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On November 15 2012 08:33 Blazinghand wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 08:28 Hapahauli wrote:
Hell you're entire read on me is OMGUS and that I'm somehow not following my principles. This is retarded and I can't imagine you'd ever come up with this shit as town. By all means show me how I'm not - the "overkill" read I've mentioned in some of my other town games as well. I'm not sure how debears questionable posting and his bombastic aggression towards you is indicative of him being scum. If I were trying to advise debears, a relatively (though not super) new player on who to attack, I'd not suggest you, and I'd certainly not say to do so the way he's done. His aggression against you isn't particularly townie but I don't get why you get scum vibes from it.
Because it's completely illogical and in pure OMGUS. He started it the SECOND his lynch started gaining traction. Way too convenient.
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On November 15 2012 08:36 iamperfection wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 08:34 Hapahauli wrote:On November 15 2012 08:33 Blazinghand wrote:On November 15 2012 08:28 Hapahauli wrote:
Hell you're entire read on me is OMGUS and that I'm somehow not following my principles. This is retarded and I can't imagine you'd ever come up with this shit as town. By all means show me how I'm not - the "overkill" read I've mentioned in some of my other town games as well. I'm not sure how debears questionable posting and his bombastic aggression towards you is indicative of him being scum. If I were trying to advise debears, a relatively (though not super) new player on who to attack, I'd not suggest you, and I'd certainly not say to do so the way he's done. His aggression against you isn't particularly townie but I don't get why you get scum vibes from it. Because it's completely illogical and in pure OMGUS. He started it the SECOND his lynch started gaining traction. Way too convenient. Well usually your pretty good at putting yourself in other peoples shoes hapa. If i was in his shoes and town and someone that coached me said i was scum i would be pretty suspicious of him.
I would completely sympathize with debears if there was any rationality to his suspicion on me whatsoever. However there isn't any. Look through his filter and show me one coherent argument about why I'm suspicious. There isn't ANY.
The only thing he ever brings up is this "Hapa is going against his rules", which is absolute bullshit. Not only have I used the read he referenced in my previous town games, but more importantly he's singling out one of the most minor points in my case against him as opposed to actually addressing it.
Top it off with his defense post with the "easy lynches" crap and there's no way this guy flips town.
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On November 15 2012 08:38 debears wrote:
case on hapa incoming. So you guys know he's full of it
Oooh boy I can't WAIT to read this.
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That's fucking rediculous debears. I have no idea why I'm going to respond to it, but hopefully I can show the thread how desperate you are right now:
1) "Overkill" case: I've used this in my TOWN games. It is not about "scumhunting too hard" at all. Rockband Mini for reference:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=369250¤tpage=40#796
2) I'm scummy because my case isn't based around debears meta. ROFL.
3) Next post. No meta. Just an assumption that iamp was my top scumread because iamp had more content and that I didn't vote him, which he sees as scummy
ROFL at no meta again.
ROFL at not responding to my relevant case AGAIN.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=381440¤tpage=47#937
4) ISN'T THAT THE PROBLEM? HOPELESS HAS BEEN AROUND AND HAS ZERO CONTENT
AGAIN, Hopeless is very capable of doing this as town.
But to all the townies out there, please read debears "case." He thinks I"m scummy because I'm not using a fucking meta read on him. But here's a meta read - debears is active as town OR scum, but what's distinguishing is his logic. This is a prime example of the crazy illogical things he uses to put suspicion on people as scum.
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On November 15 2012 08:52 strongandbig wrote:
lol this would be a great scum buddy strat
"hey db let's make terrrible terrible cases on each other and then push them really hard."
"yes hapahauli let's do that then everyone will say "oh these cases are terrible the people they are attacking must be town""
Please be useful.
Please.
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On November 15 2012 08:55 strongandbig wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 08:54 Hapahauli wrote:On November 15 2012 08:52 strongandbig wrote:
lol this would be a great scum buddy strat
"hey db let's make terrrible terrible cases on each other and then push them really hard."
