|
On June 27 2015 12:26 Targe wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:25 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:23 Fencar wrote:On June 27 2015 12:22 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:18 Fencar wrote:On June 27 2015 12:14 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:02 Fencar wrote:Thanks guys, I'm going to make an investment in a large water bottle. Any brand/type/etc you guys recommend? I am not well versed in the ways of water bottles.  Tbh I'm still not sure what to do with my time tonight from now-6:00 AM when I'll probably go make myself 'breakfast.' My options are: -Search for a couple of books to read. -Play video games. -Shitpost. -Read My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic fanfiction by ShortSkirtsandExplosions. -Watch anime. -Listen to an audiobook/podcast. -Watch youtube. -A combination of the above. klean kanteen which is stainless steel OK I found one is it safe to post the link here? http://www.mec.ca/product/5031-827/klean-kanteen-wide-stainless-steel-bottle-1.18l/you can find this at REI probably if you're in US fencar too fast Yea sorry I ninja'd you by 9 seconds I found it on REI & posted the link above. ya, point is: avoid plastic shit cause even BPA free has other weird shit even aluminum bottles have plastic lining in them yeah i swap out my bottles often enough so i dont die im up to 245 posts a week help im becoming a spammer
You've always been a spammer. You just didn't know it yet.
On June 27 2015 12:25 CorsairHero wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:23 Fencar wrote:On June 27 2015 12:22 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:18 Fencar wrote:On June 27 2015 12:14 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:02 Fencar wrote:Thanks guys, I'm going to make an investment in a large water bottle. Any brand/type/etc you guys recommend? I am not well versed in the ways of water bottles. Tbh I'm still not sure what to do with my time tonight from now-6:00 AM when I'll probably go make myself 'breakfast.' My options are: -Search for a couple of books to read. -Play video games. -Shitpost. -Read My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic fanfiction by ShortSkirtsandExplosions. -Watch anime. -Listen to an audiobook/podcast. -Watch youtube. -A combination of the above. klean kanteen which is stainless steel OK I found one is it safe to post the link here? http://www.mec.ca/product/5031-827/klean-kanteen-wide-stainless-steel-bottle-1.18l/you can find this at REI probably if you're in US fencar too fast Yea sorry I ninja'd you by 9 seconds I found it on REI & posted the link above. ya, point is: avoid plastic shit cause even BPA free has other weird shit even aluminum bottles have plastic lining in them OK, this bottle looks pretty good so I'll most likely just pick it up tomorrow. I assume I should empty this thing into my stomach 3 times a day?
|
its made in china but i haven't found one made in NA so ya
i'd slowly increase and see how your body feels
|
United Kingdom14103 Posts
just consistently drink, id say aim for at least 2 but dont rush to drink
make sure youre not just drinking when youre feeling thirsty though, that means youre probably dehydrated already
can anyonehelp me with a CV question? im putting my results and current courses at uni but i only have half the results, should i just put a predicted grade for the year?
|
On June 27 2015 12:13 Acritter wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:05 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 11:26 eieio wrote:
"everyone has faith if you're sitting in a chair right now you sat down in it with faith that you wouldn't fall" askdjfnalkjsnaelranweljrwer literally someone said this 2 week ago at a meeting I was at LMAo yes i had faith whoever made that chair wasn't completely incompetent you're absolutely right. On June 27 2015 11:41 Acritter wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 27 2015 11:25 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 11:22 Acritter wrote:"also sorry I stole shit from you" ah yes this is a good reason to apologize On June 27 2015 11:21 Targe wrote:
id legitimately feel patronised if someone told me "everything happens according to gods plan" in relation to something bad actually this is the one part of christianity that seems most reasonable to me as an atheist; dostoevsky won me over with his argument if you are interested in reading a minor text wall I'll explain this would bait the shit out of creams doitdoitdoit okay so here we go to start off with, let's get into the mindset of an intellectually rigorous christian. there are other kinds; I'm not interested in them what does this entail? well, first of all, god is the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of all things (the infinitely good bit is actually kind of irrelevant, as it's a conclusion rather than a premise IMO). god is the mechanism from which and (this is important) by which all things happen. in other words, for a consistent, intellectual christian, there isn't a significant distinction between god and the world. you know how you can say that an artist's masterpiece is sort of a part of him/her? this is basically the same way, except that since god is by nature inextricably connected with creation, it's much less of a metaphor. so with this in mind, let's take something like the book of job. job loses everything and is crushed beyond recognition. if we saw this happen to someone IRL, we'd say that it was really awful luck, but another way of putting it is that the world (universe) did it. this doesn't mean that the world is an intelligent actor working for a specific end, just as we don't say that tsunamis constantly have it in for japan. despite this, the world and the tsunamis are still what do these things to individuals. similarly, christians say that it's all according to god's plan or done by god. in our traditional mindset of viewing god as a distinct authority, this seems naturally horrible, and it is in that context. a being with unlimited power causing arbitrary harm is utterly abhorrent. however, the consistent christian views god like most of us view the universe: infinite and ineffable. things happen. now, let's step back: christians do view god as a being as well as existing as the world. it's a misrepresentation to say that it's just a synonym for the world, because that would ignore one of their fundamental understandings of the world (namely, that it is deliberately worked). however, their position of it being acceptable that evil exists as part of god's plan isn't contradictory or even vile. reason being: god is, as mentioned, ineffable and moreover irresistible. you can't get rid of god, you can't ignore god. thus, resenting god's plan is as senseless as resenting the universe for existing in such a way that (say) your father gets cancer. it simply exists. the correct response is to accept god's plan and accept the universe as it is, and despite all that goes