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On August 22 2011 15:00 tyCe wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2011 14:58 aru wrote:On August 22 2011 14:43 tyCe wrote:
Well yeah, I think IEM showed the difference in level of jungling between NA and EU most of all. TheOddOne made so few mistakes and his ability to counter-jungle almost perfectly and gank almost perfectly showed that his understanding is much better than the EU junglers and Saintvicious to a lesser extent. NA seems to have better solo tops but that's probably mostly because teams like fnatic play an inferior style (imo) with AP top, while Wickd kept playing Lee Sin who he evidently isn't that good at.
However, I think that the EU AD carries are noticeably better than the NA AD carries. Candy Panda, Lamia (?) and Tidus/Linak basically outlaned both jiji and Chaox pretty heavily, although jiji's godlike positioning made him better in team fights.
IMO, the top teams are very close. I still think SK is the best team in the world, but they rely very heavily on Candy Panda and Nyph to carry them. They also had the most nervous start of any team with their LAN debut on the mainstage and Candy Panda giving away FB to a sneaky bot brush gank. They convincingly outplayed TSM, who didn't play that poorly overall either. I'd say that fnatic and Millenium and the rest are a step below SK, CLG and TSM, who are all very close. Wickd played a top lane Warwick too and got destroyed by Hotshot's Nidalee. Chauster is CLG's best AD carry, who couldn't attend due to a final. He said he decided to take a year off school for LoL though, so that shouldn't be an issue anymore. Jiji usually players AP carry, and his AP carry is noticeably better than Salce if you compared their Orianna/Zilean games. You can watch Jiji play those on youtube if you search for IEM Guangzhou NA quals I think. It took place about a week before Gamescom. Yeah, I know Chauster is CLG's AD player and jiji is the AP player, but I still rate Candy Panda very easily above Chauster. Jiji doesn't play a bad AD, and I always thought that jiji didn't play AD in CLG was because he liked to control the midgame with AP in mid-lane and not because jiji AD is worse than Chauster AD.
While I believe Jiji's AD laning is noticeable worse than Chauster's (their team fight positioning is similar), you can't deny that CLG's AP would have been much stronger with Jiji.
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On August 22 2011 15:00 tyCe wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2011 14:58 aru wrote:On August 22 2011 14:43 tyCe wrote:
Well yeah, I think IEM showed the difference in level of jungling between NA and EU most of all. TheOddOne made so few mistakes and his ability to counter-jungle almost perfectly and gank almost perfectly showed that his understanding is much better than the EU junglers and Saintvicious to a lesser extent. NA seems to have better solo tops but that's probably mostly because teams like fnatic play an inferior style (imo) with AP top, while Wickd kept playing Lee Sin who he evidently isn't that good at.
However, I think that the EU AD carries are noticeably better than the NA AD carries. Candy Panda, Lamia (?) and Tidus/Linak basically outlaned both jiji and Chaox pretty heavily, although jiji's godlike positioning made him better in team fights.
IMO, the top teams are very close. I still think SK is the best team in the world, but they rely very heavily on Candy Panda and Nyph to carry them. They also had the most nervous start of any team with their LAN debut on the mainstage and Candy Panda giving away FB to a sneaky bot brush gank. They convincingly outplayed TSM, who didn't play that poorly overall either. I'd say that fnatic and Millenium and the rest are a step below SK, CLG and TSM, who are all very close. Wickd played a top lane Warwick too and got destroyed by Hotshot's Nidalee. Chauster is CLG's best AD carry, who couldn't attend due to a final. He said he decided to take a year off school for LoL though, so that shouldn't be an issue anymore. Jiji usually players AP carry, and his AP carry is noticeably better than Salce if you compared their Orianna/Zilean games. You can watch Jiji play those on youtube if you search for IEM Guangzhou NA quals I think. It took place about a week before Gamescom. Yeah, I know Chauster is CLG's AD player and jiji is the AP player, but I still rate Candy Panda very easily above Chauster. Jiji doesn't play a bad AD, and I always thought that jiji didn't play AD in CLG was because he liked to control the midgame with AP in mid-lane and not because jiji AD is worse than Chauster AD.
Idk I would rate candy with the best farming but chauster understands matchups, positioning and game phases better imo and honestly the farm difference isn't that big outside candy on cait, one of the big things is he lanes with nyph who is much better than elementz as well, elementz while a great player was imo the worst support player between all the decent teams at the tourney.
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On August 22 2011 15:07 aru wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2011 15:00 tyCe wrote:On August 22 2011 14:58 aru wrote:On August 22 2011 14:43 tyCe wrote:
Well yeah, I think IEM showed the difference in level of jungling between NA and EU most of all. TheOddOne made so few mistakes and his ability to counter-jungle almost perfectly and gank almost perfectly showed that his understanding is much better than the EU junglers and Saintvicious to a lesser extent. NA seems to have better solo tops but that's probably mostly because teams like fnatic play an inferior style (imo) with AP top, while Wickd kept playing Lee Sin who he evidently isn't that good at.
