EPTChina, US and the environment
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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xM(Z
Romania5281 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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saocyn
United States937 Posts
and I'm just going to call it for what it is, racism. The same people who spoke ill of the Chinese, Chinese Americans / Asians, are the same ones who are currently using the political climate to facilitate their hate. they just now have a political channel to funnel their racism. The whole I have to put down Asians, to prop myself up reeks of inferiority complex. You know these sentiments are true if you even remotely watch TI, and get a general consensus to what people type in twitch chat. "Fuck china, free hong kong, ching chong, china numba 1" along with "biased crowd" when all western crowds are completely biased towards the home team in every TI. all these sentiments are well, racial sentiments that have only been magnified due to the current political climate, but more importantly these were the same sentiments ushered far before it became a PC issue. I find it odd such focus is on the ills of china and not the betterment of america. let's call it out for what it is, racism. | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
On August 25 2019 01:07 JimmiC wrote: You are again way off the rails my friend. I have explained to you the policies that I believe will help. The issue with China is they are currently the worst Actually they are leaders when it comes to investing in renewable energies. It's a real issue for them, their citizens (comrades?) are about to riot because of it. The US are the worst, their President even said it was a "Chinese hoax" while they are the biggest polluters, only behind the richest oil nations which do whatthefuckeries in the desert with their insane wealth. But anyway, leading countries misbehaving on this matter should never be an excuse for other countries to not make the efforts required. We're speaking about thousands of billions of people yet to be born. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
Besides My main point is actually that there is a lot to be done in all countries, who is worst does not even matter. The issue with China is they are currently the worst The Chinese government is terrifying, Chinese citizens understand it more than anyone. But it's common sense that they should put their priority elsewhere. We should be happy they're putting so much efforts on environmental issues, they don't have nearly as much wealth as us. On the other hand the richest countries in the world barely try. I can only agree with saocyn. . | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Zambrah
United States7340 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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BerserkSword
United States2123 Posts
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Zambrah
United States7340 Posts
I have yet to read through Bernie's Green New Deal but I'm looking forward to it. From the synopsis I've seen around it looks good, especially moving to renewable transport, I think thatll be a tough sell to all the Americans who own a car that isn't electric but tbh if I could sell my car to the government for money towards an electric car that'd be something I'd be excited to do. Even just managing to implement robust public transit with renewables would be a good step to me. God knows the US needs better public transit. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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GreenHorizons
United States23295 Posts
On August 25 2019 10:35 BerserkSword wrote: From what I understand America is full of people like me who buy cars with V8 engines, leave the computer on 24/7, and eat meat at least 3x a day Yeah which is part of the heart of the issue. There isn't a way to make western life as we know it sustainable and things that help around the margins like consumer choice and reusables/waste reduction make us feel better and slow/reduce the impending catastrophe slightly but they miss the issue at the center which is the dominant economic system and our way of life. | ||
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Broetchenholer
Germany1944 Posts
The problem is just that there is absolutely no political will for this discussion, as politicians don't want to suicide their career for necessary changes that can only be started by taking away the toys of the public. And the public will not start freely giving away their toys if they are not forced. And then there is the issue with social equality becoming worse if we just make the toys more expensive. | ||
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Aveng3r
United States2411 Posts
On August 26 2019 03:38 Broetchenholer wrote: It's super unfair of the "western" world to now tell china to stop polluting the environment. Sure, China is the biggest polluter with heavy industry and energy production, but we are buying the products the make for cheap so that we can have more efficient industries. The only way for change is going to be limiting our own consumerism by drastically increasing prizes for the worst offenders like meat, cars, electicity. Only if it hurts our bank accounts to eat meat every day, we will stop doing it. And then, when the western world drastically reduces consumerism, we can ask countries like China to do their part as well. The problem is just that there is absolutely no political will for this discussion, as politicians don't want to suicide their career for necessary changes that can only be started by taking away the toys of the public. And the public will not start freely giving away their toys if they are not forced. And then there is the issue with social equality becoming worse if we just make the toys more expensive. I would disagree with you to the extent that I think it is fair to pressure China to clean up their act, provided that we are holding up our end of the bargain as well. I hear theres an upcoming presidential candidate who has some ideas Also JimmiC good thread with a lot to talk about, but does the OP really need to be a snippet of your latest back and forth with GH? | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Broetchenholer
Germany1944 Posts
On August 27 2019 00:48 Aveng3r wrote: I would disagree with you to the extent that I think it is fair to pressure China to clean up their act, provided that we are holding up our end of the bargain as well. I hear theres an upcoming presidential candidate who has some ideas Also JimmiC good thread with a lot to talk about, but does the OP really need to be a snippet of your latest back and forth with GH? Well, it can be expected that everybody does as much as is possible for their society and economy. But it's very unfair to go to the countries trying their best t ocatch up to our standard of living and just say that now that we fucked it up and had our 60 years of paradise, they are not allowed in. 1 billion chinese people want computers? Not gonna happen, they are not 100% emission free yet so they are not allowed to increase their energy consumption per capita. Of course it is reasonable to assume that if we are pulling our weight and help the less developed countries to do the same that they will try their best to reach a richer society in a less polluting way. But that requires our effort. We need to invest massively in development projects all over the world to make the transition feasible for countries who can not prioritize climate policies over improving living conditions. And as we are not even able to say that we need to consume less in political discourse without being laughed out of the room, there is no reason to ever talk about any other countries then our own. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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