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On July 06 2012 20:43 Lazermonkey wrote:Am I the only one who wonder where JingleHell disappeared? Starting of as THE most active player in the game, he quickly dropped of when he got unvoted by YourHarry. Since then he have only posted 4 times. The second one is this: Show nested quote +On July 05 2012 23:08 JingleHell wrote:
I do wish we could stop looking at Lazer's first post as "contradictory". Actually, for that matter, I wish we would leave alone all the initial burst of posting, the entire purpose is to get people talking, which was accomplished. Frankly, I don't think Lazer's first post felt scummy, because while it was only very basic, it was an effort to do the same thing I accomplished by bringing up sex toys. I've just discovered that something meaningless works better.
Instead of cluttering things up, I'll just say that Bass and Lazer's analysis on TMG sounds good, and I'll be interested in seeing what he has to say. So instead of actually answering any of the questions from me he starts getting nice etc. My first post was not contradictory, I have already said that a dozen of times, you don't need to tell me that. This just feels like him wanting to avoid any questions. You are just posting town reads all over the place. I made a quick overlook at Newbie XVIII where you were town and it looked like you were posting quite alot of suspicions and not many town reads at all. This game is the complete oppsosite. You havn't taken any clear stance on who you are suspicious of yet. You only mention those who you think is town. This is great scum play, as when they get misslynched/killed, you will look better for claiming they were innocent. I am still VERY suspicious of you Jingle...
I'm not playing nice, I'm telling them to make cases on you not be grounded on something that's clearly down to how you read it.
I'm not bothering to post here as much because frankly, I'd rather watch people post when it looks like a half schitzo paranoid delusional 3 headed monster shouting at itself. Don't like it, maybe people should stop making 30 second cases and then chasing the next person that posts around.
If you're so suspicious of me, do us all a favor, vote for me, and watch me flip green. It'll be tons of information that nobody will use.
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You have yet to ask me anything worth my time or effort in answering, but feel free to get me mislynched.
I never claimed not to have been part of the shouting earlier, but it's gotten much much worse, since now everyone talking a lot is accusing almost everyone else who isn't.
Me personally, I'll be enjoying seeing what comes at the end of the day, as it will provide us with plenty of information.
For the time being, though, ##Vote Lazermonkey
It's got to be somewhere, and your self-love and expectation that everyone else will dance to your tune strikes me as scummy.
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I realized that expecting much out of this game before the first mislynch woke people up was a waste of effort, since everyone who isn't scum seems to want to be the hero. Which is leading to enough chaos that we're going to die if people don't shape up after the first lynch, which is likely to be a mislynch.
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On July 07 2012 00:27 BassInSpace wrote:
Jingle, are you saying you don't think Hopeless is scum? If you think this is a mislynch, mind telling us why exactly you think Hopeless is town?
Also FYI Lazer, Jingle was mafia in NMM XVIII, not town.
I already did. It's inconclusive, but it's already on the record. The big issue is that it's based in meta from a game where he hasn't flipped yet. And, of course, most of the people here are so busy being too smart for their own good that they can't realize that I'm actually not being scummy.
I also expect a D1 lynch to almost always be a mislynch, because the odds of latching onto the right person with minimal information are kind of bad.
And, of course, if anyone feels the need to put together a case against me that isn't smoke and mirrors, I'll happily respond, but frankly, under the current circumstances, I'd rather provide information via getting mislynched than beat my head against the brick wall of the people going berserk on attacking everyone.
Actually, if we want to find out who's being scummy, since this is a newbie game, is look for the people who are trying too hard to be the polar opposite of scummy based on the various guides. So look for prolific posters who find a way to turn every single word into a scumslip, are obsessed with analysis, and want to take the lead.
You should find at least two scum that way.
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It comes down to WIFOM, newbies, and the guides.
I fully expect the majority of scum in newbie games to overdo un-scumminess. And with so many people in rabid "Has to be my read that seals the deal" mode, the scum are able to hide in plain sight doing exactly that.
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On July 07 2012 00:54 Lazermonkey wrote:
Jingle what info will we get from you, assuming you flip town? You havn't posted any scum reads(except for me I guess).
You'll get the info of who led a theoretical case against me based off of smoke and mirrors. I would have thought that was obvious, although it might be a bit too substantial for most of the people who took over the thread by screaming at anyone who posted.
