EPT
) have commited murder or shall I say molested a child. He was young and stupid. I am pretty sure that once in our time that we have done something stupid that we have regret before. Savior plays BW games on Afreeca - Page 46
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
) have commited murder or shall I say molested a child. He was young and stupid. I am pretty sure that once in our time that we have done something stupid that we have regret before. | ||
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Zeke50100
United States2220 Posts
On June 19 2011 09:42 Xiphos wrote: Seriously its not like sAviOr (yes the correct way of spelling it ) have commited murder or shall I say molested a child. He was young and stupid. I am pretty sure that once in our time that we have done something stupid that we have regret before. But betting is still horribly illegal in Korea, so there's unfortunately nothing to be done. We can only hope for SC2, and even that's a stretch. | ||
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Little-Chimp
Canada948 Posts
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ShaLLoW[baY]
Canada12499 Posts
On June 19 2011 12:02 Little-Chimp wrote: I wish Savior would be allowed to play in leagues again. I think the guy definitely learned his lesson and a 1-2 year ban was punishment enough. Not to mention the guy was a big E-sports draw and a Savior return would be big news. Not to mention I would start crying with a complete lack of shame. | ||
Plexa
Aotearoa39261 Posts
On June 19 2011 09:42 Xiphos wrote: Seriously its not like sAviOr (yes the correct way of spelling it ) have commited murder or shall I say molested a child. He was young and stupid. I am pretty sure that once in our time that we have done something stupid that we have regret before. Yeah he only fucked over the integrity of esports, exploited his position in the industry to ruin the lives of numerous other progamers (yarnc, upmagic etc) and betrayed the trust of the entire scene. Not to mention compromising the future of BW. Yeah. No biggie. -_- | ||
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SalsaShark
United States56 Posts
On June 19 2011 14:48 Plexa wrote: Yeah he only fucked over the integrity of esports, exploited his position in the industry to ruin the lives of numerous other progamers (yarnc, upmagic etc) and betrayed the trust of the entire scene. Not to mention compromising the future of BW. Yeah. No biggie. -_- Hey i can make gross exaggerations too, it doesn't change the fact that Xiphos had a valid point. Banning savior from e-sports removed his true passion from life, for his entire life. You can be as conservative as you want about the horrible things he did (and you are right, there's no way to doubt that they were horrible), but a permanent ban from the most meaningful thing in his life? You gotta be kidding me. If the integrity of the entire e-sports world were "fucked over" by what savior did, then i'm a flying spaghetti monster. If he made such a stain on the scene, why haven't other high profile players been busted? Because they know he was young and stupid, and know not to make the same mistakes he did. | ||
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Plexa
Aotearoa39261 Posts
On June 19 2011 14:57 SalsaShark wrote: Hey i can make gross exaggerations too, it doesn't change the fact that Xiphos had a valid point. Banning savior from e-sports removed his true passion from life, for his entire life. You can be as conservative as you want about the horrible things he did (and you are right, there's no way to doubt that they were horrible), but a permanent ban from the most meaningful thing in his life? You gotta be kidding me. If the integrity of the entire e-sports world were "fucked over" by what savior did, then i'm a flying spaghetti monster. If he made such a stain on the scene, why haven't other high profile players been busted? Because they know he was young and stupid, and know not to make the same mistakes he did. If anything, what I said was an understatement. Savior deserves to have his right to compete removed from him as punishment. I don't see how anyone can argue otherwise. However, no one can stop him from playing starcraft - we can't take that away from him. Have we already forgotten these? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=130217 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=125601 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=129321 The gravity of this goes far beyond a simple 'mistake' or some stupid we did once in our lives. He was actively making these deals happen, and on multiple occasions. Recall the black sox scandal - they were all banned for life as well. Why haven't other high profile players been busted? Because they are not involved. And if they are, then it's just a matter of time. The whole incident is a dark patch in BW's history and indeed provoked many questions about the esports industry in korea. Him streaming is one thing, him participating in tournaments is another. | ||
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Moa
United States790 Posts
As for savior I don't think I can have a very informed opinion as I wasn't in the community as this happened and still only loosely follow the BW scene. Almost all I know is from reading the article TL wrote on his play but from what I read and the videos I watched in that post I certainly want to see him play. | ||
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dafunk
France521 Posts
I love the guy and everybody deserves a 2nd chance. Even rapists have 2nd chance. Theres been match fixing scandals in every sports in every country in the world. Thats not such a big deal. Most of the time they just get like 1 / 2 years ban and a fee. | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
On June 19 2011 15:23 dafunk wrote: I don't give a fuck. I don't give a fuck that you don't give a fuck. | ||
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Legatus Lanius
2135 Posts
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DaemonX
545 Posts
