EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 8035
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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
KwarK
United States43991 Posts
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
___ On July 08 2017 06:02 Danglars wrote: What? That's the third time you falsely accused of not editing out a post or equivalent. Just stop it already Danglars. If I missed a post, just post it. If I missed a quote, just post it. Unlike you, I don't live in this thread. Everytime I come to this thread, the conversation has past several pages usually. If I ask a question you beleive I misinterpreted, just say it. I shouldn't have to find out from reading somebody else post because you are so squirmy.I quoted the post in my response and you chose to edit it out and ask for a new answer. Mohdoo got it, you didn't. I have no reason to think a further answer will be read and not edited out because the first didn't even get discussed to why you think it's insufficient. If you need more clarification having read my answer, PM me. I'm unwilling to shit up the thread any further. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23957 Posts
On July 08 2017 23:49 Uldridge wrote: No, GH, I wasn't being sarcastic. I just know you. And it's probably going to be a few post down the line when you start preaching how you think people posting here should be more vigilant and educated about what's going on (just 30 minutes from them) around them and how you think that's absurd or how you think that they're not doing enough to make things better for people as a whole and to end inequality that's systemically set up. Or I'm completely wrong and I will apologize for my abhorrent trend analysis. Either way, I'm fed up with hearing/reading sermons without things actually being done. Start doing, stop trying to acquire an echo chamber. Oh lol. Well you all should be if you're going to comment about it. It's pretty common for discussions here to be focused around a couple very narrow perspectives and it seems to upset people like you to have them reminded of that. That how people here and the people they knew grew up and experienced "parents", "teachers", "school" (in this case), or police, racism, poverty, etc... can and are experienced totally differently by millions and millions of people. In this obliviousness people tend to say or suggest things that are either offensive or rankly ignorant of the situations people actually face. Yeah, they should feel responsible for that. I am "doing" roflmao. I'm confident you aren't doing shit about the problems I raise though. And yes you should feel bad for that. | ||
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Karis Vas Ryaar
United States4396 Posts
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Kadungon
41 Posts
Frankly, I don't see Trump choosing to go to jail. The only hope we have is that he is truly stupid enough to realize he will go to jail the moment he is no longer president. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22373 Posts
On July 09 2017 06:38 Kadungon wrote: The way things are going for Trump, at the end of his 4 years, he either becomes a dictator, or goes to jail for a really long time. He will fall into the trap almost any dictator falls into; they either rule with an iron fist, or they lose power and they and their clique get killed. So they have no option but to get more authoritarian and repressive as time moves on. Frankly, I don't see Trump choosing to go to jail. The only hope we have is that he is truly stupid enough to realize he will go to jail the moment he is no longer president. First you need conclusive evidence of something actually illegal. There is a lot of bad shit a President can do (and that Trump is doing) that is not actually illegal. | ||
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ZerOCoolSC2
9057 Posts
On July 09 2017 06:38 Kadungon wrote: The way things are going for Trump, at the end of his 4 years, he either becomes a dictator, or goes to jail for a really long time. He will fall into the trap almost any dictator falls into; they either rule with an iron fist, or they lose power and they and their clique get killed. So they have no option but to get more authoritarian and repressive as time moves on. Frankly, I don't see Trump choosing to go to jail. The only hope we have is that he is truly stupid enough to realize he will go to jail the moment he is no longer president. Trust me, if he even hints at dictatorship, it won't happen. That's one thing Americans hate more than anything. | ||
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Kadungon
41 Posts
On July 09 2017 06:42 Gorsameth wrote: First you need conclusive evidence of something actually illegal. No I do not. There is a lot of bad shit a President can do (and that Trump is doing) that is not actually illegal. I am sure Bush never feared he would end up in jail for all the shit he pulled. And I am sure neither did his many critics. Obviously, Bush and Blair deserved long jail sentences for their war, but I was never under the illusion that was ever going to be a possibility. Trump isn't Bush. On July 09 2017 06:47 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote: Trust me, if he even hints at dictatorship, it won't happen. That's one thing Americans hate more than anything. He went far far beyond hinting even during the campaign. I am not sure how you can say this with a straight face. His Ivanka move of today is just one of the most clearer points that he is actually trying to be the dictator he promised to be during the campaign. I am not saying he will be a dictator. I see him goal to jail. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23957 Posts
On July 09 2017 06:32 Karis Vas Ryaar wrote: https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/883794529794613248 Just curious, after Trump and his family get away with whatever it is they did (there's no question there are questionable financial relations with many wealthy people and Russian oligarchs [among other wealthy foreigners] and Trump seems to be one of them) what do we think we're going to do? Are we just going to give up on expecting better? Democrats slogan of "Have you seen the other guys" indicates they think they are fine as they are. They already lost to Trump with what they claimed was their best possible candidate. There is no one worse than Trump from the Republican side, and no one better than Hillary from the Democratic side (according to Democrats), and Democrats have made clear they don't think they need drastic change, so how do they win going forward? Do Democrats think that after Mueller clears Trump (he'll still confirm some minor wrongdoing most likely) that somehow they will be able to defeat Republicans with someone they would rank as less qualified/capable than Hillary (unless Democrats think someone can surpass her in the next couple years?)? That seems unlikely at best at this point. It seems more likely that they think they can run Hillary against a battered Trump and come up victorious this time. That the same "have you seen the other guy" argument will be used, and Democrats will genuinely think that they can shame/scare people like myself (but more importantly the Democrats she lost) into voting Hillary. I get why the people who live off of this stuff would want a victory like that, but do Democrats really see that as a positive path forward? | ||
