Group D: James Foo < Androide Nyoken > cooch Nyoken > Androide cooch < Androide Ass > Nyoken Ass < Androide James Foo > cooch James Foo > Nyoken James Foo > Ass cooch < Ass
#1 Dreiven #2 HwaSin[S.sIR] (He only has 2 opponents, so he will maybe drop a game. Ending up in spot #2 with Dreiven #1. HwaSins risk to drop a game is not that big, because he won't lose to maix. So even if Maix wins vs Dreiven its 1-1 for all and it will be a tie-breaker.)
Group F:
#1 Stork (He won't drop on purpose because HwaSin will do it. Storks group is too dangerous (sounds funny..) to drop a game on purpose) #2 EX
Group G:
#1 PJ #2 Moonzerg
Group H:
#1 sAviOr #2 Mondi
Results: (Admin feel free to add when I go to sleep after the 2nd round)
i sense savior losing at least one match. most likely vs mondragon since it's on pa 1.0, and i got a gut feeling reason's got something cooked up for him.
I've always wanted foreigners to eliminate one progamer in the group stage. It's been so close sometimes but in the end the pros always made it through. Although I'm hoping for an upset I think it's not gonna happen this time either. Well that's the idea of an upset but anyways
On October 05 2007 17:51 G.s)NarutO wrote: I'd like to see korean vs korean as late as possible. So I'm ok with Stork or HwaSin throwing a game just like HonestTea.
@ Bellsprout, sAviOr will immediatly scout what Mondragon builds, there is no way you can win when sAviOr knows what you do I guess!
1:37) Rö: if you beat savior (1:37) Rö: I'll buy you 10 beers (1:37) Rö: (1:37) mondragon-@gmx.d: make it 50 and im gonna beat him (1:38) Rö: 25 (1:38) mondragon-@gmx.d: ``
On October 05 2007 19:15 mcmascote wrote: Ok guys, lets do a sig bet..
I will take Reason over savior.. but I need good odds..
If I lose I'll use your sig for two months, if you lose you will use my sig until sc2 comes out..
I'm gonna go to University now and will come back 1 hour before the game starts.. just pm me or post here if you wanna accept the sig bet..
Edit: I only accept the bet from guys with 1000 posts or more..
I accept. If I lose I'm going to use your signature until Starcraft 2 comes out (no racist signature or stuff). If you lose you will use the signature I tell you for about 2 month!
On October 05 2007 19:15 mcmascote wrote: Ok guys, lets do a sig bet..
I will take Reason over savior.. but I need good odds..
If I lose I'll use your sig for two months, if you lose you will use my sig until sc2 comes out..
I'm gonna go to University now and will come back 1 hour before the game starts.. just pm me or post here if you wanna accept the sig bet..
Edit: I only accept the bet from guys with 1000 posts or more..
I accept. If I lose I'm going to use your signature until Starcraft 2 comes out (no racist signature or stuff). If you lose you will use the signature I tell you for about 2 month!
My bet:
sAviOr > Reason
Your bet:
Reason > sAviOr
Done. I think I got good odds..
If in the past we had made a similar bet about sc:ghost you would be using my sig until forever. LOL.
On October 05 2007 17:51 G.s)NarutO wrote: I'd like to see korean vs korean as late as possible. So I'm ok with Stork or HwaSin throwing a game just like HonestTea.
@ Bellsprout, sAviOr will immediatly scout what Mondragon builds, there is no way you can win when sAviOr knows what you do I guess!
they are playing on pa with imba starting positions yes?
and w/o OT: I think HwaSin will drop game against Maix because he'll think Z>P and that its easier to go 14CC and lose to zerglings than do some weird b-u vs P which would look more obvious for the fans especially when the game is going to be broadcasted ^^; So if Dreiven loses vs Maix it will be #1 Maix #2 HwaSin. If not everyone will be tied and now HwaSin will have to gamble again hahahaha xD
On October 05 2007 20:28 Musli wrote: what a frog xD
and w/o OT: I think HwaSin will drop game with Maix because he'll think Z>P and that its easier to go 14CC and lose to zerglings than do some weird b-u vs P which would look more obvious for the fans especially when this game is broadcasted. So if Dreiven lose vs Maix it will be #1Maix #2HwaSin. if not everyone will be tied and now HwaSin will have to gamble again hahahaha xD
Maybe you are right. Whats clear to me is, that HwaSin will drop a game. It depends on who he thinks is the bigger threat!
On October 05 2007 20:19 atmablade wrote: How can you lose when you look this badass?
credits: fighterforum and esforce
Anyone know what kind of hat Savior is wearing? It looks kind of like a Boston Red Sox hat but that's probably just because I'm from Boston because I don't think that's a B, it's hard to tell though. It's the right coloring.
On October 05 2007 17:51 G.s)NarutO wrote: I'd like to see korean vs korean as late as possible. So I'm ok with Stork or HwaSin throwing a game just like HonestTea.
@ Bellsprout, sAviOr will immediatly scout what Mondragon builds, there is no way you can win when sAviOr knows what you do I guess!
1:37) Rö: if you beat savior (1:37) Rö: I'll buy you 10 beers (1:37) Rö: (1:37) mondragon-@gmx.d: make it 50 and im gonna beat him (1:38) Rö: 25 (1:38) mondragon-@gmx.d: ``
we need sponsorship
Since when beer come in a pack of 25? are u going to buy a 24 + 1 beer separately?
On October 05 2007 22:07 xM(Z wrote: if the players playing vs koreans sense they'll drop the game then they should just gg and let the koreans duke it out.
On October 05 2007 17:51 G.s)NarutO wrote: I'd like to see korean vs korean as late as possible. So I'm ok with Stork or HwaSin throwing a game just like HonestTea.
@ Bellsprout, sAviOr will immediatly scout what Mondragon builds, there is no way you can win when sAviOr knows what you do I guess!
1:37) Rö: if you beat savior (1:37) Rö: I'll buy you 10 beers (1:37) Rö: (1:37) mondragon-@gmx.d: make it 50 and im gonna beat him (1:38) Rö: 25 (1:38) mondragon-@gmx.d: ``
we need sponsorship
Since when beer come in a pack of 25? are u going to buy a 24 + 1 beer separately?
On October 05 2007 22:09 TagoMago wrote: hey guys u know who play vs who next round ? i mean groupA 1st vs groupX 2nd etc. anyone know ?
Last 16
1) 1st place of E vs 2nd place of A 2) 1st place of F vs 2nd place of B 3) 2nd place of E vs 1st place of A 4) 2nd place of F vs 1st place of B 5) 1st place of G vs 2nd place of C 6) 1st place of H vs 2nd place of D 7) 2nd place of G vs 1st place of C 8) 2nd place of H sv 1st place of D
Quarterfinal
1) Winner of 1) vs Winner of 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs Winner of 4) 3) Winner of 5) vs Winner of 6) 4) Winner of 7) vs Winner of 8)
Semifinal
1) Winner of 1) vs 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs 4)
Final
Winner of 1) Semi Final vs Winner of 2) Semi Final
But he will play Goody if he gets first in his group and he probably doesn't want to play against Phoenix in the round of 16. Or do you mean that he missed the point about avoiding savior in the round after that ?
On October 06 2007 01:50 {88}iNcontroL wrote: phoenix is translating for him and said that he plays "Goody" if he gets first. They are really nice but struggle with english hehahah
yes if pj get sencond he will fight with phoenix, i think he would not like to do that
there is no missing savior in the next round... if you lose in ro16 you are done. Its single elim. And him/phoenix are talking alot, they seem like good friends. I bet PJ was always planning on first in his group.
Don't worry. The OGN guys are helping to set up all the stuff, apparently. I mean, they are using their software for keeping track of minerals, units and upgrades.
But do mute the bleep, otherwise you'll go insane because we get to see Savior
On October 06 2007 01:50 {88}iNcontroL wrote: phoenix is translating for him and said that he plays "Goody" if he gets first. They are really nice but struggle with english hehahah
yes if pj get sencond he will fight with phoenix, i think he would not like to do that
what stream you guys watching ? mms://live.wm.wcg.servecast.net/wcg_wmlz_live700k lags like hell for me and sc2.org messes up the video colour and on sc2, it doesnt look like a sc match, it looks like 2 guys talking.
On October 06 2007 01:50 {88}iNcontroL wrote: phoenix is translating for him and said that he plays "Goody" if he gets first. They are really nice but struggle with english hehahah
yes if pj get sencond he will fight with phoenix, i think he would not like to do that
On October 06 2007 02:58 hixhix wrote: what stream you guys watching ? mms://live.wm.wcg.servecast.net/wcg_wmlz_live700k lags like hell for me and sc2.org messes up the video colour and on sc2, it doesnt look like a sc match, it looks like 2 guys talking.
sc2 does directly go into the game.. they do not talk 20 minutes about the players before (OGN STREAM)
We are intercepting that stream. Before they start to show stuff WCG TV wasn't online on the official site yet. The directors and stuff were just still walking around and chatting, camera people waiting until their job would start, etc.
On October 06 2007 03:15 EsbenPM wrote: Well isn't it still schoolhours in America??
I could imagine a lot of the people that would attend are still at school?
It's fall break for us, but I'm not sure about in Seattle. That and the fact that probably not many people know what WCG is and are most likely playing Halo 3 at home.
