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Simple Questions, Simple Answers - Page 783

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LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
February 17 2014 05:43 GMT
#15641
On February 17 2014 13:32 idonthinksobro wrote:
I was testing some stuff and i know that people hate cliff prophet for various reasons, but i tested 2 or 3 times in bot games and you end up with a 6-7 minute midas, a medium 4-5 stack and a big 4-5 stack. There is no doubt in my mind that it is more efficient than getting basilus and 2 clarities and jungling with treants.
Why are people always claiming it is less efficient?
And why do people that will stay in the jungle regardless what happens in the game for 10 minutes anyways not simply cliff jungle the first couple of minutes and stacking camps at the same time?

It's still slower than normal jungling, and I'm sure you could stack the camps if you really wanted to with normal jungling. Have to tested out getting gloves of haste and two clariries first with normal jungling with treants?
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
idonthinksobro
Profile Joined December 2010
3138 Posts
February 17 2014 05:59 GMT
#15642
On February 17 2014 14:43 LSB wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 17 2014 13:32 idonthinksobro wrote:
I was testing some stuff and i know that people hate cliff prophet for various reasons, but i tested 2 or 3 times in bot games and you end up with a 6-7 minute midas, a medium 4-5 stack and a big 4-5 stack. There is no doubt in my mind that it is more efficient than getting basilus and 2 clarities and jungling with treants.
Why are people always claiming it is less efficient?
And why do people that will stay in the jungle regardless what happens in the game for 10 minutes anyways not simply cliff jungle the first couple of minutes and stacking camps at the same time?

It's still slower than normal jungling, and I'm sure you could stack the camps if you really wanted to with normal jungling. Have to tested out getting gloves of haste and two clariries first with normal jungling with treants?


I usually only random so i get extra 200 gold, if i get prophet and have to jungle because someone insists on a solo offlane i usually get a soulring and will never be out of mana. Otherwise i will lane him in any lane that is available.
I'm pretty sure that you get out of mana if you only use claritys and you will have to tank creep hits to make sure you can clear camps fast enough, taking hits without regen is really dangerous. Because you use the treants to clear camps you can't really use them to stack as efficient and the problem is it is hard to clear stacks so early without lvl 4 treants or some damage on prophet.
Tobberoth
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden6375 Posts
February 17 2014 10:12 GMT
#15643
On February 17 2014 14:59 idonthinksobro wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 17 2014 14:43 LSB wrote:
On February 17 2014 13:32 idonthinksobro wrote:
I was testing some stuff and i know that people hate cliff prophet for various reasons, but i tested 2 or 3 times in bot games and you end up with a 6-7 minute midas, a medium 4-5 stack and a big 4-5 stack. There is no doubt in my mind that it is more efficient than getting basilus and 2 clarities and jungling with treants.
Why are people always claiming it is less efficient?
And why do people that will stay in the jungle regardless what happens in the game for 10 minutes anyways not simply cliff jungle the first couple of minutes and stacking camps at the same time?

It's still slower than normal jungling, and I'm sure you could stack the camps if you really wanted to with normal jungling. Have to tested out getting gloves of haste and two clariries first with normal jungling with treants?


I usually only random so i get extra 200 gold, if i get prophet and have to jungle because someone insists on a solo offlane i usually get a soulring and will never be out of mana. Otherwise i will lane him in any lane that is available.
I'm pretty sure that you get out of mana if you only use claritys and you will have to tank creep hits to make sure you can clear camps fast enough, taking hits without regen is really dangerous. Because you use the treants to clear camps you can't really use them to stack as efficient and the problem is it is hard to clear stacks so early without lvl 4 treants or some damage on prophet.

You can easily get 3 clarities which is more than enough though, you just have to wait a few seconds more in base before you leave for the jungle.

Personally though, I prefer getting phase boots before midas, your ability to gank is so much better, and you can start impacting the game earlier.
zezamer
Profile Joined March 2011
Finland5701 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-17 12:02:14
February 17 2014 12:00 GMT
#15644
phase lvl 4 go gang, kill towers, turn tower gold into midas
Lavitage2
Profile Joined June 2012
198 Posts
February 17 2014 16:40 GMT
#15645
if you're playing a lane babysitter, in what situation should rune camping be your priority?
DV G
Profile Joined September 2012
Argentina2339 Posts
February 17 2014 17:00 GMT
#15646
On February 18 2014 01:40 Lavitage2 wrote:
if you're playing a lane babysitter, in what situation should rune camping be your priority?


When you:
-Already determined that the carry is safe from the offlaner
-There's no way Offlaner cna kill the carry given the circumstances (obv feeding doesnt count)
-When your mid hero needs the rune badly
-When the rune is gonna give a significant advantage to your mid hero
-When you are gonna go and smoke gank after checking rune.
Go pro or die trying
idonthinksobro
Profile Joined December 2010
3138 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-17 17:16:21
February 17 2014 17:16 GMT
#15647
when the enemy mid is a strong ganker and will turn a good rune into a kill.
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia8947 Posts
February 17 2014 17:19 GMT
#15648
there is only one situation you need to fulfill
the carry wont die if you leave lane for 30seconds.
if above criteria is not fulfilled, dont check. if it is, check all the time. even if your mid or their mid arent good rune carriers, if you can get a good rune you can make shit happen.
Laurens
Profile Joined September 2010
Belgium4558 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-17 20:28:53
February 17 2014 20:26 GMT
#15649
Tips for 1v3 offlane nature's prophet? I can find several jungle guides but offlane is a bit trickier.