wrong, to love god (which in our atheist minds would be the same as loving life and existence). now, obviously this point can't be proven deductively, but there's a fairly reasonable inductive argument to it. if you get angry about everything bad that happens to you, you're going to spend a lot of time angry and unhappy. so: naked we come from the earth, and naked we shall return to it. if any of that didn't make sense or if you see a mistake let me know edit: oh and if you want to read the source material that won me over, read "the brothers karamazov" by fyodor dostoevsky (in particular the parts involving zossima). I don't agree entirely with his conclusions, but I'll be damned if he doesn't know what he's talking about edit2: also most of the christians who say this aren't particularly thorough or consistent philosophers, so what they're actually saying is probably more like "god will make everything okay, just you wait" and yeah that's pretty fucking obnoxious i was following you in the beginning and it even made sense but then u hit me with the 'it deliberately worked' and now i'm confused again. either way, if you view god as a synonym for the world we live in, then everyone's a fucking christian. it's just whether one interprets the world as god or simply as the environment you're thrust into through your mom's vagina. and i'm fine with that interpretation of god. however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me. honestly i believe in fate a tiny bit - eg, the people you meet in your life: sometimes things just don't end up working out no matter how much you try and force it, or sometimes you just bump into someone out of the blue and I tend to simplify things and chalk it up to fate in either of these occasions. "it is deliberately worked" translates to "it is made by a being with purpose and deliberation" sorry, I start using pompous language with things like this, it's a bad habit also, the point of the third big paragraph is reconciling the fact that christians don't understand god simply as a synonym for the world at large with the argument on a whole and also underlining how they can believe in god as being an individual without necessarily being an overpowered megalomaniac the mindset is really fucking complicated for consistent christians, which is why I spent most of my life simply not understanding it although I completely agree with Show nested quote +however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me I remain bothered by the vast majority of christians, although to be fair the same goes for most belief systems some probably have higher proportions of disturbing people, but most humans don't think about things with enough nuance to get beyond the elementary propositions which create a horrifying image of reality
see that's what confuses me, 'with purpose and deliberation'
how are you supposed to live life when some entity, regardless of omnipotence, has your actions all planned out for you
see, if an enemy spirit breaker bashes me 10 times in a row, then I'll say something like "thanks icefrog for the 17%" but this is still a conscious determination on my part that the game decided to rng it 17% 10 times in a row, and not attribute it to some machination of a higher power.
what's the point of hard work and ambition in life if everything's already laid out? I understand that people want to feel secure in their actions and the way they live their life but completely externalizing your experiences and decisions to a foreign entity is just so incomprehensible to me.
|
On June 27 2015 12:31 Targe wrote:
just consistently drink, id say aim for at least 2 but dont rush to drink
make sure youre not just drinking when youre feeling thirsty though, that means youre probably dehydrated already
There's my problem right there. xd
On June 27 2015 12:31 CorsairHero wrote:
its made in china but i haven't found one made in NA so ya
i'd slowly increase and see how your body feels
Okay that makes much more sense than binging on water so I'll go ahead and do that.
|
United Kingdom14103 Posts
On June 27 2015 12:32 Fencar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:31 Targe wrote:
just consistently drink, id say aim for at least 2 but dont rush to drink
make sure youre not just drinking when youre feeling thirsty though, that means youre probably dehydrated already There's my problem right there. xd Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:31 CorsairHero wrote:
its made in china but i haven't found one made in NA so ya
i'd slowly increase and see how your body feels Okay that makes much more sense than binging on water so I'll go ahead and do that.
yeah the idea is that you get into the habit of consistently drinking throughout the day, makes a real difference to concentration regardless of whether youre trying to stay up all ngiht
e: incase this got buried by the posts after my last one: can anyonehelp me with a CV question? im putting my results and current courses at uni but i only have half the results, should i just put a predicted grade for the year?
|
On June 27 2015 12:25 CorsairHero wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:23 Fencar wrote:On June 27 2015 12:22 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:18 Fencar wrote:On June 27 2015 12:14 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:02 Fencar wrote:Thanks guys, I'm going to make an investment in a large water bottle. Any brand/type/etc you guys recommend? I am not well versed in the ways of water bottles. Tbh I'm still not sure what to do with my time tonight from now-6:00 AM when I'll probably go make myself 'breakfast.' My options are: -Search for a couple of books to read. -Play video games. -Shitpost. -Read My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic fanfiction by ShortSkirtsandExplosions. -Watch anime. -Listen to an audiobook/podcast. -Watch youtube. -A combination of the above. klean kanteen which is stainless steel OK I found one is it safe to post the link here? http://www.mec.ca/product/5031-827/klean-kanteen-wide-stainless-steel-bottle-1.18l/you can find this at REI probably if you're in US fencar too fast Yea sorry I ninja'd you by 9 seconds I found it on REI & posted the link above. ya, point is: avoid plastic shit cause even BPA free has other weird shit even aluminum bottles have plastic lining in them
dude just buy one of these things for 2.50 at bevmo and wash&refill endlessly
+ Show Spoiler +
|
On June 27 2015 12:31 andyrau wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:13 Acritter wrote:On June 27 2015 12:05 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 11:26 eieio wrote:
"everyone has faith if you're sitting in a chair right now you sat down in it with faith that you wouldn't fall" askdjfnalkjsnaelranweljrwer literally someone said this 2 week ago at a meeting I was at LMAo yes i had faith whoever made that chair wasn't completely incompetent you're absolutely right. On June 27 2015 11:41 Acritter wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 27 2015 11:25 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 11:22 Acritter wrote:"also sorry I stole shit from you" ah yes this is a good reason to apologize On June 27 2015 11:21 Targe wrote:
id legitimately feel patronised if someone told me "everything happens according to gods plan" in relation to something bad actually this is the one part of christianity that seems most reasonable to me as an atheist; dostoevsky won me over with his argument if you are interested in reading a minor text wall I'll explain this would bait the shit out of creams doitdoitdoit okay so here we go to start off with, let's get into the mindset of an intellectually rigorous christian. there are other kinds; I'm not interested in them what does this entail? well, first of all, god is the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of all things (the infinitely good bit is actually kind of irrelevant, as it's a conclusion rather than a premise IMO). god is the mechanism from which and (this is important) by which all things happen. in other words, for a consistent, intellectual christian, there isn't a significant distinction between god and the world. you know how you can say that an artist's masterpiece is sort of a part of him/her? this is basically the same way, except that since god is by nature inextricably connected with creation, it's much less of a metaphor. so with this in mind, let's take something like the book of job. job loses everything and is crushed beyond recognition. if we saw this happen to someone IRL, we'd say that it was really awful luck, but another way of putting it is that the world (universe) did it. this doesn't mean that the world is an intelligent actor working for a specific end, just as we don't say that tsunamis constantly have it in for japan. despite this, the world and the tsunamis are still what do these things to individuals. similarly, christians say that it's all according to god's plan or done by god. in our traditional mindset of viewing god as a distinct authority, this seems naturally horrible, and it is in that context. a being with unlimited power causing arbitrary harm is utterly abhorrent. however, the consistent christian views god like most of us view the universe: infinite and ineffable. things happen. now, let's step back: christians do view god as a being as well as existing as the world. it's a misrepresentation to say that it's just a synonym for the world, because that would ignore one of their fundamental understandings of the world (namely, that it is deliberately worked). however, their position of it being acceptable that evil exists as part of god's plan isn't contradictory or even vile. reason being: god is, as mentioned, ineffable and moreover irresistible. you can't get rid of god, you can't ignore god. thus, resenting god's plan is as senseless as resenting the universe for existing in such a way that (say) your father gets cancer. it simply exists. the correct response is to accept god's plan and accept the universe as it is, and despite all that goes wrong, to love god (which in our atheist minds would be the same as loving life and existence). now, obviously this point can't be proven deductively, but there's a fairly reasonable inductive argument to it. if you get angry about everything bad that happens to you, you're going to spend a lot of time angry and unhappy. so: naked we come from the earth, and naked we shall return to it. if any of that didn't make sense or if you see a mistake let me know edit: oh and if you want to read the source material that won me over, read "the brothers karamazov" by fyodor dostoevsky (in particular the parts involving zossima). I don't agree entirely with his conclusions, but I'll be damned if he doesn't know what he's talking about edit2: also most of the christians who say this aren't particularly thorough or consistent philosophers, so what they're actually saying is probably more like "god will make everything okay, just you wait" and yeah that's pretty fucking obnoxious i was following you in the beginning and it even made sense but then u hit me with the 'it deliberately worked' and now i'm confused again. either way, if you view god as a synonym for the world we live in, then everyone's a fucking christian. it's just whether one interprets the world as god or simply as the environment you're thrust into through your mom's vagina. and i'm fine with that interpretation of god. however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me. honestly i believe in fate a tiny bit - eg, the people you meet in your life: sometimes things just don't end up working out no matter how much you try and force it, or sometimes you just bump into someone out of the blue and I tend to simplify things and chalk it up to fate in either of these occasions. "it is deliberately worked" translates to "it is made by a being with purpose and deliberation" sorry, I start using pompous language with things like this, it's a bad habit also, the point of the third big paragraph is reconciling the fact that christians don't understand god simply as a synonym for the world at large with the argument on a whole and also underlining how they can believe in god as being an individual without necessarily being an overpowered megalomaniac the mindset is really fucking complicated for consistent christians, which is why I spent most of my life simply not understanding it although I completely agree with however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me I remain bothered by the vast majority of christians, although to be fair the same goes for most belief systems some probably have higher proportions of disturbing people, but most humans don't think about things with enough nuance to get beyond the elementary propositions which create a horrifying image of reality see that's what confuses me, 'with purpose and deliberation' how are you supposed to live life when some entity, regardless of omnipotence, has your actions all planned out for you see, if an enemy spirit breaker bashes me 10 times in a row, then I'll say something like "thanks icefrog for the 17%" but this is still a conscious determination on my part that the game decided to rng it 17% 10 times in a row, and not attribute it to some machination of a higher power. what's the point of hard work and ambition in life if everything's already laid out? I understand that people want to feel secure in their actions and the way they live their life but completely externalizing your experiences and decisions to a foreign entity is just so incomprehensible to me.
well that's not necessarily just a christian problem; actually it's more of a non-christian problem
in studying how the body works, we find that it follows consistent patterns of action. in studying the brain, we find the same. all that you do, all that you are is determined by your starting composition and what is done to you by the outside world. in this situation, how can we say that neuroscientists have a life worth living?