God the stream is flawless now. During the match is was so laggy I couldn't hear or see anything. Can't use sc2.org because I can't install Java at work. BS!
ogn commentator: um...that strategy...against Savior...just won't work...i mean that might have worked when the SC came out in the 98...but even with drones, pro players these day can often devoid bunker/rushes of different sort including bbs. As it turned out even the location did not favor terran's BBS rush. A rather cheap cheesy rush by the Brzillian was bound to fail against Savior who anticipated such rush as he went 9 pool. And from the look of the Savior's face, we can safely assume that Savior anticipated that rush
On October 06 2007 03:32 Chill wrote: God the stream is flawless now. During the match is was so laggy I couldn\'t hear or see anything. Can\'t use sc2.org because I can\'t install Java at work. BS!
Java is for chatting room only if I remember correctly
Great strategy, but I believe that ReasoN's capable of better execution though. But its fucking sAviOr, I was nervous and i'm nowhere close to Seattle.
Map was azalea. Reason top right, savior bottom left. Reason build 2 barracks just outside savior's 2nd choke. Scouting lord and drone did not find it. I think it was the zerglings who did.
Reason could have won. Savior had built a sunken, but it was quite far from the mineral line. There was a point where reason had about 4 marines surrounded by many scv's behind mineral line, so savior had to pull out all drones (and most of his lings were still on their way from reason's base). Somehow, savior still managed to kill all marines and scvs.
It was a close one! Savior must have been very relieved he didn't lose that one...
On October 06 2007 03:32 Chill wrote: God the stream is flawless now. During the match is was so laggy I couldn\'t hear or see anything. Can\'t use sc2.org because I can\'t install Java at work. BS!
Java is for chatting room only if I remember correctly
Well, then I can't install this TVAnts. Either way, I'm boned.
one of ogn commentators just said that hwasin have diarrhea and his match vs maix will be delayed also have said that stork is 50% drunk and he broke one of wcg mouse and eaten half of mouse pad, and got penalty for that 1 more penalty and stork is out
On October 06 2007 03:43 GongKyuckTerran wrote: one of ogn commentators just said that hwasin have diarrhea and his match vs maix will be delayed also have said that stork is 50% drunk and he broke one of wcg mouse and eaten half of mouse pad, and got penalty for that 1 more penalty and stork is out
rofl. he probably partied a bit too hard last night, or maybe it was sabotage from other players.
On October 06 2007 03:43 GongKyuckTerran wrote: one of ogn commentators just said that hwasin have diarrhea and his match vs maix will be delayed also have said that stork is 50% drunk and he broke one of wcg mouse and eaten half of mouse pad, and got penalty for that 1 more penalty and stork is out
On October 06 2007 03:43 GongKyuckTerran wrote: one of ogn commentators just said that hwasin have diarrhea and his match vs maix will be delayed also have said that stork is 50% drunk and he broke one of wcg mouse and eaten half of mouse pad, and got penalty for that 1 more penalty and stork is out
rofl
I play the best after about 3 drinks.
You probably are just chilled out so you think you're playing better. It's like when I used to play high, I'd feel like my strategies were so amazing, but really I'd be watching 5 units and have 5k in the bank and get rolled.
On October 06 2007 03:43 GongKyuckTerran wrote: one of ogn commentators just said that hwasin have diarrhea and his match vs maix will be delayed also have said that stork is 50% drunk and he broke one of wcg mouse and eaten half of mouse pad, and got penalty for that 1 more penalty and stork is out
rofl
I play the best after about 3 drinks.
You probably are just chilled out so you think you're playing better. It's like when I used to play high, I'd feel like my strategies were so amazing, but really I'd be watching 5 units and have 5k in the bank and get rolled.
Hah, yeah I don't think I would even try to play high.
On October 06 2007 03:43 GongKyuckTerran wrote: one of ogn commentators just said that hwasin have diarrhea and his match vs maix will be delayed also have said that stork is 50% drunk and he broke one of wcg mouse and eaten half of mouse pad, and got penalty for that 1 more penalty and stork is out
Seriously? I am picturing that in my mind and I am literally rolling on the floor laughing... ^_^;;;
Arg, these WCG guys are hopeless. All those high tech sponsers that are supposed to show off their technology but they can't get their set up working properly...
ogn commentator: ok...Stork...most likely lost a game on purpose since Hwasin's group is only made of 3 players, it is easier for stork to drop a game and go for the second place in the group.
Music is lauder than the commentators talking... its so unproffessional. as usual.. anyone listening to the kennigit sound? im listening and its also lagging as hell.. i usually have no problem watching streams, but always WCG sux=(
I cannot stop laughing. Hwasin is showing NO respect whatsoever. He closed his wall and made a marine before his factory, made FIVE turrets, scouted for proxies. It's so hilarious. He knows there's no way he loses this.
Yeah, his two biggest mistakes were losing his nat and southeast base probes to vultures. If not, Hwasin wouldn't have scouted the carriers and damaged drieven economically.
Drieven had a great start, but yea, a little too eager to get those carriers, that and the nice all probe kill + stargate discovery of those vults, which really sealed it.
I don't see why everyone is dissing on Reason, he did what he felt was his best chance at beating SaviOr. I mean, it would've been nice to see a straight up game that lasted longer but it wouldn't be much better if Reason got raped by only mutalisk harass. They all tried their best and we can't ask for more than that.
Any word on how ra beat stork? I would have thought that if stork was going to throw a game he would have waited until later. Details of the match anyone?
I called it first =D Stork's the only one who foreigners can take games from. (Assuming he didn't drop on purpose? Makes no sense to drop a game that early) Is Testie definitely out? =( He really deserves to make it to at least quarterlies. Frigging group of death.
On October 06 2007 04:24 bErAtEd- wrote: Any word on how ra beat stork? I would have thought that if stork was going to throw a game he would have waited until later. Details of the match anyone?
iirc they "usually" drop a mirror game to make it less obvious? am i wrong?
Testie still has a chance. If Savior and Reason beat Mondi, and Testie beat Reason, then Testie, Reason and Mondi will have 1-2 and will play to each other again
On October 06 2007 04:39 Bifur wrote: Testie still has a chance. If Savior and Reason beat Mondi, and Testie beat Reason, then Testie, Reason and Mondi will have 1-2 and will play to each other again
Hmm... that's not so bad. I can't see Mondi taking a game off Savior and the rest is pretty likely as well. Shame that Mondi or Testie won't make it but IMO Testie has a better shot at going the distance if he can make it out of the group.
i think that stork know that white-ra is best after him in this group and will finish first with 4-0 if i was stork i would drop game vs white-ra cuz it's most safe
On October 06 2007 04:43 Bifur wrote: No Chingizkhan had problems with the visa
Why does gg.net have him playing and losing to reason then? (I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just trying to figure out where all the information is coming from.)
On October 06 2007 04:43 Bifur wrote: No Chingizkhan had problems with the visa
Why does gg.net have him playing and losing to reason then? (I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just trying to figure out where all the information is coming from.)
cus absentees automatically lose all their games... duh ^^
On October 06 2007 04:43 Bifur wrote: No Chingizkhan had problems with the visa
Why does gg.net have him playing and losing to reason then? (I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just trying to figure out where all the information is coming from.)
cus absentees automatically lose all their games... duh ^^
Ah. Yeah I probably should have figured that out huh. I'm quick. :/
On October 06 2007 04:36 KissBlade wrote: I called it first =D Stork's the only one who foreigners can take games from. (Assuming he didn't drop on purpose? Makes no sense to drop a game that early) Is Testie definitely out? =( He really deserves to make it to at least quarterlies. Frigging group of death.
well the ogn asked Stork if he dropped a game on purpose and it is told that is not the case. He just got beat straight up.
On October 06 2007 04:23 MuShu wrote: I don't see why everyone is dissing on Reason, he did what he felt was his best chance at beating SaviOr. I mean, it would've been nice to see a straight up game that lasted longer but it wouldn't be much better if Reason got raped by only mutalisk harass. They all tried their best and we can't ask for more than that.
Agreed. It does not make sense to play straight up game if you know you will get raped anyway. The purpose of any strategy of the game is to win, play straight up without any chance to win is just stupid.
On October 06 2007 04:36 KissBlade wrote: I called it first =D Stork's the only one who foreigners can take games from. (Assuming he didn't drop on purpose? Makes no sense to drop a game that early) Is Testie definitely out? =( He really deserves to make it to at least quarterlies. Frigging group of death.
well the ogn asked Stork if he dropped a game on purpose and it is told that is not the case. He just got beat straight up.
I don't think anyone would actually confess dropping a game, otherwise, they might as well forfeit the game beforehand.
On October 06 2007 04:43 Bifur wrote: No Chingizkhan had problems with the visa
Why does gg.net have him playing and losing to reason then? (I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just trying to figure out where all the information is coming from.)
It's question for gg.net, not for me Chingizkhan didn't get the visa - this is 100% information...it comes from different sites, for instance, from russian sites and from one of the english sites...i think i saw it somewhere right here, at teamliquid...
also I'm almost sure that Ex will not proceed to playoffs, since there is an information that he hasn't been preparing seriously for WCG
On October 06 2007 04:36 KissBlade wrote: I called it first =D Stork's the only one who foreigners can take games from. (Assuming he didn't drop on purpose? Makes no sense to drop a game that early) Is Testie definitely out? =( He really deserves to make it to at least quarterlies. Frigging group of death.
well the ogn asked Stork if he dropped a game on purpose and it is told that is not the case. He just got beat straight up.
