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On March 21 2013 09:11 TheYango wrote:
I just checked. All hard camp large creeps except the Dark Troll Warlord (both Furbolgs, Centaur Khan, Satyr Hellcaller, Enraged Wildkin) do enough damage to break Tranquil heal due to doing Chaos damage. The Dark Troll Warlord does Piercing damage, so he doesn't do enough to break the heal.
Among medium camps, the aforementioned Centaur Khan, as well as Alpha Wolf crits, do enough to break Tranquils.
The threshold is pre armor?
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United States47024 Posts
No, the threshold is based on post-mitigation damage.
Theoretically, if you have high enough armor, even player-based damage wouldn't break Tranquil's heal. And as I said, there were player-based damage sources that were doing below-threshold damage before that would break the Tranquil heal that, if this change is implemented correctly, shouldn't now.
So in the general case, Tranquil's are slightly worse for jungling, but in the specific case against certain heroes, they're actually better (the clearest one being against Dark Seer, since Ion Shelled creeps won't interrupt the Tranquil heal).
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On March 21 2013 09:15 TheYango wrote:
No, the threshold is based on post-mitigation damage.
Theoretically, if you have high enough armor, even player-based damage wouldn't break Tranquil's heal. And as I said, there were player-based damage sources that were doing below-threshold damage before that would break the Tranquil heal that, if this change is implemented correctly, shouldn't now.
So in the general case, Tranquil's are slightly worse for jungling, but in the specific case against certain heroes, they're actually better (the clearest one being against Dark Seer, since Ion Shelled creeps won't interrupt the Tranquil heal).
That is what i thought but your comment made me a little confused. xD so you can still avoid breaking the heal with stout and armor at least on the hits that stout procs.
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On March 21 2013 09:20 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2013 09:15 TheYango wrote:
No, the threshold is based on post-mitigation damage.
Theoretically, if you have high enough armor, even player-based damage wouldn't break Tranquil's heal. And as I said, there were player-based damage sources that were doing below-threshold damage before that would break the Tranquil heal that, if this change is implemented correctly, shouldn't now.
So in the general case, Tranquil's are slightly worse for jungling, but in the specific case against certain heroes, they're actually better (the clearest one being against Dark Seer, since Ion Shelled creeps won't interrupt the Tranquil heal). That is what i thought but your comment made me a little confused. xD so you can still avoid breaking the heal with stout and armor at least on the hits that stout procs.
Except then he's going to hit you a second later and cancel it ^_^ Your best option is just not using the active during camps that can break it.
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United States47024 Posts
On March 21 2013 09:20 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2013 09:15 TheYango wrote:
No, the threshold is based on post-mitigation damage.
Theoretically, if you have high enough armor, even player-based damage wouldn't break Tranquil's heal. And as I said, there were player-based damage sources that were doing below-threshold damage before that would break the Tranquil heal that, if this change is implemented correctly, shouldn't now.
So in the general case, Tranquil's are slightly worse for jungling, but in the specific case against certain heroes, they're actually better (the clearest one being against Dark Seer, since Ion Shelled creeps won't interrupt the Tranquil heal). That is what i thought but your comment made me a little confused. xD so you can still avoid breaking the heal with stout and armor at least on the hits that stout procs.
Well most heroes do enough damage by the time you have Tranquils that even a Stout proc probably wouldn't reduce the hit by enough.
70 damage - 20 from Stout proc--you'd need an unrealistic amount of armor early game for that to be reduced below 20 (remember damage block is pre-armor).
EDIT: If you meant on jungle camps, then yeah, what Blitz said is right--you'd have to luck out super hard to have Stout blocks carry you through the whole camp.
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Russian Federation4050 Posts
errrrrr... apparently Santa leaves Virtus Pro. What the fuck is going on? There is no explanation at all.
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On March 21 2013 09:23 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2013 09:20 PrinceXizor wrote:On March 21 2013 09:15 TheYango wrote:
No, the threshold is based on post-mitigation damage.
Theoretically, if you have high enough armor, even player-based damage wouldn't break Tranquil's heal. And as I said, there were player-based damage sources that were doing below-threshold damage before that would break the Tranquil heal that, if this change is implemented correctly, shouldn't now.
So in the general case, Tranquil's are slightly worse for jungling, but in the specific case against certain heroes, they're actually better (the clearest one being against Dark Seer, since Ion Shelled creeps won't interrupt the Tranquil heal). That is what i thought but your comment made me a little confused. xD so you can still avoid breaking the heal with stout and armor at least on the hits that stout procs. Well most heroes do enough damage by the time you have Tranquils that even a Stout proc probably wouldn't reduce the hit by enough. 70 damage - 20 from Stout proc--you'd need an unrealistic amount of armor early game for that to be reduced below 20 (remember damage block is pre-armor). EDIT: If you meant on jungle camps, then yeah, what Blitz said is right--you'd have to luck out super hard to have Stout blocks carry you through the whole camp.