|
On June 27 2015 12:34 andyrau wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:25 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:23 Fencar wrote:On June 27 2015 12:22 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:18 Fencar wrote:On June 27 2015 12:14 CorsairHero wrote:On June 27 2015 12:02 Fencar wrote:Thanks guys, I'm going to make an investment in a large water bottle. Any brand/type/etc you guys recommend? I am not well versed in the ways of water bottles. Tbh I'm still not sure what to do with my time tonight from now-6:00 AM when I'll probably go make myself 'breakfast.' My options are: -Search for a couple of books to read. -Play video games. -Shitpost. -Read My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic fanfiction by ShortSkirtsandExplosions. -Watch anime. -Listen to an audiobook/podcast. -Watch youtube. -A combination of the above. klean kanteen which is stainless steel OK I found one is it safe to post the link here? http://www.mec.ca/product/5031-827/klean-kanteen-wide-stainless-steel-bottle-1.18l/you can find this at REI probably if you're in US fencar too fast Yea sorry I ninja'd you by 9 seconds I found it on REI & posted the link above. ya, point is: avoid plastic shit cause even BPA free has other weird shit even aluminum bottles have plastic lining in them dude just buy one of these things for 2.50 at bevmo and wash&refill endlessly + Show Spoiler +
yea trade off of durability and weight
i use mine for hiking/commute and stuff so its multipurpose
|
I see myself potentially abusing my bottle + going to REI is easier than getting something from bevmo or w/e so I'll stick with the stainless steel one.
|
oh i usually just put it in my car lol
On June 27 2015 12:37 Acritter wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:31 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 12:13 Acritter wrote:On June 27 2015 12:05 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 11:26 eieio wrote:
"everyone has faith if you're sitting in a chair right now you sat down in it with faith that you wouldn't fall" askdjfnalkjsnaelranweljrwer literally someone said this 2 week ago at a meeting I was at LMAo yes i had faith whoever made that chair wasn't completely incompetent you're absolutely right. On June 27 2015 11:41 Acritter wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 27 2015 11:25 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 11:22 Acritter wrote:"also sorry I stole shit from you" ah yes this is a good reason to apologize On June 27 2015 11:21 Targe wrote:
id legitimately feel patronised if someone told me "everything happens according to gods plan" in relation to something bad actually this is the one part of christianity that seems most reasonable to me as an atheist; dostoevsky won me over with his argument if you are interested in reading a minor text wall I'll explain this would bait the shit out of creams doitdoitdoit okay so here we go to start off with, let's get into the mindset of an intellectually rigorous christian. there are other kinds; I'm not interested in them what does this entail? well, first of all, god is the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of all things (the infinitely good bit is actually kind of irrelevant, as it's a conclusion rather than a premise IMO). god is the mechanism from which and (this is important) by which all things happen. in other words, for a consistent, intellectual christian, there isn't a significant distinction between god and the world. you know how you can say that an artist's masterpiece is sort of a part of him/her? this is basically the same way, except that since god is by nature inextricably connected with creation, it's much less of a metaphor. so with this in mind, let's take something like the book of job. job loses everything and is crushed beyond recognition. if we saw this happen to someone IRL, we'd say that it was really awful luck, but another way of putting it is that the world (universe) did it. this doesn't mean that the world is an intelligent actor working for a specific end, just as we don't say that tsunamis constantly have it in for japan. despite this, the world and the tsunamis are still what do these things to individuals. similarly, christians say that it's all according to god's plan or done by god. in our traditional mindset of viewing god as a distinct authority, this seems naturally horrible, and it is in that context. a being with unlimited power causing arbitrary harm is utterly abhorrent. however, the consistent christian views god like most of us view the universe: infinite and ineffable. things happen. now, let's step back: christians do view god as a being as well as existing as the world. it's a misrepresentation to say that it's just a synonym for the world, because that would ignore one of their fundamental understandings of the world (namely, that it is deliberately worked). however, their position of it being acceptable that evil exists as part of god's plan isn't contradictory or even vile. reason being: god is, as mentioned, ineffable and moreover irresistible. you can't get rid of god, you can't ignore god. thus, resenting god's plan is as senseless as resenting the universe for existing in such a way that (say) your father gets cancer. it simply exists. the correct response is to accept god's plan and accept the universe as it is, and despite all that goes wrong, to love god (which in our atheist minds would be the same as loving life and existence). now, obviously this point can't be proven deductively, but there's a fairly reasonable inductive argument to it. if you get angry about everything bad that happens to you, you're going to spend a lot of time angry and unhappy. so: naked we come from the earth, and naked we shall return to it. if any of that didn't make sense or if you see a mistake let me know edit: oh and if you want to read the source material that won me over, read "the brothers karamazov" by fyodor dostoevsky (in particular the parts involving zossima). I don't agree entirely with his conclusions, but I'll be damned if he doesn't know what he's talking about edit2: also most of the christians who say this aren't particularly thorough or consistent philosophers, so what they're actually saying is probably more like "god will make everything okay, just you wait" and yeah that's pretty fucking obnoxious i was following you in the beginning and it even made sense but then u hit me with the 'it deliberately worked' and now i'm confused again. either way, if you view god as a synonym for the world we live in, then everyone's a fucking christian. it's just whether one interprets the world as god or simply as the environment you're thrust into through your mom's vagina. and i'm fine with that interpretation of god. however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me. honestly i believe in fate a tiny bit - eg, the people you meet in your life: sometimes things just don't end up working out no matter how much you try and force it, or sometimes you just bump into someone out of the blue and I tend to simplify things and chalk it up to fate in either of these occasions. "it is deliberately worked" translates to "it is made by a being with purpose and deliberation" sorry, I start using pompous language with things like this, it's a bad habit also, the point of the third big paragraph is reconciling the fact that christians don't understand god simply as a synonym for the world at large with the argument on a whole and also underlining how they can believe in god as being an individual without necessarily being an overpowered megalomaniac the mindset is really fucking complicated for consistent christians, which is why I spent most of my life simply not understanding it although I completely agree with however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me I remain bothered by the vast majority of christians, although to be fair the same goes for most belief systems some probably have higher proportions of disturbing people, but most humans don't think about things with enough nuance to get beyond the elementary propositions which create a horrifying image of reality see that's what confuses me, 'with purpose and deliberation' how are you supposed to live life when some entity, regardless of omnipotence, has your actions all planned out for you see, if an enemy spirit breaker bashes me 10 times in a row, then I'll say something like "thanks icefrog for the 17%" but this is still a conscious determination on my part that the game decided to rng it 17% 10 times in a row, and not attribute it to some machination of a higher power. what's the point of hard work and ambition in life if everything's already laid out? I understand that people want to feel secure in their actions and the way they live their life but completely externalizing your experiences and decisions to a foreign entity is just so incomprehensible to me. well that's not necessarily just a christian problem; actually it's more of a non-christian problem in studying how the body works, we find that it follows consistent patterns of action. in studying the brain, we find the same. all that you do, all that you are is determined by your starting composition and what is done to you by the outside world. in this situation, how can we say that neuroscientists have a life worth living?
