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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Nakajin
Profile Blog Joined September 2014
Canada8989 Posts
January 31 2017 03:09 GMT
#134201
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?
Writerhttp://i.imgur.com/9p6ufcB.jpg
biology]major
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2253 Posts
January 31 2017 03:11 GMT
#134202
On January 31 2017 12:09 Nakajin wrote:
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?


the AG just determines what is lawful and what isn't. Sally went above and beyond by stating whether it was 'just' or 'right'. She should have just resigned, but wanted some publicity points on her departure.
Question.?
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
January 31 2017 03:13 GMT
#134203
On January 31 2017 12:11 biology]major wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:09 Nakajin wrote:
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?


the AG just determines what is lawful and what isn't. Sally went above and beyond by stating whether it was 'just' or 'right'. She should have just resigned, but wanted some publicity points on her departure.


She is sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution, not to obey all directions given by the POTUS.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-01-31 03:14:39
January 31 2017 03:13 GMT
#134204
On January 31 2017 12:00 biology]major wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 11:57 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
So anyone in government who doesn't comply is a betrayer. Any journalist that doesn't write what they like is the enemy, the opposition party, fake news.



calm down, we are so far away from facism it would require light speed travel and bending of spacetime to get there. Our institutions are stronger than Trump.

institutions strengthen and weaken over time.
behavior like this can cause them to be weakened unless it is very vigorously opposed, including opposition by his own party/supporters.
some people are being a bit excessive of course.

and our institutions are stronger than trump isn't much of an endorsement
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
biology]major
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2253 Posts
January 31 2017 03:14 GMT
#134205
On January 31 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:11 biology]major wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:09 Nakajin wrote:
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?


the AG just determines what is lawful and what isn't. Sally went above and beyond by stating whether it was 'just' or 'right'. She should have just resigned, but wanted some publicity points on her departure.


She is sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution, not to obey all directions given by the POTUS.


Well, she pulled a Comey by providing unnecessary details and explanations about what is right or wrong. That is the president's job. Her job is to simply state if it is legal or not. So no, she failed miserably and she is an interim AG with a few days left.
Question.?
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
January 31 2017 03:16 GMT
#134206
On January 31 2017 12:14 biology]major wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:11 biology]major wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:09 Nakajin wrote:
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?


the AG just determines what is lawful and what isn't. Sally went above and beyond by stating whether it was 'just' or 'right'. She should have just resigned, but wanted some publicity points on her departure.


She is sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution, not to obey all directions given by the POTUS.


Well, she pulled a Comey by providing unnecessary details and explanations about what is right or wrong. That is the president's job. Her job is to simply state if it is legal or not. So no, she failed miserably and she is an interim AG with a few days left.


Haha what? You must be trolling.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Nakajin
Profile Blog Joined September 2014
Canada8989 Posts
January 31 2017 03:17 GMT
#134207
On January 31 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:11 biology]major wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:09 Nakajin wrote:
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?


the AG just determines what is lawful and what isn't. Sally went above and beyond by stating whether it was 'just' or 'right'. She should have just resigned, but wanted some publicity points on her departure.


She is sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution, not to obey all directions given by the POTUS.


Ok, so she is like a judge, or just a legal advisor?
Writerhttp://i.imgur.com/9p6ufcB.jpg
ticklishmusic
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States15977 Posts
January 31 2017 03:17 GMT
#134208


Now that is some funny shit right there.
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
January 31 2017 03:17 GMT
#134209
On January 31 2017 12:17 Nakajin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:11 biology]major wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:09 Nakajin wrote:
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?


the AG just determines what is lawful and what isn't. Sally went above and beyond by stating whether it was 'just' or 'right'. She should have just resigned, but wanted some publicity points on her departure.


She is sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution, not to obey all directions given by the POTUS.


Ok, so she is like a judge, or just a legal advisor?


No she is the attorney that reps the Government the chief one at least.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
January 31 2017 03:18 GMT
#134210
On January 31 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:11 biology]major wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:09 Nakajin wrote:
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?


the AG just determines what is lawful and what isn't. Sally went above and beyond by stating whether it was 'just' or 'right'. She should have just resigned, but wanted some publicity points on her departure.


She is sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution, not to obey all directions given by the POTUS.