Well for centaur you only need it to proc twice to get a big effect out of it since he attacks so slowly. activate it right after the damage of 1 attack, stout stout third attack breaks it but you end up positive in hp for the camp if you clear them quickly
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On March 21 2013 09:29 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2013 09:23 TheYango wrote:On March 21 2013 09:20 PrinceXizor wrote:On March 21 2013 09:15 TheYango wrote:
No, the threshold is based on post-mitigation damage.
Theoretically, if you have high enough armor, even player-based damage wouldn't break Tranquil's heal. And as I said, there were player-based damage sources that were doing below-threshold damage before that would break the Tranquil heal that, if this change is implemented correctly, shouldn't now.
So in the general case, Tranquil's are slightly worse for jungling, but in the specific case against certain heroes, they're actually better (the clearest one being against Dark Seer, since Ion Shelled creeps won't interrupt the Tranquil heal). That is what i thought but your comment made me a little confused. xD so you can still avoid breaking the heal with stout and armor at least on the hits that stout procs. Well most heroes do enough damage by the time you have Tranquils that even a Stout proc probably wouldn't reduce the hit by enough. 70 damage - 20 from Stout proc--you'd need an unrealistic amount of armor early game for that to be reduced below 20 (remember damage block is pre-armor). EDIT: If you meant on jungle camps, then yeah, what Blitz said is right--you'd have to luck out super hard to have Stout blocks carry you through the whole camp. Well for centaur you only need it to proc twice to get a big effect out of it since he attacks so slowly. activate it right after the damage of 1 attack, stout stout third attack breaks it but you end up positive in hp for the camp if you clear them quickly
Or you could just wait five seconds and get the full heal off your tranquils. Only procing twice is also pretty poor odds on something that isn't very time sensitive. You shouldn't lose much of anything by waiting to use them on camps that don't break them.
Keep in mind tranquil boots got changed so they take twice as long to heal you now. The regen they give is the same, but it has a longer cooldown and duration.
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You don't always get that luxury though, and knowing how you can net positive hp on certain camps is useful.
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On March 21 2013 09:40 PrinceXizor wrote:
You don't always get that luxury though, and knowing how you can net positive hp on certain camps is useful.
What do you mean you don't always get that luxury? You're jungling. Waiting five seconds to use your tranquil boots should always be better than getting them disabled because you didn't get a 60% block roll (which is actually less because of PRD). Surely you aren't activating your tranquil boots in the hopes you're going to get block rolls or die.
The fact that they don't even break on most of the camps only makes this even more silly. Even with unlucky medium camp spawns you should be able to use them during the small camp every cooldown.
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Czech Republic18921 Posts
On March 21 2013 09:26 dfs wrote:
errrrrr... apparently Santa leaves Virtus Pro. What the fuck is going on? There is no explanation at all.
Really? Would they swap a player out before The Defense finals? That doesn't make any sense to me.
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Russian Federation4050 Posts
On March 21 2013 09:49 cecek wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2013 09:26 dfs wrote:
errrrrr... apparently Santa leaves Virtus Pro. What the fuck is going on? There is no explanation at all. Really? Would they swap a player out before The Defense finals? That doesn't make any sense to me.
The only info they posted was that they know it is a terrible timing, but they couldn't help it.
Santa just tweeted that he was thinking about retiring from Dota but it happened sooner than he though.
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United Kingdom24425 Posts
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Well, if he's just retiring, he might as well play just for about one more week, since it's not going to be that much of a difference, but he'd do his teammates a favor. However if he's retiring for personal / private [maybe even health reasons, which I don't hope] then whatever.
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santa was like my favorite player on VP. 
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Is it intended, that Slark Dark Pact also dispells SD Disrupt?
on a completely unrelated note: The lack of heroes getting ported might also be due to valve re-modeling some heroes, because the release in China is near? Just another idea of mine. Heroes like Skeleton King and Naix were troublesome if I remember correctly.
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On March 21 2013 11:06 Talron wrote:
on a completely unrelated note: The lack of heroes getting ported might also be due to valve re-modeling some heroes, because the release in China is near? Just another idea of mine. Heroes like Skeleton King and Naix were troublesome if I remember correctly.
that was just for wow and it was just pure bullshit.
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EPT