see i'm fine with what you're saying - that if the world has consistent patterns, they interpret these as acts of god/god himself/herself/itself; i interpret these as natural biology/chemistry/physics. same shit different toilet.
what i can't understand is why anyone would think that absolving yourself of responsibility for an action or a consequence is acceptable - like 'oh i became addicted to meth' - a higher being has probably laid this challenge out for me to improve myself as a person.
|
On June 27 2015 12:37 Acritter wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:31 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 12:13 Acritter wrote:On June 27 2015 12:05 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 11:26 eieio wrote:
"everyone has faith if you're sitting in a chair right now you sat down in it with faith that you wouldn't fall" askdjfnalkjsnaelranweljrwer literally someone said this 2 week ago at a meeting I was at LMAo yes i had faith whoever made that chair wasn't completely incompetent you're absolutely right. On June 27 2015 11:41 Acritter wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 27 2015 11:25 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 11:22 Acritter wrote:"also sorry I stole shit from you" ah yes this is a good reason to apologize On June 27 2015 11:21 Targe wrote:
id legitimately feel patronised if someone told me "everything happens according to gods plan" in relation to something bad actually this is the one part of christianity that seems most reasonable to me as an atheist; dostoevsky won me over with his argument if you are interested in reading a minor text wall I'll explain this would bait the shit out of creams doitdoitdoit okay so here we go to start off with, let's get into the mindset of an intellectually rigorous christian. there are other kinds; I'm not interested in them what does this entail? well, first of all, god is the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of all things (the infinitely good bit is actually kind of irrelevant, as it's a conclusion rather than a premise IMO). god is the mechanism from which and (this is important) by which all things happen. in other words, for a consistent, intellectual christian, there isn't a significant distinction between god and the world. you know how you can say that an artist's masterpiece is sort of a part of him/her? this is basically the same way, except that since god is by nature inextricably connected with creation, it's much less of a metaphor. so with this in mind, let's take something like the book of job. job loses everything and is crushed beyond recognition. if we saw this happen to someone IRL, we'd say that it was really awful luck, but another way of putting it is that the world (universe) did it. this doesn't mean that the world is an intelligent actor working for a specific end, just as we don't say that tsunamis constantly have it in for japan. despite this, the world and the tsunamis are still what do these things to individuals. similarly, christians say that it's all according to god's plan or done by god. in our traditional mindset of viewing god as a distinct authority, this seems naturally horrible, and it is in that context. a being with unlimited power causing arbitrary harm is utterly abhorrent. however, the consistent christian views god like most of us view the universe: infinite and ineffable. things happen. now, let's step back: christians do view god as a being as well as existing as the world. it's a misrepresentation to say that it's just a synonym for the world, because that would ignore one of their fundamental understandings of the world (namely, that it is deliberately worked). however, their position of it being acceptable that evil exists as part of god's plan isn't contradictory or even vile. reason being: god is, as mentioned, ineffable and moreover irresistible. you can't get rid of god, you can't ignore god. thus, resenting god's plan is as senseless as resenting the universe for existing in such a way that (say) your father gets cancer. it simply exists. the correct response is to accept god's plan and accept the universe as it is, and despite all that goes wrong, to love god (which in our atheist minds would be the same as loving life and existence). now, obviously this point can't be proven deductively, but there's a fairly reasonable inductive argument to it. if you get angry about everything bad that happens to you, you're going to spend a lot of time angry and unhappy. so: naked we come from the earth, and naked we shall return to it. if any of that didn't make sense or if you see a mistake let me know edit: oh and if you want to read the source material that won me over, read "the brothers karamazov" by fyodor dostoevsky (in particular the parts involving zossima). I don't agree entirely with his conclusions, but I'll be damned if he doesn't know what he's talking about edit2: also most of the christians who say this aren't particularly thorough or consistent philosophers, so what they're actually saying is probably more like "god will make everything okay, just you wait" and yeah that's pretty fucking obnoxious i was following you in the beginning and it even made sense but then u hit me with the 'it deliberately worked' and now i'm confused again. either way, if you view god as a synonym for the world we live in, then everyone's a fucking christian. it's just whether one interprets the world as god or simply as the environment you're thrust into through your mom's vagina. and i'm fine with that interpretation of god. however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me. honestly i believe in fate a tiny bit - eg, the people you meet in your life: sometimes things just don't end up working out no matter how much you try and force it, or sometimes you just bump into someone out of the blue and I tend to simplify things and chalk it up to fate in either of these occasions. "it is deliberately worked" translates to "it is made by a being with purpose and deliberation" sorry, I start using pompous language with things like this, it's a bad habit also, the point of the third big paragraph is reconciling the fact that christians don't understand god simply as a synonym for the world at large with the argument on a whole and also underlining how they can believe in god as being an individual without necessarily being an overpowered megalomaniac the mindset is really fucking complicated for consistent christians, which is why I spent most of my life simply not understanding it although I completely agree with however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me I remain bothered by the vast majority of christians, although to be fair the same goes for most belief systems some probably have higher proportions of disturbing people, but most humans don't think about things with enough nuance to get beyond the elementary propositions which create a horrifying image of reality see that's what confuses me, 'with purpose and deliberation' how are you supposed to live life when some entity, regardless of omnipotence, has your actions all planned out for you see, if an enemy spirit breaker bashes me 10 times in a row, then I'll say something like "thanks icefrog for the 17%" but this is still a conscious determination on my part that the game decided to rng it 17% 10 times in a row, and not attribute it to some machination of a higher power. what's the point of hard work and ambition in life if everything's already laid out? I understand that people want to feel secure in their actions and the way they live their life but completely externalizing your experiences and decisions to a foreign entity is just so incomprehensible to me. well that's not necessarily just a christian problem; actually it's more of a non-christian problem in studying how the body works, we find that it follows consistent patterns of action. in studying the brain, we find the same. all that you do, all that you are is determined by your starting composition and what is done to you by the outside world. in this situation, how can we say that neuroscientists have a life worth living?