I don't think anyone would actually confess dropping a game, otherwise, they might as well forfeit the game beforehand.
Not saying whether stork dropped it or didn't.
well i am just relaying what the OGN commentator said on air that's all. But if there's a game to be dropped, yeah, it makes sense to drop the first game, since white ra more likely to win the remaining games.
On October 06 2007 04:43 Bifur wrote: No Chingizkhan had problems with the visa
Why does gg.net have him playing and losing to reason then? (I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just trying to figure out where all the information is coming from.)
It's question for gg.net, not for me Chingizkhan didn't get the visa - this is 100% information...it comes from different sites, for instance, from russian sites and from one of the english sites...i think i saw it somewhere right here, at teamliquid...
also I'm almost sure that Ex will not proceed to playoffs, since there is an information that he hasn't been preparing seriously for WCG
GG.net had NotForU playing aswell... so its just they didn't remove the visa guys.
i am goin to play him in like half hour cos he is still playin dreiven on stage... Wish me luck guys I will need it, I just saw white ra(sitting next to me) beat Stork pretty eazy so everything is possible
On October 06 2007 05:03 G.s)NarutO wrote: From MAIX:
i am goin to play him in like half hour cos he is still playin dreiven on stage... Wish me luck guys I will need it, I just saw white ra(sitting next to me) beat Stork pretty eazy so everything is possible
my comment to that: DROP GAME!
no way, according to gosugamers: "GosuGamers asked Stork after the game if it was a throw-game or not, and the translator was very insistent about it not being the case." so it wasnt a dropped game... I TEH SWEAR!
Last game for Ra is against Ex ? All that group should try to make Stork get the first spot, teach lame koreeans a lesson. Each year same thing, It gets old and boring
On October 06 2007 05:11 GongKyuckTerran wrote: i bet pj dropped game vs cloud so he can face phoenix and avoid savior .. considering that cloud will take first spot in his group
This is very dubious since Pj and Phoenix are both from China
On October 06 2007 05:11 GongKyuckTerran wrote: i bet pj dropped game vs cloud so he can face phoenix and avoid savior .. considering that cloud will take first spot in his group
This is very dubious since Pj and Phoenix are both from China
Think about it. China vs China... 1 will remain for china. Its better than 1 lose vs sAviOr and the other one loses vs another player.
On October 06 2007 05:03 G.s)NarutO wrote: From MAIX:
i am goin to play him in like half hour cos he is still playin dreiven on stage... Wish me luck guys I will need it, I just saw white ra(sitting next to me) beat Stork pretty eazy so everything is possible
my comment to that: DROP GAME!
no way, according to gosugamers: "GosuGamers asked Stork after the game if it was a throw-game or not, and the translator was very insistent about it not being the case." so it wasnt a dropped game... I TEH SWEAR!
Haha, gosugamers never fails to amaze me.
Stork is in the top5 of the best progamers easily, there's NO FUCKING WAY he got beat easily. God I can't believe they seriously reported that, hahahahaa.
On October 06 2007 05:11 GongKyuckTerran wrote: i bet pj dropped game vs cloud so he can face phoenix and avoid savior .. considering that cloud will take first spot in his group
This is very dubious since Pj and Phoenix are both from China
I'm quite sure he cares more about winning/making it further than owning some dude he probably doesn't even know well.
if pj is smart enough(i think he is) he will forget that phoenix is from his country and try to get to top 8 but again he could be ultra fucking good friend with him and respect friendship and go for savior.. but i doubt he is that good with pheonix
There are 2 reasons why I believe it's still a drop game, and why he said it wasn't even if it was.
#1) Obviously to avoid playing Hwasin. But many have suggested, why so early? Why not wait and see what happens first? Because there was a time when the progamers tried this in another event, and failed. I believe it was one of the Korea/China events, where Reach and YellOw (I think) were in danger of facing each other in the Ro8. One of them still had a game left, but due to some unfortunate results it didn't matter if that person dropped the game or not, they'd still advance to play each other.
So, by recieving a loss early on, Stork increases his chances to #2, and then if somehow he ends up #1 anyway, he can still drop another game. He probably chose White-ra to drop the game against, because White-ra is expected to come out of the group next to him. Thus if they both end up with same results, White-ra would be #1 and Stork #2, meaning stork wouldn't have to drop another game.
2) But why say he didn't drop? This is fairly obvious. It would be unsports-man like to say he dropped a game. It would probably disappoint many fans as it does every year. But there's a deeper reason probably. Right now the Korean community is pummeling Stork, calling him "Song Excuse" (송핑계). This is because when he lost to Bisu in the GomTV2 finals, he said in his interview that he lost because he forgot dragoon range. This created a lot of fuss in the community, Bisu fans complaining that Stork is just putting out excuses and should be a man and just admit his loss, while Stork fans were defending him.
Then came the Stork vs Savior game on.... I can't remember. I think it was the Proleague Allstar match. Stork was doing very well against savior when Savior came back with a massive hydra drop, where Stork realized he forgot both dragoon range (again), AND storm. This was revealed by stork and once again the Korean community was all over his ass, and calling him "Song Excuse" (his last name is Song).
So, he probably dropped a game, but did not want people his fans to continue saying "he just makes excuses when he loses" so he's telling everyone he lost straight up. This way, the Koreans who know Stork's true power will make their own deduction without Stork actually saying so, saving his face and his reputation. Of course it's a daring move since everyone who's lost to a foreigner at WCG has gotten ridiculed (Silent_Control was verbally assaulted mercilessly when he lost in 2005)... but he's probably banking on his MSL/OSL/PL performances for his fans to not doubt his true strength. Besides, as long as he wins the entire thing from now on no one will even mention his loss.
no way, according to gosugamers: "GosuGamers asked Stork after the game if it was a throw-game or not, and the translator was very insistent about it not being the case." so it wasnt a dropped game... I TEH SWEAR!
Haha, gosugamers never fails to amaze me.
Stork is in the top5 of the best progamers easily, there's NO FUCKING WAY he got beat easily. God I can't believe they seriously reported that, hahahahaa.
Obviously you judge without having any info prior to doing to so. We never reported that it wasn't a throw game, the quoted sentence is taken out of context and it is simply saying that he denied, and that the translator was very insistent.
On October 06 2007 05:33 IntoTheWow wrote: Can\'t believe people actually think Stork didn\'t throw a game. They have been doing this all years.
Foreigners should just drop their games too so they ace each other.
that would be hilarious.
A korean knows he needs to drop a game so he doesn't face a fellow Korean, but the opponent gets sneaky and tries to drop the game too so that the Korea DOES face his pal.... and game would be like the noobiest game in the world until someone attacks themselves. rofl
Then came the Stork vs Savior game on.... I can't remember. I think it was the Proleague Allstar match. Stork was doing very well against savior when Savior came back with a massive hydra drop, where Stork realized he forgot both dragoon range (again), AND storm. This was revealed by stork and once again the Korean community was all over his ass, and calling him "Song Excuse" (his last name is Song).
man i didnt know this, didnt watch that game #1 kespa forgeting range + storm in same game ...vs savior ?? ROOOOFL
stork and testie should write on their monitor "RANGE UPGRADE ASAP"
On October 06 2007 05:33 IntoTheWow wrote: Can\'t believe people actually think Stork didn\'t throw a game. They have been doing this all years.
Foreigners should just drop their games too so they ace each other.
that would be hilarious.
A korean knows he needs to drop a game so he doesn't face a fellow Korean, but the opponent gets sneaky and tries to drop the game too so that the Korea DOES face his pal.... and game would be like the noobiest game in the world until someone attacks themselves. rofl
If there are no tie breakers then if Stork and Ra tie, Ra will be no.1.
So it's hard for Ra also to drop a game. He needs to drop two and still be second.
If Stork drops his game against the second best player he can tie with that player and still be second. Otherwise, he can't. Ra is the player you would expect to be second best.
On October 06 2007 05:33 IntoTheWow wrote: Can\'t believe people actually think Stork didn\'t throw a game. They have been doing this all years.
Foreigners should just drop their games too so they ace each other.
that would be hilarious.
A korean knows he needs to drop a game so he doesn't face a fellow Korean, but the opponent gets sneaky and tries to drop the game too so that the Korea DOES face his pal.... and game would be like the noobiest game in the world until someone attacks themselves. rofl
"I tried to attack my opponent and I attacked my own buildings one by one so I lost. =( No seriously, I wasn't trying to drop game!"
On October 06 2007 05:33 IntoTheWow wrote: Can\'t believe people actually think Stork didn\'t throw a game. They have been doing this all years.
Foreigners should just drop their games too so they ace each other.
that would be hilarious.
A korean knows he needs to drop a game so he doesn't face a fellow Korean, but the opponent gets sneaky and tries to drop the game too so that the Korea DOES face his pal.... and game would be like the noobiest game in the world until someone attacks themselves. rofl
Haha I was thinking the same thing, who can kill his own base the fastest with workers !
