I was really bummed when I saw that the Oov/NaDa match is off. I thought "those two have such history." Plus I wanted NaDa to spank that gorilla.
But I just realized that every match being played today has particular history. Yellow vs Anytime is a rematch from SO1 where Anytime went 3 gate DT rush. If the map was R-Point instead of Outsider it would be a perfect rematch. Ra vs Kingdom is a tie-breaker match from their long history. They are 12-12 against each other. Also, at one point, Kingdom was known for his good record against Ra (winning every BO3+ head-to-head). Finally, Tossgirl and Reach has the incident Reach apologized for the other day. Not as deep a history as the other matches IMO, but still something.
On July 20 2009 13:26 konadora wrote: I believe ALL the matches have some sort of history or another. Maybe except Boxer vs Tossgirl ~_~
hmm...well...they did play as a 2v2 team together a reeeeally long time ago?:p
Wtf they did? VOD NOW xD damn i was looking forward to Nada-Oov =(
hmm, i think vods from really old matches are really hard to find and i don't even know if they exist anymore! however there are some screenshots! here they are..
On July 20 2009 13:26 konadora wrote: I believe ALL the matches have some sort of history or another. Maybe except Boxer vs Tossgirl ~_~
Well, I know many of them have history. Some A LOT of history. But not all. Tossgirl against anyone except Yellow or Reach feels like just another game. Savior against anyone other than NaDa, Oov or Ra feels likewise to me (don't get me wrong, I'm a HUGE Savior fan, but those are the games that really feel special). Anytime against any of the other tosses doesn't seem particularly special to me (though Anytime vs Yellow, Boxer, Oov, or NaDa does). Reach, Ra, Kingdom, NaDa, Boxer and Oov all have some history against pretty much anyone who was ever on any Who's Who list of Starcraft gamers (except maybe "Who's Who Among Foreigners," but since foreigners have been utter suck compared to Korean progamers since like 2002, that list doesn't really matter). However, even among them, there are some games that feel more special. Ra vs Oov doesn't have the same kick as Reach vs Oov. Kingdom's main history with Boxer and Oov was as teammates and I can't say I'd enjoy those possible matches as much as Kingdom vs NaDa, Ra, or Reach. Yellow against Oov doesn't really matter when compared with Yellow against Boxer or NaDa. Yellow vs Kingdom is also pretty much irrelevant compared with other Yellow vs the other tosses.
Anyway, I'm rambling and should probably go to bed. But the point is that today's line-up is particularly interesting even without the real match of the night being played.
Everybody here on TL needs to make an agreement that if Reach loses to Tossgirl, we are all going to have a moment of silence. Or like Railz said, they can just lock the site for 24 hours.
On July 20 2009 17:39 jhNz wrote: is the word "bonjwa" used for girls / in the female sc scene too? if so, Tossgirl is definitly the female version of it ^^
I've given up on Liquibet for the season, just betting the people I really want to win. So I bet Tossgirl for two of the next three games. Except Boxer. There's no way she's beating Boxer.
On July 20 2009 18:38 So no fek wrote: I've given up on Liquibet for the season, just betting the people I really want to win. So I bet Tossgirl for two of the next three games. Except Boxer. There's no way she's beating Boxer.
I was in top 20 for quite a while.. Up until the e-Stars tourney started..
Of course I'm sad that we don't get to see Oov compete, but if you think about it, it's only fair. After all, the players from the other group are also getting a free win, in the form of Tossgirl.
Yellow is turtling like a bitch and teching to hive. He's using Mutalisks to try and stop Anytime from getting too many bases, but that isn't working out too well.
Yellow attacking Anytime's 6 mineral only with mutas and a ton of scourge. Anytime lets it go. He's not going to break Yellow's front no matter how many forces he has lol.
Yellow taking out Anytime's Nexus at the double gas at 3. Nothing Anytime can do. Anytime has a templar chilling at Yellow's 12... 5 kills o it. Guardians are ripping apart Anytime's 3.
Haha cute. Yellow puts a nydus on the other side of the minerals to bring troops in. Yellow attacking with drops on one side and the nydus forces on the other. Reavers are killing a ton of shit.
