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On August 03 2012 12:26 Hopeless1der wrote:
Do not claim immediately. The role is not alignment indicative and really just paints a target on you. There is no guarantee that there are both town and scum masons. I do not see a benefit to masons claiming.
I agree with this perspective. It's going to do nothing but cause random finger pointing which will lead to a random lynching.
So if I get this straight, one person dies by the end of the day before any action?
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I really don't see a reason for someone NOT to claim if they get masoned. One might argue that it let's scum get one of the few pieces of info that they've not already recived, however I don't really see how scum would be able to capitalize on the fact that there are town masons in the game.
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All right, guys and gals, let's not let this little to-do rain on our parade! We've just got to make the best of it!
Now, have of y'all seen my Pete? He's got a little bit of ex-plainin' to do for hisself!
Now, let's get down to some brass tacks and see just what y'all have been gettin' your selves up to while the rest of you thought the missus wasn't lookin'!
On August 03 2012 12:52 talismania wrote:
3) Let's say 10 masons claim. Ok you have a point. Let's say 4 do. That's gotta be at least 3 town 1 scum, if not 2-2. 4 - 0 either way is silly. And frankly I think it's easier to find one out four than to find 5 out of 19 at the beginning.
Now, now, girl - just because somethin's silly don't mean it can't happen! Besides, if we're goin' to be spankin' our six-shooters 'mongst a mess o' masons, then those malicious ones ain't gonna claim at-all - and if that's the truth, ain't no reason for the town ones to claim either, far's I see it. My thinkin's that a townie ain't got nothin' to hide, but a scum mason's gonna have his work cut out for 'im, so let'm try an fool us!
On August 03 2012 10:36 JingleHell wrote:Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 10:34 prplhz wrote:
And we're off.
This is a 23 player game and I will not be able to handle it if there is a 130 page spamfest between a couple of people before night1. Seriously, condense your god damn posting. That said, there's also a couple of new/newer people on the list. You guys remember to post your thoughts and stuff on the game. No one here bites. Do you bite if we ask nicely? Zephirdd, don't you think there's danger of an early bandwagon voting with no cause like that? It's hard to defend yourself against a vote for no reason. FoS Zephirdd
Now now, girl, you're a right greenhorn aren't y'all! I did some diggin' and it 'peers you've been a-musin' yourself over in the kiddie pool, so might be a bit 'scusable for you to be playin' like we're still in it - but even for a greenhorn, this is some mighty weak sauce you got cookin' up here! Let me lend you one of my be-autiful cookbooks!
On August 03 2012 12:08 talismania wrote:Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 11:32 wherebugsgo wrote:
I'm town.
for that matter I'm Roger fucking Sterling, so suck my dick. oh man I hope bc didn't link role names and actual roles. kinda bet he did though
I'm Trudy Campbell, and I'm a plain old ordinary re-gu-lar vanilla townie type. Now here's the thing - more like me claimin' our identities ain't gonna shed much light on the problem, cause it could go either way - us wives and relations could be vanilla on account of being un-important, or just on account of being plenniful. So here's what I propose - if any of you're a vanilla townie and are some kinda big important hot-shot who might be thought likely to be a power role or scummy type, how's about you say so? If no one does it won't tell us much, but if they do we might be able to move away from this line of thinkin'.
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Sup everyone
Talis
VE
WBG
thoughts?
Prplhz if you had to make different groups in this game. Who/how many would you end up putting in the VET-group?
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@Toadesstern Could you explain that post? First you write random letters in red and then you ask me "if you had to make different groups" which I don't understand at all. I don't put people in "vet" groups, there are people who have established meta behavioral patterns and who should be watched closely (or not watched closely) if they deviate, but there isn't any player in this game who has a reputation for single handedly ruining scum teams on a regular basis.
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On August 03 2012 19:25 prplhz wrote:
@Toadesstern Could you explain that post? First you write random letters in red and then you ask me "if you had to make different groups" which I don't understand at all. I don't put people in "vet" groups, there are people who have established meta behavioral patterns and who should be watched closely (or not watched closely) if they deviate, but there isn't any player in this game who has a reputation for single handedly ruining scum teams on a regular basis.
Yeah when I posted that I read the thread the first time and colored names the way I thought about them when reading through.