Seriously though, they should really randomize the brackets without announcing it till after the group stage and make them double elim again.
no way, according to gosugamers: "GosuGamers asked Stork after the game if it was a throw-game or not, and the translator was very insistent about it not being the case." so it wasnt a dropped game... I TEH SWEAR!
Haha, gosugamers never fails to amaze me.
Stork is in the top5 of the best progamers easily, there's NO FUCKING WAY he got beat easily. God I can't believe they seriously reported that, hahahahaa.
Obviously you judge without having any info prior to doing to so. We never reported that it wasn't a throw game, the quoted sentence is taken out of context and it is simply saying that he denied, and that the translator was very insistent.
You're right, I was kinda off on that but still.... why even bother to ask him if he did throw it or not, when you know the answer is going to be 0% reliable. Just seems so silly to me. Noone is going to admit he's done something unsportsman like.
On October 06 2007 05:33 IntoTheWow wrote: Can\'t believe people actually think Stork didn\'t throw a game. They have been doing this all years.
Foreigners should just drop their games too so they ace each other.
that would be hilarious.
A korean knows he needs to drop a game so he doesn't face a fellow Korean, but the opponent gets sneaky and tries to drop the game too so that the Korea DOES face his pal.... and game would be like the noobiest game in the world until someone attacks themselves. rofl
lol, this would be awesome to see on stage with tasteless is casting ^^
On October 06 2007 05:33 IntoTheWow wrote: Can\'t believe people actually think Stork didn\'t throw a game. They have been doing this all years.
Foreigners should just drop their games too so they ace each other.
that would be hilarious.
A korean knows he needs to drop a game so he doesn't face a fellow Korean, but the opponent gets sneaky and tries to drop the game too so that the Korea DOES face his pal.... and game would be like the noobiest game in the world until someone attacks themselves. rofl
lol, this would be awesome to see on stage with tasteless is casting ^^
i hope they would actually do this because then the organizers might realize the problem with the way the tourney is set up right now and maybe change it to double elim in the future -_-
this is the problem for koreans: Food. Hard core koreans suffer alot if they don't eat their own korean food. Damn it. There's got to be few korean restaurants in Seattle, have some fans go and pick up some korean food.
its not as clear as stork vs ra... i mean its zvz and savior already showed against sen that he is touchable zvz (.. well anybody is touchable zvz but thats another story). i guess we wont be able to see until they release the reps.. should be soon
On October 06 2007 06:42 diehilde wrote: its not as clear as stork vs ra... i mean its zvz and savior already showed against sen that he is touchable zvz (.. well anybody is touchable zvz but thats another story). i guess we wont be able to see until they release the reps.. should be soon
True, this is not really a surprise...ZvZ...anything can happen.
On October 06 2007 06:42 diehilde wrote: its not as clear as stork vs ra... i mean its zvz and savior already showed against sen that he is touchable zvz (.. well anybody is touchable zvz but thats another story). i guess we wont be able to see until they release the reps.. should be soon
True, this is not really a surprise...ZvZ...anything can happen.
is it possible that Savior will met Stork now ? Pls God make it so ! I hate Stork, whould be such a nice turn of events if he needs to play Savior faster..
Mondi, is smart and has the experience, I think he won that game for real. I'm not saying Mondi is te better player, but I think he's victory today is real. It's long time overdue that Mondi accompishes something big in BW.
On October 06 2007 06:42 diehilde wrote: its not as clear as stork vs ra... i mean its zvz and savior already showed against sen that he is touchable zvz (.. well anybody is touchable zvz but thats another story). i guess we wont be able to see until they release the reps.. should be soon
True, this is not really a surprise...ZvZ...anything can happen.
Any time a korean loses, yes, it is a surprise.
Surprise or no surprise, it happens every WCG, I can't see why people making such a big fuss about it. It's a BO1 and even top tier progamers doesn't have a guaranteed win against top foreigners in a BO1. A BO3 would be a surprise though. This result changes nothing.
On October 06 2007 06:49 mayap wrote: well now savior plays vs androide and mondi plays vs hwasin (instead of it being savior if he finished first), which one has it easier ? ;d
Ok can someone please explain more clear scenrio of who plays who and stuff.
If Hwasin gets first who does he face in the next round?
I mean if Savior also gets first does that mean they play each other in the next round? i am lost someone explain!!!
On October 06 2007 06:49 mayap wrote: well now savior plays vs androide and mondi plays vs hwasin (instead of it being savior if he finished first), which one has it easier ? ;d
Ok can someone please explain more clear scenrio of who plays who and stuff.
If Hwasin gets first who does he face in the next round?
I mean if Savior also gets first does that mean they play each other in the next round? i am lost someone explain!!!
1) 1st place of E vs 2nd place of A 2) 1st place of F vs 2nd place of B 3) 2nd place of E vs 1st place of A 4) 2nd place of F vs 1st place of B 5) 1st place of G vs 2nd place of C 6) 1st place of H vs 2nd place of D 7) 2nd place of G vs 1st place of C 8) 2nd place of H sv 1st place of D
Quarterfinal
1) Winner of 1) vs Winner of 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs Winner of 4) 3) Winner of 5) vs Winner of 6) 4) Winner of 7) vs Winner of 8)
Semifinal
1) Winner of 1) vs 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs 4)
Final
Winner of 1) Semi Final vs Winner of 2) Semi Final
On October 06 2007 06:55 GTR-2-Go wrote: Hwasin is playing SteelHeart. Savior is going to play either jamesfoo (if he gets first) or androide (if he gets second). stork? no idea.
So in the end we will see three korean in the semi? is that likely scenario at the moment?
On October 06 2007 06:55 GTR-2-Go wrote: Hwasin is playing SteelHeart. Savior is going to play either jamesfoo (if he gets first) or androide (if he gets second). stork? no idea.
so if thats the case even if savior threw away his match it wouldnt even change anything cus theres no korean in the group that group H is facing, mondi won cleanly
On October 06 2007 06:55 GTR-2-Go wrote: Hwasin is playing SteelHeart. Savior is going to play either jamesfoo (if he gets first) or androide (if he gets second). stork? no idea.
so if thats the case even if savior threw away his match it wouldnt even change anything cus theres no korean in the group that group H is facing, mondi won cleanly
On October 06 2007 06:55 GTR-2-Go wrote: Hwasin is playing SteelHeart. Savior is going to play either jamesfoo (if he gets first) or androide (if he gets second). stork? no idea.
so if thats the case even if savior threw away his match it wouldnt even change anything cus theres no korean in the group that group H is facing, mondi won cleanly
It's possible he wants to avoid Hwasin in semifinals, but it's all just speculation.
On October 06 2007 06:56 G.s)NarutO wrote: Last 16
1) 1st place of E vs 2nd place of A 2) 1st place of F vs 2nd place of B 3) 2nd place of E vs 1st place of A 4) 2nd place of F vs 1st place of B 5) 1st place of G vs 2nd place of C 6) 1st place of H vs 2nd place of D 7) 2nd place of G vs 1st place of C 8) 2nd place of H sv 1st place of D
Quarterfinal
1) Winner of 1) vs Winner of 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs Winner of 4) 3) Winner of 5) vs Winner of 6) 4) Winner of 7) vs Winner of 8)
Semifinal
1) Winner of 1) vs 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs 4)
Final
Winner of 1) Semi Final vs Winner of 2) Semi Final
On October 06 2007 06:56 G.s)NarutO wrote: Last 16
1) 1st place of E vs 2nd place of A 2) 1st place of F vs 2nd place of B 3) 2nd place of E vs 1st place of A 4) 2nd place of F vs 1st place of B 5) 1st place of G vs 2nd place of C 6) 1st place of H vs 2nd place of D 7) 2nd place of G vs 1st place of C 8) 2nd place of H sv 1st place of D
Quarterfinal
1) Winner of 1) vs Winner of 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs Winner of 4) 3) Winner of 5) vs Winner of 6) 4) Winner of 7) vs Winner of 8)
Semifinal
1) Winner of 1) vs 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs 4)
Final
Winner of 1) Semi Final vs Winner of 2) Semi Final
On October 06 2007 07:03 mayap wrote: ah i get it, now savior doesnt need to face either stork or hwasin until semi-finals(according to the brackets) so the kors can get top 3 again
No that is true since stork lost, the only thing imaginable is he wanted to avoid Hwasin and play Stork instead. Or he just lost one single zvz, which he did against Sen, too.