Yeah it makes sense when you think of it that way but I fucking hate the mindset of "yeah our entire lives are predetermined at birth" because it's wasteful and doesn't help you improve as a person at all. The greatest thing I've had that's come out of thinking that is that focusing on this kind of thing is not helpful to me whatsoever.
|
On June 27 2015 12:46 andyrau wrote:oh i usually just put it in my car lol Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:37 Acritter wrote:On June 27 2015 12:31 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 12:13 Acritter wrote:On June 27 2015 12:05 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 11:26 eieio wrote:
"everyone has faith if you're sitting in a chair right now you sat down in it with faith that you wouldn't fall" askdjfnalkjsnaelranweljrwer literally someone said this 2 week ago at a meeting I was at LMAo yes i had faith whoever made that chair wasn't completely incompetent you're absolutely right. On June 27 2015 11:41 Acritter wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 27 2015 11:25 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 11:22 Acritter wrote:"also sorry I stole shit from you" ah yes this is a good reason to apologize On June 27 2015 11:21 Targe wrote:
id legitimately feel patronised if someone told me "everything happens according to gods plan" in relation to something bad actually this is the one part of christianity that seems most reasonable to me as an atheist; dostoevsky won me over with his argument if you are interested in reading a minor text wall I'll explain this would bait the shit out of creams doitdoitdoit okay so here we go to start off with, let's get into the mindset of an intellectually rigorous christian. there are other kinds; I'm not interested in them what does this entail? well, first of all, god is the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of all things (the infinitely good bit is actually kind of irrelevant, as it's a conclusion rather than a premise IMO). god is the mechanism from which and (this is important) by which all things happen. in other words, for a consistent, intellectual christian, there isn't a significant distinction between god and the world. you know how you can say that an artist's masterpiece is sort of a part of him/her? this is basically the same way, except that since god is by nature inextricably connected with creation, it's much less of a metaphor. so with this in mind, let's take something like the book of job. job loses everything and is crushed beyond recognition. if we saw this happen to someone IRL, we'd say that it was really awful luck, but another way of putting it is that the world (universe) did it. this doesn't mean that the world is an intelligent actor working for a specific end, just as we don't say that tsunamis constantly have it in for japan. despite this, the world and the tsunamis are still what do these things to individuals. similarly, christians say that it's all according to god's plan or done by god. in our traditional mindset of viewing god as a distinct authority, this seems naturally horrible, and it is in that context. a being with unlimited power causing arbitrary harm is utterly abhorrent. however, the consistent christian views god like most of us view the universe: infinite and ineffable. things happen. now, let's step back: christians do view god as a being as well as existing as the world. it's a misrepresentation to say that it's just a synonym for the world, because that would ignore one of their fundamental understandings of the world (namely, that it is deliberately worked). however, their position of it being acceptable that evil exists as part of god's plan isn't contradictory or even vile. reason being: god is, as mentioned, ineffable and moreover irresistible. you can't get rid of god, you can't ignore god. thus, resenting god's plan is as senseless as resenting the universe for existing in such a way that (say) your father gets cancer. it simply exists. the correct response is to accept god's plan and accept the universe as it is, and despite all that goes wrong, to love god (which in our atheist minds would be the same as loving life and existence). now, obviously this point can't be proven deductively, but there's a fairly reasonable inductive argument to it. if you get angry about everything bad that happens to you, you're going to spend a lot of time angry and unhappy. so: naked we come from the earth, and naked we shall return to it. if any of that didn't make sense or if you see a mistake let me know edit: oh and if you want to read the source material that won me over, read "the brothers karamazov" by fyodor dostoevsky (in particular the parts involving zossima). I don't agree entirely with his conclusions, but I'll be damned if he doesn't know what he's talking about edit2: also most of the christians who say this aren't particularly thorough or consistent philosophers, so what they're actually saying is probably more like "god will make everything okay, just you wait" and yeah that's pretty fucking obnoxious i was following you in the beginning and it even made sense but then u hit me with the 'it deliberately worked' and now i'm confused again. either way, if you view god as a synonym for the world we live in, then everyone's a fucking christian. it's just whether one interprets the world as god or simply as the environment you're thrust into through your mom's vagina. and i'm fine with that interpretation of god. however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me. honestly i believe in fate a tiny bit - eg, the people you meet in your life: sometimes things just don't end up working out no matter how much you try and force it, or sometimes you just bump into someone out of the blue and I tend to simplify things and chalk it up to fate in either of these occasions. "it is deliberately worked" translates to "it is made by a being with purpose and deliberation" sorry, I start using pompous language with things like this, it's a bad habit also, the point of the third big paragraph is reconciling the fact that christians don't understand god simply as a synonym for the world at large with the argument on a whole and also underlining how they can believe in god as being an individual without necessarily being an overpowered megalomaniac the mindset is really fucking complicated for consistent christians, which is why I spent most of my life simply not understanding it although I completely agree with however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me I remain bothered