On July 20 2009 19:05 samachking wrote: This game was really terrible . Ace players should stick to all ins in this mu . They can only PvT/PvP/ZvZ, but their other mus are a big
Sheesh. I don't know where all this is coming from. Anytime might have stuttered a bit, but I thought Kong was excellent. He showed really good control and strategy there.
On July 20 2009 19:05 samachking wrote: This game was really terrible . Ace players should stick to all ins in this mu . They can only PvT/PvP/ZvZ, but their other mus are a big
Sheesh. I don't know where all this is coming from. Anytime might have stuttered a bit, but I thought Kong was excellent. He showed really good control and strategy there.
On July 20 2009 19:05 samachking wrote: This game was really terrible . Ace players should stick to all ins in this mu . They can only PvT/PvP/ZvZ, but their other mus are a big
Sheesh. I don't know where all this is coming from. Anytime might have stuttered a bit, but I thought Kong was excellent. He showed really good control and strategy there.
What was so terrible about that game?
How about Anytime going mass nexii + canons without mustering a ground army in the 15 minutes without HARASSING YELLOW ONCE, and getting a double stargate without adding a robo and going reaver/sair which is the only way to win in this map if you dont go for a goon heavy late game sunk push which he didnt, and his army was tiny all of the time due to double stargate + imma mass nexii + probes + canons.
Manner Pylon by Nal_ra in Kingdom's mineral line that catches 2 probes. Nal_ra sends 2 zealots but pulls one back. Nal_ra sneaks a zealot around and hides it in the corner.
Nal_ra snipes 2 probes with his dragoons before backing them off. He now has them camped at the top of a ramp. He's bringing more goons to reinforce. Nal_ra attacks with his forces, Kingdom brings 2 probes to help fend off Nal_ra's attack.
Kingdom carelessly loses an observer to Nal_ra's forces. Nal_ra charging into Kingdom's base! Kingdom gets quite a few shots off on Nal_ra's forces! Nal_ra gets 3 goons to the top of the ramp but has to retreat with his others. Both players macroing up.
Nal_ra has a shuttle though. Reavers are coming.
Kingdom seems to have more gates.
Observer ALMOST sees the shuttle but it probably didn't.
2 Carriers out for Reach, building 2 more. Tossgirl snipes 2 probes at the third that Reach is trying to set up. Tossgirl has now scanned the carriers and is building gols.
Reach failed hard right there, he just threw different half-ass attacks at her not really trying. And wtf was that with the island expo, did he really expect to keep that?
There have been worse. But it was pretty close. And there's a chance I might be confusing it with the most one sided bet, that wasn't an upset, but I'm pretty sure there was one that was a more one sided upset.
On July 20 2009 20:27 icystorage wrote: reach probably wants to make it up to tossgirl xD excellent play by tossgirl btw
Can someone explain to me what he's making up for? There were several people mentioning Reach apologizing for something prior to the match, but I have no idea what they're referring to. Can anyone enlighten me?
On July 20 2009 20:27 icystorage wrote: reach probably wants to make it up to tossgirl xD excellent play by tossgirl btw
Can someone explain to me what he's making up for? There were several people mentioning Reach apologizing for something prior to the match, but I have no idea what they're referring to. Can anyone enlighten me?
On July 20 2009 20:27 icystorage wrote: reach probably wants to make it up to tossgirl xD excellent play by tossgirl btw
Can someone explain to me what he's making up for? There were several people mentioning Reach apologizing for something prior to the match, but I have no idea what they're referring to. Can anyone enlighten me?
he was apologizing for a match in germany , it supposed to be a showmatch for a german fans , and instead of a showmatch Reach totally destroyed her . She was pretty pissed off afaik .
On July 20 2009 20:27 icystorage wrote: reach probably wants to make it up to tossgirl xD excellent play by tossgirl btw
Can someone explain to me what he's making up for? There were several people mentioning Reach apologizing for something prior to the match, but I have no idea what they're referring to. Can anyone enlighten me?
On July 20 2009 20:27 icystorage wrote: reach probably wants to make it up to tossgirl xD excellent play by tossgirl btw
Can someone explain to me what he's making up for? There were several people mentioning Reach apologizing for something prior to the match, but I have no idea what they're referring to. Can anyone enlighten me?
