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Active: 547 users

[SPL] PO: Khan vs KT (Day 1)

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
Post a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 112 113 114 Next
Abort Retry Fail
Profile Joined December 2011
2636 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-24 11:56:16
March 21 2012 05:35 GMT
#1

[image loading]

thanks to disciple for the awesome banner
+ Show Spoiler +
and thanks to sam, my officemate, who did some tweaks to the original banner for this thread.
pizza and bottomless booze on me on saturday




2011-2012 SK Planet Proleague Semifinals Day 1
Saturday March 24, 03:00 GMT (+00:00)



[image loading]      [image loading]
badass team icon by Heimatloser
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]      [image loading]

[image loading] Samsung KHAN vs KT Rolster [image loading]

« Neo Outlier »
« Sniper Ridge »
« Neo Chain Reaction »
« Ground Zero »
« Jade »
« Neo Electric Circuit »
« Neo Outlier »


[image loading]
+ Show Spoiler +
+ Show Spoiler +
(P)Stork « Neo Outlier » (P)Wooki

+ Show Spoiler +
(Z)RorO « Sniper Ridge » (Z)HoeJJa

+ Show Spoiler +
(Z)Shine « Neo Chain Reaction » (Z)Action

+ Show Spoiler +
(P)Jangbi « Ground Zero » (T)Flash

+ Show Spoiler +
(T)Reality « Jade » (P)Stats

+ Show Spoiler +
(P)Grape « Neo Electric Circuit » (Z)Crazy-Hydra

+ Show Spoiler +
« Neo Outlier »


[image loading]
+ Show Spoiler +
+ Show Spoiler +
(P)Stork « Neo Outlier » (P)Wooki

+ Show Spoiler +
(Z)RorO « Sniper Ridge » (Z)HoeJJa

+ Show Spoiler +
(Z)Shine « Neo Chain Reaction » (Z)Action

+ Show Spoiler +
(P)Jangbi « Ground Zero » (T)Flash

+ Show Spoiler +
(T)Reality « Jade » (P)Stats

+ Show Spoiler +
(P)Grape « Neo Electric Circuit » (Z)Crazy-Hydra

+ Show Spoiler +
(P)Stork « Neo Outlier » (P)Stats


+ Show Spoiler [Final Team Score] +
[image loading] Samsung KHAN [3] vs [4] KT Rolster [image loading]


[image loading]
+ Show Spoiler +
+ Show Spoiler +
Poll: Recommend Game 1?

Yes (37)
 
73%

No (14)
 
27%

51 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 1?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No


+ Show Spoiler +
Poll: Recommend Game 2?

No (26)
 
59%

Yes (18)
 
41%

44 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 2?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No


+ Show Spoiler +
Poll: Recommend Game 3?

Yes (55)
 
96%

No (2)
 
4%

57 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 3?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No


+ Show Spoiler +
Poll: Recommend Game 4?

No (28)
 
56%

Yes (22)
 
44%

50 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 4?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No


+ Show Spoiler +
Poll: Recommend Game 5?

Yes (71)
 
92%

No (6)
 
8%

77 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 5?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No


+ Show Spoiler +
Poll: Recommend Game 6?

Yes (67)
 
99%

No (1)
 
1%

68 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 6?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No


+ Show Spoiler +
Poll: Recommend Game 7?

Yes (44)
 
56%

No (34)
 
44%

78 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Game 7?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No



[image loading]
Wala.Revolution
nanashin
Pro7ecT
supernovamaniac



User was warned for failing to maintain an LR OP
BSOD
Abort Retry Fail
Profile Joined December 2011
2636 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-23 06:58:44
March 21 2012 05:36 GMT
#2
Vote for your team here!
+ Show Spoiler +
Poll: Who will win in Day 1?

KT Rolster (139)
 
50%

Samsung Khan (138)
 
50%

277 total votes

Your vote: Who will win in Day 1?

(Vote): Samsung Khan
(Vote): KT Rolster





Poll: Who will enter the Grand Finals?

KT Rolster (138)
 
51%

Samsung Khan (133)
 
49%

271 total votes

Your vote: Who will enter the Grand Finals?

(Vote): Samsung Khan
(Vote): KT Rolster





Poll: Which team has a better chance against SKT T1 in the Grand Finals?