"yes hapahauli let's do that then everyone will say "oh these cases are terrible the people they are attacking must be town"" Please be useful. Please. what do you think about my comments on hopeless's list post did you actually read hopeless's list post? if not go do it now and actually think for like thirty seconds about what he says in it. do the things he says in it actually make sense?
Just read it - I think he makes sense. You really hate on his "associative tells", but I think they're pretty reasonable to make when you have strong feelings about a player's allignment. Then again I'm seethingly biased on this since I'm pretty convinced debears is scum
I agree it doesn't have much in the way of content, but at the end of the day, i really think he's capable of doing this stuff as town. I also think debears is infinitely more scummy than Hopeless at this point.
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Oooh boy wall-o-text case on Z-Bo. Readin' readin'
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@ BH
Why the hell do you still have your vote on me? It's shit and you know it.
Regarding Z-Boson
It's interesting, and I'm interested in hearing what Z-Bo has to say about it. That being said, I still find debears much more scummy.
1) Z-Boson is matching his Newbie XXV scum-meta. I'm reallllly hesitant about using meta from that long-ago. It was his first game, and he's changed as a player a lot since then. There is a resemblance, but nothing lynchable.
2) Z-Boson is not making enough "non-serious" remarks. Again, this isn't a deviation that I consider significant enough from his town meta to be lynchable.
3) Z-Boson is more decisive. This point I like quite a bit. However, I've had some conversations with Z-Bo after recent newbie game where he mentioned he wanted to make a stylistic change to his game. He talked to me a lot about wanting to post less and what not. I think it's consistent. I'll see if I can find the skype logs.
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@ Z-Boson
Would you mind if I posted our skype convos?
Hell am I allowed to post skype convos?
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Ugh that's a good point. Debears is still really damn scummy though.
I'll have to think this one through a bit.
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http://postimage.org/image/9ilt0jqpt/
Hapa = Melvin
Z-Bo = Paulo
The above is a small snip of a skype convo we had a few weeks back. I obviously don't want to screenshot the whole thing (it goes on a while), but this should get the gist of it - Z-Bo really wanted to play a less-active style of play and was running it by me (I advised against it, but he was unconvinced throughout). This makes me think that this could be town Z-Bo.
I know what Ver's guide says about the random 1-liners and what not but I really just disagree with it in this specific case. I think it's just a product of him wanting to post less.
He could be scum, but at the end of the day, debears is much scummier to me.
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On November 15 2012 09:49 Blazinghand wrote:
Guys, DP just claimed scum. Get of your crap wagons and let's get rid of him, now.
Where what why?
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On November 15 2012 09:53 Clarity_nl wrote:
I hope everyone is cool with me addressing DP's case after lynchtime, because it'll clog up the thread and we need to consolidate right about now.
@ Hapa
Aren't you saying the opposite of what the log suggests? In the log he says "I guess I should post less" and you tell him to post more anyway. Yet he hasn't.
Yeah I spent most of the convo trying to convince him. He never budged. Want me to dig up the rest?
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On November 15 2012 09:51 marvellosity wrote:
I could consolidate on to Crossfire, I guess.
I don't think DP is scum. I don't think DP would make a case on Clarity if he's scum. There are enough outlying candidates for him to make a case on and vote on.
I think it's more likely DP is being bad. I often find DP's reads as town somewhat ridiculous.
Why do you want to consolidate on Crossfire when he's heading to modkill land?
Also regarding DP, coming in with a random case on a player who hasn't been considered at all, especially considering we're not consolidated at all as town is pretty questionable. Dunno if it's enough to lynch him over debears though - these last minute things never end well.