by the vast majority of christians, although to be fair the same goes for most belief systems some probably have higher proportions of disturbing people, but most humans don't think about things with enough nuance to get beyond the elementary propositions which create a horrifying image of reality see that's what confuses me, 'with purpose and deliberation' how are you supposed to live life when some entity, regardless of omnipotence, has your actions all planned out for you see, if an enemy spirit breaker bashes me 10 times in a row, then I'll say something like "thanks icefrog for the 17%" but this is still a conscious determination on my part that the game decided to rng it 17% 10 times in a row, and not attribute it to some machination of a higher power. what's the point of hard work and ambition in life if everything's already laid out? I understand that people want to feel secure in their actions and the way they live their life but completely externalizing your experiences and decisions to a foreign entity is just so incomprehensible to me. well that's not necessarily just a christian problem; actually it's more of a non-christian problem in studying how the body works, we find that it follows consistent patterns of action. in studying the brain, we find the same. all that you do, all that you are is determined by your starting composition and what is done to you by the outside world. in this situation, how can we say that neuroscientists have a life worth living? see i'm fine with what you're saying - that if the world has consistent patterns, they interpret these as acts of god/god himself/herself/itself; i interpret these as natural biology/chemistry/physics. same shit different toilet. what i can't understand is why anyone would think that absolving yourself of responsibility for an action or a consequence is acceptable - like 'oh i became addicted to meth' - a higher being has probably laid this challenge out for me to improve myself as a person.
those kinds of people are indeed difficult to understand, but there are also extremely consistent christians that can believe in a higher power without using it as an excuse for themselves
that's all i'm trying to say
On June 27 2015 12:49 Fencar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:37 Acritter wrote:On June 27 2015 12:31 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 12:13 Acritter wrote:On June 27 2015 12:05 andyrau wrote:On June 27 2015 11:26 eieio wrote:
"everyone has faith if you're sitting in a chair right now you sat down in it with faith that you wouldn't fall" askdjfnalkjsnaelranweljrwer literally someone said this 2 week ago at a meeting I was at LMAo yes i had faith whoever made that chair wasn't completely incompetent you're absolutely right. On June 27 2015 11:41 Acritter wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On June 27 2015 11:25 PassiveAce wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 11:22 Acritter wrote:"also sorry I stole shit from you" ah yes this is a good reason to apologize On June 27 2015 11:21 Targe wrote:
id legitimately feel patronised if someone told me "everything happens according to gods plan" in relation to something bad actually this is the one part of christianity that seems most reasonable to me as an atheist; dostoevsky won me over with his argument if you are interested in reading a minor text wall I'll explain this would bait the shit out of creams doitdoitdoit okay so here we go to start off with, let's get into the mindset of an intellectually rigorous christian. there are other kinds; I'm not interested in them what does this entail? well, first of all, god is the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of all things (the infinitely good bit is actually kind of irrelevant, as it's a conclusion rather than a premise IMO). god is the mechanism from which and (this is important) by which all things happen. in other words, for a consistent, intellectual christian, there isn't a significant distinction between god and the world. you know how you can say that an artist's masterpiece is sort of a part of him/her? this is basically the same way, except that since god is by nature inextricably connected with creation, it's much less of a metaphor. so with this in mind, let's take something like the book of job. job loses everything and is crushed beyond recognition. if we saw this happen to someone IRL, we'd say that it was really awful luck, but another way of putting it is that the world (universe) did it. this doesn't mean that the world is an intelligent actor working for a specific end, just as we don't say that tsunamis constantly have it in for japan. despite this, the world and the tsunamis are still what do these things to individuals. similarly, christians say that it's all according to god's plan or done by god. in our traditional mindset of viewing god as a distinct authority, this seems naturally horrible, and it is in that context. a being with unlimited power causing arbitrary harm is utterly abhorrent. however, the consistent christian views god like most of us view the universe: infinite and ineffable. things happen. now, let's step back: christians do view god as a being as well as existing as the world. it's a misrepresentation to say that it's just a synonym for the world, because that would ignore one of their fundamental understandings of the world (namely, that it is deliberately worked). however, their position of it being acceptable that evil exists as part of god's plan isn't contradictory or even vile. reason being: god is, as mentioned, ineffable and moreover irresistible. you can't get rid of god, you can't ignore god. thus, resenting god's plan is as senseless as resenting the universe for existing in such a way that (say) your father gets cancer. it simply exists. the correct response is to accept god's plan and accept the universe as it is, and despite all that goes wrong, to love god (which in our atheist minds would be the same as loving life and existence). now, obviously this point can't be proven deductively, but there's a fairly reasonable inductive argument to it. if you get angry about everything bad that happens to you, you're going to spend a lot of time angry and unhappy. so: naked we come from the earth, and naked we shall return to it. if any of that didn't make sense or if you see a mistake let me know edit: oh and if you want to read the source material that won me over, read "the brothers karamazov" by fyodor dostoevsky (in particular the parts involving zossima). I don't agree entirely with his