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My problem with people voting for Tack is as follows. You said he was mafia and then fit the night actions around that. This is the wrong way to go about it. You need to take a step back and assess each situation separately:
1) Tack is maf
2) Coag is maf
3) Jackal is maf
4) Lemon is maf
What people have done is taken situation 1 and just fit everything around that. Apart from me and Rean, no one has considered anything else.
Another thing that bothers me is why double stack on annul? If bum is correct, and it was 100% mafia that hit annul and not black, then its a strong possibility that the redirect wasn't done by mafia.
Here is another question. Can anyone show me something scummy that Tack has done?
He stole from Jackal, but every other person in the game would have done the same. The shot from Coag was redirected from him to annul, but there is nothing to show that Tack did it, or even that mafia did it. The entire case is Coag's gut feeling that Lemon is town.
This is what has happened:
Jackal and Coag come up with a plan to verify each other. Jackal thinks Lemon is town. By a process of elimination they say that 2/3 of annul/tack/darmo are the scum. They try to get Tack lynched first because they think he is the easiest to lynch. No evidence, no scumminess, nothing. They throw in a few bullshit PMs that mean nothing just to try and give the appearance of having done something when that isn't the case.
Bum lynches darmo and annul flips town. Keep in mind that Jackal and Coag STILL HAVEN'T VERIFIED EACH OTHER! Coag even admits that if Tack is town, Jackal is probably the mafia.
In fact, the ONLY reason Tack is the prime suspect right now is because Lemon is Coag's friend and Tack isn't. That's it. If it was the other way around, Lemon would be the one up for a lynch.
Finally, Jackal and Coag have just been raging, shouting, repeating the same things over and over and over. They have NO CASE. NOTHING. ZERO. Not one person voting for Tack has thought for themselves, they are just sheeping two tunnellers.
I'm most disappointed in bum, its clear he hasn't even read the thread properly.
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Oh and the argument about Tack covering both bases fails too. Coag claimed he had a stun gun that would zap people who visited him. Redirecting him would do nothing. It would make 100% more sense to redirect Jackal and steal from Coag.
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EBWOP: Unless you are Lemon/Jackal and know that Coag is the one with the real gun.
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You're wrong, there were many people who questioned other things, like why Lemon is "cleared".
I myself have asked for extensive explanations on why we are only focusing on Tack, you need to go back and read the thread more carefully.
And no it wouldn't make sense to steal from Coag, as a KP is more important than a RB for mafia.
And as Coag was clearly the shooter, and jackal's item got stolen, that safely clears them both. As much as you can have someone cleared in a game of Mafia.
So it's between Lemon and Tackster, and it doesn't make sense for mafia to double-shoot Annul if they KNEW Coag had the real gun. It would make much more sense to use the "stun gun" to RB annul's potato.
Anything else makes a lot less sense than this theory.
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You guys need to sleep at night.
Decon - You claiming to be vet?
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On March 29 2011 21:10 Jackal58 wrote:
You guys need to sleep at night.
Decon - You claiming to be vet?
Yep, posted role PM earlier if you wanna read it.
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On March 29 2011 20:57 CubEdIn wrote:
So it's between Lemon and Tackster, and it doesn't make sense for mafia to double-shoot Annul if they KNEW Coag had the real gun. It would make much more sense to use the "stun gun" to RB annul's potato.
Anything else makes a lot less sense than this theory.
The theoretical stun gun blocks people who visit Coag not people that Coag visits. So using it to stop the potato makes no sense.
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On March 29 2011 21:13 deconduo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 29 2011 21:10 Jackal58 wrote:
You guys need to sleep at night.
Decon - You claiming to be vet? Yep, posted role PM earlier if you wanna read it.
Isnt claiming vet kinda pointless? Like Im still newbish (Nothing to do with the lurking I actually wanted to do analysis yesterday but ended up in the hospital >_<)
But wouldnt scum be less inclined to hit you after you claim vet (Which kinda ruins the point of hit absorption?)
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On March 29 2011 21:57 OriginalName wrote:Show nested quote +On March 29 2011 21:13 deconduo wrote:On March 29 2011 21:10 Jackal58 wrote:
You guys need to sleep at night.
Decon - You claiming to be vet? Yep, posted role PM earlier if you wanna read it. Isnt claiming vet kinda pointless? Like Im still newbish (Nothing to do with the lurking I actually wanted to do analysis yesterday but ended up in the hospital >_<) But wouldnt scum be less inclined to hit you after you claim vet (Which kinda ruins the point of hit absorption?)
He's claiming it to point out that Kavdragon might very well be black.
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On March 29 2011 21:58 Rean wrote:Show nested quote +On March 29 2011 21:57 OriginalName wrote:On March 29 2011 21:13 deconduo wrote:On March 29 2011 21:10 Jackal58 wrote:
You guys need to sleep at night.
Decon - You claiming to be vet? Yep, posted role PM earlier if you wanna read it. Isnt claiming vet kinda pointless? Like Im still newbish (Nothing to do with the lurking I actually wanted to do analysis yesterday but ended up in the hospital >_<) But wouldnt scum be less inclined to hit you after you claim vet (Which kinda ruins the point of hit absorption?) He's claiming it to point out that Kavdragon might very well be black.
Im not claiming med by any means but wouldbt Kav be a half decent choice for med protection as Bum has BGs and RoL has been playing a rather quiet game for himself (Do note this is exactly why I did not shoot him DF mafia) So while possible doesnt it seem unlikely?