You'll get the info of who votes where.
And you'll get the info that I'm still unimpressed by anyone who bases a case off of my (actually succesful) means of getting conversation started. Oh wait, that's been available for a while now.
But like I said, I'm not in the mood to slam repeatedly against circular logic, so I'm waiting to see how the D1 lynch goes, at which point there will be more info to make a read off of.
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On July 07 2012 01:11 Lazermonkey wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2012 01:06 JingleHell wrote:On July 07 2012 00:54 Lazermonkey wrote:
Jingle what info will we get from you, assuming you flip town? You havn't posted any scum reads(except for me I guess). You'll get the info of who led a theoretical case against me based off of smoke and mirrors. I would have thought that was obvious, although it might be a bit too substantial for most of the people who took over the thread by screaming at anyone who posted. You'll get the info of who votes where. And you'll get the info that I'm still unimpressed by anyone who bases a case off of my (actually succesful) means of getting conversation started. Oh wait, that's been available for a while now. But like I said, I'm not in the mood to slam repeatedly against circular logic, so I'm waiting to see how the D1 lynch goes, at which point there will be more info to make a read off of. I am doing a case against you because I think you are scummy. I will push people I think are scummy. If they flip green because they play bad, i can't be blamed for that.
Playing badly? Like excessively prolific posts with "reads" based off of nothing, pointing fingers in a million directions at once, creating chaos, and picking and choosing what posts to analyze?
Yeah, you actually can be blamed for that.
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On July 07 2012 01:24 Lazermonkey wrote:
EBWOP: Where is my reads based on nothing?
On July 05 2012 09:54 Lazermonkey wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I'm getting suspicious of Jingle. On July 05 2012 06:43 JingleHell wrote:
So, since Lazer already opened with the pre-requisite long-winded "Please don't lynch me" post, I'd feel silly making a similar one, so instead, I'm going to open by asking Evulrabbitz why his name references a sex toy. After that question, of course, it suddenly feels awkward, but unless he can answer it well, FoS Evulrabbitz 1st post. Instead of commenting on my post he starts to ridicule it, effectivly killing discussion about it. Instead he is the first one to start shit up the thread with sex-toy w/e. Also, instead of posting his own reads he says I'd feel silly making a similar one which doesn't make any sense at all. I'd much rather have a post about your thought's on scum hunting rather than sex toys. At least when we are playing mafia... The next couple of posts he is effectivly fills half the thread with his talk about Evul being a perv and what not. On July 05 2012 07:56 JingleHell wrote:
Well, Hopeless, since you're at least talking, I don't think you're scum yet. However, if day1 lurkers start causing trouble, I'm all for just throwing the dice and lynching one just to make a clear point.
Also, just as wonky meta, compared to your D1 play in XIX, I'm pretty sure you're town here. You're not afraid of prolific D1 posting, among other things.
Actually, I'm VERY suspicious about YourHarry's lightning fast vote. Could be a throwaway effort to get a bandwagon started, since D1 voting is nonsense in newbie games. In the case of a mislynch, it would be easy to argue away. If you would write this as a first time player I could be somewhat cool with it. But you are not. We want to lynch scum, not lurkers. And we absolutly don't want to roll the dice. And I really don't see how you are very suspicious about the vote. There were ~50 hours untill deadline when he threw the vote. How is this even close to start a bandwagon? Like wtf? On July 05 2012 08:05 JingleHell wrote:
EBWOP: And Harry, don't try to turn my logic around on me, my vote was based on your suspicious vote.
Your quote on Hopeless wasn't what I'd call a real reason to vote for someone who's at least being active, and not particularly suspicious.
Voting for him that way makes you look scummy, considering you've said nothing of real substance yet. But at this point you only had one minor post of substance as well. On July 05 2012 08:13 JingleHell wrote:
I couldn't care less how many games you've played on mafiascum. As it turns out, in newbie games on TL, D1 bandwagons have a tendency to be lethal, particularly if there's no substance to the case to defend against. As such, it's better to target someone who's being either actively or passively useless, not somebody who's at least jumping into the deep end.
