EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 3580
| Forum Index > General Forum |
Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
|
JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
| ||
|
gobbledydook
Australia2602 Posts
The system is broken but proposing to ignore the immigration laws just opens you up to being attacked for lawlessness. The dirty secret is that the US needs a cheap underclass of workers to do the dirty work like picking strawberries and delivering takeaway meals but no one is willing to actually advocate for having a legal scheme for those workers. | ||
|
JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
| ||
|
Mohdoo
United States15643 Posts
On April 11 2022 17:49 gobbledydook wrote: I don't know why Democrats continue to allow themselves to be vulnerable to attacks on immigration. The system is broken but proposing to ignore the immigration laws just opens you up to being attacked for lawlessness. The dirty secret is that the US needs a cheap underclass of workers to do the dirty work like picking strawberries and delivering takeaway meals but no one is willing to actually advocate for having a legal scheme for those workers. Immigration and abortion are democrats 2 worst platforms. Imagine a world where democrats just focused on fighting billionaires and the elite. | ||
|
LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
On April 11 2022 17:49 gobbledydook wrote: I don't know why Democrats continue to allow themselves to be vulnerable to attacks on immigration. The system is broken but proposing to ignore the immigration laws just opens you up to being attacked for lawlessness. The dirty secret is that the US needs a cheap underclass of workers to do the dirty work like picking strawberries and delivering takeaway meals but no one is willing to actually advocate for having a legal scheme for those workers. Keep in mind that being pro-immigration blends well with the "accuse the opponent of being racist" and "pander to the important Hispanic voter base with open borders" goals. Which to be fair was, until recently, a fairly dominant line of political thought and one that the Republicans had themselves been leaning to coming around to. Trump's campaign did prove that the anti-immigration position was much more powerful and effective than the political mainstream had given it credit for. | ||
|
JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
| ||
|
plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
| ||
|
Mohdoo
United States15643 Posts
On April 12 2022 04:57 plasmidghost wrote: With the midterms happening in seven months, what can Biden do to improve seriously lagging poll numbers and enthusiasm? More importantly, what will he be likely to do? 1) Targeted tax on all billionaires 2) Substantial student loan reform 3) Don't touch abortion with a 10 ft pole 4) Don't touch immigration with a 10 ft pole 5) Executive order on something related to drug prices 6) Executive order on something related to child tax credit 7) Executive order on weed 8) Take obvious action in Ukraine such that the Ukraine war wraps up and the US had an obvious, large role in Russia losing 9) Gas prices average down to $3 10) Inflation not a big deal anymore through some mechanism | ||
|
plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
On April 12 2022 05:06 Mohdoo wrote: 1) Targeted tax on all billionaires 2) Substantial student loan reform 3) Don't touch abortion with a 10 ft pole 4) Don't touch immigration with a 10 ft pole 5) Executive order on something related to drug prices 6) Executive order on something related to child tax credit 7) Executive order on weed 8) Take obvious action in Ukraine such that the Ukraine war wraps up and the US had an obvious, large role in Russia losing 9) Gas prices average down to $3 10) Inflation not a big deal anymore through some mechanism I really hope he can get these passed, but I'm still wary | ||
|
LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
| ||
|
Zambrah
United States7288 Posts
On April 12 2022 05:06 Mohdoo wrote: 1) Targeted tax on all billionaires 2) Substantial student loan reform 3) Don't touch abortion with a 10 ft pole 4) Don't touch immigration with a 10 ft pole 5) Executive order on something related to drug prices 6) Executive order on something related to child tax credit 7) Executive order on weed 8) Take obvious action in Ukraine such that the Ukraine war wraps up and the US had an obvious, large role in Russia losing 9) Gas prices average down to $3 10) Inflation not a big deal anymore through some mechanism I see 3, and 4. happening but the rest seems like a pipe dream | ||
|
jafetturbo
2 Posts
| ||
|
GreenHorizons
United States23153 Posts
On April 12 2022 05:34 Zambrah wrote: I see 3, and 4. happening but the rest seems like a pipe dream Same, though I don't think they'll help his poll numbers/enthusiasm much. | ||
|
Doc.Rivers
United States404 Posts
