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On October 16 2012 08:11 5-s wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 04:39 LuckoftheIrish wrote:
I'm not particularly interested in giving you the rundown. Suffice it to say, I know what I'm doing, and I think it's a boring skill. Whether it's boring or not, it's the one you should max first in most situations. Wanting to be different or exciting has never been a good reason to use bad builds.
Fine, fantastic. It's the only skill Veno has that really benefits from levels (outside situational level 2 poison sting and the ult). It doesn't change anything. I max it at 7 when I play Veno and I wish that I'd randomed a different hero. I'll use the 'correct' build, but I don't have to like that it's the best way to play. Posts like this one seem to assume things that aren't either true or relevant.
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On October 16 2012 09:34 canikizu wrote:
I don't understand the reason to go random and get 250 bonus gold anymore. If you go random and get heroes you don't know how to play, 250 gold might help you, but most of the time, all I see is randoming and get 250gold gives you significantly advantage. Nowaday, people seem to play random to get 250 gold, not for the sake of random heroes anymore.
I hope they get rid of 250 gold bonus like HoN, or at least make it available for mid level games only. High/Very High level games should not have 250 gold bonus for going random.
No seriously though, i believe there is no reason to actually random anymore.
People, there is this thing called the Random Spinner
It does the exact same thing as random, except when you get sniper you don't have to waste money to repick, you just hit the spinner again and get a better hero.
I wish they would get rid of the extra gold from randoming, it truly is a warcraft 3 relic, i mean it encourages people to random but if you really think that extra 250 gold is worth having 4 carries on a team, you need to go own that one guy named Wilson Bot a few more times
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On October 16 2012 11:25 BeanerBurrito wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 09:34 canikizu wrote:
I don't understand the reason to go random and get 250 bonus gold anymore. If you go random and get heroes you don't know how to play, 250 gold might help you, but most of the time, all I see is randoming and get 250gold gives you significantly advantage. Nowaday, people seem to play random to get 250 gold, not for the sake of random heroes anymore.
I hope they get rid of 250 gold bonus like HoN, or at least make it available for mid level games only. High/Very High level games should not have 250 gold bonus for going random.
No seriously though, i believe there is no reason to actually random anymore. People, there is this thing called the Random Spinner It does the exact same thing as random, except when you get sniper you don't have to waste money to repick, you just hit the spinner again and get a better hero. I wish they would get rid of the extra gold from randoming, it truly is a warcraft 3 relic, i mean it encourages people to random but if you really think that extra 250 gold is worth having 4 carries on a team, you need to go own that one guy named Wilson Bot a few more times
Random spinner doesn't force you into it though
Some people...lack discipline.....
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i think randoming has a nice feel to it tho, you get a hero and it almost makes you play it unless you swap or repick, i think most people do it just because they find it more spontaneous rather than deciding before hand they're going to play 2 morphling games, 1 antihero game and a slayer game
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On October 16 2012 11:25 BeanerBurrito wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 09:34 canikizu wrote:
I don't understand the reason to go random and get 250 bonus gold anymore. If you go random and get heroes you don't know how to play, 250 gold might help you, but most of the time, all I see is randoming and get 250gold gives you significantly advantage. Nowaday, people seem to play random to get 250 gold, not for the sake of random heroes anymore.
I hope they get rid of 250 gold bonus like HoN, or at least make it available for mid level games only. High/Very High level games should not have 250 gold bonus for going random.
No seriously though, i believe there is no reason to actually random anymore. People, there is this thing called the Random Spinner It does the exact same thing as random, except when you get sniper you don't have to waste money to repick, you just hit the spinner again and get a better hero. I wish they would get rid of the extra gold from randoming, it truly is a warcraft 3 relic, i mean it encourages people to random but if you really think that extra 250 gold is worth having 4 carries on a team, you need to go own that one guy named Wilson Bot a few more times
Randoming first or second pick is a really good strategy in every -ap game. Your team gets an extra 250g at no cost. If you can't play the hero, swap it to another player.
One player randoming is just good.
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On October 16 2012 11:38 Shai wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 11:25 BeanerBurrito wrote:On October 16 2012 09:34 canikizu wrote:
I don't understand the reason to go random and get 250 bonus gold anymore. If you go random and get heroes you don't know how to play, 250 gold might help you, but most of the time, all I see is randoming and get 250gold gives you significantly advantage. Nowaday, people seem to play random to get 250 gold, not for the sake of random heroes anymore.