In particular, compared to his play in a different game, where he seemed painfully scummy, Hopeless1der seems like he's heading for direct contribution. I don't get this post. I may be missunderstanding this but if there is no substance to the case then why would that even be considered a case? And why on earth would someone ever get lynched by such a ''case'' On July 05 2012 08:13 JingleHell wrote:
I couldn't care less how many games you've played on mafiascum. As it turns out, in newbie games on TL, D1 bandwagons have a tendency to be lethal, particularly if there's no substance to the case to defend against. As such, it's better to target someone who's being either actively or passively useless, not somebody who's at least jumping into the deep end.
In particular, compared to his play in a different game, where he seemed painfully scummy, Hopeless1der seems like he's heading for direct contribution. Once again, there is no threat of a bandwagon at all. Why do you keep saying that? What I find maybe most intresting is how you start the game by shitting up the thread and literally don't post a single usefull thing. When the first vote get thrown tho, You go ''WTF DUDE, VOTING IZ NOT COOL''. No, I agree that the reasoning behind the vote to begin with was verrrry vauge but I don't really see why you get so upset about it ESPICIALLY since it's not even on you. ##Vote JingleHell
You target me for a laundry list of things.
A: You're offended that I blew off your rather annoying policy post that, you'll notice, nobody else liked either.
B: You don't like me saying that excessive lurking, in absence of clear scumreads, is a valid reason to lynch.
C: You don't have the capacity for sufficient critical though to realize that in a plurality lynch game, an early bandwagon can easily stick.
Your entire initial "read" against me was based on fluff, taking me out of context, and ignoring reality. Why should I bother paying any attention to you later, when you continue to tunnel me, while decrying tunnel vision?
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On July 07 2012 01:31 Lazermonkey wrote:
Okay, I will go soon and may or may not be at home at the deadline. I will have my phone tho so I am able to check the thread and swap my vote if that is necessary. I will keep my vote on Jingle as of now, although that may change during the rest of the day. I will also change my vote to most scummy person in case there is a close voting. Here is my wish list for people I want dead:
1. Jingle.
2. JieXian
3. Hope/TMG
Oh look, asks for an explanation, gets it, and says he has to go without responding. Almost sounds like Jiexian in XVIII a couple of times, where he posted in the QT for like 3 hours after telling the thread he was going to sleep. Did I mention he was scum in that game?
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On July 07 2012 01:38 Lazermonkey wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2012 01:34 JingleHell wrote:On July 07 2012 01:31 Lazermonkey wrote:
Okay, I will go soon and may or may not be at home at the deadline. I will have my phone tho so I am able to check the thread and swap my vote if that is necessary. I will keep my vote on Jingle as of now, although that may change during the rest of the day. I will also change my vote to most scummy person in case there is a close voting. Here is my wish list for people I want dead:
1. Jingle.
2. JieXian
3. Hope/TMG
Oh look, asks for an explanation, gets it, and says he has to go without responding. Almost sounds like Jiexian in XVIII a couple of times, where he posted in the QT for like 3 hours after telling the thread he was going to sleep. Did I mention he was scum in that game? The amount of WIFOM in this post in beyond possible. It's friday evening in sweden atm. Yes, I am going soon.
Well, don't forget to leave your scum buddies instructions to try and save you at the last minute in case people notice my points here.
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On July 07 2012 01:42 Lazermonkey wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2012 01:29 JingleHell wrote:On July 07 2012 01:24 Lazermonkey wrote:
EBWOP: Where is my reads based on nothing? On July 05 2012 09:54 Lazermonkey wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I'm getting suspicious of Jingle. On July 05 2012 06:43 JingleHell wrote:
So, since Lazer already opened with the pre-requisite long-winded "Please don't lynch me" post, I'd feel silly making a similar one, so instead, I'm going to open by asking Evulrabbitz why his name references a sex toy. After that question, of course, it suddenly feels awkward, but unless he can answer it well, FoS Evulrabbitz 1st post. Instead of commenting on my post he starts to ridicule it, effectivly killing discussion about it. Instead he is the first one to start shit up the thread with sex-toy w/e. Also, instead of posting his own reads he says I'd feel silly making a similar one which doesn't make any sense at all. I'd much rather have a post about your thought's on scum hunting rather than sex toys. At least when we are playing mafia... The next couple of posts he is effectivly fills half the thread with his talk about Evul being a perv and what not. On July 05 2012 07:56 JingleHell wrote:
Well, Hopeless, since you're at least talking, I don't think you're scum yet. However, if day1 lurkers start causing trouble, I'm all for just throwing the dice and lynching one just to make a clear point.