However, I think that the EU AD carries are noticeably better than the NA AD carries. Candy Panda, Lamia (?) and Tidus/Linak basically outlaned both jiji and Chaox pretty heavily, although jiji's godlike positioning made him better in team fights.
IMO, the top teams are very close. I still think SK is the best team in the world, but they rely very heavily on Candy Panda and Nyph to carry them. They also had the most nervous start of any team with their LAN debut on the mainstage and Candy Panda giving away FB to a sneaky bot brush gank. They convincingly outplayed TSM, who didn't play that poorly overall either. I'd say that fnatic and Millenium and the rest are a step below SK, CLG and TSM, who are all very close. Wickd played a top lane Warwick too and got destroyed by Hotshot's Nidalee. Chauster is CLG's best AD carry, who couldn't attend due to a final. He said he decided to take a year off school for LoL though, so that shouldn't be an issue anymore. Jiji usually players AP carry, and his AP carry is noticeably better than Salce if you compared their Orianna/Zilean games. You can watch Jiji play those on youtube if you search for IEM Guangzhou NA quals I think. It took place about a week before Gamescom. Yeah, I know Chauster is CLG's AD player and jiji is the AP player, but I still rate Candy Panda very easily above Chauster. Jiji doesn't play a bad AD, and I always thought that jiji didn't play AD in CLG was because he liked to control the midgame with AP in mid-lane and not because jiji AD is worse than Chauster AD. While I believe Jiji's AD laning is noticeable worse than Chauster's (their team fight positioning is similar), you can't deny that CLG's AP would have been much stronger with Jiji.
I wonder if anyone would have been stupid enough to let orianna through with jiji there though as he is by far the best orianna in the world, it is stupid how good he is on her, it is almost hotshot nid level of good with orianna being much more op base wise.
Also kind of sad to see no salce vlad, shows just how far the champ has fallen that the guy with 98 percent win rate on ladder won't pick him in games that matter.
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he played vlad* in the final match against tsm.... lol
and salce's ranked stats were initial release vald, when he was flamboyantly op
not to take away from his vlad's skill or anything
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On August 22 2011 15:09 bigjenk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2011 15:07 aru wrote:On August 22 2011 15:00 tyCe wrote:On August 22 2011 14:58 aru wrote:On August 22 2011 14:43 tyCe wrote:
Well yeah, I think IEM showed the difference in level of jungling between NA and EU most of all. TheOddOne made so few mistakes and his ability to counter-jungle almost perfectly and gank almost perfectly showed that his understanding is much better than the EU junglers and Saintvicious to a lesser extent. NA seems to have better solo tops but that's probably mostly because teams like fnatic play an inferior style (imo) with AP top, while Wickd kept playing Lee Sin who he evidently isn't that good at.
However, I think that the EU AD carries are noticeably better than the NA AD carries. Candy Panda, Lamia (?) and Tidus/Linak basically outlaned both jiji and Chaox pretty heavily, although jiji's godlike positioning made him better in team fights.
IMO, the top teams are very close. I still think SK is the best team in the world, but they rely very heavily on Candy Panda and Nyph to carry them. They also had the most nervous start of any team with their LAN debut on the mainstage and Candy Panda giving away FB to a sneaky bot brush gank. They convincingly outplayed TSM, who didn't play that poorly overall either. I'd say that fnatic and Millenium and the rest are a step below SK, CLG and TSM, who are all very close. Wickd played a top lane Warwick too and got destroyed by Hotshot's Nidalee. Chauster is CLG's best AD carry, who couldn't attend due to a final. He said he decided to take a year off school for LoL though, so that shouldn't be an issue anymore. Jiji usually players AP carry, and his AP carry is noticeably better than Salce if you compared their Orianna/Zilean games. You can watch Jiji play those on youtube if you search for IEM Guangzhou NA quals I think. It took place about a week before Gamescom. Yeah, I know Chauster is CLG's AD player and jiji is the AP player, but I still rate Candy Panda very easily above Chauster. Jiji doesn't play a bad AD, and I always thought that jiji didn't play AD in CLG was because he liked to control the midgame with AP in mid-lane and not because jiji AD is worse than Chauster AD. While I believe Jiji's AD laning is noticeable worse than Chauster's (their team fight positioning is similar), you can't deny that CLG's AP would have been much stronger with Jiji. I wonder if anyone would have been stupid enough to let orianna through with jiji there though as he is by far the best orianna in the world, it is stupid how good he is on her, it is almost hotshot nid level of good with orianna being much more op base wise. Also kind of sad to see no salce vlad, shows just how far the champ has fallen that the guy with 98 percent win rate on ladder won't pick him in games that matter.