I saw the iceiceice vid, he starts with basi + clarities, blocks the easy camp for like 3-4 mins and then goes to jungle.
I guess the idea is that you starve the enemy supports of XP for a while, or force them to take from the carry. What would be the sign to go to the jungle, when you first run out of mana and tp back to base?

Rush midas or phase boots first?

Any other vital information?
KOFgokuon
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States14912 Posts
February 17 2014 20:36 GMT
#15650
Depends how risky you want to be. You can go boots first and try to leech some XP while blocking their pulls with your treants, kinda depends on who you're laning against though. When you run out of mana, that's a good time to go back to the fountain and start doing something.
zezamer
Profile Joined March 2011
Finland5701 Posts
February 17 2014 22:05 GMT
#15651
start with boots tango clarity

build straight into phase
Erasme
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Bahamas15899 Posts
February 17 2014 22:37 GMT
#15652
pull the wave to you and block the camp with trees
phase boots first is probably better
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7lxwFEB6FI “‘Drain the swamp’? Stupid saying, means nothing, but you guys loved it so I kept saying it.”
Archeon
Profile Joined May 2011
3275 Posts
February 17 2014 22:50 GMT
#15653
so after reading phase boots on np for the third time on one page i am a bit astonished. Why phase>treads on NP?
Isnt NP mainly a split-pusher? I get that the global thing is big, but it's only big if you have equal or advantageous lanes anyways, that dont totally crush their opposition. Phase is gonna give you maybe an auto-attack more during early engagements, which can make the difference between kill or not, but only like in every 10th engagement.

Or is it because of the meta that works better for gankers than split-pushes?
low gravity, yes-yes!
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
February 17 2014 22:59 GMT
#15654
Phase Boots is largely a choice for laning NP because it has a larger impact on winning lanes than Treads does.

On jungle NP, Treads are fine, though it's game dependent.
Moderator
iv~nk~j
Profile Joined August 2012
1140 Posts
February 18 2014 02:37 GMT
#15655
phase boots are often better if you actually offlane/mid furion instead of just going to jungle straight from start since +dmg is stronger for contesting last hits than attack speed

also the active can often be the difference between that ganking support getting in range to land a stun on you or not
SigmaoctanusIV
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States3313 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-18 04:53:48
February 18 2014 04:46 GMT
#15656
When I watch streams seems like all the pros always use Midas on the big creep in the camp, Wouldn't you make more money to midas a little creep and kill the big one, I know it saves time clearing the camp, though the gold difference can be pretty big if it's the centaur/satyr.


EDIT: Thanks KOF!! Didn't really think of that aspect. I am still super Chobo at Dota never played in on WC3 and only have 120 games on Dota2 still learning so much.
I am Godzilla You are Japan
KOFgokuon
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States14912 Posts
February 18 2014 04:49 GMT
#15657
You midas the big creep because you get 2.5x experience, and levels are more important early on than a little extra gold. Once you reach 16 you midas the smallest creep to maximize gold
ilbh
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Brazil1606 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-18 06:25:35
February 18 2014 05:41 GMT
#15658
does Linken's Sphere protect from items like Scythe and Orchid or just skills(abilities)?

edit: thanks!
Part of the inhumanity of the computer is that, once it is competently programmed and working smoothly, it is completely honest.
Orome
Profile Blog Joined June 2004
Switzerland11984 Posts
February 18 2014 05:50 GMT
#15659
it does
On a purely personal note, I'd like to show Yellow the beauty of infinitely repeating Starcraft 2 bunkers. -Boxer
Tobberoth
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden6375 Posts
February 18 2014 07:50 GMT
#15660
On February 18 2014 07:50 Blackfeather wrote:
so after reading phase boots on np for the third time on one page i am a bit astonished. Why phase>treads on NP?
Isnt NP mainly a split-pusher? I get that the global thing is big, but it's only big if you have equal or advantageous lanes anyways, that dont totally crush their opposition. Phase is gonna give you maybe an auto-attack more during early engagements, which can make the difference between kill or not, but only like in every 10th engagement.

Or is it because of the meta that works better for gankers than split-pushes?

Phase might only give you an extra autoattack in a chasing scenario. The point with them, however, is that they give you far better right-click damage early, which makes your ganks much more deadly. Now obviously, threads is a better late-game option, so if you're going to AFK jungle, that's great. If you're planning to start ganking immediately at lvl 4 or so, phase is great, it takes you from doing almost nothing to pounding really hard. You don't even need to use the phase active, you'll kill the target before the sprout disappears (assuming they are too bad to tango it, obviously).

Threads is slighty better for split-pushing, but it's not really a big deal. When you're pounding towers with lvl 4 treants and lvl 3 necrobook, your choice in boots makes a pretty miniscule difference. At least in my opinion, the extra kills you can get from ganks and the extra pressure you exert on your opponents, is worth more than what the threads give you in a splitpushing scenario.
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