Also, just as wonky meta, compared to your D1 play in XIX, I'm pretty sure you're town here. You're not afraid of prolific D1 posting, among other things.
Actually, I'm VERY suspicious about YourHarry's lightning fast vote. Could be a throwaway effort to get a bandwagon started, since D1 voting is nonsense in newbie games. In the case of a mislynch, it would be easy to argue away. If you would write this as a first time player I could be somewhat cool with it. But you are not. We want to lynch scum, not lurkers. And we absolutly don't want to roll the dice. And I really don't see how you are very suspicious about the vote. There were ~50 hours untill deadline when he threw the vote. How is this even close to start a bandwagon? Like wtf? On July 05 2012 08:05 JingleHell wrote:
EBWOP: And Harry, don't try to turn my logic around on me, my vote was based on your suspicious vote.
Your quote on Hopeless wasn't what I'd call a real reason to vote for someone who's at least being active, and not particularly suspicious.
Voting for him that way makes you look scummy, considering you've said nothing of real substance yet. But at this point you only had one minor post of substance as well. On July 05 2012 08:13 JingleHell wrote:
I couldn't care less how many games you've played on mafiascum. As it turns out, in newbie games on TL, D1 bandwagons have a tendency to be lethal, particularly if there's no substance to the case to defend against. As such, it's better to target someone who's being either actively or passively useless, not somebody who's at least jumping into the deep end.
In particular, compared to his play in a different game, where he seemed painfully scummy, Hopeless1der seems like he's heading for direct contribution. I don't get this post. I may be missunderstanding this but if there is no substance to the case then why would that even be considered a case? And why on earth would someone ever get lynched by such a ''case'' On July 05 2012 08:13 JingleHell wrote:
I couldn't care less how many games you've played on mafiascum. As it turns out, in newbie games on TL, D1 bandwagons have a tendency to be lethal, particularly if there's no substance to the case to defend against. As such, it's better to target someone who's being either actively or passively useless, not somebody who's at least jumping into the deep end.
In particular, compared to his play in a different game, where he seemed painfully scummy, Hopeless1der seems like he's heading for direct contribution. Once again, there is no threat of a bandwagon at all. Why do you keep saying that? What I find maybe most intresting is how you start the game by shitting up the thread and literally don't post a single usefull thing. When the first vote get thrown tho, You go ''WTF DUDE, VOTING IZ NOT COOL''. No, I agree that the reasoning behind the vote to begin with was verrrry vauge but I don't really see why you get so upset about it ESPICIALLY since it's not even on you. ##Vote JingleHell You target me for a laundry list of things. A: You're offended that I blew off your rather annoying policy post that, you'll notice, nobody else liked either. B: You don't like me saying that excessive lurking, in absence of clear scumreads, is a valid reason to lynch. C: You don't have the capacity for sufficient critical though to realize that in a plurality lynch game, an early bandwagon can easily stick. Your entire initial "read" against me was based on fluff, taking me out of context, and ignoring reality. Why should I bother paying any attention to you later, when you continue to tunnel me, while decrying tunnel vision? A: No, you don't read. I offend you bacause talking about sex toys is 100x worse than talking about blues/policy in regards to scum hunting B: How you cannot how scum reads at this point is impressive. C: No, not with 48 hours untill lynch. Right now, yes probebly. But not then. You contradict yourself. in your last post you said I accused everyone. Now you say I tunnel you.
Uhm. How I can't have scumreads NOW? I do have some now, including you. I didn't back then. Funny how you try to make points B and C not work on the same timescale, specifically, in the context of the time those posts were from.
This is blatant tunneling, horrendous contradiction, terrible analysis, and scummy as all hell. I rest my case.
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Jiexian, after XVIII, I think we both have a fair read on eachother's habits. We can't PM, but I'm personally giving you a hefty BOTD based on meta, even though nobody else here is interested in meta.
What do you think of my read on Lazer?
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On July 07 2012 02:19 Lazermonkey wrote:
Posting from phone. Jingle, before I started pressuring you didn't have any scum reads or suspiciouns. You only posted town reads all over the place. Yoy said the case against TMG were good but you didn't pressure at all ans didn't call him scum or vote him.
