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Personal attacks in this thread will draw a temp ban. |
On June 04 2012 20:55 Crake_ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2012 15:40 Incze wrote:Yeah, but even if he switched back now, he would have to practice the muta build all over again, which should be easier than this anyway, since he loves that build and hates the infestor one. I really don't know, but I have to say, nothing was more epic than when an actual swarm of mutas, blings and lings rushed for the enemy tank like and obliterated everything. That was an actual zerg swarm, when I saw that I really thought that it was a zerg masterpiece, the true zerg now a slow-moving, immobile force, a deathball if you wish. I'm trying to find that vid of 5 best engagements or something like that, really early in sc2, in which he got twice, I think, both with ling bling muta. That was fucking awesome Edit: Whole, please tell me you hired this guy to make the plushie for Greg http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=342117 Totally remember this, Bel'Shir beach? Idra's engineered some of the most awesome zerg moments. I was basically sexually aroused by his nydus play against puma at IEM China. I know I suck at the game, but I wonder if zergs could use nydus + 3base spine turtling to defeat protoss 2-base all-ins? Could stall out push at zerg third by baiting FFs long enough to send some roaches to hit protoss expand, then nydus them back to hold zerg expand? I love it when zergs place the nydus far enough away that it doesn't get insta-killed while spawning. PS my dream is to get idra to call me an idiot!!!
The problem is that Protoss 2 base all ins are hardly all in enough to justify spine/nydus. Protoss can simply see the spines, go home, resume probe production, tech and upgrades and take a third. Zerg, having invested into useless spines/nydus cannot punish this in the slightest, even though the Protoss cut economy and tech to get out units earlier.
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On June 04 2012 21:41 Micket wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2012 20:55 Crake_ wrote:On June 04 2012 15:40 Incze wrote:Yeah, but even if he switched back now, he would have to practice the muta build all over again, which should be easier than this anyway, since he loves that build and hates the infestor one. I really don't know, but I have to say, nothing was more epic than when an actual swarm of mutas, blings and lings rushed for the enemy tank like and obliterated everything. That was an actual zerg swarm, when I saw that I really thought that it was a zerg masterpiece, the true zerg now a slow-moving, immobile force, a deathball if you wish. I'm trying to find that vid of 5 best engagements or something like that, really early in sc2, in which he got twice, I think, both with ling bling muta. That was fucking awesome Edit: Whole, please tell me you hired this guy to make the plushie for Greg http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=342117 Totally remember this, Bel'Shir beach? Idra's engineered some of the most awesome zerg moments. I was basically sexually aroused by his nydus play against puma at IEM China. I know I suck at the game, but I wonder if zergs could use nydus + 3base spine turtling to defeat protoss 2-base all-ins? Could stall out push at zerg third by baiting FFs long enough to send some roaches to hit protoss expand, then nydus them back to hold zerg expand? I love it when zergs place the nydus far enough away that it doesn't get insta-killed while spawning. PS my dream is to get idra to call me an idiot!!! The problem is that Protoss 2 base all ins are hardly all in enough to justify spine/nydus. Protoss can simply see the spines, go home, resume probe production, tech and upgrades and take a third. Zerg, having invested into useless spines/nydus cannot punish this in the slightest, even though the Protoss cut economy and tech to get out units earlier.
2 base mass spine muta
my favourite zvp build
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IDra didnt have a really good zvz win rate because his micro was "bad"..... Go back and watch some of his zvzs, in fact I think his micro was pretty descent. I don't like to claim why people under preform, his micro is very good, but I don't think he always plays consistently at a high level with his micro.
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On June 04 2012 20:58 Whole wrote:
There is a 2 base Nydus all-in with Hydras that Zerg can do, but IDK if you can manage 3 bases, Nydus, and hold off an all-in. Nydus costs 200 gas to make, and 100 gas to make the exit I think. Considering how strong protoss 2-base all-ins are atm, you really need that gas.
So the idea isn't to do it with hydras, but roaches. Take Daybreak: do a mineral-focused three-base response to a protoss FE. Use minerals for queen/spine, with gas for roaches/speed/nydus. When protoss pushes out to either one of the chokes, feint with a group of roaches just enough to force FFs (to slow down the protoss push). At the same time, use nydus to hit protoss expand, at minimum forcing a warp-in at the expand. Then you can nydus back home and clean up the (much less strong b/c of defensive warp-in) toss push.
The problem with muta harass is that (1) it's super gas-intensive, so you can't mine as many minerals, (2) mutas die in a direct confrontation.
Like I said, I don't really know, and obviously this is not a strategy thread. But Idra's offensive multitasking is so good that maybe he could pull it off, especially with the new queens.
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On June 04 2012 21:41 Micket wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2012 20:55 Crake_ wrote:On June 04 2012 15:40 Incze wrote:Yeah, but even if he switched back now, he would have to practice the muta build all over again, which should be easier than this anyway, since he loves that build and hates the infestor one. I really don't know, but I have to say, nothing was more epic than when an actual swarm of mutas, blings and lings rushed for the enemy tank like and obliterated everything. That was an actual zerg swarm, when I saw that I really thought that it was a zerg masterpiece, the true zerg now a slow-moving, immobile force, a deathball if you wish. I'm trying to find that vid of 5 best engagements or something like that, really early in sc2, in which he got twice, I think, both with ling bling muta. That was fucking awesome Edit: Whole, please tell me you hired this guy to make the plushie for Greg http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=342117 Totally remember this, Bel'Shir beach? Idra's engineered some of the most awesome zerg moments. I was basically sexually aroused by his nydus play against puma at IEM China. I know I suck at the game, but I wonder if zergs could use nydus + 3base spine turtling to defeat protoss 2-base all-ins? Could stall out push at zerg third by baiting FFs long enough to send some roaches to hit protoss expand, then nydus them back to hold zerg expand? I love it when zergs place the nydus far enough away that it doesn't get insta-killed while spawning. PS my dream is to get idra to call me an idiot!!! The problem is that Protoss 2 base all ins are hardly all in enough to justify spine/nydus. Protoss can simply see the spines, go home, resume probe production, tech and upgrades and take a third. Zerg, having invested into useless spines/nydus cannot punish this in the slightest, even though the Protoss cut economy and tech to get out units earlier.