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Kadungon
41 Posts
Fuck the democrats. Sure. Trump belongs in jail. But I'd rather vote for him than for Hillary. Of course, if I were poor, I wouldn't have that luxury. | ||
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30548 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35173 Posts
On July 09 2017 07:36 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote: You guys really need to make a 3rd party big to stop the endless rep-dem stalemate of awfulness. Oh and put ethics demands on the president in law form. Doesn't work because our election process is shit and the only people who have the power to change it are the ones that benefit from it. | ||
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zlefin
United States7689 Posts
On July 09 2017 06:56 Kadungon wrote: Obviously, in 3.5 years, it will be Hillary vs Trump again. And just as last time, I am sure I know who will win before election day. Fuck the democrats. Sure. Trump belongs in jail. But I'd rather vote for him than for Hillary. Of course, if I were poor, I wouldn't have that luxury. that makes you a terrible voter; if you're choosing the objectively worse choice and are aware of it  | ||
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ZerOCoolSC2
9057 Posts
The G20 Summit ended in Hamburg with affirmation to pursue the Paris climate accord by leaders of the world's strongest economies, minus President Trump. "The leaders of the other G20 members state that the Paris Agreement is irreversible," reads a declaration adopted on the final day of meetings Saturday, by a group that includes Britain, France, Germany, Russia and China, and which some are now calling the "G19," at least when it comes to the question of climate change. The C40 network of some of the world's largest cities, whose leaders include former New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg, said in a tweet that its members "stand together with the G19 leaders" to uphold the climate accord. "We are ready to save the planet, and with the support of the G19 leaders our progress cannot be stopped," said Paris Mayor Anne Hidalgo, the current C40 chair. Source | ||
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NewSunshine
United States5938 Posts
Fuck whichever party you like or don't like, this is a thoroughly awful picture. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22373 Posts
On July 09 2017 08:33 NewSunshine wrote: I don't even know if you can call Trump's administration an administration anymore. With hundreds of vacancies all across the government still unfilled, and now the man himself can't be arsed to attend an international meeting. The people who are left are either quitting, or simply can't get anything done. Fuck whichever party you like or don't like, this is a thoroughly awful picture. To be clear, Ivanka did not replace Donald for the entire meeting. He stepped out to meet with someone else (Indonesia I think it was) and Ivanka covered for him until he got back. Still wrong to use her and not some senior official he had with him but not as bad as missing the entire meeting. (ofc biased articles don't mention that little fact). | ||
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ZerOCoolSC2
9057 Posts
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ZerOCoolSC2
9057 Posts
On July 09 2017 08:38 Gorsameth wrote: To be clear, Ivanka did not replace Donald for the entire meeting. He stepped out to meet with someone else (Indonesia I think it was) and Ivanka covered for him until he got back. Still wrong to use her and not some senior official he had with him but not as bad as missing the entire meeting. (ofc biased articles don't mention that little fact). Indonesia could have waited. | ||
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KwarK
United States43991 Posts
Or just have someone competent whose job it is to represent the United States abroad. Who isn't a handbag saleswoman. Like a Secretary of State. | ||
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Kadungon
41 Posts
On July 09 2017 07:51 zlefin wrote: that makes you a terrible voter; if you're choosing the objectively worse choice and are aware of it Trump is objectively the better vote over Clinton (be it Hillary or Chelsea at that time). If you want to change the system, better elect someone that is so corrupt, criminal, and incompetent at being so as Trump, ending up in jail, than someone as slick and conniving as Clinton. They are both extremely right wing and both giving crony capitalism free play. At least with Trump, some people (but too few) will realize something needs to change. That said, I left the US and I don't plan on returning. I advice anyone educated and civilized to leave that sinking ship. Right now, it is fucked up for the poor. While it got worse, in a few years it will be fucked up for the middle class. And if this continues, in a decade or so, it will be fucked up for anyone not the super-rich. And at that point, the super-rich are going to get lynched. There is a breaking point. And then, it will be fucked up for everyone. On July 09 2017 08:38 Gorsameth wrote: To be clear, Ivanka did not replace Donald for the entire meeting. He stepped out to meet with someone else (Indonesia I think it was) and Ivanka covered for him until he got back. Still wrong to use her and not some senior official he had with him but not as bad as missing the entire meeting. (ofc biased articles don't mention that little fact). The problem is not Trump leaving for a bit, though him dropping the ball is a continuous pattern. The problem is him randomly having his daughter replace him. That's pure nepotism. And I understand why Trump does it. He is so incompetent and delusional, he cannot trust anyone but his family. Why? Because anyone that isn't his family cannot trust Trump. No one dares to take a stand and tell Trump he is wrong. For all people around Trump, it is all about manipulating Trump. Everyone around him for sure is smarter than he is. Anyone around the White House knows more about their subject than Trump does. He is like a child being in charge of a country. And that is how he must experience the presidency. He is completely overwhelmed, while he feels everyone around him is trying to manipulate him (which they are). So all he can do is trust family. Hence the nepotism. Typical dictatorship pattern. It also doesn't occur to him that he ought to have his top diplomat or top administrator represent him, rather than his daughter. He is oblivious. And now he is confused about why everyone hates him. He honestly believes the media reporting on this, being critical, is again some which hunt against him. I guess Trump should start wearing the 'Why Always me?' shirt Balotelli wore. | ||
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