Her proclamation was absurdly obtuse in all of its political glory. Trump was right to can her, and I don't think that his language in the termination letter was out of place.
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
January 31 2017 03:19 GMT
#134211
I have to say that I think Trump did exactly what he should have with this obtuse and utterly politicized interim AG's statement. Good riddance.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
January 31 2017 03:22 GMT
#134212
On January 31 2017 12:19 LegalLord wrote:
I have to say that I think Trump did exactly what he should have with this obtuse and utterly politicized interim AG's statement. Good riddance.

firing was of course appropriate, what about the wording of the letter though?
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
Nakajin
Profile Blog Joined September 2014
Canada8989 Posts
January 31 2017 03:22 GMT
#134213
On January 31 2017 12:17 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:17 Nakajin wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:11 biology]major wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:09 Nakajin wrote:
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?


the AG just determines what is lawful and what isn't. Sally went above and beyond by stating whether it was 'just' or 'right'. She should have just resigned, but wanted some publicity points on her departure.


She is sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution, not to obey all directions given by the POTUS.


Ok, so she is like a judge, or just a legal advisor?


No she is the attorney that reps the Government the chief one at least.


I mean I can see why there is problem here, I don't really see why she has to believe if the law is constitutional or not, it's not her to decide. She probably didn't deserve to be insulted in a letter, but if your lawyer is not gonna represent you, you have to get another one, someone have to defend you, right or wrong.
Writerhttp://i.imgur.com/9p6ufcB.jpg
Djzapz
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada10681 Posts
January 31 2017 03:26 GMT
#134214
On January 31 2017 12:18 xDaunt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:11 biology]major wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:09 Nakajin wrote:
I honestly just want information, what are the power/responsibility of the AG exactly? It honestly is a bit strange to me to have someone working for the government as attorney to refuse to defend a executive order because he/she believe it is not constitutional, isn't that the judges work to decide?

I mean someone will have to defend the government in front of the court right?


the AG just determines what is lawful and what isn't. Sally went above and beyond by stating whether it was 'just' or 'right'. She should have just resigned, but wanted some publicity points on her departure.


She is sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution, not to obey all directions given by the POTUS.

Her proclamation was absurdly obtuse in all of its political glory. Trump was right to can her, and I don't think that his language in the termination letter was out of place.

You're blind now... it's sad.

User was warned for this post
"My incompetence with power tools had been increasing exponentially over the course of 20 years spent inhaling experimental oven cleaners"
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
January 31 2017 03:26 GMT
#134215
Nixon's AG resigned in protest. The AG is not supposed to be a rubber stamp for the president - the AG has his/her own mission to uphold the law.
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
January 31 2017 03:27 GMT
#134216
On January 31 2017 12:22 zlefin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:19 LegalLord wrote:
I have to say that I think Trump did exactly what he should have with this obtuse and utterly politicized interim AG's statement. Good riddance.

firing was of course appropriate, what about the wording of the letter though?

Betrayed =/= treason, so I don't see the problem here. She did indeed fail to do her job properly.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
January 31 2017 03:30 GMT
#134217
On January 31 2017 12:27 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:22 zlefin wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:19 LegalLord wrote:
I have to say that I think Trump did exactly what he should have with this obtuse and utterly politicized interim AG's statement. Good riddance.

firing was of course appropriate, what about the wording of the letter though?

Betrayed =/= treason, so I don't see the problem here. She did indeed fail to do her job properly.

it's still awfully strong wording throughout, and not very consistent wtih democratic standards. it does feel more like the kind of thing you hear in bad regimes.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-01-31 03:34:10
January 31 2017 03:30 GMT
#134218
Remember kids, grandiose political gestures that are outside the bounds of the ordinary are the exclusive purview of Trump. Nobody else is allowed to stand up for what they believe is right or break with traditional rules/standards for conduct!
ChristianS
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3295 Posts
January 31 2017 03:33 GMT
#134219
On January 31 2017 12:27 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:22 zlefin wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:19 LegalLord wrote:
I have to say that I think Trump did exactly what he should have with this obtuse and utterly politicized interim AG's statement. Good riddance.

firing was of course appropriate, what about the wording of the letter though?

Betrayed =/= treason, so I don't see the problem here. She did indeed fail to do her job properly.

Failed to do her job =/= traitor, and it's a longer walk from failed to do her job to traitor than it is from traitor to treason.

Anybody have a comment on Trump installing his own interim AG without any congressional approval, who can do whatever Trump asks until Congress gives him whoever he nominated? What's the point of requiring congressional approval if he can do whatever the fuck he wants while they deliberate?
"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." -Robert J. Hanlon
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
January 31 2017 03:36 GMT
#134220
On January 31 2017 12:27 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 31 2017 12:22 zlefin wrote:
On January 31 2017 12:19 LegalLord wrote:
I have to say that I think Trump did exactly what he should have with this obtuse and utterly politicized interim AG's statement. Good riddance.

firing was of course appropriate, what about the wording of the letter though?

Betrayed =/= treason, so I don't see the problem here. She did indeed fail to do her job properly.

they could have said that she got fired for being unable to do her job/for refusing to do her job.

Betrayal kinda makes it sound like she's going to end up in in the gulags...
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
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