If they go take a third, can't zerg just go take a fourth and tech to hive?
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On June 05 2012 00:07 Crake_ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2012 21:41 Micket wrote:On June 04 2012 20:55 Crake_ wrote:On June 04 2012 15:40 Incze wrote:Yeah, but even if he switched back now, he would have to practice the muta build all over again, which should be easier than this anyway, since he loves that build and hates the infestor one. I really don't know, but I have to say, nothing was more epic than when an actual swarm of mutas, blings and lings rushed for the enemy tank like and obliterated everything. That was an actual zerg swarm, when I saw that I really thought that it was a zerg masterpiece, the true zerg now a slow-moving, immobile force, a deathball if you wish. I'm trying to find that vid of 5 best engagements or something like that, really early in sc2, in which he got twice, I think, both with ling bling muta. That was fucking awesome Edit: Whole, please tell me you hired this guy to make the plushie for Greg http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=342117 Totally remember this, Bel'Shir beach? Idra's engineered some of the most awesome zerg moments. I was basically sexually aroused by his nydus play against puma at IEM China. I know I suck at the game, but I wonder if zergs could use nydus + 3base spine turtling to defeat protoss 2-base all-ins? Could stall out push at zerg third by baiting FFs long enough to send some roaches to hit protoss expand, then nydus them back to hold zerg expand? I love it when zergs place the nydus far enough away that it doesn't get insta-killed while spawning. PS my dream is to get idra to call me an idiot!!! The problem is that Protoss 2 base all ins are hardly all in enough to justify spine/nydus. Protoss can simply see the spines, go home, resume probe production, tech and upgrades and take a third. Zerg, having invested into useless spines/nydus cannot punish this in the slightest, even though the Protoss cut economy and tech to get out units earlier. If they go take a third, can't zerg just go take a fourth and tech to hive?
They still have units to pressure you & deny the fourth, and you still lost drones on the spines.
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Just swung by to let you know that IdrA's still #1 EU, US, CA, KR etc.
Have a nice day everybody
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On June 04 2012 21:46 Wampaibist wrote:
IDra didnt have a really good zvz win rate because his micro was "bad"..... Go back and watch some of his zvzs, in fact I think his micro was pretty descent. I don't like to claim why people under preform, his micro is very good, but I don't think he always plays consistently at a high level with his micro.
His specific unit control is really good, for example his ling/bling ZvZ early game and his muta control- absolutely top notch
But his general army management is complete shit sometimes. That's where he gets caught out of position with broodlord infestor, that's where he mis engages against terran, and stuff like that
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Yea, when IdrA really focuses on micro, it's actually stunning. It's top notch, and so unexpected.
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On June 05 2012 02:32 Aocowns wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2012 21:46 Wampaibist wrote:
IDra didnt have a really good zvz win rate because his micro was "bad"..... Go back and watch some of his zvzs, in fact I think his micro was pretty descent. I don't like to claim why people under preform, his micro is very good, but I don't think he always plays consistently at a high level with his micro. His specific unit control is really good, for example his ling/bling ZvZ early game and his muta control- absolutely top notch But his general army management is complete shit sometimes. That's where he gets caught out of position with broodlord infestor, that's where he mis engages against terran, and stuff like that
I think this assessment is spot on. In the small skirmishes that take place in the early / early -mid game his micro clearly is very good; his ling - bling micro is not bad at all and I've seen him micro very well against early Terran harass. Where he seems to falter is generally when he has infestors in the mix. He frequently seems to be in a bad position and to misjudge what he needs to defeat his opponents' army. That said, I've seen some games, against Terran, where his late game army control was spot on. Also, microing zerg late game armies is pretty hard, which is why very, very few pros do it well and if you make a mistake you usually just lose. (See the Stephano - Bomber game 5 from this weekend for an example of how quickly everything can fall apart.)
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are the games vs ret worth watching?
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On June 05 2012 04:14 Fortii wrote:
are the games vs ret worth watching?
Meh.. the first one was pretty stupid, IdrA was just too greedy.
In the second one Ret did a lot of pressure with roaches, but because of the better economy IdrA could hold off and punished him then.
Dunno about the third game though
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Greg Fields @idrajit
on SOTG tonight at 5pm PST/8pm EST
IDRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA IDRAAAAAAAAAAAAA ON STATE OG THE GAAAAAAAAAAMEEEE!!!!!!!!!
FUCK YES!
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since seeing idra nowadays is kinda rare i will defenitely turn in 
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man intro preshow was hilarious.
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Gosh, IdrA's laughing! But it doesn't sound good lol.
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Thanks for doing State of the Game IdrA; I always enjoy how you know just when to comment.
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IDRA time to watch (like i wasnt anyways -_-)
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Okay, IdrA won't get the gift before Anahiem, but aside from that, everything is in place!
edit: For those who thought I already sent the package...I did, but we had $350 left to spend 
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EPT