Actually if VE were to be someone else than VE his name would completly red and nt just semi red because VE does some STRANGE things from time to time. Anyways, copy & paste here I come:
+ Show Spoiler [VE] +(Pregame!): clicky! I'm joking around, he picks up the joke, Marv does so as well but VE isn't getting that Marv's just joking around when it was preeeetty obvious. Seems like he's nervous to me? Or was that some kind of anti-joke I'm not getting?  Clicky! Looks kind of try-hard to me. Obviously Zeph is fooling around or at least (if he's mafia) trying to make it look like he's carelessly fooling around. I doubt this honestly was an attempt to get a random lynch. It would be fine if VE pointed that out but the 2nd paragraph is weird. Why does he have to rub that in everyone's faces? "LOOK GUYS I DON'T WANT TO RND-LYNCH BECAUSE THAT's BAD". No shit sherlock. Yet he feels the urge to tell everyone about that. Looks to me like someone desperatly trying to get townie-points. But this is VE, he does weird shit every time so idk... Clicky! Big shiny text about how masons should claim. I totally disagree with him. It was a desaster in L. We lost a complete cycle, got no advantage, everyone eneded up being paranoid because obviously one group (pro-claim or anti-claim) had to be mentally retarded or scum to be stupid enough to not agree with ones self conclusion according to everyone in the game. Clicky! The big thing, with multiple [big]'s and [b] in his most recent post was "MASON CLAIMS". Not "MASONS CLAIM MAYBE?" or something else, it was Mason claims. Now he proceeds to tell people he doesn't think it's a good idea for masons to claim and only wanted to talk about the idea? The fuck?
Talis on the other hand is a guy who usually ends up posting what he thinks about the game d1 in an honest way, no matter of alignment. Remember PYP? Talis was the guy who told people to encrypt their shit. He's the kind of guy that thinks about the set-up ahead of time and then proceeds to post his thoughts about it no matter of alignment.
I think he genuinely believes in what he posted, but what he posted is incredible stupid. So he either didn't think this trough or he thinks it's best to change his "conclusion" in some kind of way. What he posted makes little to no sense to me and that feels off because as mentioned I'm pretty sure he usually means what he posts d1 no matter of alignment.
Still making notes about everything and I'm at talis's post right now, so that's why I had to improvise something right now :p
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Masoned players should claim IMO.
masons themselves shouldn't unless that would save his life.
toad, why improvise? Are you feeling some kind of pressure that stops you from making a decent post?
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On August 03 2012 17:57 Lazermonkey wrote:
I really don't see a reason for someone NOT to claim if they get masoned. One might argue that it let's scum get one of the few pieces of info that they've not already recived, however I don't really see how scum would be able to capitalize on the fact that there are town masons in the game.
Okay, when thinking of it, there might be some situations that people claiming masoned might be usefull for scum. But Town will most likely gain more from claiming than scum. Masoned players SHOULD claim.
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On August 03 2012 20:02 Zephirdd wrote:
Masoned players should claim IMO.
masons themselves shouldn't unless that would save his life.
toad, why improvise? Are you feeling some kind of pressure that stops you from making a decent post?
na, as mentioned I'm still making my notes and as mentioned I was re-reading everything and wasn't done with page 13 at that time. So that's why I had to type something instead of copy & pasting.
If you want to have a proper post here you go:
+ Show Spoiler [Talis] +Tclicky! Completly disagree with him. A Mason is probably one of the strongest town roles in existence and he calls them worthless. Surely it's incredible dangerous because you could end up getting influenced if you hit mafia but a 2nd point of view is the best thing that can possibly happen to any townie to make sure he's staying objective and not just ranting about someone because he doesn't like the dude. That being said Talis usually posts the truth about what he's thinking d1 no matter of alignment, so he really thinks so either way. But there are some BIG issues in his post. It's just not thought trough. - 1) They are not worthless, Masons are incredible strong. Strong to a point that they might end up being dangerous. THAT's a proper reason to want them claimed if there's mafia masons as well.
THAT's the reason we had masons claimed in L, because BC thought they are to strong to run around when there's mafia masons as well.
What Talis said is the complete opposite of that.
