv why does he assume i am serious. Something he also failed to answer.

On March 26 2013 12:27 Hapahauli wrote:
Ok so you have a meta comparison between one of Dandel's scum games and this game. That's cool and all, but you're missing one giant piece in the analogy you're trying to make.

Brownie points to you if you point out your own logical flaw.

On March 26 2013 12:37 InsertSmurfHere wrote:
Is he an idiot as town, too?

From your filter, that is what I surmise is your opinion of him already. If that's the case, I guess you're content to let him lurk away the rest of day 1 as he intends?

Or...?

On March 26 2013 13:04 InsertSmurfHere wrote:
The games I've read of town Dandel are him where he replaced in for another player. Perhaps it is my unfamiliarity with his general play in the opening phase of the game that you seem to have a better handle on.

Fine, we'll play the waiting game you suggest. In the mean time, I'll look through some other filters. His was simply the most egregious at the moment. Hopefully some of the lurkier players like sinani and nisani start posting more.

On March 26 2013 22:05 raynpelikoneet wrote:

It's just that from what i have understood marv is a really good player as scum as well. It becomes even easier for him to lead the town to destruction (if he is mafia) if he gets to do stuff he wants to and doesn't have to worry about people's concerns about him.

On March 26 2013 22:28 raynpelikoneet wrote:
marv what do you think of the cases there are atm?

On March 26 2013 12:37 InsertSmurfHere wrote:
Is he an idiot as town, too?

On March 26 2013 23:00 Palmar wrote:
Do you think this makes hapa scum marv? I wasn't really looking at hapa as someone that needed more attention.

I do agree the smurf looks bad, but honestly, just based on at least putting in the effort of making that case I'd rather lynch other people on day 1.

When is the lynch?

On March 26 2013 23:31 InsertSmurfHere wrote:
You know who I really haven't seen anything out of today at all?

Corazon. That dude's filter is a lot of nothing. Many other players have managed to take stances and interact with the thread on at least a basic level, but he's currently completely flying under the radar.

On March 26 2013 23:46 strongandbig wrote:

Also yeah I've been getting uber shat on but it would be cool if prplhz showed up sometime in the next few hours and posted some stuff. There's quite a lot that he could actually comment on now productively and without unnecessarily cluttering the thread again.

On March 27 2013 00:11 cDgCorazon wrote:

In all honesty this thread has still been ridiculously chaotic. After the tragedy that was Personality Mafia, I'm trying to only post when I have thoughts and cases to make. Right now we are just switching from one lynch target to the other and not really getting anything done besides calling each other scum. As much as the hosts love to troll, I don't think that they made everyone scum. Sorry guys.

On March 27 2013 00:25 cDgCorazon wrote:


Palmar's tunneling of Grack is Palmar being Palmar. I'm slightly leaning town because I could see a scum Palmar tunneling someone who is a more popular read (such as OO or Marv). Besides that, it's not very revealing about Palmar's alignment.

@Smurf: I'm not going to sit here and give you all my random thoughts. I'm playing a focused game and I think Rayn is scum. Are you going to comment about the case or call me scummy for having a scum read?

On March 27 2013 01:11 cDgCorazon wrote:


I read your filter and all you've done is attack 6 people, all of which have been under pressure from others. I read your filter bro. Get some better defense.

On March 27 2013 01:18 cDgCorazon wrote:


He's not being suspicious of many people, he's jumping around from read to read hoping that it makes him look like he is scumhunting. The only read that he has discussed more than a sentence is his read on OO, which was the popular person to attack at the time. He also called me prp's scum buddy 5 minutes into the game and then started lurking when I called him on that read.

He's making a whole bunch of bs reads and only scratching the surface with the arguments that he has made. It's all smoke and mirrors to look like he is scumhunting when in fact he is only creating chaos.

On March 27 2013 01:31 strongandbig wrote:
There needs to be more pressure on dandel ion.

Keeping the thread clear, readable, and coherent (AKA "not spamming") has been a major topic of discussion. It has reverberated in offhand comments, in the way players have said they are interacting with the game, and explicitly in pressure put on various players.

The only player to completely ignore this and keep to his "spammy meta" has been dandel. At this point, for him not to notice the difference between how he is interacting with the thread and how everyone else is would have to take a conscious effort.

The scum motivation for this is obvious. Long, unreadable, spammy threads hurt the town.

Dandel is choosing to play in a way that hurts town and helps scum. That's not okay.

On March 27 2013 01:51 Dandel Ion wrote:

See, snb, like that.

I already had a post written out that said
"I really don't think you need any incentive to be confused"

But then I decided that it was useless and didn't need posting so I didn't post it only now i post it so you know i could have posted it but decided against it even though i did in the end but only to make a point.

