EPTWith all that in mind and possibly more via news from other corners of Westeros, I don't think Jon's resurrection is all that out of grasp for most northerners contemplating the meaning of the Watch's vows.
[TV] HBO Game of Thrones - Page 1600
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farvacola
United States18866 Posts
With all that in mind and possibly more via news from other corners of Westeros, I don't think Jon's resurrection is all that out of grasp for most northerners contemplating the meaning of the Watch's vows. | ||
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Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On May 29 2017 20:57 opisska wrote: It may be TV shortcut issue, in the books there are supposedly more exdead walking around, no? So people are probably more used to it than we think. Off the top of my head, I can only remeber + Show Spoiler + Catelyn  , the red priest who rezzes the bandit leader guy and possibly (we don't know this in either the book or show) the Mountain, who may not have actually died so it might not count. The red priest guy may have rumors of his rezzing power going around, but I don't know if they would be taken seriously. Maybe rumors of + Show Spoiler +Catelyn | ||
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Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On May 29 2017 20:59 farvacola wrote: I mean, look at this way. You're a villager in some northern hold or village and you keep hearing that an army of dead is rumored to be assembling north of the wall. You keep the old gods and know that magic was once far more plentiful. Further, you likely know at least one survivor or tale of what happened at the battle of the bastards and word of a giant fighting for Jon Snow has now spread. With all that in mind and possibly more via news from other corners of Westeros, I don't think Jon's resurrection is all that out of grasp for most northerners contemplating the meaning of the Watch's vows. I guess we'll agree to disagree, to me the world is way more medieval than fantasy. I suppose I would be happy if they had made Jon into some religious leader or formed a cult around him, but w/e. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On May 29 2017 16:58 opisska wrote: Jon did desert nothing. His watch has ended, he clearly declared that and the wows are clearly worded for this exact thing to work, I don't think there will be any confusion about it. I hate this logic, nobody words a vow a way so you can come back from the dead and be free | ||
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opisska
Poland8852 Posts
On May 29 2017 21:57 The_Red_Viper wrote: I hate this logic, nobody words a vow a way so you can come back from the dead and be free It appeaars to me that GRRM did exactly that, so your statement is disproven  | ||
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opisska
Poland8852 Posts
is one of the greatest TV moments I have ever seen. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On May 29 2017 22:01 opisska wrote: It appeaars to me that GRRM did exactly that, so your statement is disproven Well that would mean he knew 100% how he wants to develop jons arc from the very beginning. That could be the case, but not necessarily In universe nobody would word it that way though, it basically means: "until you cannot serve us anymore" | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18387 Posts
On May 29 2017 21:15 Sbrubbles wrote: Off the top of my head, I can only remeber + Show Spoiler + Catelyn , the red priest who rezzes the bandit leader guy and possibly (we don't know this in either the book or show) the Mountain, who may not have actually died so it might not count. The red priest guy may have rumors of his rezzing power going around, but I don't know if they would be taken seriously. Maybe rumors of + Show Spoiler +Catelyn Well, there's also all the wights. And while even to northerners those were nonsense legends at the beginning of the story, the night's watch has been trying to bring attention to them since they realized that they are very real. Hence why Alliser Thorne was sent to King's Landing with a wriggling wight's hand, and stuff like that. Between that and news of the Massacre of Hardhome spreading (although most probably still dismiss that as gossip), it's possible people are starting to come around to the idea that weird shit is happening. The main guy who keeps being revived is of course Beric Dondarrion, but nobody really knows about that. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18387 Posts
On May 29 2017 21:57 The_Red_Viper wrote: I hate this logic, nobody words a vow a way so you can come back from the dead and be free Technically, it's how the marriage vow is worded too. Until death do us part. It just wasn't contemplated that death is not necessarily final. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On May 29 2017 23:00 Acrofales wrote: Technically, it's how the marriage vow is worded too. Until death do us part. It just wasn't contemplated that death is not necessarily final. Sure but that's the point isn't it. It basically means "as long as you can". Going full lawyer on the phrasing seems absurd to me. With that being said, it wasn't really a topic in the show so who cares. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On May 29 2017 23:21 Plansix wrote: Remember that all vows, promises and obligations are based on the world power structure remaining intact. John's vow was based on the concept that the Wall would receive support from the 7 Kingdoms in its times of need. They have barely gotten that and shit is only getting worse. Once the undead stated marching at the wall and his brothers killed him, only to have him come back, all bets were off. Sure that's the explanation behind the motivation. Everybody can understand this. But just talking about if he is a deserter or not i think it is weird to be that specific with the phrasing when it's not worded to be very specific. He is a deserter in my eyes, 100% | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On May 29 2017 23:24 The_Red_Viper wrote: Sure that's the explanation behind the motivation. Everybody can understand this. But just talking about if he is a deserter or not i think it is weird to be that specific with the phrasing when it's not worded to be very specific. He is a deserter in my eyes, 100% When the leadership promotes you to be the Master of the watch, then murders you because of your decision making, I'm not sure you are required to stay on. More importantly, I don't think the Watch is going to enforce that rule. I think it will be interesting if it is brought up by other political groups that think John isn't the legitimate king because he left it watch. That is the exact type of political reasoning I would expect from the show. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On May 29 2017 23:29 Plansix wrote: When the leadership promotes you to be the Master of the watch, then murders you because of your decision making, I'm not sure you are required to stay on. More importantly, I don't think the Watch is going to enforce that rule. I think it will be interesting if it is brought up by other political groups that think John isn't the legitimate king because he left it watch. That is the exact type of political reasoning I would expect from the show. I mean he could (and did) hang the people who were behind that. At that point it's surely motivation to be frustrated with the situation (and more, coming back from the dead is kinda huge; wasted potential in the show imo) but he still could have done his duty he swore to do. It's not that i don't understand his motivation, but i still think he basically deserted even if it's with good reasons. And yeah i would expected it to be a topic as well, it wasn't though iirc. | ||
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opisska
Poland8852 Posts
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On May 29 2017 23:37 opisska wrote: If you put enough red priests as medics into your army, does it become unbeatable without splash damage, for example dragons? Hard to say, i think it's not as consistent as medics though  | ||
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opisska
Poland8852 Posts
On May 29 2017 23:40 The_Red_Viper wrote: Hard to say, i think it's not as consistent as medics though But they restore the whole hp at once and we don't even know if the energy is limited. I would definitely love Jon to die at least once more. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On May 29 2017 23:48 opisska wrote: But they restore the whole hp at once and we don't even know if the energy is limited. I would definitely love Jon to die at least once more. We don't really know much about it, but i think it's not really a common thing :D | ||
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goody153
44282 Posts
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On May 30 2017 00:31 goody153 wrote: Is season 7 likely the last season ? Or possibly just a preparation for the next next season (which is resolving the white walker bigger threat shit) No it's 8 seasons in total. 13 episodes still to come from now on. | ||
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