On October 06 2007 06:56 G.s)NarutO wrote: Last 16
1) 1st place of E vs 2nd place of A 2) 1st place of F vs 2nd place of B 3) 2nd place of E vs 1st place of A 4) 2nd place of F vs 1st place of B 5) 1st place of G vs 2nd place of C 6) 1st place of H vs 2nd place of D 7) 2nd place of G vs 1st place of C 8) 2nd place of H sv 1st place of D
Quarterfinal
1) Winner of 1) vs Winner of 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs Winner of 4) 3) Winner of 5) vs Winner of 6) 4) Winner of 7) vs Winner of 8)
Semifinal
1) Winner of 1) vs 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs 4)
Final
Winner of 1) Semi Final vs Winner of 2) Semi Final
On October 06 2007 06:56 G.s)NarutO wrote: Last 16
1) 1st place of E vs 2nd place of A 2) 1st place of F vs 2nd place of B 3) 2nd place of E vs 1st place of A 4) 2nd place of F vs 1st place of B 5) 1st place of G vs 2nd place of C 6) 1st place of H vs 2nd place of D 7) 2nd place of G vs 1st place of C 8) 2nd place of H sv 1st place of D
Quarterfinal
1) Winner of 1) vs Winner of 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs Winner of 4) 3) Winner of 5) vs Winner of 6) 4) Winner of 7) vs Winner of 8)
Semifinal
1) Winner of 1) vs 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs 4)
Final
Winner of 1) Semi Final vs Winner of 2) Semi Final
On October 06 2007 06:56 G.s)NarutO wrote: Last 16
1) 1st place of E vs 2nd place of A 2) 1st place of F vs 2nd place of B 3) 2nd place of E vs 1st place of A 4) 2nd place of F vs 1st place of B 5) 1st place of G vs 2nd place of C 6) 1st place of H vs 2nd place of D 7) 2nd place of G vs 1st place of C 8) 2nd place of H sv 1st place of D
Quarterfinal
1) Winner of 1) vs Winner of 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs Winner of 4) 3) Winner of 5) vs Winner of 6) 4) Winner of 7) vs Winner of 8)
Semifinal
1) Winner of 1) vs 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs 4)
Final
Winner of 1) Semi Final vs Winner of 2) Semi Final
correct??
if this is true and stork & savior are getting 2nd in their groups and hwasin 1st they can get 1#2#3# kor
"group h doesnt play vs any korean in the next round, so obviously even if savior threw his game away it wouldnt have made any difference, savior plays vs androide now and mondi vs jamesfoo so the games were clean for sure
On October 06 2007 07:14 Pads wrote: TT1 on GG.net
"group h doesnt play vs any korean in the next round, so obviously even if savior threw his game away it wouldnt have made any difference, savior plays vs androide now and mondi vs jamesfoo so the games were clean for sure
hwasin plays vs steelheart"
except if they want 1# / 2# to be either hwasin or savior and stork 3. for sure
On October 06 2007 06:56 G.s)NarutO wrote: Last 16
1) 1st place of E vs 2nd place of A 2) 1st place of F vs 2nd place of B 3) 2nd place of E vs 1st place of A 4) 2nd place of F vs 1st place of B 5) 1st place of G vs 2nd place of C 6) 1st place of H vs 2nd place of D 7) 2nd place of G vs 1st place of C 8) 2nd place of H sv 1st place of D
Quarterfinal
1) Winner of 1) vs Winner of 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs Winner of 4) 3) Winner of 5) vs Winner of 6) 4) Winner of 7) vs Winner of 8)
Semifinal
1) Winner of 1) vs 2) 2) Winner of 3) vs 4)
Final
Winner of 1) Semi Final vs Winner of 2) Semi Final
if he gets first he's got savior and stork in the upper half, provided that stork get 2nd in his group (if ra wins vs ex)
unfortunately he'll have to hwasin in the semi finals if he makes it this far, but i dont think that should be a problem again jamesfoo and then goody/Cloud most likely
even more perfect would it be if ra lost to ex. then they would have tiebreaker which stork wins, knocking out hwasin in the quarterfinals and losing to mondi in the semi finals, who beats savior in the grand final
Savior has no reason to throw a match right? I checked the brackets as described on tl.net in another post. But someone quoted that and said it contradicts what is on the WCG site. As far as I know Savior has no reason to throw a match.
So that means he was just beaten straight up. And that suggests again that he is out of shape.
You think Draco can beat Stork and Steelheart can beat Hwasin?
There will always be upsets. I don't have to explain about Draco, he is hungry for revenge and prepared some nasty strategies for Stork. Being the former progamer that he is, Draco is confident about winning. Confidence is everything in the mind game called Starcraft. Stork, after being humiliated by White-Ra is highly doubting his own skills and therefore playing extremely nervous. I must agree Steelheart is more difficult to explain, playing against the most stable korean in WCG this year. I believe in an upset because I've seen his extraordinary skills in the replays of the past WCG's and I believe that he has been practising tremendously on the island of his. And I've seen him SLAY C rank people in PGT, he had amazing stats (like 40-20 if I recall correctly).
Funny thing you didn't mention Satanik > Savior. I guess Satanik is already expected to be this years huge star. He is a master of tricks, always with something terribly intimidating up his sleeve. His extraordinary gaming-style and mass ladder gaming will finally pay off, I tell ya.
Mondragon has his 9/9/9 build that I'm pretty sure some of the programers haven't see for a while at their level. Gives him a nice advantage over double gates anyways.
Do you really think Savior - the master of zerg - fears Hwasin that much ??? edit: I don´t think 2nd place means anything to Savior - he said he wants to win WCG, so he has to beat Hwasin anyway.
On October 06 2007 08:11 IaniAniaN wrote: Mondragon has his 9/9/9 build that I'm pretty sure some of the programers haven't see for a while at their level. Gives him a nice advantage over double gates anyways.
That one is more a safe bo to do against worse players, than a bo to do vs. progamers, since it's pretty bad against FE, and is more likely they always make FE ;P
Testie lost to Reason, that makes him 0-3 in his group. Poor Testie. Reason wa such a fag playing teran against Savior and Mondragon. Why did he do it ? Is he that good with terran ?
Tomorrow Savior vs Androide, most exciting game I would say. And Draco playing Dreiven...nooooooo I also look forward to seeing Satanic, he's a full bag of tricks !!!!
On October 05 2007 17:51 G.s)NarutO wrote: I'd like to see korean vs korean as late as possible. So I'm ok with Stork or HwaSin throwing a game just like HonestTea.
@ Bellsprout, sAviOr will immediatly scout what Mondragon builds, there is no way you can win when sAviOr knows what you do I guess!
1:37) Rö: if you beat savior (1:37) Rö: I'll buy you 10 beers (1:37) Rö: (1:37) mondragon-@gmx.d: make it 50 and im gonna beat him (1:38) Rö: 25 (1:38) mondragon-@gmx.d: ``
we need sponsorship
Since when beer come in a pack of 25? are u going to buy a 24 + 1 beer separately?
apparently in the hwasin vs maix game maix typed "come on" to hwasin in the beginning on the game, and hwasin reacted with a "spark terran" build and owned his sunks lol
apparently in the hwasin vs maix game maix typed "come on" to hwasin in the beginning on the game, and hwasin reacted with a "spark terran" build and owned his sunks lol
haha pwn. xD
but it's pretty funny hearing that they chatted while playing, as hwasin says in the interview.
How can some people be so sure savior did not throw the game vs mondi? For a progamer playing sub par on purpose (foreigner level), lose the game and make it seem legit should not be so hard I think. Making it look like a straight up loss is the whole purpose of dropping a game with style, after all he has to think about wcg sportsmanship etc. haha. I don't know if he cared about having to meet hwasing in the semis or not, but it's possible that he did. My point is wether he threw the game or not, is'nt it all speculation?
On October 06 2007 08:49 GongKyuckTerran wrote: reason why tvz why T_T u have x2 better zvz then mondi ...
i hope stork get out gogo ra + ex
yup and the fact that Mondragon won Savior (yes, I know its bo1) makes ur comment cpmpletely silly.
sad that reason didnt pick z vs mondi T.T
be more of a douche
i dont think he meant anything bad by it, he probably meant reason would of had more of a chance to beat mondragon with zvz rather tvz. ZvZ is anywhere from 50-75% luck where as you can't say the same for tvz.
On October 06 2007 09:25 Pistasj wrote: How can some people be so sure savior did not throw the game vs mondi?
Because he has nothing to gain from it. Look, if Hwasin and Stork both made it no.1 they would knock each other out. But Savior is in the total opposite part of the elimination tree. He will either meet Stork or Hwasin in the finals.
if savior did throw a game only because of facing hwasin, that doesn't say much in the way of confidence. and considering how he said he wanted to win the tournament, it makes even less sense. throwing a game is just not very characteristic of savior.
On October 06 2007 09:25 Pistasj wrote: How can some people be so sure savior did not throw the game vs mondi?
Because he has nothing to gain from it. Look, if Hwasin and Stork both made it no.1 they would knock each other out. But Savior is in the total opposite part of the elimination tree. He will either meet Stork or Hwasin in the finals.
Savior only made it harder for himself.
What you don't get is that Stork HAD to throw a game for korea to get all the medals. Stork vs Hwasin in round of 8 would be ridicilous from a korean point of view. Savior knew this of course and was free to chose wether he want to meet stork or hwasin in the semis depending on first or second place in his group.
On October 05 2007 17:51 G.s)NarutO wrote: I'd like to see korean vs korean as late as possible. So I'm ok with Stork or HwaSin throwing a game just like HonestTea.
@ Bellsprout, sAviOr will immediatly scout what Mondragon builds, there is no way you can win when sAviOr knows what you do I guess!