On March 27 2013 01:57 strongandbig wrote:


Right now, I'm null on his alignment. I want him to change the way he's posting. The longer he continues without changing it, the more likely that he's doing it because he's scum trying to mess up our thread. So the 'pressure' is less of a "I SAY YOU ARE MAFIA NOW REACT/DANCE FOR ME" and more of a "you are doing this thing that has a clear scum motivation and no town motivation, stop doing it or I will be forced to conclude you're doing it because of the scum motivation rather than without thinking about it."

On March 27 2013 03:01 Acrofales wrote:

What makes you say OO is not timid? He has not really done anything that stands out except to not read his role PM, when he had, probably, not read his role pm, which makes that completely non-indicative of alignment. Since then he has shared 2 rather vague and meaningless association cases... and a meandering post about Grack that left me with the feeling that he didn't actually have an opinion either way.

Where are the reads? Where is the scumhunting? Where is the townie activity?

On March 27 2013 06:12 cDgCorazon wrote:


Perhaps not. I never really thought of Rayn as a paranoid townie. I just wish he would stick with his reads and not react to everything that has happened. It's a new perspective that I didn't think of before. I'm glad you brought this up Hapa.

##Unvote: Rayn
(I forgot to vote him in the thread anyways T.T)

So now my attention turns to Mr. Smurf, the man who calls me out for only scumhunting one person when he has, in fact, scumhunted no one. Care to give us some actual reads Yamato?

On March 27 2013 06:20 cDgCorazon wrote:
Marv did not say anything about Rayn being paranoid town. He just mentioned Rayn overreacting to prp's message, which wouldn't really be paranoid if it was a one time occurrence.

On March 27 2013 06:26 cDgCorazon wrote:
Are you going to go anywhere with this Marv?

You basically said what Rayn did, Hapa made actual analysis on it and summed it up. Plus he made it so I could actually see his point. You just made a wall of text with your point hidden somewhere in it.

If you want to vote for me, go ahead. You out of all people should be cautious of that Marv, especially after you burned yourself so badly with your crappy read on me last game. So bad that you didn't even believe my flip.

On March 27 2013 01:13 marvellosity wrote:


The fact is that rayn has brought new things to the table too; his analysis/vote of OO's second post, or Oats' apparent contradiction with the prplhz/Dandel cases - and indeed something came of this.

Being active, suspicious of many people, and aggressively questioning are not what I think of as mafia characteristics.

On March 27 2013 06:42 cDgCorazon wrote:
Btw the post Hapa linked and the post you quoted were different. That's why I said the stuff I said.

On March 27 2013 07:07 Dandel Ion wrote:

does it matter?

On March 27 2013 07:11 Dandel Ion wrote:

It'd be an awesome opportunity to free yourself from the shackles of meta though.

You could be free.

On March 27 2013 07:20 Dandel Ion wrote:

That's not a good attitude bro.

You should always look to improve.


I guess that means I won't tell you. I only mentioned it because acro said something stupid about how he needs to know who smurfdude is to get a read - a ridiculous notion.

It's not really a meaningful topic to talk about - I think it's yam, that should be enough. Anything further is clutter.

You'll either take my "read" on his person as is, and if you don't, then you wouldn't if i explained it either.

On March 27 2013 07:27 Acrofales wrote:
If it helps, both Hapa and DI (I think independently) think it's Yamato. Yamato also had some weird little thing in the pre-game where he dropped in specially to say he had no reason to smurf when someone mentioned Smurf might be him.

On March 27 2013 07:23 Hapahauli wrote:
Just tell him Dandel. I'm curious to know myself. This is a fight over semantics and should be over and done with.

On March 27 2013 08:01 cDgCorazon wrote:
@Marv: Perhaps because after Personality Mafia I'm not inclined to read every single bs post that everyone posts.

In all honesty, you need to stop asking questions and start making accusations. This is Mafia, not 20 Questions. Come at me bro. Call me scum. Make the case.

You did this same shit in Personality and I flipped town. I really don't think that you are stupid enough to repeat that mistake again, or are you?

On March 27 2013 08:08 cDgCorazon wrote:


THEN CALL ME MAFIA

On March 27 2013 08:10 cDgCorazon wrote:


Because Marv's done this in every game I've played with him.

On March 27 2013 08:17 cDgCorazon wrote:
I really do not understand what you want from me Hapa. Did I not answer his question?

On March 27 2013 09:09 strongandbig wrote:
Hey older peoples - (actually woah I'm pretty sure that other than Palmar, marv and I have been playing the longest of anyone here wtf. maybe acro? grack doesn't count cause he wasn't really playing this whole time)

but anyway older peoples like marv and acro - why is palmar talking so much on day 1? at first I was like wow palmar cares about this game guess he's town, but now i'm just sort of like wtf is going on. do you think he's just super town or what?

On March 27 2013 09:41 raynpelikoneet wrote:
PALMAR LET GO OF CORA AND GRACK AND FOCUS ON SCUM LIKE OO/OATS/SMURF/NISANI PLZ!
Don't you see thye have disappeared when townies call out other townies and laugh in the background. Man, you should be able to see that.

Who of those guys are mafia?