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On March 29 2011 22:03 OriginalName wrote:Show nested quote +On March 29 2011 21:58 Rean wrote:On March 29 2011 21:57 OriginalName wrote:On March 29 2011 21:13 deconduo wrote:On March 29 2011 21:10 Jackal58 wrote:
You guys need to sleep at night.
Decon - You claiming to be vet? Yep, posted role PM earlier if you wanna read it. Isnt claiming vet kinda pointless? Like Im still newbish (Nothing to do with the lurking I actually wanted to do analysis yesterday but ended up in the hospital >_<) But wouldnt scum be less inclined to hit you after you claim vet (Which kinda ruins the point of hit absorption?) He's claiming it to point out that Kavdragon might very well be black. Im not claiming med by any means but wouldbt Kav be a half decent choice for med protection as Bum has BGs and RoL has been playing a rather quiet game for himself (Do note this is exactly why I did not shoot him DF mafia) So while possible doesnt it seem unlikely?
If you are med protected you don't get told you were hit. Medic is informed.
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On March 29 2011 22:06 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 29 2011 22:03 OriginalName wrote:On March 29 2011 21:58 Rean wrote:On March 29 2011 21:57 OriginalName wrote:On March 29 2011 21:13 deconduo wrote:On March 29 2011 21:10 Jackal58 wrote:
You guys need to sleep at night.
Decon - You claiming to be vet? Yep, posted role PM earlier if you wanna read it. Isnt claiming vet kinda pointless? Like Im still newbish (Nothing to do with the lurking I actually wanted to do analysis yesterday but ended up in the hospital >_<) But wouldnt scum be less inclined to hit you after you claim vet (Which kinda ruins the point of hit absorption?) He's claiming it to point out that Kavdragon might very well be black. Im not claiming med by any means but wouldbt Kav be a half decent choice for med protection as Bum has BGs and RoL has been playing a rather quiet game for himself (Do note this is exactly why I did not shoot him DF mafia) So while possible doesnt it seem unlikely? If you are med protected you don't get told you were hit. Medic is informed.
I'm pretty sure kav claimed vet as well, though I might be mistaken on this. He certainly implied it if he didn't state it outright.
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EBWOP: Nevermind, I was mistaken.
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=8486512
Just stated he was hit.
So if you are vet and get hit you turn into a zombie.
Unless not all vets have the same reaction to a hit?
We know blacks are bullet proof. (That sounds so KKK to me)
So if a black was hit why claim it?
What other mechanisms or roles may be in place that allow a player to absorb a hit and be notified that they were indeed shot?
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On March 29 2011 22:25 Jackal58 wrote:
So if a black was hit why claim it?
Safest thing to do. No reason for a townie to stay quiet if he was hit. If it was a mafia hit, mafia would know he's black. If it was a vig hit, vig would know he's red/black.
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On March 29 2011 22:29 deconduo wrote:Safest thing to do. No reason for a townie to stay quiet if he was hit. If it was a mafia hit, mafia would know he's black. If it was a vig hit, vig would know he's red/black.
This is pretty spot on. It'd standard to claim you were hit immediately after it happens. Hiding out and waiting for someone else to claim usually hurts more than helps.
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It's **
Sry posting from a cell phone -_-
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On March 29 2011 20:12 deconduo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 29 2011 19:05 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:On March 29 2011 18:57 deconduo wrote:1. Tack is town 2. Lemon is Maf 3. Kav is Black I've explained 1+2 to the best of my ability, but unfortunately TL townies just sheep whoever shouts loudest. Once again there is NO CASE against Tack that doesn't apply to any of the other item game players bar Coag. But hey, don't let that stop you. 3 is kinda cool. Kav is black and got hit last night. As he didn't know whether it was maf or town that hit him, he claimed vet to stop any suspicion towards him. He made a fatal error however, vets work a little differently in this game: Original Message From kitaman27:
You are the Veteran! You have one extra night life! By one extra night life I mean if you die you get ressed as a zombie I can't convince you not to lynch Tack today it seems, so we are doomed to lose the item game. At least when he flips town it clears me and you can lynch kav though. Well fuck this changes things, Kenpachi may still be a red that the Blacks found somehow and want lynched... in fact this may make the case stronger. But I withdraw my green call on Kav, wanna hear more from decon What do you want to hear?
Well my question was going to be are you sure you're unique and that there aren't other vets with different types of roles. But I realized that's a pretty pointless question and just calls for specualtion so I'd rather hear from Kav instead.
Kav: why did you live if you're not a vet. And if you are a vet how does it work since it must be different from Decon.
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That's pretty insulting deconduo, I know I have missed ALOT of details, but I know what I am doing. There is a lot of information that I am processing, and a ridiculous amount of outcomes I could throw together. I need to focus on just the IG at the moment, as it is where I've directed myself and my team's attention, I as I feel it is the easiest way to add to my rather large confirmed list. I know it seems like I pulled darm out of my ass, but I assure you I put the exact same effort I am now coming up with what made him scum as I have with tackster.
If you don't think that I haven't pictured Kav as a solid black scum, then you are underestimating me. Reactions and general townie opinions have driven my vote. Have I done extensive analysis on anyone but darm yet? No. Have I clearly read the thread properly? Yes.
It's funny because I know scum wouldn't call me out on not putting enough effort because I am right on course. Congrats decon!
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Just FYI: I voted Tackster in the vote thread.
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EPT