I hope they get rid of 250 gold bonus like HoN, or at least make it available for mid level games only. High/Very High level games should not have 250 gold bonus for going random.
No seriously though, i believe there is no reason to actually random anymore. People, there is this thing called the Random Spinner It does the exact same thing as random, except when you get sniper you don't have to waste money to repick, you just hit the spinner again and get a better hero. I wish they would get rid of the extra gold from randoming, it truly is a warcraft 3 relic, i mean it encourages people to random but if you really think that extra 250 gold is worth having 4 carries on a team, you need to go own that one guy named Wilson Bot a few more times Randoming first or second pick is a really good strategy in every -ap game. Your team gets an extra 250g at no cost. If you can't play the hero, swap it to another player. One player randoming is just good.
I really don't think it being good is a reason to do it, I mean for fun or excitement or whatever sure, but that little amount of gold doesn't add up to much, you could very easily choose a much better team instead of depending on a random potentially bad hero, and you risk having to repick or being stuck with said bad hero.
Also if you are used to having that extra gold, you are tricking yourself into a false sense of security, you won't always have that gold so why get used to it, it could be a crutch for some players.
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On October 16 2012 11:42 BeanerBurrito wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 11:38 Shai wrote:On October 16 2012 11:25 BeanerBurrito wrote:On October 16 2012 09:34 canikizu wrote:
I don't understand the reason to go random and get 250 bonus gold anymore. If you go random and get heroes you don't know how to play, 250 gold might help you, but most of the time, all I see is randoming and get 250gold gives you significantly advantage. Nowaday, people seem to play random to get 250 gold, not for the sake of random heroes anymore.
I hope they get rid of 250 gold bonus like HoN, or at least make it available for mid level games only. High/Very High level games should not have 250 gold bonus for going random.
No seriously though, i believe there is no reason to actually random anymore. People, there is this thing called the Random Spinner It does the exact same thing as random, except when you get sniper you don't have to waste money to repick, you just hit the spinner again and get a better hero. I wish they would get rid of the extra gold from randoming, it truly is a warcraft 3 relic, i mean it encourages people to random but if you really think that extra 250 gold is worth having 4 carries on a team, you need to go own that one guy named Wilson Bot a few more times Randoming first or second pick is a really good strategy in every -ap game. Your team gets an extra 250g at no cost. If you can't play the hero, swap it to another player. One player randoming is just good. I really don't think it being good is a reason to do it, I mean for fun or excitement or whatever sure, but that little amount of gold doesn't add up to much, you could very easily choose a much better team instead of depending on a random potentially bad hero, and you risk having to repick or being stuck with said bad hero. Also if you are used to having that extra gold, you are tricking yourself into a false sense of security, you won't always have that gold so why get used to it, it could be a crutch for some players.
It does. 1 free stout shield for melee heroes is big. Or more wards for blocking pull camps/checking runes/counterwarding. Or whatever item you choose to get, giving you a big boost at the start of the game.
We had this discussion before..
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Only men random 100% of the time. =D
@Canikizu - What? As long as you're not screwing over your own team then 250 extra is advantageous. Either you random 1st or 2nd, be able to play all heroes, or random after your team has already picked 2-4 carries since they've done the screwing themselves. Might as well have Fun.
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On October 16 2012 11:35 Makenshi wrote:
i think randoming has a nice feel to it tho, you get a hero and it almost makes you play it unless you swap or repick, i think most people do it just because they find it more spontaneous rather than deciding before hand they're going to play 2 morphling games, 1 antihero game and a slayer game
Then there's no point for having extra 250 gold. You can still just random and get no bonus gold. If you want to be spontaneous, there's no reason for having almost 2 free creep waves like that.
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On October 16 2012 11:59 canikizu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 11:35 Makenshi wrote:
i think randoming has a nice feel to it tho, you get a hero and it almost makes you play it unless you swap or repick, i think most people do it just because they find it more spontaneous rather than deciding before hand they're going to play 2 morphling games, 1 antihero game and a slayer game Then there's no point for having extra 250 gold. You can still just random and get no bonus gold. If you want to be spontaneous, there's no reason for having almost 2 free creep waves like that.
As a point, do you often lose because of randoms? And do you honsetly believe the game would have been different if the played didn't random.