1:37) Rö: if you beat savior (1:37) Rö: I'll buy you 10 beers (1:37) Rö: (1:37) mondragon-@gmx.d: make it 50 and im gonna beat him (1:38) Rö: 25 (1:38) mondragon-@gmx.d: ``
i'm happy 2 worthy players advanced from group of death. I mean with testie and mondragon as two of the very best foreigners, reason advancing would be just.. meh.. and savior is like auto advance. also taking a game from savior is such satisfaction.
controversy: stork did a stop bug trick with observer over turret trick vs ex. but ex signed off after end of match.
conclusion: rematch of stork vs ex.
rematch: Stork proxy gatewayed - zealot rushed, attacked ex's base early with two zealots. ex managed to bunker away from the cc. ex is microing the rines to kill off the two zlots but the zlots killed off scvs. while harassing with 2 zlots, stork teched to templar archive and early expoed. same strat as before. ex didn't expect it to happen again. first game stork tried to stop ex from walling in but walled in anyway this game ex didn't wall in.
game 2 - stork vs ra - paranoid android
stork at 12, ra at 3. stork fast nexused. stork is killing off probes with zealots. stork gg.
Stork must get 2nd not to face Hwasin. He can't get 1st in this group. Only reason why he might be doing fe or silly build orders. vs white-ra after he wins 1st game vs Ex.
1st Place of this group goes to bottom brackets. (Hwasin bottom, face in ro8) 2nd Place of this group goes to top brackets. (sAviOr top, face in semis)
guys, stork has no reason to get 2nd. what the koreans said was that 1) new players don't usually throw games and stork is new to playing on an international level 2) if the player was to throw a game, they wouldn't do it this early. 3) the koreans assume that they will meet each other in the final four anyway. 4) stork said he didn't throw the game.
On October 06 2007 10:56 mnm wrote: stork just won vs ex. ex is playing ra again.
so they changed order now ?
No. Someone asked if Ra was losing legitimately to Ex as a rhetorical question in response to mnm's sarcasm. But she didn't get that. She thought he talked about Stork, saying he already beat Ex.
On October 06 2007 11:00 mnm wrote: guys, stork has no reason to get 2nd. what the koreans said was that 1) new players don't usually throw games and stork is new to playing on an international level 2) if the player was to throw a game, they wouldn't do it this early. 3) the koreans assume that they will meet each other in the final four anyway. 4) stork said he didn't throw the game.
Sorry but those sounds more like excuses than reasons Let me enjoy my circus please.
Oh so ex and ra weren't playing, and are going to play now? (Edit: I know that was the order the first time, but I thought they'd switched around this time or something from mnm's post earlier.)
On October 06 2007 11:08 samsammy wrote: Wait a sec.... #1 goes against Hwasin Not Savior -_-.
Right. Maybe Stork is throwing games, maybe he isn't. (I'm gonna guess that he is, especially after losing to Ra three times, but that's a separate issue.) No matter what, though, if Stork takes first place in this group, it will be guaranteed that one of the non-Koreans will take a medal.
Ra vs Stork 3:0 ... Stork is constantly going to lose gainst Ra, as long as stork beats Ex And it looks like as if Ra can't beat Ex ... If he seriously can't the only way this whole thing can end is that
Ex does some kind of gamble and rushes stork Ra does the same thing and wins... and Stork is out.
ex is heading across bridge with 5 rines a vult a scv and 2 tanks and another vult.. killing off ra's 2-3 goons. 1 goon left and ra retreats goon up his ramp. there are 3 goons up there waiting for him
I'm not gonna be biased or anything... But seriously, losing three times in a row, ? I would be surprised even if Ra were the #1 foreign player (which he isn't) and surprised more because Stork is the official #1 Korean player (of course Savior would own him...)
On October 06 2007 11:12 Plexa wrote: O ffs untill you guys see the reps, you guys have nothing on stork - meanwhile mnm is right there seeing everything, i trust her words
sorry i have much respect for mnm and her work, but do you honestly believe stork is losin 0-3 to ra when he gives his best? come on....
On October 06 2007 11:14 jtan wrote: And I'm pretty sure stork is throwing games. Stork is clearly the better player, and he just really wants to avoid the koreans.
It's his national duty to fix up the brackets. This is done all the time in all kinds of sports. It's not that he fears Hwasin. He should rather fear Savior. And if he gets second he avoids an early Hwasin and a non-Korean medal and instead plays Savior in the semis.
stork is no1 kespa. on top of that, stork has the best pvp in the world. the only reasons might be that he's way tierd from the trip or something (but then again, why is he loosing only to white ra and not ex), or he is loosing on purpose.
i hope the guys who supported the faggot charade we see in form of "throwing games" now realize what an unsportsman thing to do it is. im really sorry for ex, id slap stork silly if i were him. i for one have lost all my respect for stork. the only thing we can hope for is that after x rounds of this shit going on its just gonna be decided by the dice and stork gets the short end of the stick. that would be so hilarious.
Was it last year? or when was it? I remember one of the Korean protoss losing intentionally on a PvP I think it was Park Jung Suk ... HE did say he lost intentionally... the opponent said that too. (I don't think it's last year now, the players were Zerg, terran terran last year)
Or maybe it wasn't the WCG. I don't care, but the point is that Korea progamers can lose, making the game look quite legitimate.
I'm pretty sure mnm can see some kind of flaw in Stork's play.
Like abnormal, or unsafe build order, or deliberate pylon misplacement, or attacking without control, or intentional unit production block.
Is Stork losing on purpose? The Korean's official statement is no. Ra says that he is winning easily and I think he is implying that he is winning legitimately via skill. Now whether or not they are totally fucking with our minds I have no idea.
On October 06 2007 11:14 jtan wrote: And I'm pretty sure stork is throwing games. Stork is clearly the better player, and he just really wants to avoid the koreans.
It's his national duty to fix up the brackets. This is done all the time in all kinds of sports. It's not that he fears Hwasin. He should rather fear Savior. And if he gets second he avoids an early Hwasin and a non-Korean medal and instead plays Savior in the semis.
Yeah it's no big deal to me if he manages to touch up the brackets a little so korea gets top 3, but the way this turned out it looks so clumsy and embarrassing for stork
I agree, Stork should be banned for life from any Starcraft competition, so other players will learn the spirit of the game :fair play, not this bull...
Why would they admit they are throwing the game, that's stupid. ra is a good player, but he's getting a little too full of himself... "winning easily?" That should be enough reason.
exactly. Stork is doint it very... aesthestically.... spelling right?
Ra could also be losing on purpose.
I do understand why people are mad at Stork for losing (intentioanlly) and I'm kind of mad at him, but I also understand this kid because Korea? the culture is a bit different there... If Stork just gave up and went against Hwasin, the fans in Korea would make fun of Stork... or something. When it comes to WCG Koreans try their best for their country to win, not themselves. Even though they might not want to follow these rules, they would be publicly dissed? for being selfish. I'm sure Stork isn't having so much fun going on this infinite circlde of matches.
If one does view this whole WCG as a country Vs country, there is no reason for one to hate Stork. Stork is just doing the right thing for his country to win.
On October 06 2007 11:19 nitram wrote: They should just ban stork from the tourney this is getting ridiculous
Why only Stork? Ra does the same thing.
Then Ex and Fire(?) advances.
Anyway, I don't see how they can prove Stork or Ra loses on purpose.
stork is being the faggot here. i can only hope that ex and ra agreed on ra losing every game against ex as long as stork intentionally loses against him. i mean normally the winner of ex and ra would advance, so the better player takes it. but with this shit ex basically has 0 chance of advancing unless he beats stork. in this case, ra and ex would only play a real game when stork played real against ra, to let the better player advance and for good sportsmanship. this is totally different from what stork is doing.
On October 06 2007 11:23 mnm wrote: Is Stork losing on purpose? The Korean's official statement is no. Ra says that he is winning easily and I think he is implying that he is winning legitimately via skill. Now whether or not they are totally fucking with our minds I have no idea.
On October 06 2007 11:23 mnm wrote: Is Stork losing on purpose? The Korean's official statement is no. Ra says that he is winning easily and I think he is implying that he is winning legitimately via skill. Now whether or not they are totally fucking with our minds I have no idea.
Obviously it's all just speculation right now, but I really don't see any reason to trust either of them on this subject.
On October 06 2007 11:23 mnm wrote: Is Stork losing on purpose? The Korean's official statement is no. Ra says that he is winning easily and I think he is implying that he is winning legitimately via skill. Now whether or not they are totally fucking with our minds I have no idea.
If Ra says he is winning easily against Stork, I think he is implying that Stork is throwing games actually (not being cocky). Stork has one of the most solid PvP's in the world. He won't lose 3-0 to a random foreigner. Ra isn't that strong.
If Stork admits to throwing games they will probably disqualify him for that. Now, that will be embarrassing. And if he eliminates Hwasin, then Korean fans will get angry. That will be viewed as unsportsmanlike.
It's not illegal to go 24 nexus and it's not illegal to lose.
why is everyone so angry? i for one find it very entertaining, maybe they should try ex>stork, stork>ra, ra>ex for once, just to have a little more variety. lol...
of course, i'm actually hoping that both ex and ra will cheese stork and eliminate him for the annoying bracket fixing that koreans do every year, but that's a dream that will never come true...
On October 06 2007 11:23 mnm wrote: Is Stork losing on purpose? The Korean's official statement is no. Ra says that he is winning easily and I think he is implying that he is winning legitimately via skill. Now whether or not they are totally fucking with our minds I have no idea.
If Ra says he is winning easily against Stork, I think he is implying that Stork is throwing games actually (not being cocky). Stork has one of the most solid PvP's in the world. He won't lose 3-0 to a random foreigner. Ra isn't that strong.