3 years ago he promised to play an entertaining long game with tossgirl as a showmatch, but then didn't because he panicked and was afraid of losing to her
he apologized for it recently, because she brought it up in an interview
some fools think he gave away this game to make it up to her, but no way he did, because losing to her is still a stigma, and if he won he could've made it out of his group for a chance at $40,000
On July 20 2009 20:27 icystorage wrote: reach probably wants to make it up to tossgirl xD excellent play by tossgirl btw
Can someone explain to me what he's making up for? There were several people mentioning Reach apologizing for something prior to the match, but I have no idea what they're referring to. Can anyone enlighten me?
I can't believe she said they had previously agreed to play a certain way to provide an "entertaining" game. Just letting that be public clouds any of her future games, especially ones she "wins." Having to hear an apology for not playing a predictable game is astounding... A bulldog in this game, that's a build you use versus players who you know are stronger than you -- as you figure it at least gives you a chance. If it works -- it's gg and far from entertaining. After making an apology then playing this style, it's "interesting," which is too bad.
On July 20 2009 20:34 machinehead.. wrote: I can't believe she said they had previously agreed to play a certain way to provide an "entertaining" game. Just letting that be public clouds any of her future games, especially ones she "wins." Having to hear an apology for not playing a predictable game is astounding... A bulldog in this game, that's a build you use versus players who you know are stronger than you -- as you figure it at least gives you a chance. If it works -- it's gg and far from entertaining. After making an apology then playing this style, it's "interesting," which is too bad.
if anything, those comments took pressure off of reach, but that doesn't mean he meant to toss the game. MAYBE he went a little softball at first to give her a chance, but after that initial bulldog, he played like he meant it
On July 20 2009 20:34 machinehead.. wrote: I can't believe she said they had previously agreed to play a certain way to provide an "entertaining" game. Just letting that be public clouds any of her future games, especially ones she "wins." Having to hear an apology for not playing a predictable game is astounding... A bulldog in this game, that's a build you use versus players who you know are stronger than you -- as you figure it at least gives you a chance. If it works -- it's gg and far from entertaining. After making an apology then playing this style, it's "interesting," which is too bad.
if anything, those comments took pressure off of reach, but that doesn't mean he meant to toss the game. MAYBE he went a little softball at first to give her a chance, but after that initial bulldog, he played like he meant it
Mayb that was the planned strategy for the games in Germany lol..
If you are at the level Reach is, you should never have to use a bull dog versus tossgirl, and that would be my point. If the other player is given any sort of inkling that a bulldog may be incoming, the fate of the game is pretty much already decided. He may not have tossed the game per se, but I find it highly likely he didn't show his "A" game.
I would guess that reach doesn't think this is very funny. His play was very surprising especially considering how he probably would win if he just played a standard game. I wonder why he chose to take such risks.
Stork vs Last is a bigger upset in my opinion. And Stork lost that in more humiliating fashion :<
P.S. what's with all the sexist comments? jesus, I'd like to see any of you scrubby 10 yr olds take a game off Tossgirl. She played great! And to the conspiracy theorists who think Reach "threw" the game, you guys are crazy. Korean progamers don't throw games (except at WCG). He didn't bulldog to "go soft on her." He probably did it because he took out that first tank and thought he saw a window. And how is that keeping a promise? Bulldog rushes aren't the best way to open into a long game are they?
lulz, whats with all the sexist comments? Uh, shes a girl, and girls are, as a rule, terrible and less dedicated to gaming then men? And even if you are to ignore the emasculating factor of losing to a girl in something that is culturally and physically a male sport [hand eye coordination>male thing], tossgirl as an individual, is simply fucking horrible at starcraft. xD
On July 21 2009 03:40 Dazed_Spy wrote: lulz, whats with all the sexist comments? Uh, shes a girl, and girls are, as a rule, terrible and less dedicated to gaming then men? And even if you are to ignore the emasculating factor of losing to a girl in something that is culturally and physically a male sport [hand eye coordination>male thing], tossgirl as an individual, is simply fucking horrible at starcraft. xD
Poor reach.