KT Rolster (147)
 
62%

Samsung Khan (91)
 
38%

238 total votes

Your vote: Which team has a better chance against SKT T1 in the Grand Finals?

(Vote): Samsung Khan
(Vote): KT Rolster




[image loading]

PREDICTIONS, ANALYSIS, HYPE!

by Wala.Revolution:

Predictions

Doing predictions for playoffs made me appreciate coaches and managers even more. Because of its Bo7 format and its lengthy preparation time, there are so many possibilities of mindgames (factor in it's Bo3 of Bo7s and it's even more complex). It's too hard to predict. Even I feel that my predictions are only slightly better than bogus. Also I am biased towards Khan.

« Neo Outlier »
Against CJ Hoejja was sent on here all three matches. Both teams know that, and I do think Samsung will try to use to their advantage to snipe Hoejja with a Terran. I don't see KT 'wasting' Flash or Stats on here, so it'll either be a zerg (which shouldn't be different from Hoejja), or Barracks/Perfectman to counter-snipe.

I think Turn is a good choice for this, as his aggressive style can be used to the max because on that map TvZ and TvP will be about whether the terran can break the front or not.

Hoejja < Turn

« Sniper Ridge »
« Neo Chain Reaction »
« Ground Zero »
« Jade »
The reason I group these maps together are because I highly doubt Flash won't be sent out on one of these maps. KT could take a risk and send Flash out on Jade, but I think it's unlikely because a 4-0 is a possibility (without Flash, albeit low) and Jade can be handled by everyone else. It's also unlikely that he will play on Neo Chain Reaction as well, so we can assume he'll be either playing on Sniper Ridge or Ground Zero.

I think Flash will come out on Sniper Ridge, just like day 2 and 3 of KT vs CJ. It is a superb map for Terrans to play standard vs both Protoss and Zerg, as well as with Flash's 6th sense (which is actually 'just' his ability to analyze information, no matter how small; however, this can be used against him, as was the case of vs. Dear), he'll have a good chance to show us why he is considered a demigod.

As for Khan, I think Stork or Jangbi will be sent out to soft-counter Flash. His games vs Horang2 shows that he is definitely beatable on this map, if not on any map (Horang shouldn't have lost 2nd game and should've won first game more convincingly). I can't tell if Jangbi or Stork will be sent out.

Flash < Jangbi but Flash > Stork because I think Stork will make a crucial mistake on a game-deciding maneuver.

Chain Reaction will still be Brave's map, despite Samsung expecting KT to prepare as such. After fielding him so many times with good results, I think Brave will still be suitable on this map to deal with anything KT throws at him. I expect Wookie to come out with a double fake build of some sorts, but Brave will be prepared and beat it.

Wookie < Brave

On Ground Zero, Stats will come out for KT and I expect whoever didn't come out against Flash to be fielded here. It's a tossup as to who wins. All three players are solid players, and Stats would have easily overcome his shock from that huge mine over the past few days.

Stats <> Stork/Jangbi

Then it's time for a ZvZ on Jade. I expect Action or Crazy-Hydra vs Roro, because I think Roro is better at ZvZ than Shine. Action has experience on this map over CH though. It should go to muta fights, and I expect whoever has the better BO to win.

Action <> Roro

« Neo Electric Circuit »
Shine/Reality/Grape will come out on Neo Electric Circuit, and for KT, it can either be Crazy-Hydra or Mind for a surprise. But CH has been doing quite well in Proleague (and Mind failing), and despite his loss vs Hero which he was very close to having a good chance to win, CH will come out on this map. If Samsung thinks as such, I expect Reality or Grape to come out because ZvZ can always become a tossup.

Reality > Crazy-Hydra > Grape

« Neo Outlier »
It's ace match, so it'll be Flash, possibly Stats or even Crazy-Hydra, expecting a snipe but I doubt it. Stork has been fielded many times on Outlier, and I expect him to have something vs Terran on this map. If it's PvP or PvZ, it'll be decided by who has the better play (and BO), but if it's Flash vs Stork I expect Stork to win.