On March 27 2013 09:56 Keirathi wrote:

But....your stance wasn't neutral? You gave a rather detailed explanation of why you thought Palmar was town. That is the opposite of neutral.

Argg, why does everything you post feel so defensive and backpeddling-y :o

On March 27 2013 10:02 Acrofales wrote:


I am starting to agree. This last post just seemed... pointless. It's a very longwinded way of saying "I am reanalysing" and a promise of future activity.

But I am left with the nagging question: if Palmar is town, why would a scum Grackaroni bother trying to backpedal his safe town read? And if they're scumbuddies, why has Palmar's only action this game been to bus Grack? Neither makes sense, so this only really makes sense if Grack is town.

On March 27 2013 10:29 Grackaroni wrote:

This is exactly the kind of thing that makes me pissed off. If you are going to run around saying that I am the best lynch you should have at least put in the effort to read the actual exchange in the thread.

On March 27 2013 10:34 Grackaroni wrote:

and seriously..... reallly.... Do you even read my posts? I pointed this exact thing out in my post. I said that you didn't read the thread closely or didn't filter Palmar because you would have known that my post on Palmar didn't come out of the blue. and then you came back with "Whereas Grack is literally making shit up about me to get me lynched." But now when Marv says it all of a sudden you notice. And people wonder why I've been less than motivated this game.



Meh I was mostly right. You haven't mentioned anyone else you think is a better lynch.

On March 27 2013 10:42 Grackaroni wrote:

Like honestly why are you saying that I'm the best lynch out of these 3/16 players rather than just saying who you want to lynch/who is the best lynch. What is the point of that? If that's not you saying who you want to lynch than I have absolutely no idea so far who you want to lynch.

On March 27 2013 05:08 Acrofales wrote:

There are a bunch of people I think could be scum as well. Cora, Sinani and OO are currently vying for second spot. I just looked over OO's town meta in Fruity and LX and it is very different from his play this game. Far more engaged and discussing things with people, less over-analysing and vague reads.

On March 27 2013 11:00 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Fuck you are being wishy-washy about this.

On March 27 2013 11:04 raynpelikoneet wrote:
[b]##Unvote:
Vote: Grackaroni{/b[

On March 27 2013 11:06 raynpelikoneet wrote:

No, he has failed to do anything productive and i don't find his answers acceptable anymore.

On March 27 2013 11:14 Acrofales wrote:

It doesn't matter what you thought at the time. In fact, I didn't even look at your filter. You made a meta case saying OO was town this game because he wasn't playing like in Hydra, where he was scum. So obviously I looked at that game, and at his recent town games. I don't see how he is playing similar to his town games... if anything, his meta has been more similar to his scum game (which isn't saying much, because it is a single game).

So yeah, I don't see at all how you have a meta town read on OO. And the fact that you had a scumread on OO because he was trolling on D1 as a townie just seems to reinforce the fact that your meta case was complete crap. So once again, how on earth did that town read on OO come about?

On March 27 2013 11:27 Acrofales wrote:

The impression I got from his filter. You call it trolly. I call it relaxed and engaging with people. The real important part is that his play is WORLDS apart from his play this game...

And that you failed to see that despite playing in those games, while I just had a look through the relevant filter and thread sequences.
+ Show Spoiler +

On March 27 2013 11:47 Acrofales wrote:

Where are you going with this?

I looked at fruity and was like "wait, that's not how he's playing this game", then read LX and saw that he was actively engaging the thread and pretty damned relaxed, which is pretty similar to his later play in Fruity.

I will do whatever I like with this info, now explain your damn meta town read on OO.

On March 27 2013 11:53 Acrofales wrote:
Well, do you agree that his D1 in Fruity is NOTHING like his D1 here?

On March 27 2013 12:00 ObviousOne wrote:

Unless I misunderstood, his meta read on me was that I was fearless here/previous town games and I was afraid to post in Hydra (my only scum game and therefore his only scum game to draw from) which is spot on. If you understood his meta case on me differently then that may be where the malfunction is occurring.

On March 27 2013 12:01 Acrofales wrote:

It was a DIRECT response to your META town read on OO. I am not calling OO scum based on that. I was calling him not-a-town-read. You answered how he was not playing at ALL like his scum meta in Hydra. So I looked at his town games and found that your meta case is bollocks.

Fruity was included there because those were the games I looked at and any numbskull can see that OO is not playing a similar game at all. So once again. How did you have a meta read on OO? Now answer the damn question and stop deflecting.

On March 27 2013 12:20 Acrofales wrote:

I have answered your question already. Your turn to explain where your magic meta read on OO came from where you left out the other half of OO's meta.

On March 27 2013 12:30 Acrofales wrote:
What I found in Fruity D1 was that he played differently from here. What I found in the rest of Fruity was that he loosened up and started engaging the thread. He continued to do so in his next town game, LX, and did so right from the start. I said that here:

On March 27 2013 12:40 Hapahauli wrote:
Nah I can see Grack actually being a busy/rusty townie. I can't see Prplhz being this dis-engaged as town.