Haha I wasn't aware my penis affected how well my hands and eyes coordinate. Thanks for telling me! Maybe this is why men have this proclivity to watch porno with their eyes while jerking with their hands? It ALL makes sense now!
On a serious note though, I hope you're joking. And TossGirl isn't horrible, she's just got a lack of confidence. I feel bad for her tbh. If people stopped putting so much attention on her and playing her up as the ONE FEMALE GAMER, I'm sure she could have grown a lot more as a player, rather than wasting all her thoughts on reputation.
On July 21 2009 03:40 Dazed_Spy wrote: lulz, whats with all the sexist comments? Uh, shes a girl, and girls are, as a rule, terrible and less dedicated to gaming then men? And even if you are to ignore the emasculating factor of losing to a girl in something that is culturally and physically a male sport [hand eye coordination>male thing], tossgirl as an individual, is simply fucking horrible at starcraft. xD
What's the big deal here. I'm actually happy and glad that Tossgirl won her match and will be looking forward to watching the VOD (I see it's already uploaded on YouTube).
Also it's not like she defeated Reach in his prime in an OSL final or something. Let's face it, none of the gamers playing in this tournament could even come close to beating the likes of Bisu, Jaedong, or Flash. They are all pretty average players in this day and age.
It's like in tennis, I'm sure Serena Williams could defeat the men's world number 150 but she'd struggle to take a single game off Federer or Nadal. What is Reach's rank now? Probably less than 150?
It's like in tennis, I'm sure Serena Williams could defeat the men's world number 150 but she'd struggle to take a single game off Federer or Nadal. What is Reach's rank now? Probably less than 150?
lol you wish, Serena would not be able to beat any players inside the top 1000 for the ATP.
On July 21 2009 06:38 ssj114 wrote: What's the big deal here. I'm actually happy and glad that Tossgirl won her match and will be looking forward to watching the VOD (I see it's already uploaded on YouTube).
Also it's not like she defeated Reach in his prime in an OSL final or something. Let's face it, none of the gamers playing in this tournament could even come close to beating the likes of Bisu, Jaedong, or Flash. They are all pretty average players in this day and age.
It's like in tennis, I'm sure Serena Williams could defeat the men's world number 150 but she'd struggle to take a single game off Federer or Nadal. What is Reach's rank now? Probably less than 150?
So one of these players beat Bisu a few weeks ago.
And Reach is 59th atm if you must know. TGirl 167th.
It's like in tennis, I'm sure Serena Williams could defeat the men's world number 150 but she'd struggle to take a single game off Federer or Nadal. What is Reach's rank now? Probably less than 150?
lol you wish, Serena would not be able to beat any players inside the top 1000 for the ATP.
Agreed, although I'd pick a number less than 1000, but larger than 150 obv
It's like in tennis, I'm sure Serena Williams could defeat the men's world number 150 but she'd struggle to take a single game off Federer or Nadal. What is Reach's rank now? Probably less than 150?
lol you wish, Serena would not be able to beat any players inside the top 1000 for the ATP.
Agreed, although I'd pick a number less than 1000, but larger than 150 obv
Not to mention SC is more volatile than tennis. Federer has over an 80% over his entire career. Waay longer and better than any SC player's. Not to mention he went 95-3 one year, compared to Effort's paltry 26-3.
you know i think reach got a little overconfident and went for upper right not thinking tossgirl had any way to atk it, but not only did he lose a whole expansion, he lost a lot of units/resources trying to defend it
On July 21 2009 03:40 Dazed_Spy wrote: lulz, whats with all the sexist comments? Uh, shes a girl, and girls are, as a rule, terrible and less dedicated to gaming then men? And even if you are to ignore the emasculating factor of losing to a girl in something that is culturally and physically a male sport [hand eye coordination>male thing], tossgirl as an individual, is simply fucking horrible at starcraft. xD
Poor reach.
Haha I wasn't aware my penis affected how well my hands and eyes coordinate. Thanks for telling me! Maybe this is why men have this proclivity to watch porno with their eyes while jerking with their hands? It ALL makes sense now!