Stork > Flash

So I have

(Z)HoeJJa « Neo Outlier » Turn
Flash « Sniper Ridge » (P)Stork
Wookie « Neo Chain Reaction » Brave
(P)Stats « Ground Zero » (P)JangBi
(Z)Action « Jade » (Z)RorO
(Z)Crazy-Hydra « Neo Electric Circuit » Reality
(T)Flash « Neo Outlier » Stork

A possibility is for KT to field Flash on Neo Outlier, preparing him for both the first match and should it be necessary, for the ace match as well. I think that's unlikely though, given Flash has capacity to prepare for two maps at least.

Map analysis: Neo Outlier

Why do I expect Turn on here? Because I think Terrans can do fine on this map. Against Zerg, I think two-port is a great opening as Leta has shown in all his games, although spawning at 12 can lead to complications as demonstrated by Light. However, I doubt anyone other than Leta to open two-port, so I expect a wall-in at the nat from Terran for a safe expo, or a vult-expo.

Then zerg will be able to get a easy 3rd gas; up to here, it's standard TvZ except the distance between bases is probably shorter. Why I believe this map is good for Terran is because there is a safe expo at mid you can easily take as a 3rd base by mining out the mineral to high ground and positining a few tanks there. By having tanks there, Terran can secure the narrow, lower-ground pathway as well a good portion of center, allowing considerable range for his mnm/vessel army to roam around with tank support. With aggressive vessel play backed by tanks in middle, zerg's 4th base, whether at either of middle expos or at the unused main expo will always be in trouble. Then, zergs have to opt for drop play while taking a 4th at the side expo between the terran and the zerg, which is always vulnerable to drops before a nydus sets up or Terran can choose to mine out minerals and fight that way, because he'll need to defend that area with drops anyway.

In addition, there are two steps for the terran to push to zerg's base. If he chooses to advance through the wide center, which is smarter because lurkerling can stall on the narrow ramp for a long time, the only ways zerg can backstab are through the narrow pathway of terran's or pathway though theirs into terran's 3rd. Defending a backstab teasily done by having a bunker or two there, and sandwhiching the zerg with the main army.

Other than that, the zerg can attempt to fight at center head-to-head. This battle, I believe, is much better for Terran. No matter which way the zerg flanks, there is still an open path because there are three pathways out of center. In addition, terran's reinforcements are quick to arrive, threatening one of zerg's flank with a pincer maneuver. Without a good way for the zerg to engage in center, I think Terran can always put enormous pressure before defilers are out with the short distance, and even if that were to fail, have another good chance gain a big advantage before zerg can set up a 4th base.

There will be problems however, if terran cannot secure an advantage with a 3rd base in the middle. Side expos are difficult for Terrans to take and secure once Zergs have defiler tech, and drops are always a threat as well. Hence, I expect Turn to be sent out as his aggressive style suits Terran's needs on this map.

Against protoss, it is a bit more diffcult to theorycraft. Midgame should be similar to that of a standard game as Protoss also has a safe 3rd expo, but lack of flankable positions other than center is a problem for protoss as well because routing a big zealot army around neutral side's highground can be cumbersome. If not executed properly, Protoss may find Terran's army already wailing at the natural nexus with plenty of mines to delay the flanking army. Once lategame hits however, arbitors become nightmares.
BSOD
dRaW
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Canada5744 Posts
March 21 2012 05:41 GMT
#3
EPIC!!!!!!!!!!!!! I really hope KT wins this though... maybe again in 3 sets since more BW = better!!
I don't need luck, luck is for noobs, good luck to you though
TheNessman
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States4158 Posts
March 21 2012 05:48 GMT
#4
Thank you very much for starting the LR thread so early, part of the reason i missed the last playoffs live was because the LR threads came up so late. :/