On March 27 2013 21:51 Acrofales wrote:
Good morning. The fact that nobody is commenting on Marv means we are either reliving MTG 2, or he is scum and his scumbuddies are deflecting with a timely case on someone else. For now, I reread our exchange and Marv feels as if he is intentionally pushing my buttons, which is something I feel when rereading MTG 2 as well. Yet some things...



Like... what the hell am I reading. You are defending Marv based on a meta read that he DIRECTLY contradicts. You can see Marv thinking this game is more similar because OO is more active here, when his OWN impression of Fruity was that OO was an inactive, unengaged troll.

Everybody: have you looked at Marv this game? What is his alignment? I really don't want to repeat MTG 2 where I solo-tunnel (or there with DI in a reinforcing hydra chat of tunnelvision) Marv all game. READ HIM AND SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS.

I know Hapa and Keir want to lynch prplhz. I don't feel the lynch. Mainly because:


Nisani still scum even if you guys forget that. And this is the scummiest reason to vote for a guy in the thread. Lets look at Nisani so far, right?

+ Show Spoiler [prplhz null] +
And then:
+ Show Spoiler [lets vote for him] +
Where's the justification? It is PURELY reactionary to

Who's the flavour of the page? Prplhz is. Pressure on Nisani to do anything disappeared, and Nisani could crawl back into his scumQT.

Also, this:

reads like confirmation bias if I ever saw it. The prplhz bit isn't encouraging pressure against Palmar, it's saying he saw an inconsistency in Nisani's play and wanted that explained.

Eh, I don't know why I am defending prplhz. I looked over his filter and everything said about him is right. Just Nisani is even scummier and it looks highly unlikely they're both scum.

---

In completely unrelated news. WTF is that kill on Grack in the middle of nowhere?

The first line seems very insincere. He wants to say it's strange, but isn't too sure of himself. This seems completely uncharacteristic for Palmar. Palmar, did you shoot Grack? Out of everybody in the thread, you seem to be the only townie with both the scumspicion and the ego to just shoot Grack out of nowhere on D1. If it's a scum shot, why the hell shoot Grack, when they could take out some high-profile player? Grack was a borderline lurker with a good chance of getting lynched. Why shoot him? I honestly see NO scum motivation for wasting an anonymous dayvig shot on Grack.

On March 27 2013 22:11 Dandel Ion wrote:
marv tell me why you think snb is town.

On March 27 2013 22:14 prplhz wrote:
I'm not really sure about this Nisani201 thing because last time I played with him he played like this too. He never seems to have that "drive" that just about all players on this subforum has so I think we should really consider this more strongly than just saying "he's almost as bad as that drplhz guy". sinani206 seems emotional but in an aggressive and indignant way and that seems townie of him even though I don't think he's shown the classic sinani206 trollish behavior. Maybe he's just not that into this game and he only joined because he was invited (which was why I asked that fucking question).

On March 27 2013 22:16 Dandel Ion wrote:

You call his early case scumbait. No sense scumbaiting as scum, is there.

In case you get all hairsplitting on me now, because you can't converse like a normal human being, let me ask differently: Why don't you think he's scum?
cuz he totally is.

On March 27 2013 22:19 prplhz wrote:
No but I didn't want to write something big. The "softpushing" (whatever the fuck that is since that's apparently what also makes me scum) and "going with the flow" is something I remember from him from our last game (which was like a year ago so bear with me while I check up on it even though I don't really want to reread that game because I messed up royally). That seems to be the biggest points. I like your argument about the scumbait/InsertSmurfHere/strongandbig thing but I don't think it's damning.

On March 27 2013 22:25 Palmar wrote:


uncertain doesn't mean tightfisted

On March 27 2013 22:29 Palmar wrote:


Think I already stated how I feel about prplhz.

Nisani I tend to ignore, same as sinani.

On March 27 2013 22:43 Oatsmaster wrote:


I dont know.
Hmm.

Like nisani is scummy, but there are players that are scummy as town too.

SO IM WISHYWASHY AS FUCK AND CANT MAKE A DECISION. Or find scum. Hmm.

I kinda want Palmar to die though.

On March 27 2013 22:51 Oatsmaster wrote:
He was wrong about Grack and I was right.
That should not happen.

He pushes Grack 100% day 1, like when he is in the thread, thats basically most of what he talks about aside from smurfs bad case and stuff surrounding that.

Really fucking weird post. Its just weird. Like what.


I know Palmar is arrogent but what in the world is this. Day 1 is not over. Way overreaction.

Ok so Grack was basically the only thing Palmar pushed day 1 right?
This reads like Palmar wasnt sure/expected himself to find another read. Which isnt inline with his mentality before the dayvig.

So some scummy stuff about Palmar.

I dont see much point in putting down a vote at this time.
Do you?

On March 27 2013 22:59 Oatsmaster wrote:


Im inclined to think not scum because he looked like becoming mislynch number 1.