On a serious note though, I hope you're joking. And TossGirl isn't horrible, she's just got a lack of confidence. I feel bad for her tbh. If people stopped putting so much attention on her and playing her up as the ONE FEMALE GAMER, I'm sure she could have grown a lot more as a player, rather than wasting all her thoughts on reputation.
lawl like totally man, gender means nothing! I mean it doesnt have any effect on the makeup of the mind, eye hand coordination, emotions, hormones, physique, or ANYTHING else, WHATSOEVER. INFACT! You know that whole thing about sex? Ye know, the concept of there being social definitions of whats acceptable for each gender and thus influencing their actions subconsciously, interests etc? Doesn't exist either. Reality as we know it? Fabrication. Tossgirl is JUST like every other male gamer and there is NOTHING remotely taboo or shocking that she defeated reach in Korea, in the West, or anywhere else.
On July 21 2009 03:40 Dazed_Spy wrote: lulz, whats with all the sexist comments? Uh, shes a girl, and girls are, as a rule, terrible and less dedicated to gaming then men? And even if you are to ignore the emasculating factor of losing to a girl in something that is culturally and physically a male sport [hand eye coordination>male thing], tossgirl as an individual, is simply fucking horrible at starcraft. xD
Poor reach.
Haha I wasn't aware my penis affected how well my hands and eyes coordinate. Thanks for telling me! Maybe this is why men have this proclivity to watch porno with their eyes while jerking with their hands? It ALL makes sense now!
On a serious note though, I hope you're joking. And TossGirl isn't horrible, she's just got a lack of confidence. I feel bad for her tbh. If people stopped putting so much attention on her and playing her up as the ONE FEMALE GAMER, I'm sure she could have grown a lot more as a player, rather than wasting all her thoughts on reputation.
lawl like totally man, gender means nothing! I mean it doesnt have any effect on the makeup of the mind, eye hand coordination, emotions, hormones, physique, or ANYTHING else, WHATSOEVER. INFACT! You know that whole thing about sex? Ye know, the concept of there being social definitions of whats acceptable for each gender and thus influencing their actions subconsciously, interests etc? Doesn't exist either. Reality as we know it? Fabrication. Tossgirl is JUST like every other male gamer and there is NOTHING remotely taboo or shocking that she defeated reach in Korea, in the West, or anywhere else.
anannanananananana.
Of course it's shocking because the only reason she gets any attention is because she is a girl. I'm not saying that's right, but that's how it is. Although, I'm more shocked that reach threw this game away more so than tossgirl taking advantage.
It's like in tennis, I'm sure Serena Williams could defeat the men's world number 150 but she'd struggle to take a single game off Federer or Nadal. What is Reach's rank now? Probably less than 150?
lol you wish, Serena would not be able to beat any players inside the top 1000 for the ATP.
Agreed, although I'd pick a number less than 1000, but larger than 150 obv
Except Serena is ranked on a different system from the ATP unlike Tossgirl.
I dont think e-starts is rigged. I do think that he threw that game, I just watched it. His carriers and goons could have crushed her about 3/4 of the way though, but he pulls em back to deal with 4 vultures? IMO he threw it for her.
On July 14 2009 23:07 Rekrul wrote: the funniest part is, none of you have a clue about the biggest scandal to date
This e-stars is rigged just my opinion....
Stop making baseless assumption please. The first thing you should know about Starcraft progamers is that most of them have tremedous pride in what they're doing. Dare you ask MANTOSS to lose on purpose, he will fucking smack your head into halves.
On July 14 2009 23:07 Rekrul wrote: the funniest part is, none of you have a clue about the biggest scandal to date
This e-stars is rigged just my opinion....
Stop making baseless assumption please. The first thing you should know about Starcraft progamers is that most of them have tremedous pride in what they're doing. Dare you ask MANTOSS to lose on purpose, he will fucking smack your head into halves.
"stop making baseless assumptions" "makes a baseless assumption" ?
EPT
iloveoov < Nostalgia > 
[NC]..YellOw < Outsider > 
AnyTime..[gm]
here they are..![[image loading]](http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_1xQanRh__IQ/SmP__jpYUEI/AAAAAAAAACc/b-FQBhS83ww/s320/tg+n+b.bmp)
![[image loading]](http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1xQanRh__IQ/SmP_xamfYxI/AAAAAAAAACU/3yGGo857eMM/s320/tg+n+b+2.bmp)