On October 06 2007 11:27 mnm wrote: ra just beat ex a passing ref said. ill look into this
Ok, that means Stork is second. Ra stopped throwing his match. Good luck vs Hwasin, RA.
Well, he'll only play Hwasin if he wins in the ro16. But he didn't have much of a choice if he and ex played first. If he'd lost, he could've been eliminated.
On October 06 2007 11:32 Pyrthas wrote: Well, he'll only play Hwasin if he wins in the ro16. But he didn't have much of a choice if he and ex played first. If he'd lost, he could've been eliminated.
That's the advantage Stork has. Ra is risking elimination by throwing a game before he is sure to be at least 2nd.
If Ra and Stork both try to throw the same game then that will be really retarded. And if Stork wins he has to lose to Ex so he is not no.1 and then they are still tied.
On October 06 2007 11:35 ahole-surprise wrote: Ok so as soon as the order is changed and Ra can't guarantee second by losing to Ex, Ra wins. Ra was throwing games too.
On October 06 2007 11:39 diehilde wrote: lemme guess - storks probes try to block ras nexus, while a cpl of ras zealots try to get through the blockade to destroy their own nexus....
4 goons now trying to break into ra's base but moving back slowly against the aggressive zealots. zealots retreated and stork followed with goons.. 4 goons.. down to 3.. vs ra's goon and 4 zlots
Lookes like Stork couldn't gamble losing to Ra and then trying to win Ex the next.
But If Stork is still aiming to be #2, And if our hypothesis - that stork is losing intentionally to be #2 - is right (okay more like a truth) .... If I'm correct Stork is going to lose this time.
On October 06 2007 11:51 diehilde wrote: i bet if there was a liquibet or gosubet the odds would suddenly be like 80% for ex against stork for this one ^^
I do feel sorry for Stork. It has been like 2? days since he came, he must be jetlagged. He's probablly thinkin
'I WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANT SLEEEEEEEP"
but then again his coach will be looking behind ... with that impenetrable stare... w/e that means All right I'm going to sleep. It's 11:00 PM here. I got a test.
yeah jtan I was thinkin about that but I think Stork was playing safe. There is always the possibility of him losing to Ex because of some rush or strategyt
On October 06 2007 11:53 jtan wrote: It's pretty weird though, if stork really is going for the top 3 koreans he should have lost to ra again and then beaten ex.
Yeah, him beating ra surprised me. But we'll have to see what happens against ex.
On October 06 2007 11:55 samsammy wrote: yeah jtan I was thinkin about that but I think Stork was playing safe. There is always the possibility of him losing to Ex because of some rush or strategyt
its just weird because he finally got a good chance to get 2nd and with ra winning, he could of lost to ra and beaten ex
On October 06 2007 11:21 samsammy wrote: Was it last year? or when was it? I remember one of the Korean protoss losing intentionally on a PvP I think it was Park Jung Suk ... HE did say he lost intentionally... the opponent said that too. (I don't think it's last year now, the players were Zerg, terran terran last year)
Or maybe it wasn't the WCG. I don't care, but the point is that Korea progamers can lose, making the game look quite legitimate.
I'm pretty sure mnm can see some kind of flaw in Stork's play.
Like abnormal, or unsafe build order, or deliberate pylon misplacement, or attacking without control, or intentional unit production block.
probably reach vs leg on on the IEF thing? or whatever it was called
stork just put down an expansion. he went to ex's expo finding him expanding and picked off building scv. ex put down 2 mines at his ramp with vult so stork couldnt go up. ex is trying to go up ramp but 2 goons and zlot in way. 2 rines and 1 tank and 1 scv fighting. lost everything except tank n scv so retreated
flaw in game? the flaw i saw was that stork kept getting rushed and it seems like either stork thought he could handle teching or expoing even with the rush and just failed or he left himself wide open..
stork has obs right now he has 4 goons running out of base. ex is setting up at middle with 4 tanks and some mines but stork zlot bombed the tanks and pushed forward with 4 goons. 2 vults and 1 tank left
On October 06 2007 12:00 mnm wrote: flaw in game? the flaw i saw was that stork kept getting rushed and it seems like either stork thought he could handle teching or expoing even with the rush and just failed or he left himself wide open..
stork is expanding at 11. while killing off ex's base. he walled the ramp of the expo with pylons.. 4 of them.. killing off ex's base at the same time.. picking off scvs at ex's expo.. burning buildings all around ex's base
hahaha YEY! GOGO FOREIGNERS! now if everything goes well mondi can meet stork in the semis... and i think if he has a chance against any of the foreigners bo3, its against stork pvz.
On October 06 2007 12:08 GeLaar wrote: ex should get a special medal for "curageous sacrifice to thwart the korean conspiracy of complete sc domination"
did Ex have anything to say here ? I don't think so..
On October 06 2007 12:12 denyo77 wrote: why he didnt just lost vs ex and win vs ra to get 2#?
That makes a tie breaker. Judging from the reports though, it seemed Stork was trying very subpar builds but his opponents just gg'd before he got a chance to go through with a loss.
On October 06 2007 12:08 GeLaar wrote: ex should get a special medal for "curageous sacrifice to thwart the korean conspiracy of complete sc domination"
did Ex have anything to say here ? I don't think so..
he had his role to play, and he played along. in the first two tie-breakers ra absolutely had to lose vs ex in order to avoid the no 1 spot, and ex could have made it difficult for ra to throw. so yes, he helped ra get the outcome he wanted for his group.
On October 06 2007 12:21 mayap wrote: btw can the kors get 1 2 3 now?
erm im sure they cant because Hwasin and stork have to meet before semis now i think.
well wouldnt you have to meet in the semis in order to have a chance to play for the 3rd place match ? i think this means only 2 kors get into the top 3 now
edit : i think a couple of foreigners just ruined cj, stx soul and khan's master plan
koreans can get top2 still but not top3 due to the fact the Hwasin and Stork might meet in ro8 (Round of 8) but yeah having 2 koreans in opposite side of brackets.
It would of been nicer if they were all in in bottom half. that way a non-korean guarantees 2nd place
i still find it hard for a non-korean to beat a korean in bo3 now. well atleast these particular top5 kespa korean players.
they also placed top3 in WCG Korea without using these WCG Maps.
On October 06 2007 12:24 RoMeO wrote: koreans can get top2 still but not top3 due to the fact the Hwasin and Stork might meet in ro8 (Round of 8) but yeah having 2 koreans in opposite side of brackets.
It would of been nicer if they were all in in bottom half. that way a non-korean guarantees 2nd place
i still find it hard for a non-korean to beat a korean in bo3 now. well atleast these particular top5 kespa korean players.
they also placed top3 in WCG Korea without using these WCG Maps.
We don't need affirmative action thx. Let the 3 best players take the medals.
well its pretty obvious the kors were targeting top 3, ra is a great player but beating stork 3 (best pvp along with bisu)games then losing to ex who stork just easily ran over every game? i dont think the kors would want to enter a tour like this where one of them doesnt get a prize and played all these games for no reason and wasted their time while they could have prepared themselves for upcoming league matchs etc.
On October 06 2007 12:28 Aphelion wrote: Fuck this. WCG needs to have seeding system or double elimination.
agreed with seeding system but thats pretty hard for the foreigners who arnt really known or the foreigners who are close to each other skill-wise,i guess they wouldnt make any difference in the group (the foreigners who arnt known really well) stages but u never know
I like how everyone is blaming Stork for doing what he is suppose to do, and not Ra/Ex who are just trying to fuck one of the koreans from getting a medal. WCG needs to implement a seeding system next year so the better players don't have to purposely throw games like this.
On October 06 2007 12:52 MyCrow wrote: I like how everyone is blaming Stork for doing what he is suppose to do, and not Ra/Ex who are just trying to fuck one of the koreans from getting a medal. WCG needs to implement a seeding system next year so the better players don't have to purposely throw games like this.
no they dont, they need to implement double elim,
Double elim BO1 is better than single elim bo3 imo.
On October 06 2007 12:52 MyCrow wrote: I like how everyone is blaming Stork for doing what he is suppose to do, and not Ra/Ex who are just trying to fuck one of the koreans from getting a medal. WCG needs to implement a seeding system next year so the better players don't have to purposely throw games like this.
no they dont, they need to implement double elim,
Double elim BO1 is better than single elim bo3 imo.
I agree.
With double elim we won't get so much of this crap.
I took a closer look at the savior/mondragon thing, and guess what, thanks to savior being #2 in his group, he can now avoid Hwasin until the finals. Otherwise he would have played him in semis (if GG.net's bracket order is correct) Now I'm not saying savior threw the game, but a little odd how the way things turned out, no?
Koreans want to get #1,#2,#3 like last year. So I'm sure they thought of the best possible ways to get their brackets split as far as possible. It would have been a success if Stork just pulled through, but thanks to White-ra and Ex's continuous tiebreakers (intentional or not) it didn't happen.
Look at the brackets on GGnet. If Stork got #2, he wouldn't have to face another Korean until semis (savior), and then face Hwasin at the finals. Now he has to face hwasin at the Ro16.
Now if you look at this in another light, it's probably more likely that Mondy beat savior fair, because savior/mondi game came before stork's 3 way tiebreaker. Which means they probably assumed stork would get #2 anyways, and if savior got #1 in his group, he's play hwasin at the semis and whoever won would play stork at the finals. This seems like a more logical choice, so the fact that didn't happen is probably a strong argument that the savior/mondi game was legit.