[Speculation Incoming]
The reason why it wasnt claimed its cause
1. Dude flipped town, its embarrassing
2. The dayvig can do it again/has other powers

##Vote: Palmar
Marv why arent you sheeping me?

On March 27 2013 23:56 Palmar wrote:


Except he isn't right now. Which is what worries me.

As marv himself recognized I'm taking the "sit back but watch" approach to looking at him, but we're closing in on lynch time and he doesn't really seem to care how the lynch goes.

On March 28 2013 00:05 prplhz wrote:

Well, actually you said in this post



that you think he's town. So you can say that you think he is town but you cannot say that he isn't scum or what exactly are you saying?

On March 28 2013 00:13 prplhz wrote:
"I can fight my own battles"

"I'm going to answer for Palmar"

On March 28 2013 00:12 prplhz wrote:

My problem is that in Palmar's reasonable for why Acrofales is town, he's actually spending more time explaining why he could be scum. I don't see what it is that you all see in Acrofales. I get that we're not lynching him today because he's reasonably active and there's probably nothing damning about him, but I'm still interested in why you actually all think he's so townie because I'm getting more of a Personality 2 feeling about him.

On March 28 2013 00:03 marvellosity wrote:
Acro is my strongest townread out of Hapa/Palmar/Acro. In addition to investment blabla, some of his posts are craycray, like at points in the first half of Duel, and MTG2. The Acro-mafia I played with in Personality was way more measured.

On March 28 2013 00:24 cDgCorazon wrote:
Bleh all I know is that this lynch is not going to come easy. Too many scum candidates and too little time.

I do think Palmar's reasoning for why Grack's shot does not make him scum is valid. It really does not make sense to tie yourself to voting for a person and tunneling them, then go on to shoot them. Doesn't make sense.

Acro is a bit of a harder read. I really cannot tell what he is playing right now, so I won't vote for him on D1. Too much confusion to risk a vote there. I'm worried that Marv is his top scum read, yet he only gave superficial reasons as to why Marv is scum. Marv's defense seems in line with him trying to play a better game, plus his stupid mini-tunnel of me feels way too much like Personality for me to be suspicious now.

Smurf still needs to commit himself to actually scum hunting and not bouncing around multiple targets. Right now he's looking most likely to get my vote.

Prp, now that Grack is dead, can you stop beating around the bush and give us actual reasons as to why Acro could be scum? A vote for anything would be nice too.

On March 28 2013 00:27 cDgCorazon wrote:


Who is the vote leader? Too many votes so far.

On March 27 2013 15:46 InsertSmurfHere wrote:
The overwhelming consensus is against town dayvigs shooting on day 1.

Looks like a blue snipe to me, honestly.

On March 28 2013 01:34 raynpelikoneet wrote:

I agree.

After i read the thread today, i went through Grack's filter to see if there was any indication of him being blue. I didn't see anything pointing into that direction.

On March 28 2013 01:45 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Why smurf over OO? I get Nisani and i agree. I think OO is way more scummy than Smurf (who i think is scummy too).

On March 28 2013 02:06 raynpelikoneet wrote:
marv: I understand it could be bad play. I just think it's scummy play. On top of that: Remember when i first posted my case against OO? Nobody commented in any way. Then OO came and said "fuck you, i'm not even going to read your bad case whatever it is". I think he was in fear that somebody actually goes back and sees why he is scummy and starts to question him. He was just trying to brush the case away and basically said "the case is bad, everyone, let's not go back and look at it" without actually saying so. He is trying to hide in shadows without looking like that. Notice also that he is not even trying to push the case on me further, he just agrees with Hapa that "prplhz is a good lynch too". Why not try to convince other players that i am scum if he is so sure of that?

I'm going to reread Smurf later.

On March 28 2013 02:12 Oatsmaster wrote:
How is Palmar town Marv?

Also extremely non accurate way of determining mislynch.
Nisani lynch is too easy.

Only me(im town) and Rayn(probably town) pushed any other candidate.
I dont see anything going on.
Like no one is really in favor of the Nisani lynch only going like
'Yeah he is scum, maybe'
I dont know, it doesnt sit right.

On March 28 2013 02:26 prplhz wrote:

Uh I read something in that old game, he didn't seem to sheep people and instead he actively did stuff on D1. He actually went against all thread opinion to go for his very own lynch candidate.

I think Nisani201 is hard to read though. He plays similar as scum and as town and his filter usually isn't very long so it's hard to follow his thought process. I don't know, he could be scum. I'm not terribly convinced but I have nothing better right now.

I don't like the InsertSmurfHere lynch. I think his defence of me against a rampaging Hapahauli/Keirathi duo looked good.

On March 28 2013 02:51 Oatsmaster wrote:
Hapa can you explain why we are not lynching Palmar today, and if not today, then when do you want to lynch him?

Do you see anything townie about his play?
Do you see anything scummy about his play?

What do you think about his suspicions of marv considering Marv is probably town?
Also notice the fact that his list is basically echoing town sentiment.