- 2) Mason is worthless for scum? The fuck? Ultimate manipulating role in existence is kinda worthless for mafia? Especially if they can choose who gets to be the mason? WBG-Mafia-Mason would be incredibly scary. I wouldn't want to play against that.
- 3) is speculation and completly wrong according to what I saw in the past. I think in L it was something like 5 town masons vs 2 mafia masons if I remember correctly?
- 4) It gives little to no information to town while giving a shitton of information to mafia. Do they want to hit masons because they think they're dangerous? Awesome hit masons. Do they want to hit other blue roles instead? Awesome, hit whoever is not a mason and your chances to hit a blue are way better.
- 5) The biggest issue: If you are masoned you don't claim. Ever. If you are masoned you either got masoned because someone thinks you're scum and wants to sacrifice himself to catch you with a trap in PM-Land for a 1v1 trade (highly unlikely but possible) or you got masoned because the guy thinks it's highly likely you are town and wants to talk with you to get another point of view on reads, to make sure he stays objective. So claiming you got masoned is basicly telling mafia "sup, someone think's I'm the most likely guy to be a townie IN THE GAME. Pretty please don't shoot me though". I don't like outing townreads and I don't like outing the strongest townread someone has either.
That being said if WBG turns out to be a Mason I'd be up for policy lynching him :3
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What you said makes sense. Mason'd people shouldnt claim :s
wbg mason does sound scary too
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On August 03 2012 20:09 Lazermonkey wrote:Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 17:57 Lazermonkey wrote:
I really don't see a reason for someone NOT to claim if they get masoned. One might argue that it let's scum get one of the few pieces of info that they've not already recived, however I don't really see how scum would be able to capitalize on the fact that there are town masons in the game. Okay, when thinking of it, there might be some situations that people claiming masoned might be usefull for scum. But Town will most likely gain more from claiming than scum. Masoned players SHOULD claim.
what kind of information do you get as a townie if I were to tell you that I got masoned for example?
What kind of reaction would that trigger?
I can't think of one to be honest.
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Toady, stop rephrasing my questions to talis as your own thoughts <3
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On August 03 2012 11:41 Erandorr wrote:Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 11:39 JingleHell wrote:On August 03 2012 11:37 Erandorr wrote:On August 03 2012 11:32 wherebugsgo wrote:
I'm town.
for that matter I'm Roger fucking Sterling, so suck my dick. lets start this game right ## VOTE: WBG We don't even have much discussion yet, but you still ignored it. Why? I am just used to wbg being dead all the time in dota and dont wanna adjust
I am just used to you being bad, so I suppose I shouldn't let my expectations run too high.
That's probably why they gave me the big room and you got the one with the pillar in it.
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On August 03 2012 20:47 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 11:41 Erandorr wrote:On August 03 2012 11:39 JingleHell wrote:On August 03 2012 11:37 Erandorr wrote:On August 03 2012 11:32 wherebugsgo wrote:
I'm town.
for that matter I'm Roger fucking Sterling, so suck my dick. lets start this game right ## VOTE: WBG We don't even have much discussion yet, but you still ignored it. Why? I am just used to wbg being dead all the time in dota and dont wanna adjust I am just used to you being bad, so I suppose I shouldn't let my expectations run too high. That's probably why they gave me the big room and you got the one with the pillar in it.
i love trolling scum bugs
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before I forget, I got masoned by VE.
I'm not a mason. I'm Roger Sterling. You guys should know that by now, but then again I don't remember why I hired some of you.
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he also hurt my feelings and made me cry. can we kill him?
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On August 03 2012 20:50 Erandorr wrote:
he also hurt my feelings and made me cry. can we kill him?
no worries, I'll be scum when you have feelings worth considering
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On August 03 2012 20:50 wherebugsgo wrote:
before I forget, I got masoned by VE.
I'm not a mason. I'm Roger Sterling. You guys should know that by now, but then again I don't remember why I hired some of you.
... have you already talked with him?
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On August 03 2012 20:53 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 20:50 Erandorr wrote:
he also hurt my feelings and made me cry. can we kill him? no worries, I'll be scum when you have feelings worth considering
any reason why you would out VE as mason this early? I mean thats kind of retarded.
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##Vote VE
We need a voting thread
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EPT
