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On June 15 2011 19:38 Kaniol wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 19:10 Shiragaku wrote:
So I am debating whether I want to use Udyr again or not. I build Udyr as Phoenix tank (who wouldn't?) but I am curious if tankwick is more viable of a tank than Udyr at the moment. Whaaaaat? What's the point of going phoenix on udyr? I always thought phoenix udyr players were the ones that didn't know tiger exists. But you just proved that my theory is wrong. What's so good in phoenix udyr that makes you pick him over tigerdyr or any other champ? If you want tanky aoe damage dealer then wouldn't it be better to go for something like... amumu? I really don't see anything good in phoenixdyr
going tiger stance pretty much means you have to get an early sheen/triforce to really take advantage of tiger and output good dps. that makes you have a little less utility early game as you're pretty squishy, but you end up with a monster of a mid-late game. phoenix stance udyr tends to ignore pretty much all offensive options until they get all their tank items, which gives them slightly more utility the entire game at the cost of more dps.
either way, udyr is just simply outclassed as a jungler/pick in general right now. the fact that the common solo lane/carries often have very strong escapes, coupled with the fact that udyr's gap-closer is very susceptible to being kited means his ganks aren't as strong as other junglers. he's also pretty item dependent regardless of if you go tiger or phoenix. he's an absolute beast once farmed, but getting there can be tough.
also. no more locket :[
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Just why would Tiger make you need to rush Sheen(an item that has 0 synergy with aspd) but Phoenix doesn't?
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You don't really need an early sheen/triforce at all. Tiger is one of the most ridiculous damage steroid abilities in the game which makes up for the fact that you have very limited mobility. I don't understand what pheonix "tank" has going for it since you don't do good damage and you don't have any more CC. I often build pretty much full tank on udyr with maybe a wits end or something if the team is such that it has a vlad/nidalee solos or something where we have strong poke and all I need to do is be tanky enough and in the face of the squishies so that they can't hit vlad and he will just kill everyone with nidalee heals.
Even with no items except wriggles tiger udyr wrecks squishies very fast. Triforce is a great item but it means you kind of have to play smart and juke in and out a bit using turtle and bear stance with sheen procs to keep you alive while doing damage. If you go tank you can actually just stay in tiger stance longer and just beat the shit out of whoever.
Reason he is outclassed right now is because he has no ultimate. Give him a solid ultimate and maybe he'll be a pickable champ in draft mode.
He is pretty farm dependent so you have to kinda be prepared to farm him up later as well. But only nunu and amumu are really item independent to be effective in teamfights.
Pheonix has weaker ganks and it doesn't clear the jungle any faster if you just start blue and do the full route with tiger, so it's pretty much useless right now. Since it doesn't scale well at all it's like garen that is even it if's really strong early game it gets really weak later. Since it isn't even good early game now it's pretty much useless. They just should make it his ultimate and add something cool to it.
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Phoenix udyr basically maxes turtle as first skill and you don't even have to buy madreds to be fast at killing the jungle, you can just go full tank. In fights you can rotate stun etc...while being a lot harder than tiger to kill.
The game has evolved both theoretically as well as through nerfs to tanky dps so phoenix isn't very good anymore and even old non locket phoenix might not be a great pick the way people play now.
TBH though phoenix udyr is a lot more interesting than Tiger, you could do more than just train some target for the kill.
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Do, do you guys think they will ever bring locket back, nerfed or not?
I wasn't around during it's reign, so I don't truly understand how powerful it was, but from what I read it did on the Wiki, I can see why is was OP on Udyr and Sona.
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On June 15 2011 22:15 57 Corvette wrote:
Do, do you guys think they will ever bring locket back, nerfed or not?
I wasn't around during it's reign, so I don't truly understand how powerful it was, but from what I read it did on the Wiki, I can see why is was OP on Udyr and Sona.
Yah if you were Sona and had locket, you could actually spam all 3 of your QWE spells nonstop for eternity. Just keep smashing your fingers down on all 3 of them, never ever run out of mana.
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I personally don't feel like the game needs locket anyway.
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So does that mean we can get the armor back in the HOG?
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On June 15 2011 17:07 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
Just played a game with Morello, next patch gold/10 items have unique passives.