On March 28 2013 03:16 Hapahauli wrote:


Why has your play been different marv? You yourself acknowledge that you aren't playing like the traditional town-marv we all know and love.

On March 27 2013 23:59 marvellosity wrote:


I've made it pretty clear who I want to lynch, and your response "I'm ignoring that player" doesn't help.

I'm going to say this only once, so you guys can take it or leave it. I had a horrible experience in Personality where I spammed way too much, got overemotional, got tunnelled, and got blinded. So much so that I barely read more than a couple of filters that game. This game I'm trying to turn my back on all that and take a bird's eye view. Is this a possibly convenient excuse for an uninvested mafia-marv? Sure. But it's not the case. Anyway, I'm not going to mention it again.

On March 28 2013 03:42 Oatsmaster wrote:


Well generally people thought it was a scum shot at the time AFAIK. Then he 180s after I explain my 180.
I dont know, its just weird.
I wanna lynch palmar.
Im going keep saying this.

On March 28 2013 03:51 Hapahauli wrote:

But here's what gets me... you played Hydra Mini just fine concurrently with Personality. Your town-style worked fine in pretty much every game except for Personality. So why are you lingering on Personality so much? It's a shitty, stupid game that everyone should forget about, and certainly nothing worth changing your tried and tested approach to the game over.

On March 28 2013 03:57 Hapahauli wrote:
Now as for Nisani, I just have him and Sinani labeled as lurkers. I did a brief dive through their metas last night, and basically arrived at the conclusion that they are lurk-tastic regardless of alignment.

Of the two, I thought Sinani had a higher chance of flipping red. He came in and bombed a case at a time when I was railing against prplhz. Often I see scum make plays like this - slam down a confident case against a non-suspicious party in order to look original and throw the town into chaos. Furthermore, when he entered, he also randomly attacked Yamato and soft-pushed the current suspicion of the thread (prplhz) without giving any clear opinions on him:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=403256&currentpage=41#814

His filter reads a lot like clean scum-play, and his only real contribution is his case on Nisani, which reads a lot like a lynch-bait case.

Also, I really didn't get scum-vibes from Nisani's filter. Yes it's short, and yes he doesn't justify his read on prplhz very much, but the way he pushed Acro early on (and how he came off Acro) seemed fairly genuine.

On March 28 2013 04:06 Hapahauli wrote:


What has Sinani done this game? His filter:
1) A really awkward exchange with me about OO not reading his role PM.
2) Prplhz suspicion he never follows up on:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=403256&currentpage=25#497
3) A neatly packaged case on Nisani:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=403256&currentpage=41#809
4) ...whilst concurrently making a snide comment against the person defending prplhz (and NOT commenting on his stance on prplhz)
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=403256&currentpage=41#814

It reads a lot like your archtypical "clean" scum-play. I've discussed this read with you before, and I've used it successfully in many games. If you disagree, what am I missing here in your view?

On March 28 2013 04:13 Hapahauli wrote:


Since when does bad case = mafia?

On March 28 2013 04:14 Hapahauli wrote:


It's fucking null.

On March 28 2013 04:16 Hapahauli wrote:


Yeah but the way he backed down seemed pretty organic.


This feels very townie. He discloses a ton more information than he was asked to do so, and even though the thoughts are wishy-washy, I can sympathize with this attitude a lot from a town perspective.

On March 28 2013 03:24 Hapahauli wrote:
##Unvote

I leik prplzh

On March 28 2013 03:33 Hapahauli wrote:


I rather liked the last post, and you've been slowly improving overnight in terms of analysis. Combined with that is this lingering suspicion of InsertSmurfHere for his defense of you last night. Details will be disclosed shortly.

On March 28 2013 02:46 Keirathi wrote:

Why are you not pushing any of those people then? :o

On March 28 2013 04:30 Keirathi wrote:

What in the actual fuck?

Why aren't you voting for me? Why haven't you engaged me to try to figure out my alignment? Why are you just randomly throwing my name out?

I call bullshit.

On March 28 2013 04:44 Keirathi wrote:

2 hours. Do you really want a play by play of what I was doing in those 2 hours?

I took a shower, ate lunch, had a call from my mom, and spent about an hour catching up on the thread I missed while I was asleep.

Seriously, how the fuck does that make me scum. Go on.

On March 28 2013 04:53 Nisani201 wrote:

This post is untrue. And horrible.

I would be down with a Kei lynch.

On March 28 2013 04:55 cDgCorazon wrote:
@Marv and Oats:

Right now, adding in the Kei case is anti-consolidation. Because a lack of consolidation would mean a no-lynch, anti-consolidation would mean anti-town.

Why are you guys trying to add in another case to steal potential votes away from Nisani? To save your scumbuddy by forcing a no-lynch, yet at the same time looking like you are scum hunting?

It's not very hard to see through your ruse, Marv.

My town read on you = gone.