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On November 15 2012 09:58 iamperfection wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 09:50 Hapahauli wrote:http://postimage.org/image/9ilt0jqpt/Hapa = Melvin Z-Bo = Paulo The above is a small snip of a skype convo we had a few weeks back. I obviously don't want to screenshot the whole thing (it goes on a while), but this should get the gist of it - Z-Bo really wanted to play a less-active style of play and was running it by me (I advised against it, but he was unconvinced throughout). This makes me think that this could be town Z-Bo. I know what Ver's guide says about the random 1-liners and what not but I really just disagree with it in this specific case. I think it's just a product of him wanting to post less. He could be scum, but at the end of the day, debears is much scummier to me. that all from the skype conversation? He doesn't really say much about changing his style fundamentally there just that he is going to post less and he failed to do so.
I'll dig up the rest, brb.
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On November 15 2012 09:58 iamperfection wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 09:50 Hapahauli wrote:http://postimage.org/image/9ilt0jqpt/Hapa = Melvin Z-Bo = Paulo The above is a small snip of a skype convo we had a few weeks back. I obviously don't want to screenshot the whole thing (it goes on a while), but this should get the gist of it - Z-Bo really wanted to play a less-active style of play and was running it by me (I advised against it, but he was unconvinced throughout). This makes me think that this could be town Z-Bo. I know what Ver's guide says about the random 1-liners and what not but I really just disagree with it in this specific case. I think it's just a product of him wanting to post less. He could be scum, but at the end of the day, debears is much scummier to me. that all from the skype conversation? He doesn't really say much about changing his style fundamentally there just that he is going to post less and he failed to do so.
Oh also, it doesn't really look like some "fundamental" change to me. He's just posting less, and his individual posts are longer. When you do that, the "fundamental" changes that marv points out (i.e. lack of jokes) are a pretty natural outcome.
Like I can see him being scum here, but based on our conversations, I think he can do this as town.
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On November 15 2012 10:04 Z-BosoN wrote:Allright let's consolidate. Hapa, this post by debears: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=381440¤tpage=53#1054And his interaction with you really makes me think he is town. Do you remember our newbie game? I started finding him scum, and he disagreed heavily with my logic, and focused on me based on that (and my case was very similar to yours: weak weak reasoning for his suspicious actions). That post I cited makes me think the same. He seems like he genuinely thinks you as scum, and he really really disagrees with your logic. This is almost analogous, and I'd really not want to lynch him now. Regarding DP, I'm not sure about that marv. debears was getting hammered on, and one of the argumetns was "weak over-explanation" for a case. As scum, he could easily have felt that if he sheeped, he would look a lot more scummier, so he went ahead with an original case on someone with little suspicion on him. I'm going to go read the rest of his filter now. What is the reasoning on crossfire? A policy lynch? Isn't he just going to go get himself replaced? If I were to policy lynch, I'd go with thrawn, who hasn't done anything all game and is null in his posting.
I think you're referencing debears... what... 2nd game? He's definitely changed since then and should know a thing or two about better logic. Because his logic in scum-games is absolutely turrrrrrible, and when I see stuff like "hapa is suspicious because he didn't post a meta read on me", I'm inclined to believe he's scum
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Errrrg rando 11th hour case by crossfire
I think it speaks more to his cluelessness/inactivity than anything else. But if there's anything I learned from newbie coaching, last minute emotional vote swing rarely ends well ever.
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Holy scumslip DP
iamp - good stuff
OK. I was not suggesting we switch on to clarity. What I was doing is making a case I was convinced of as I promised. Obviously we are not going to lynch him. Did you see a vote?
##unvote
##Vote DarthPunk
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On November 15 2012 10:29 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 10:25 Hapahauli wrote:Holy scumslip DP iamp - good stuff OK. I was not suggesting we switch on to clarity. What I was doing is making a case I was convinced of as I promised. Obviously we are not going to lynch him. Did you see a vote? ##unvote##Vote DarthPunk This fucking game. How in the FLYING FUCK is that a scumslip?!?!?!?! It would be anti town to try and persuade the entire town to vote clarity this close to dead line. Also nigh impossible. I am being rational and realistic about my chances of voting my top scumread. Holy balls hapa.
You kinda just admitted to making a case for the hell of it ya know?
Making a case on clarity and then... "not suggesting we switch onto clarity?" Ok brah.
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EPT