I would have #2 seeds of ko brackets randomly shuffled/drawn after groups. With added restriction no players from same group can play against each other in ro16.
On October 06 2007 12:46 Jyvblamo wrote: TL.Net should send a condolence ham to Stork. I feel really bad for him now, being stuck in his shitty situation.
you feel bad for him for trying to throw a game and failing?
On October 06 2007 12:46 Jyvblamo wrote: TL.Net should send a condolence ham to Stork. I feel really bad for him now, being stuck in his shitty situation.
you feel bad for him for trying to throw a game and failing?
Not sure if anyone got this, but Reason is zerg and played terran because it's what Savior did vs GoRush. That's why both of them were smiling before the match.
how would you feel if you got bracket-fucked like the Koreans did?
The system is screwed up. the Koreans are simply trying to rectify the situation and make the best of it they can. If that means tossing games, so be it. I'd rather watch Koreans play each other later in higher-importance matches than early on.
Plus, nobody can deny that the three strongest players there are the Korean representatives, and that the three best deserve the medals. If they aren't following the rules by the letter in throwing games, they are following the spirit of the tournament by trying to let the best men get prizes. I don't see why anyone can blame them for it.
Every year WCG does this. It needs to be fixed. The maps are always fucked, too. They need to be fixed. I have zero faith in WCG administration.
While I wouldn't go so far as to say that throwing games is following the spirit of the tournament, the fact remains that the WCG system is fucked up. No listening to gamers, shitty organization year after year, completely out of touch with this crap maps and Microsoft money determining the games.
Maybe for SC2 Blizzard should hold an annual tourny. I wouldn't mind playing like a dollar a year for B.Net every year to fund it. It should just take over WCG as the premier gaming event. I won't even mind if games like War3 or WoW are included. Still better than the crap WCG has right now.
Are you saying the brackets weren't generated randomly? Or that they should somehow say "Oh, the Koreans are the best, so let's engineer the brackets so that they don't have to face each other until the semifinals"? Clearly that would be wholly unfair. Assuming there was no tampering that put the Koreans together at a certain time or something, I don't see why they shouldn't have to to face each other before the end of the match. Maybe a better solution is double elimination after the group stage?
The biggest loss now is trying to question which of these kor games were legit vs non. I don't 100% blame the koreans for trying to beat the brackets but honestly there needs to be a better system.
On October 06 2007 15:03 Last Romantic wrote: ....
how would you feel if you got bracket-fucked like the Koreans did?
what are you talking about? the odds are against a country with 3 representatives being seperated enough in the groups/bracket to get top 3 without throwing games.
If there are players so far ahead of the competition that there is incentive for them to cheat the brackets (they feel assured they can win when necessary), then a different system must be implemented. Double elimination sounds the best right now, but either way something must be done.
On October 06 2007 15:03 Last Romantic wrote: ....
how would you feel if you got bracket-fucked like the Koreans did?
what are you talking about? the odds are against a country with 3 representatives being seperated enough in the groups/bracket to get top 3 without throwing games.
On October 06 2007 15:03 Last Romantic wrote: ....
how would you feel if you got bracket-fucked like the Koreans did?
what are you talking about? the odds are against a country with 3 representatives being seperated enough in the groups/bracket to get top 3 without throwing games.
Maybe I worded it badly. Fucked by the system, then.
I don't think seeding is quite the right answer, but double elimination seems to work well. A combination [a la Blizzcon, WWI] would work even better, though DE suffices.
have the winner choose if he wants to be 1st or 2nd. They did this at WEG WarCraft when ElakeDuck and GoStop played. The winner would go into a group with only koreans, while the 2nd place would go into a group with only foreigners. Obviously nobody wants to win, so they just decided that whoever wins get to choose his group.
On October 06 2007 12:52 MyCrow wrote: I like how everyone is blaming Stork for doing what he is suppose to do, and not Ra/Ex who are just trying to fuck one of the koreans from getting a medal. WCG needs to implement a seeding system next year so the better players don't have to purposely throw games like this.
we blame stork / the koreans who make him do this because they started this bullshit and without their unsportsman bracket fixing behaviour, ra and ex would never even have THOUGHT about not playing legit. Its a response to storks gayness. And at least in things like this foreigners seem to own koreans when it comes down to strategy its a strange mentality to accept throwing games that is going on with many koreans it seems. when this happened in a soccer world cup match between germany and austria (well they played draw cus theyd both advance) the fans were in an uproar and the rules were changed so this could never happen again. that some ppl here on tl support such behaviour for the sake of nationalism is beyond me. its a legit wish to get all 3 medals for your country, but its not ok to throw games to achieve that. that is against the spirit of fair play. did u ever think about the other contenders who get royally fucked and whom it is totally unfair against (for example for ex)?
ex didnt get fucked, he wouldntve qualified either way (ra threw the last game to go into tiebreaks)
in the cases where it really does screw over other people, it sucks. but if the koreans go into a bracket with no other koreans theyre almost guaranteed top 2, which is significant money, along with everything else. cant really blaim them for trying.
shut up about koreans fixing the brackets. So what if they tried? A lot of money is involved so they tried to give themselves a good position to be in to get to top 3. Even if it wasn't planned among the koreans, individually it would make sense to avoid the strongest bracket tree. And ra threw his games too and no one seems to be blaming him?
i wont discuss this further, fixing brackets is considered unfair in EVERY sport on the earth and in 99% of these there is much more money involved than in wcg finals.
On October 06 2007 18:15 Aepplet wrote: the solution is obvious, tried, and tested:
have the winner choose if he wants to be 1st or 2nd. They did this at WEG WarCraft when ElakeDuck and GoStop played. The winner would go into a group with only koreans, while the 2nd place would go into a group with only foreigners. Obviously nobody wants to win, so they just decided that whoever wins get to choose his group.
that would be unfair to other brackets because then it is advantageous to be playing in a later bracket.
edit: i dont understand why stork has to get all the shit. there were 3 players in the tie and none of the 3 wanted to face hwasin. white_ra threw just as hard as stork did and i also don't get why the heck anyone would consider ex a "martyr" - he just too much of a noob to win his first game so he never got to throw his 2nd one.
On October 06 2007 18:15 Aepplet wrote: the solution is obvious, tried, and tested:
have the winner choose if he wants to be 1st or 2nd. They did this at WEG WarCraft when ElakeDuck and GoStop played. The winner would go into a group with only koreans, while the 2nd place would go into a group with only foreigners. Obviously nobody wants to win, so they just decided that whoever wins get to choose his group.
No this is also not ideal, since this means you can still plan the tournament, and have a choice that those who played earlier did not have!
In other major competitions you instead play the final match at the same time, so you won't have the option to choose. If you want to drop a game, do so at your own peril, since you won't know 100%..
throwing games to get in a better position regarding the price money is understandable. it's understandable, and about the positive stuff one could say about it, that's completely it. far more importantly it's unfair, childish and proof of a really bad understanding of sportmanship. the latter also fits for people taking sides.. ("best players should win the medals and it's okay to manipulate the tournament because of that" omg never heard such bullshit)
oh and it's really dumb to say that one should blame white-ra as much as stork. white-ra's motivation was revenge-like, which is, of course, not very sportsman-like as well. but considering stork bitching from the beginning, i totally adore what ra did. cool guy.
i guess what it all boils down to is that the playing field is not leveled enough. nobody would throw the winners game in an msl because the risk of not qualifying at all is too large. that's why we get to see teammates facing off early sometimes (bisu and light last msl, savior and iris daum osl etc.). when there are only a handful of contenders and the rest are just cannon fodder this kind of situation will arise =(
On October 06 2007 22:02 ffs wrote: throwing games to get in a better position regarding the price money is understandable. it's understandable, and about the positive stuff one could say about it, that's completely it. far more importantly it's unfair, childish and proof of a really bad understanding of sportmanship. the latter also fits for people taking sides.. ("best players should win the medals and it's okay to manipulate the tournament because of that" omg never heard such bullshit)
oh and it's really dumb to say that one should blame white-ra as much as stork. white-ra's motivation was revenge-like, which is, of course, not very sportsman-like as well. but considering stork bitching from the beginning, i totally adore what ra did. cool guy.
That's exactly my opinion, I just couldn't word it so perfectly
Yeah. Stork just let's Ra walk over him in terms of macro. He has even more gateways in the middle game because he doesn't go reavers. Still, Ra has more units. Stork goes HT but then lets his army get killed without HT support. He actually moves his forces back the whole time, then forward again, until he is driven in the right hand corner of the map.
At some point when stork was attacking ra, you could see that stork was microing his zeals so that they would walk in front of ra's goons and take unnecessary damage. Just one of many clues.
Stork wanted 2nd place in group to get get top brackets, hwasin middle and savior bottom so the can own the brackets but then that didnt happen when mondragon won against savior. Savior got top bracket. Stork still thinking that he will get second and a chance to at least get third didnt happened either because it was foiled by the russian plans ;d.... so now stork will have to take out hwasin making it a foreigner will get top 3!
Stork put up a good show though, used up his money and all. But going zealgoon vs reavergoon lol. And just bad timing with expoing. And cutting probes. He just wanted to be outmacroed imo
EPT
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