Salce played Vlad in the final match of the finals and actually did really well with him. His ults on Chaox were the deciding factor in CLG's win imo.
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They are restreaming the finals, is it really necessary to restream the massive downtime between games 2 and 3?
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United States37500 Posts
On August 22 2011 16:08 BlackHat wrote:
They are restreaming the finals, is it really necessary to restream the massive downtime between games 2 and 3?
They're just restreaming off of a VOD. I highly doubt there's someone behind the console to skip non-gameplay air time.
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On August 22 2011 15:14 aru wrote:
Salce played Vlad in the final match of the finals and actually did really well with him. His ults on Chaox were the deciding factor in CLG's win imo.
I don't think Vlad contributed hardly anything to that win. I love the character, but watching that game, I never saw Vlad do anything noteworthy. He was never in a protracted 1v1 or 1v2 which is where he shines the most. Instead he was just an ult bot, and while his ult is good, I didn't see any game-changing 4-5 man ults.
Also, I love how the announcer kept saying "troll-pool", but he died every time he was trying to escape with it. Though that might be more due to no flash.
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trying to avoid spoilers and looking for a VOD of the final. please link!
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On August 23 2011 04:34 bakedace wrote:
trying to avoid spoilers and looking for a VOD of the final. please link!
VOD not posted yet as far as I can see. I'll link it when I see it if no one does before then though.
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I still can't believe TSM didn't just fucking ban Nidalee for game 3.
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I think the difference between DH and GC was that the NA teams respected the EU teams/meta more. at DH NA went into it barely knowing the EU meta and only having practiced with its own inbred metagame.
then again i cant say anything for sure.
as for EU begin better in bot lane, it did seem like they were getting more farm, but i feel like they had less game impact than some of the NA bot laners. there was definnitely one game where the ranged carry bot just AFK farmed and let the NA team just take over the game. so it didnt matter that he was 60CS ahead.
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EU lost because they're still sticking to double AP even after the Deathcap nerf. Deathcap nerf = run a bruiser in your 2nd solo.
EDIT: also Shushei's janky solo Cow got nerfed and Yellowstar wasn't there.
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United States37500 Posts
On August 23 2011 04:48 Mogwai wrote:
I still can't believe TSM didn't just fucking ban Nidalee for game 3.
Would have been fine if TSM had a Nidaree player. But CLG knew that Regi's Nid was really subpar (when compared to HSGG's) so they didn't waste a ban on Nid.
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United States37500 Posts
On August 23 2011 04:51 Mogwai wrote:
EU lost because they're still sticking to double AP even after the Deathcap nerf. Deathcap nerf = run a bruiser in your 2nd solo.
EDIT: also Shushei's janky solo Cow got nerfed and Yellowstar wasn't there.
Double AP is fine, it's just their window to win a game is much smaller though. The Deathcap nerf plays a big role in that shrinking window.
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On August 23 2011 04:52 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2011 04:48 Mogwai wrote:
I still can't believe TSM didn't just fucking ban Nidalee for game 3. Would have been fine if TSM had a Nidaree player. But CLG knew that Regi's Nid was really subpar (when compared to HSGG's) so they didn't waste a ban on Nid.
Well, yea, that's exactly what I'm saying.
Regi on Nid was idiotic. Did they really think CLG would waste a ban to prevent Regi from being forced into playing Nid instead of playing one of his many other, way better AP characters?
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im surprised that more people arent good with nid. I mean she might be hard to play midgame, but late game you just derp spear/heal since you are too squishy to do anything else.
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On August 23 2011 04:59 Orpheos wrote:
im surprised that more people arent good with nid. I mean she might be hard to play midgame, but late game you just derp spear/heal since you are too squishy to do anything else.
...and how exactly do you plan on being far enough ahead to be relevant late game when you're mediocre earlier? The whole reason she's even good lategame is because she's so fucking strong before that.
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On August 22 2011 17:29 BlackHat wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2011 15:14 aru wrote:
Salce played Vlad in the final match of the finals and actually did really well with him. His ults on Chaox were the deciding factor in CLG's win imo.
I don't think Vlad contributed hardly anything to that win. I love the character, but watching that game, I never saw Vlad do anything noteworthy. He was never in a protracted 1v1 or 1v2 which is where he shines the most. Instead he was just an ult bot, and while his ult is good, I didn't see any game-changing 4-5 man ults. Also, I love how the announcer kept saying "troll-pool", but he died every time he was trying to escape with it. Though that might be more due to no flash.
He had a good fight near CLGs bot inner and 1 or 2 good baits with pool that turned things in CLGs favor.
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On August 22 2011 15:13 Navi wrote:
he played vlad* in the final match against tsm.... lol
and salce's ranked stats were initial release vald, when he was flamboyantly op
not to take away from his vlad's skill or anything
>.< fuck was helping someone move during the last game and still can't find vods up
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EPT
