Damn, who that boy?

Seriously though, great analysis.

It's curious becuase Protoss always had air superiority ever since the corsair came out. Took a while for the pros to find the best way to seize it and use it though.

Now, Zerg is prey. More than anything else, it's the change in attitude amongst protosses as they go into that matchup.

Credit to Bisu.

Luddite

United States2315 Posts

October 17 2007 02:13 GMT

#22

Man us poor zergs get no love...

Savior fighting!

Myrmidon

United States9452 Posts

October 17 2007 02:16 GMT

#23

There are many great insights here. I loved the articulation of threat.

Danka

Peru1018 Posts

October 17 2007 02:55 GMT

#24

On October 17 2007 07:35 Last Romantic wrote:
Minor issue - "Only a zerg" was from a HwaSin interview regarding ipxzerg, IIRC.
...

Actually I think Bluz meant the "Revolutionary Magic" Final Edit article by Hot_Bid.

Edit: btw Bluz, a very good read, you explain the corsair phenomenon very clearly and well organized, I loved it.

uppTagg

Sweden473 Posts

October 17 2007 03:18 GMT

#25

I was so tired and was just about to hit bed (school pretty early tomorrow and it's like 5:30am here atm >< ) but I soon found myself at the end of your article anyway ^^ Great read! now off to bed -.-

IntoTheWow

is awesome32274 Posts

October 17 2007 03:47 GMT

#26

I was thinking about this other while watching PJ reps vs SaviOr. PJ lost all his sairs and later in the gae he re-built his force. I switched to Z view only. SaviOr was playing almost blind at one moment. The need tons of multitasking, but basically:

Overlords are free scouting for any good Z. P has to play blind.

By building sairs you turn the table, kill his overlords, get free scouting and suddenly is the other race playing in the dark.

MoNKeYSpanKeR

United States2869 Posts

October 17 2007 04:37 GMT

#27

Holy shit, amazing read bluzman, really worthy of it's locatin ont he website.

IaniAniaN

Canada555 Posts

October 17 2007 06:08 GMT

#28

I wonder if there's going to be another paragdim shift for zerg players, they don't exactly have anything mobile enough to counter the corsair threat at that stage in the game. Maybe a change in thinking is due, similar to how bisu countered the fast lair build by savior simply by going stargate so quickly. Nal_ra went two stargates (after citadel I believe), the perfect counter to mutas and he still got over run by them. What can zerg come up with?

I felt so bad watching the Superfight match between Savior and Bisu, because it felt like Savior was doing so well, had it in the bag, then suddenly with tiny amounts of bad luck (like an overlord a few boxes off missing a dt) it slipped away from him. Seems like Bisu can make his own luck.

Seraphim

United States4467 Posts

October 17 2007 06:21 GMT

#29

Just a note I wanted to add:

To be perfectly fair, PvZ was imbalanced back then. The advantage that Zerg had was so enormous, that some degree of imbalance was there. The matchup itself wasn't imbalanced, but the way it was played definitely was. Corsairs were incredibly neglected which made Protoss work very hard to churn out few PvZ victories. Although, yes, there was a lot of whining back then on PvZ imba, it had some degree of merit.

I congratulate you again, NyRe, for writing this awesome piece. It's definitely a piece of work and I hope you write more in the future :D

HonestTea

5007 Posts

October 17 2007 06:40 GMT

#30

I read it again, because it's that good.

Nyre is so good at describing past trends, and pointing out just how exactly the paradigm shifted.

It's the kind of article I always love to read and always wished I could write myself, but couldn't. High praise.

And that point about threat was something that I think a lot of high-level players have on their minds, but has never been articulated quite like Nyre just did.

Brutalisk

794 Posts

October 17 2007 10:00 GMT

#31

I don't think that there's many answers for Z... if P FEs and goes corsairs, you are pretty much forced to do double expansion and go hydras. You might go muta/scourge with armor upgrade but you need godlike micro for it and still must get some hydras as backup. And you pretty much can't attack his probes because cannon+sair > muta. So their use is limited.

I think that some form of hydra pressure is a good answer, because then you're not playing the P's games, instead you try to kill him while he only has a few cannons, zeals and sairs. While he's still in the process of getting a real army. Savior did so vs. Stork recently. He also did a triple expansion, maybe it's worth it.

Highways

Australia6103 Posts

October 17 2007 10:02 GMT

#32

Nice Read.

Nal_rA vs Gorush @ Requiem in the kt-ktf league was the first televised reaver/sair game (i think).

http://teamliquid.net/tlpd/games/202_GoRush_vs_Nal_rA

Daigomi

South Africa4316 Posts

October 17 2007 11:05 GMT

#33

I always find it amazing at just the depth of knowledge to be found at tl.net . Great article!

alffla

Hong Kong20321 Posts

October 17 2007 12:11 GMT

#34

GREAT WRITE!!

i also dont really know about azalea and arcadia being the forerunner maps to influence protosses to play Sair/Reaver though, what about Forte/ Neo Forte?? i loved that map.

and, yeah, fuck i hate zvp now

FUCK U BISU!!

BluzMan

Russian Federation4235 Posts

October 17 2007 13:33 GMT

#35

Thank you everyone, I did never expect this to make it to FE in the first place ^^

Fixed a few typos I was able to find and added a pic, btw.

Plovez

Russian Federation83 Posts

October 17 2007 15:11 GMT

#36

that was really interesting to read

Thank you.

zer0das

United States8519 Posts

October 17 2007 15:16 GMT

#37

Nice pic.

gravity

Australia1847 Posts

October 17 2007 15:53 GMT

#38

Great article, nice to have everything about the PvZ Corsair revolution put together so well.

strongwind

United States862 Posts

October 17 2007 16:14 GMT

#39

I absolutely love how Bisu did more than just win games. He totally changed how zerg players think. You could definitely see it in the Bisu vs. GGPlay match, where GGPlay always seemed to be one step behind. I guess the maphack upgrade was worth it ^^

and I also love the timing of it all...in a grand finals with the scariest zerg ever. Too awesome!