conclusions, but I'll be damned if he doesn't know what he's talking about edit2: also most of the christians who say this aren't particularly thorough or consistent philosophers, so what they're actually saying is probably more like "god will make everything okay, just you wait" and yeah that's pretty fucking obnoxious i was following you in the beginning and it even made sense but then u hit me with the 'it deliberately worked' and now i'm confused again. either way, if you view god as a synonym for the world we live in, then everyone's a fucking christian. it's just whether one interprets the world as god or simply as the environment you're thrust into through your mom's vagina. and i'm fine with that interpretation of god. however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me. honestly i believe in fate a tiny bit - eg, the people you meet in your life: sometimes things just don't end up working out no matter how much you try and force it, or sometimes you just bump into someone out of the blue and I tend to simplify things and chalk it up to fate in either of these occasions. "it is deliberately worked" translates to "it is made by a being with purpose and deliberation" sorry, I start using pompous language with things like this, it's a bad habit also, the point of the third big paragraph is reconciling the fact that christians don't understand god simply as a synonym for the world at large with the argument on a whole and also underlining how they can believe in god as being an individual without necessarily being an overpowered megalomaniac the mindset is really fucking complicated for consistent christians, which is why I spent most of my life simply not understanding it although I completely agree with however most christians are convinced that god is an omnipotent puppeteer and that's what bothers me I remain bothered by the vast majority of christians, although to be fair the same goes for most belief systems some probably have higher proportions of disturbing people, but most humans don't think about things with enough nuance to get beyond the elementary propositions which create a horrifying image of reality see that's what confuses me, 'with purpose and deliberation' how are you supposed to live life when some entity, regardless of omnipotence, has your actions all planned out for you see, if an enemy spirit breaker bashes me 10 times in a row, then I'll say something like "thanks icefrog for the 17%" but this is still a conscious determination on my part that the game decided to rng it 17% 10 times in a row, and not attribute it to some machination of a higher power. what's the point of hard work and ambition in life if everything's already laid out? I understand that people want to feel secure in their actions and the way they live their life but completely externalizing your experiences and decisions to a foreign entity is just so incomprehensible to me. well that's not necessarily just a christian problem; actually it's more of a non-christian problem in studying how the body works, we find that it follows consistent patterns of action. in studying the brain, we find the same. all that you do, all that you are is determined by your starting composition and what is done to you by the outside world. in this situation, how can we say that neuroscientists have a life worth living? Yeah it makes sense when you think of it that way but I fucking hate the mindset of "yeah our entire lives are predetermined at birth" because it's wasteful and doesn't help you improve as a person at all. The greatest thing I've had that's come out of thinking that is that focusing on this kind of thing is not helpful to me whatsoever.
oh I totally know that what i said is true but don't think for a moment that I actually live by it
man that would be a shitty, unpleasant way to live, and really what would be better about it? authenticity? gimme a break, that means jack all
also I'm heading out so if I don't reply it's not because I hate you
|
|
|
On June 27 2015 12:34 Targe wrote:
e: incase this got buried by the posts after my last one: can anyonehelp me with a CV question? im putting my results and current courses at uni but i only have half the results, should i just put a predicted grade for the year?
you can pm me and I can get you an email to send it to to review it (if you're doing tech) if you want
I did a ton of resume reviewing and intern interviewing at amazon I'm pretty used to it
fencar if you're super pressed for cash a nalgene is gonna be like $10 but one of those steel ones is prolly nicer lol
not waycrosscampapproved tho
On June 27 2015 12:46 andyrau wrote:
what i can't understand is why anyone would think that absolving yourself of responsibility for an action or a consequence is acceptable - like 'oh i became addicted to meth' - a higher being has probably laid this challenge out for me to improve myself as a person.
ya this tilts me hard too
|
On June 27 2015 12:49 CorsairHero wrote:
andy what do u drive
a ferrari 430
camry hybrid
|
do you also shop at whole foods
i expect an upgrade to a tesla in the future  logical upgrade for someone in the valley
|
United Kingdom14103 Posts
On June 27 2015 12:51 eieio wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:34 Targe wrote:
e: incase this got buried by the posts after my last one: can anyonehelp me with a CV question? im putting my results and current courses at uni but i only have half the results, should i just put a predicted grade for the year? you can pm me and I can get you an email to send it to to review it (if you're doing tech) if you want I did a ton of resume reviewing and intern interviewing at amazon I'm pretty used to it
fencar if you're super pressed for cash a nalgene is gonna be like $10 but one of those steel ones is prolly nicer lol not waycrosscampapproved tho
Show nested quote +On June 27 2015 12:46 andyrau wrote:
what i can't understand is why anyone would think that absolving yourself of responsibility for an action or a consequence is acceptable - like 'oh i became addicted to meth' - a higher being has probably laid this challenge out for me to improve myself as a person. ya this tilts me hard too
that would be sick! yeah its in tech (im a comp sci student)
just need to replace some placeholder text in it first (likely do that tomorrow though seeing as its 5 am)
|
28103 Posts
edit: nvm it was something else.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](https://vossworld.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/c2a9kamiswingle_northern-virginia-product-photography-voss-water-2.jpeg)