Savior would have to do something *big* for the community to start to turn people's opinions around, and to convince any league of any game that he would be ok to let back in. He isn't starting from zero, he's starting from -1,000. Even then some will never forgive him...but obviously if he does ever have a future in gaming, it will be in SC2. Maybe if he offered a free workshop to players for a few months or something. It would have to be a pretty big contribution to the scene to start to make up the damage he did. | ||
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Aus)MaCrO
Australia349 Posts
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LEGAsee
170 Posts
On June 19 2011 14:57 SalsaShark wrote: Hey i can make gross exaggerations too, it doesn't change the fact that Xiphos had a valid point. Banning savior from e-sports removed his true passion from life, for his entire life. You can be as conservative as you want about the horrible things he did (and you are right, there's no way to doubt that they were horrible), but a permanent ban from the most meaningful thing in his life? You gotta be kidding me. If the integrity of the entire e-sports world were "fucked over" by what savior did, then i'm a flying spaghetti monster. If he made such a stain on the scene, why haven't other high profile players been busted? Because they know he was young and stupid, and know not to make the same mistakes he did. The industry had already become suspect following the war3. Hello, Mr. Flying Spaghetti Monster. | ||
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red4ce
United States7313 Posts
On June 19 2011 12:02 Little-Chimp wrote: I wish Savior would be allowed to play in leagues again. I think the guy definitely learned his lesson and a 1-2 year ban was punishment enough. Not to mention the guy was a big E-sports draw and a Savior return would be big news. Even before he was banned Savior was washed up and getting bounced out of the OSL/MSL preliminaries. He hasn't been an elite player since 2008. By the end of his career watching Savior play was more depressing than inspirational. If Savior came back people would tune in for the first game, then after he gets roflstomped everyone would remember that he wasn't even good anymore. I doubt Savior would even be a regular starter for CJ given how well they are playing right now. On June 19 2011 14:57 SalsaShark wrote: Hey i can make gross exaggerations too, it doesn't change the fact that Xiphos had a valid point. Banning savior from e-sports removed his true passion from life, for his entire life. You can be as conservative as you want about the horrible things he did (and you are right, there's no way to doubt that they were horrible), but a permanent ban from the most meaningful thing in his life? You gotta be kidding me. If the integrity of the entire e-sports world were "fucked over" by what savior did, then i'm a flying spaghetti monster. If he made such a stain on the scene, why haven't other high profile players been busted? Because they know he was young and stupid, and know not to make the same mistakes he did. So the world should be awarding leniency to criminals based on 'meaninfulness' lol. If Savior loved e-sports as much as you say he did, he would never have done what he did. You say e-sports was the most meaningful thing in Savior's life. Savior's actions say he cared more about $$$. On June 19 2011 15:23 dafunk wrote: I don't give a fuck. I love the guy and everybody deserves a 2nd chance. Even rapists have 2nd chance. Theres been match fixing scandals in every sports in every country in the world. Thats not such a big deal. Most of the time they just get like 1 / 2 years ban and a fee. That isn't even remotely close to the truth. Every major sport takes match-fixing seriously and lifetime bans are handed out regularly to those who are caught. | ||
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Daozzt
United States1263 Posts
On June 19 2011 15:23 dafunk wrote: I don't give a fuck. I love the guy and everybody deserves a 2nd chance. Even rapists have 2nd chance. Theres been match fixing scandals in every sports in every country in the world. Thats not such a big deal. Most of the time they just get like 1 / 2 years ban and a fee. It's nice that he's streaming and everything, but he doesn't deserve a second chance. It's as dumb as if David Stern was caught match fixing NBA games, and only got a 2 year ban before he's back as the commissioner. Ok, that was a bad analogy, but Savior's greed killed the integrity of the BW scene. It's actually not an exaggeration to say that his actions nearly destroyed the Korean BW industry, and caused problems for many players and teams (Sparkyz). | ||
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Gamegene
United States8308 Posts
Don't set aside values and morals over a game. | ||
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Plexa
Aotearoa39261 Posts
On June 19 2011 16:03 DaemonX wrote: I view Savior and Justin as enablers. While getting involved was fucking stupid on their half, they wouldn't have been put in that position if it weren't for them. Further, given that they were only kids with minimal education it's feasible they they didn't appreciate the gravity of their crimes esp. since their hyungs (justin/savior) were involved.Plexa is basically right on all fronts. Except that obviously the other players involved didn't get 'ruined' by him - anyone who threw a match knew they were doing something egregiously wrong. | ||
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Disarray
United States1164 Posts
On June 19 2011 16:45 Plexa wrote: I view Savior and Justin as enablers. While getting involved was fucking stupid on their half, they wouldn't have been put in that position if it weren't for them. Further, given that they were only kids with minimal education it's feasible they they didn't appreciate the gravity of their crimes esp. since their hyungs (justin/savior) were involved. Thats like saying Savior wouldn't have gotten involved if the treatment of pro-gamers in Korea was better | ||
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ShaLLoW[baY]
Canada12499 Posts
My two favorite progamers  At least Nal_rA is clean. | ||
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