HYPE HYPE HYPE
~~! youtube.com/xmungam1 !~~
sour_eraser
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada932 Posts
March 21 2012 05:49 GMT
#5
Hope this goes till ace match for both days. I dont want 4 games, I want 7 !!!
"What's the f*cking point of censoring a letter if everyone and their mother knows what it stands for.... F*cking morons"
Zariel
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Australia1285 Posts
March 21 2012 05:54 GMT
#6
Loving these saturday 12:00kst matches. I finish work and speed home just in time to watch.
sup
Caesarion
Profile Joined April 2011
Australia8332 Posts
March 21 2012 06:07 GMT
#7
Map order can be found here.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=322221
Jindo
Profile Joined July 2011
United States1305 Posts
March 21 2012 06:19 GMT
#8
PvX fighting!
Sawamura
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Malaysia7602 Posts
March 21 2012 06:24 GMT
#9
Blind Rawr is going to get mad when he sees this .......... He was supposed to make the LR thread but oh well......
BW/KT Forever R.I.P KT.Violet dearly missed ..
ffreakk
Profile Joined September 2010
Singapore2155 Posts
March 21 2012 06:25 GMT
#10
KHAN be smashing them Rolsters!
Look. Only Forward. See. Only Victory.
kitaman27 *
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States9245 Posts
March 21 2012 06:25 GMT
#11
Go Go Khan :D
I'm better than dirt. Well, most kinds of dirt. I mean not that fancy store bought dirt. That stuffs loaded with nutrients. I... I can't compete with that stuff.
Sinedd
Profile Joined July 2008
Poland7052 Posts
March 21 2012 06:31 GMT
#12
SAMSUNG KHAN FIGHTIIIING !!!
T H C makes ppl happy
Oozo
Profile Joined December 2009
Finland432 Posts
March 21 2012 06:34 GMT
#13
This will be quite interesting match up. Lot to stake on how zergs play it out. Only difference from bo5->bo7 kind of introduced is that there is massive need of skill for zergs to succeed. KT looking strong, but its Shine&Roro now, hoping for good games! (not really a fan of either, but Khan fighting!).
SKT for OSL!
OminouS
Profile Joined February 2010
Sweden1343 Posts
March 21 2012 06:37 GMT
#14
Make me proud. I know you can do it.
On the 6th day JF made Reavers and on the 7th day JF put his opponent to rest
Abort Retry Fail
Profile Joined December 2011
2636 Posts
March 21 2012 06:39 GMT
#15
On March 21 2012 15:34 Oozo wrote:
This will be quite interesting match up. Lot to stake on how zergs play it out. Only difference from bo5->bo7 kind of introduced is that there is massive need of skill for zergs to succeed. KT looking strong, but its Shine&Roro now, hoping for good games! (not really a fan of either, but Khan fighting!).

Are you serious? I hope you are joking because they just trashed the two best Zergs and ZvZers in Hydra and Effort last series!
BSOD
Kiett
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States7639 Posts
March 21 2012 06:42 GMT
#16
My boys have got this, np.

+ Show Spoiler +
I'll wear my lucky Khan jacket to make sure they win :3
[image loading]
Writer:o
J1.au
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Australia3596 Posts
March 21 2012 06:44 GMT
#17
KT Zergs are too strong for KHAN.
Iplaythings
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Denmark9110 Posts
March 21 2012 06:45 GMT
#18
There was once upon a time a brocode about calling a LR thread

Poor blind
In the woods, there lurks..
Hyde
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
Australia14568 Posts
March 21 2012 06:45 GMT
#19
On March 21 2012 15:42 Kiett wrote:
My boys have got this, np.

+ Show Spoiler +
I'll wear my lucky Khan jacket to make sure they win :3
[image loading]

You'd wear that jacket even if Khan wasn't playing lol
+ Show Spoiler +
You even wear it to sleep, I wish I had more team swag


Go Khan, show us your might and defeat the current champions!
Because when you left, Brood War was all spotlights and titans. Now, with the death of the big leagues, Brood War has moved to the basements and carparks. Now, Brood War is unlicensed brawls, lost teeth, and bloody fights for fistfulls of money - SirJolt
Oozo
Profile Joined December 2009
Finland432 Posts
March 21 2012 06:49 GMT
#20
On March 21 2012 15:39 Abort Retry Fail wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 21 2012 15:34 Oozo wrote:
This will be quite interesting match up. Lot to stake on how zergs play it out. Only difference from bo5->bo7 kind of introduced is that there is massive need of skill for zergs to succeed. KT looking strong, but its Shine&Roro now, hoping for good games! (not really a fan of either, but Khan fighting!).

Are you serious? I hope you are joking because they just trashed the two best Zergs and ZvZers in Hydra and Effort last series!


Ok, Roro is kinda long stretch, but you can't just ignore Shine. Guy got good ZvZ, and you need also think that its not all about ZvZ (there is other possibilities like ZvT and ZvP) . Also one good match does not prove that anyone is god tier in ZvZ, for what I did see, there is still room to improve (aka when JD was beasting everyone in that match up.)
SKT for OSL!
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