My point is i random most of my games i can play everyhero in the game now at a fair enough level. Randoming is advantageous for me in pubs because the 250gold advantage means we will always have a courier/wards/free stouth shield for carry/faster bottle for mid.
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Honestly half the reason I random is because I make up my mind before the game to go Phase/Drums/Force/Blink and don't give a crap which hero I play.
Practicing for ARDM and refining the Omni-Build(tm).
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On October 16 2012 11:59 canikizu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 11:35 Makenshi wrote:
i think randoming has a nice feel to it tho, you get a hero and it almost makes you play it unless you swap or repick, i think most people do it just because they find it more spontaneous rather than deciding before hand they're going to play 2 morphling games, 1 antihero game and a slayer game Then there's no point for having extra 250 gold. You can still just random and get no bonus gold. If you want to be spontaneous, there's no reason for having almost 2 free creep waves like that.
Yes there is, you are rewarded for not being able to choose your own hero.
Why should you not be rewarded for that?
Also it's extremely illogical that one of the reasons people shouldn't random is because someone might get a hero they can't play, if there are heroes you aren't able to play then randoming forces you to play them so you CAN learn how to play them.
Ontop of that, if i get a hero i really don't want to play, i can repick. I don't mind playing with a hundred gold less in pubs, that is not going to be what loses or wins the game. There are like 3 or 4 heroes i repick, and i random almost all the time.
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The real problem is that the queue for people who care about trying to get good and attempt to play some "real" dota is the same as the people who give no fucks and are happy to random/never ward/pick 5th carryl/etc... Sure you can argue "go play 5s" etc... but obviously it's not as easy as that.
The ranked queue honestly works really well in LoL, if people random or pick terribly they get flamed to hell and they will probably learn their lesson by losing in 20mins.
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On October 16 2012 14:06 rob.au wrote:
The real problem is that the queue for people who care about trying to get good and attempt to play some "real" dota is the same as the people who give no fucks and are happy to random/never ward/pick 5th carryl/etc... Sure you can argue "go play 5s" etc... but obviously it's not as easy as that.
The ranked queue honestly works really well in LoL, if people random or pick terribly they get flamed to hell and they will probably learn their lesson by losing in 20mins.
People who random are often people trying to get good and play some 'real Dota.' I strongly doubt there's a correlation between number of MM games playing a random hero and player skill.
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I usually like to hit the random buttton to ensure that there will be a courier lol. I can buy courier and still have a normal amount of gold regardless of my role. It's also a good way to learn various new heroes and avoiding picking the heroes i love to play like WR or Invoker every game. Maybe random bonus should be eliminated and there should be a fun mode with free courier, since no one wants to buy them at low MMR.
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AP super competitive mode. You get the combinations that only true pros can play. Random completely spoils it though. I mean, a 853 sniper is so much better than a 603 gold darkseer. Its just not a fair contest.
Also, they could fix this by adding AR as a MMR option.
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On October 16 2012 14:22 ViZe wrote:
I usually like to hit the random buttton to ensure that there will be a courier lol.
Lately I've had more and more games where no one has picked up a courier. And it's weird because these games are the ones where I feel I'm being matched with the better end of low tier MMR, some communication and people not just diving or chasing.
I typically pick jungle heroes so dependent on who I'm playing I don't mind buying it, but it means wasting my time to walk back. Even had a game where two people died, respawned and just went back to their lane without picking up a courier despite me asking multiple times if whoever goes back next could do it
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On October 16 2012 14:13 LuckoftheIrish wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 14:06 rob.au wrote:
The real problem is that the queue for people who care about trying to get good and attempt to play some "real" dota is the same as the people who give no fucks and are happy to random/never ward/pick 5th carryl/etc... Sure you can argue "go play 5s" etc... but obviously it's not as easy as that.
The ranked queue honestly works really well in LoL, if people random or pick terribly they get flamed to hell and they will probably learn their lesson by losing in 20mins. People who random are often people trying to get good and play some 'real Dota.' I strongly doubt there's a correlation between number of MM games playing a random hero and player skill.
I doubt playing a random hero every 100ish games on average is going to make you particularily good.
I imagine there's a correlation between no one taking any kind of pub game seriously and the overall skill/knowledge base of the entire dota2 community. Laning against no supports doesn't exactly improve your laning phase, just like a successful gank from mid in a pub normally just means the other team didn't ward rather than you making a big play.
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EPT