On April 11 2022 17:49 gobbledydook wrote: I don't know why Democrats continue to allow themselves to be vulnerable to attacks on immigration. The system is broken but proposing to ignore the immigration laws just opens you up to being attacked for lawlessness. The dirty secret is that the US needs a cheap underclass of workers to do the dirty work like picking strawberries and delivering takeaway meals but no one is willing to actually advocate for having a legal scheme for those workers. Like inflation and gas prices, immigration is a major problem for Biden right now, given that we are likely seeing record numbers of people illegally crossing the southern border. Unlike inflation and gas prices, the immigration problem is actually Biden's fault. I think the volume of people crossing the southern border illegally depends in large part on the messaging coming out of the party in power. So for example, when all 10 democratic presidential candidates promise at a debate to provide free Healthcare to all undocumented immigrants, a whole bunch of people are going to be induced to come walk across the border illegally. That's how it works - when Trump was in office, immigration numbers at the southern border were way down. It's not actually a good idea to maximize the number of illegal border crossers. | ||
|
JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
| ||
|
Doc.Rivers
United States404 Posts
On April 12 2022 07:31 JimmiC wrote: Are the crossing the border illegally? Or are they crossing the border legally and then not leaving? I think they are crossing illegally, then if stopped are being let in anyway, and then they're not leaving. | ||
|
JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
| ||
|
Doc.Rivers
United States404 Posts
On April 12 2022 08:11 JimmiC wrote: Unless things have dramaticly changed in the last year, most of illegals are not the one you are thinking of. https://www.npr.org/2019/01/10/683662691/where-does-illegal-immigration-mostly-occur-heres-what-the-data-tell-us The NPR article appears to be advancing the fallacy that if most undocumented people are people who overstayed their visas, it is not a major problem that hundreds of thousands are illegally crossing the border each year. But both of those things can be problems. Btw it is entirely possible that things have dramatically changed since Biden took office (for the reasons I stated). | ||
|
Mohdoo
United States15643 Posts
On April 12 2022 07:26 Doc.Rivers wrote: Like inflation and gas prices, immigration is a major problem for Biden right now, given that we are likely seeing record numbers of people illegally crossing the southern border. Unlike inflation and gas prices, the immigration problem is actually Biden's fault. I think the volume of people crossing the southern border illegally depends in large part on the messaging coming out of the party in power. So for example, when all 10 democratic presidential candidates promise at a debate to provide free Healthcare to all undocumented immigrants, a whole bunch of people are going to be induced to come walk across the border illegally. That's how it works - when Trump was in office, immigration numbers at the southern border were way down. It's not actually a good idea to maximize the number of illegal border crossers. Yeah I forget the exact numbers but I remember illegal immigration plummeted under Trump because people were like "no but really, it seems like a terrible idea. This dude is nuts." For me, it isn't clear what sort of impact illegal immigration has on the country. From a purely labor-centered perspective, more people willing to work for less money should be bad for manual labor workers. For a long time, I read articles about farmers unable to find workers and that illegals were the only ones willing to work. Then the great resignation happened and people proved the problem wasn't "unwilling to work", it was "fuck you, that's a terrible wage, I'm not doing that job for $8/hour". I would work at McDonald's for $100/hour. Many people with college degrees would work there for $40/hour. When people said "fuck off, pay me more" these companies paid significantly more and they could have paid significantly more the whole time. I gotta admit that the recent labor situation has made me scratch my chin regarding immigration for the reasons listed above. We know globalism has been a train wreck for the American lower class. I don't think anyone here would argue against that. The question is whether illegal immigration (which we have recently seen is used to allow employers to pay less when they have every ability to pay more) is directly harming the lower class. If illegal immigration allows a farmer to pay $10 rather than $20, it is anti-labor. For a long time, I saw illegal immigrants as people willing to do work Americans wouldn't. Now I realize that isn't the case. Right now illegal immigration feels like just another method of globalization. Where am I wrong? | ||
KwarK
United States42518 Posts
His wife voted Trump and Trump promptly had him deported as an illegal. This is what the easy on immigrants liberal policy looks like and the hardline conservative policy. Conservatives typically agree with examples of liberal policy in action but imagine the common sense approach to be the conservative one. | ||
| ||