I don't get what you mean with ''can't get C and B work at the same time. Doesn't C refer to the start of the game where you and others used the threat of a bandwagon as an argument against agast YourHarrys early vote?
You're taking a response that's based in context, that specific post, which is where 100% of your baseless attack comes from. Part of your response is in the context of the time it was posted, another part is based in current context.
You're saying I should have scum reads now, which has nothing to do with the post I responded to, when there weren't any clear ones. But for the other part, where it's convenient to stay in context, you do.
You're tunneling me, and bouncing around like a cricket on meth. Of course I'm going to try to ignore it, and call it scummy. It doesn't make any sense at all, unless you blatantly misinterpret things and ignore context.
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On July 07 2012 02:29 JieXian wrote:
Jingle I think your read on Lazer sucks because I've got a better one. Too bad he's gone and I got to sleep soon. I was waiting for more posts from him.
I think you're mixing "case" and "read". Read is just "town vs scum", case is "how it's proven". I've not built some massive thing with piles of evidence, just going off a small subset that screams scum.
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On July 07 2012 02:37 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On July 06 2012 23:58 Release wrote:caught up; I think Meta is a horrible form of analysis. + Show Spoiler +Defending me based on my previous games is quite shit. But, ingoring the meta, the case on hope1 is still fairly good.Since i should be back 15 minutes before the deadline, i'll leave my vote on Lazer for now.One word: deceitful and Jingle is pulling a half-grush, which i think is never good for town. DAFUQ? Do you honestly believe that Lazer is a better case than Hopeless? Show nested quote +On July 07 2012 01:31 Lazermonkey wrote:
Okay, I will go soon and may or may not be at home at the deadline. I will have my phone tho so I am able to check the thread and swap my vote if that is necessary. I will keep my vote on Jingle as of now, although that may change during the rest of the day. I will also change my vote to most scummy person in case there is a close voting. Here is my wish list for people I want dead:
1. Jingle.
2. JieXian
3. Hope/TMG DAFUQ? Jingle and JieXian are better cases than Hopeless? Stop pointing fingers, focus on one read, and build a substantial case.
Thanks for suggesting tunnel vision in defense of lazer, to help substantiate what Jiexian said.
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Can we get votecount/timecheck please?
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*Yawn*
I suppose I should bow before the superior reasoning power of someone who ignores everything recent and goes based off of the fact that two people were able to overcome a difference of opinion and get on with business?
And please, explain to me what makes my recent explanation of why the "case" against me is smoke and mirrors so inferior to if I had done it considerably earlier? I was hoping we could get on with productive hunting instead of getting sidetracked by such a joke.
Go ahead, lurker, explain to us why you've earned so much more credibility than me?
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EBWOP, that last post was directed at the rabbit.
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On July 07 2012 04:14 Hapahauli wrote:
I hope this is the last I'll say on this topic, but with the recent wave of posting, I'm not optimistic.
Why the hell is the town going after controversial players? We should be going after suspicious players!
LazerMonkey is a TOWNIE! Its so blitheringly obvious! Lazer has been under relentless pressure since day 1 and hasn't said anything remotely incriminating. He has been calling out lurkers, making cases, has been active, and freely speaks his mind! Fingerpointing =/= suspicious behavior. Agreeing with people =/= suspicious behavior. What's important is that we find someone acting suspicious in a mafia-oriented way. We're looking for deflection, deception, dishonesty... Lazer's shown NONE of those traits!
There are SO MANY BETTER TARGETS for pressure than Lazer right now!
There are multiple lurking players with low post counts that we should be scrutinizing! We already have an obvious D1 lynch target in Hopeless1der - we don't have to create a case against a controversial, clearly town-alligned player!
If he's so clearly town aligned, why are you so desperate to convince people? It should be easy to see. Hence "clearly"?
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On July 07 2012 04:34 Hapahauli wrote:
You, Zen, Release, and JieXian have all launched votes/FOS/cases against Lazer. I want you to all stop running around in circles, start pressure non-obvious townies, and get the obvious mafia (Hopeless1der) lynched.
So since your case has failed to convince us, you instead imply that all other cases are worse than yours, and anyone who disagrees with your tunnel vision is stupid? Great plan. How about you actually convince people, instead of just trying to get peer pressure started.
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EPT