On March 28 2013 04:52 Hapahauli wrote:
Sinani is Scum. Here's why:

1) He has a HUGE HISTORY playing with Nisani! He of all people should understand how to read Nisani very well. Instead, his case...
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=403256&currentpage=41#809
... is completely comprised of stuff that is in Nisani's town games as well!

On March 28 2013 05:05 Palmar wrote:
there's plenty of time for marv to push his lynch.

I had keirathi red-ish early on but at some point I swapped my read on him. I did not note down why I did it.

It's tempting to just roll with it, as I'm pretty uncertain myself. I will be back soon to think more.

On March 28 2013 05:06 cDgCorazon wrote:
We have 56 minutes left and Nisani has 8 votes. It's too late for any other wagon besides Sinani and perhaps prp.

The timing of this Kei stuff is either stupid or scummy. I'm going with scummy because I know Marv isn't stupid. It's a power play to save Nisani. I'm not buying it.

On March 28 2013 05:11 cDgCorazon wrote:


Then why are bringing up Kei now and not sticking with Nisani?

On March 26 2013 07:33 Kurumi wrote:

Day 1

I am already late! Fluff can come tomorrow!

Welcome to the Day 1! Since we have 16 players here, I'll create a voting thread so it is easier for me to manage (I'll rewrite OP accordingly) Remember we're doing Deadline Majority. So you better get 9 people to vote someone or you're left with nothing. We end this day on 28th of March 7:00 KST.

On March 28 2013 05:11 sinani206 wrote:



Nisani plays very similarly as scum and town, and according to you, I know him well. This knowledge of him allows me to determine whether he is scum or town more efficiently than others (hint: you) who seem to be extremely confused

On March 28 2013 05:13 cDgCorazon wrote:


No because a vote for Kei is basically a vote to save Nisani right now. That's why the timing of the case is really suspect.

On March 28 2013 05:10 marvellosity wrote:
How can you say this is a powerplay to save Nisani, when I've been one of the primary pushers of Nisani today? For example, prplhz is voting Nisani pretty specifically because what I said about Nisani. What you say makes no sense, Cora.

On March 28 2013 06:13 Oatsmaster wrote:
Why did you think it was a good idea to claim keir?

On March 28 2013 06:13 cDgCorazon wrote:
Marv. The facts speak for themselves.

Nisani was the leading vote getter, and then you decide to make a case on Kei 2 hours before the lynch and vote for him. What else is there to say?

On March 28 2013 05:10 marvellosity wrote:
How can you say this is a powerplay to save Nisani, when I've been one of the primary pushers of Nisani today? For example, prplhz is voting Nisani pretty specifically because what I said about Nisani. What you say makes no sense, Cora.

On March 28 2013 06:13 Palmar wrote:
So they're masons that are confirmed town to each other. Can you recruit into your mason circle? hell explain your role in detail now that it's out there anyway

On March 28 2013 06:15 Keirathi wrote:

One word: Node.

On March 28 2013 06:22 Oatsmaster wrote:
I dont know.

Why did Hapa unvote so fast?

Grr.

Thanks keir for making me confused. >.<

Palmar WE SHOULD LYNCH PALMAR.
or sinani. ##Unvote:
Vote: Sinani

On March 28 2013 06:27 Oatsmaster wrote:


Because Palmar is known to bus?

Why should I base my reads on associations to unflipped players?

On March 28 2013 06:28 Palmar wrote:
don't think he'll flip scum* I mean

On March 28 2013 06:39 Hapahauli wrote:


Since when the hell are you suspicious of Nisani?

On March 28 2013 06:41 Hapahauli wrote:


I beat you to that like 15 minutes ago bud. I unvoted a while ago.

On March 28 2013 06:56 Hapahauli wrote:
Mebe. I think I'd kill Yamato over him at this point tbh.

On March 28 2013 07:01 cDgCorazon wrote:
Good thing he flipped town because now I can confidently say that Marv has no clue what he is doing.

On March 28 2013 07:07 cDgCorazon wrote:
I also caught half of the scum team in Personality. If you can't remember that.

On March 28 2013 07:10 cDgCorazon wrote:
Well they would've been lynched if you hadn't decided the "magic marker" turned my flip to red.

Seriously Marv you're not doing yourself any favors here.

On March 28 2013 07:12 prplhz wrote:
Be nice guys.

On March 28 2013 07:16 Hapahauli wrote:
Corazon does have a point marv. You spent most of Day 1 championing 2 mislynches. Your support of lynching Kei ESPECIALLY after Kei started spamming up the thread in his defense looks rather poor given how well you know him.

On March 28 2013 07:30 Keirathi wrote:

Looking back through your filter, did you really use "Keir is saying ':o; a bunch" as evidence of me being scum?

Like, I talk to you on IRC quite often. I always use stupid emoticons. How was that even relevant AT ALL? Would be like me calling you scum for saying 'dear'.

On March 28 2013 07:35 Keirathi wrote:

You know better than to make stupid ass arguments like that. What gives?