NOOOO MY TROLLPLANK. DDDD: !!
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On June 15 2011 23:10 Two_DoWn wrote:
So does that mean we can get the armor back in the HOG?
We obviously could. But I doubt it's going to happen.
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I just did a little research, and found out these facts:
The last Free Champion Rotation that had Akali in it was January 24th
The last Free Champion Rotation that had Gragas in it was at the end of February.
The last Free Champon Rotation for Eve was October 2010 (Thank god ._.)
Karma was last free at the end of March
Lux was last free at the end of march
Pantheon was last free in January
Poppy was last free at the end of march
Shaco was last seen NOVEMBER 30th!!
Trundle was last seen free at the end of Feb
Trynd was last free mid-Feb
TF was last free in January
Twitch was last free at the end of march
Urgot was last free mid-march
Vlad was last free in January (Thank god ._.)
There has also been 3 or 4 champs from the April 5th rotation that have not been free since.
Akali, Cass, Eve, Gragas, Karma, Lux, Nidalee, Olaf, Pantheon, Poppy, Shaco, Trundle, Tryndamere, Twisted Fate, Twitch, Urgot, Vladimir.
Why do you think Riot doesn't make any of these champions free?
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Watch out for LarissaLover and Lykha on EU.. epic trolls around 1700..
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On June 15 2011 23:32 Senx wrote:
Watch out for LarissaLover and Lykha on EU.. epic trolls around 1700..
end of season :D
and i've just seen aaa momo on wetdreams stream doing epic mclaren anivia style :D
apparently he got hacked or something, atleast wickd and wetdream and whoever were talking about something like that...
btw, opinions on twitch? still playable or nerfbat hit to hard? i'm in the mood to try something new :D
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Most blow (cass, panth, karma, trynd, twitch), some are stupidly annoying to play against (Eve, poppy, shaco, TF, urgot, Vlad), and the others really have no good reason as for why.
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he's still invisible, so I guess he has that going for him... it's basically like playing a worse eve who's damage scales better, but doesn't randomly heal himself for 500 hp at a time in teamfights or CC people.
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But he still has the global taunt (same as Eve and Teemo) so as soon as you pop you WILL die before you can do any damage.
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some asshole around 1900-2000 was spamming twitch games last time I was playing (I wanna say it was Brettt). he was doing atmogs iirc. Also he was sucking and losing a lot.
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On June 15 2011 23:55 Two_DoWn wrote:
But he still has the global taunt (same as Eve and Teemo) so as soon as you pop you WILL die before you can do any damage.
i always have that epic twitch vid where someone gets thats awesome ace at baron bush :D
that's what i wanna do, hahaha.
i guess twitch is not someone you play here and there but need to play him quite well to be on the same level as with other easier and not so up champs?
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On June 15 2011 17:07 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
Just played a game with Morello, next patch gold/10 items have unique passives. Riot king of useless changes. instead of giving people alternative ways to play they just nerf the current trend and then people will find another FotM to do that they will then nerf again.
Endless circle of illusionary progress that accomplishes nothing
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Twitch is flat out terrible.
Before the nerf, you played Twitch because 1) he ganks decently and forces pink wards / oracles and 2) he's a time bomb. If the enemy team doesn't win before he gets 2/3 DPS items, teamfights suddenly become exponentially more difficult. EVERYONE on the enemy team is suddenly taking tons of damage.
Now imagine how effective a DPS champ is when they only get 7 autoattacks before dying. The best Twitch can hope for now is to hit most of the enemy team 7 times. This is much harder than it sounds and Twitch can't continue destroying afterwards, which kind of removes the point of Twitch. Man, that sounded more coherent in my head.
Twitch's passive is actually really really strong though, and I've been 'abusing' it with a Malady-GRB build. Sneak up behind someone and open fire, expunge them for 600 damage npnp.
Double Jungle Taric/Twitch is a pretty stupid hilarious strategy. After all, the problem with jungle Twitch is that he has no innate survivability and the problem with jungle Taric is he's so slow. So give blue buff to Taric and all the creeps to Twitch and gank lanes every 5 seconds because stealthslow -> stun is craaazy indeed.
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EPT