On March 28 2013 07:51 Keirathi wrote:

It's not about "revolving" around it. It's that you included it at all.

Hell, for the sake of argument, I went back and ctrl+f'd through my games for ':o'. I had a grand total of 1 instance in scum games (when I was arguing BL on the last day of GSL 3), and like 40'ish instances in my town games. And you, better than anyone, should know that I use emoticons in casual conversation.

So, to me, that whole point was 100% an appeal to emotion. It had 0 basis in fact, and was only there to make you case look better.

Do you not see why that is scummy as fuck?

On March 28 2013 11:40 Acrofales wrote:

I don't understand how you have too many town reads in this game. I literally have 3 town reads I have any confidence in, and another 3 players I am willing to consider town, because I don't think they play like this as scum.

That leaves you, Sinani, raynpelikoneet, prplhz, SnB, Smurf and OO in the null to scum range. I am really dying to know how you have any kind of confident town range on them.

On March 28 2013 21:38 raynpelikoneet wrote:

This is my main problem with you. Earlier (when you were pushing Grack) you said you had "a copule of other targets to explore". When Grack died you were totally clueless and just threw a list of five people and didn't push any of those for lynch (no, i don't think you voting for sinani counts as pushing). From what i remember about you from games i have read you are pretty fucking confident as town, especially on D1 (when you are town). This is nowhere near your normal town play.

And your thoughts about the vigi shot are just.. meh..

On March 28 2013 22:01 raynpelikoneet wrote:

How does it make Palmar null and not scum?

On March 27 2013 08:34 Palmar wrote:
a few more reads. Initially I was leaning slight scum on Keirathi but now I don't know what to make of it. He defended prplhz against s&b's case based on reasons I don't entirely agree with, seeing as I actually think prplhz is being much more useless than when he's playing lazy town.

But the little fact that Keirathi then proceeded to call out prplhz makes me think his defense may not have been an absolute stance, but a fluid one. It's not a huge town-tell, but it's something.

On March 28 2013 05:05 Palmar wrote:
there's plenty of time for marv to push his lynch.

I had keirathi red-ish early on but at some point I swapped my read on him. I did not note down why I did it.

It's tempting to just roll with it, as I'm pretty uncertain myself. I will be back soon to think more.

On March 28 2013 05:08 marvellosity wrote:


I'll tell you why you did it; you did it because you thought Keirathi was defending prplhz at the start of the game, and went on to attack him later, and you found that somewhat of a towntell. An incorrect one in my opinion as Keirathi was merely attacking the bad case on prplhz.

On March 28 2013 05:23 Palmar wrote:
Just a heads up I honestly can't find the reason whatever it was that switched my keirathi read to slight town lean. So I guess if sinani isnt' happening I'm going to support keirathi over nisani dying.

On March 28 2013 22:46 Acrofales wrote:
Marv deserves a special mention, because he was hard on the Nisani wagon, then starts up a counterwagon on Keirathi and then hops back onto Nisani when Keirathi claims mason. But this deserves more extensive analysis... have to decide whether this was town Marv being indecisive or scum Marv screwing around with the lynch.

On March 28 2013 23:36 Oatsmaster wrote:
Marv, given what Cora and Keir have said about masons, why is keir scum and cora town?

I would think its the other way around if in fact they were not both town.

On March 28 2013 23:45 Oatsmaster wrote:
Would you be in favor of lynching Palmar tmr?

On March 28 2013 23:53 Oatsmaster wrote:


I was kidding.

Marv are you talking about smurf?

On March 29 2013 00:00 Oatsmaster wrote:


How long are you willing to give Palmar before you want to kill him with fire?

What is your current read on Hapa especially after the lynch.

On March 29 2013 00:39 Hapahauli wrote:
Ohhhh nevermind. It's awkwardly worded, but he's saying that he hasn't played with early Day1 Dandel

On March 29 2013 00:45 prplhz wrote:
Just wanna bump in and say that I don't really find InsertSmurfHere's defense of me weird. The various arguments against him have been how he was right when nobody else was (I remember that Palmar said that wherebugsgo was scum in some game just for that reason and then wherebugsgo put it in his signature because wherebugsgo was actually town). There's also the argument that he was very adamant in his defense of me at a relatively early point but if you look at this post it looks like he takes a certain pride in being able to discern my alignment (something I don't think anybody other than yamato77 and marvellosity would ever do).

Finally I'd like to point out that just about everything he said about me was, at least in my opinion, perfectly true. He wasn't just bullshitting, he was actually interpreting my posts really well and squeezed every little thing out of them that he could while not taking anything too far. Good analysis in my opinion. Would not lynch.

On March 29 2013 00:48 prplhz wrote:
This case on InsertSmurfHere is a stretch and everybody should look elsewhere.

@marvellosity What do you make of InsertSmurfHere's reluctance to drop his suspicions of two claimed masons?

On March 29 2013 00:48 marvellosity wrote:


Correct/good analysis is super-fucking easy as mafia, sweetie.