The one team I don't mind beating SKT that much. I'm just hoping there is a bit more diversity than a bisu all kill (which is very likely). I adjusted my sleep schedule to watch this, but when I read the calendar I thought it was an early game, so I'm going to be messed up for the rest of the day. Make it worth it SKT!
T1 fighting! Hopefully we'll see more Bisu games this time around though. Those are always fun to watch. If it wasn't such a close race for first, I actually wouldn't mind a Stars win.
On March 08 2011 16:20 Simplistik wrote: Alright SK, please make it a team win!
hell no - team games are cool cuz it means that there is a lot of them but I rather have zero almost all kill then bisu reverse all-kill. fantasy all-kill would be nice too but seems way more unlikely.
I feel so bad i cant watch it, im thinking fanta will 2 kill taking down one of ZerO/Soulkey and will either be taken out by one of the zergs or light, if its one of the zergs Bisu will most likely rape them and then play vs light in which its anyones game.
Between Light and Zero, one of the two should be able to deal with Fantasy. The rest of SKT1 should then fall like dominos, as Free can clean up any shitty PvPers that are left.
as long as woongjin's coaching staff doesn't fail today, i think woongjin can take this one.. please woongjin >< so that kt can take the 1st place spot!
On March 08 2011 18:00 Doraemon wrote: im just hoping we don't play either sun or soo...
Oh come on, give Sun a chance. He's certainly better than Soo. And thanks to procrastination, it looks like I'll be able to watch this match... Or at least some of it. Yippee~
On March 08 2011 18:00 Doraemon wrote: im just hoping we don't play either sun or soo...
Oh come on, give Sun a chance. He's certainly better than Soo. And thanks to procrastination, it looks like I'll be able to watch this match... Or at least some of it. Yippee~
sun has had plenty of opportunities, he's like 3-7 in his last 10 and i think soo is 1-9 or something terrible.
On March 08 2011 18:00 Doraemon wrote: im just hoping we don't play either sun or soo...
Oh come on, give Sun a chance. He's certainly better than Soo. And thanks to procrastination, it looks like I'll be able to watch this match... Or at least some of it. Yippee~
sun has had plenty of opportunities, he's like 3-7 in his last 10 and i think soo is 1-9 or something terrible.
i'd rather see paralyze play
He gets opportunities because he's the best that SKT has. I've seen really nice play from him before, he just needs a bit more.
On March 08 2011 18:00 Doraemon wrote: im just hoping we don't play either sun or soo...
Oh come on, give Sun a chance. He's certainly better than Soo. And thanks to procrastination, it looks like I'll be able to watch this match... Or at least some of it. Yippee~
sun has had plenty of opportunities, he's like 3-7 in his last 10 and i think soo is 1-9 or something terrible.
i'd rather see paralyze play
Paralyze is like, forbidden from PL or something, or he wronged the coaches or something... Anyway....
Oooh snap, Bisu vs. Soulkey 1st set. SKT wants to end this quickly, it seems and make me not risk my health.
storm drop kills 4 drones and the shuttle + ht live many scourge give chase but all of them together only kill 1 sair soulkey with a hold lurker above bisu's 3rd
I have a related anecdote. Yesterday I was doing a jeopardy-style quiz show for a special last day with my first-year JHS students and the easy movie question was 'what movie is Darth Vader in?' This one girl raised her hand, I called on her, and she just started singing the imperial march. I doubled over laughing and gave her team the points anyways.
Early to early-midgame, I was seriously impressed at how well Soulkey prepared for this game. He knew the Sair/DT opening was coming, with the DT/+1 Speedlot followup attack and defended almost perfectly with minimal costs..
but in the end, Bisu is Bisu and his PvZ is just simply the best.. truly amazing play from both sides. Soulkey would've run over any other Protoss here.
Man, when Bisu is on his game I dont think there is any zerg who can take him even if he gives them vision. Soulkey knew exactly what Bisu's plan was still couldn't stop him. And Soulkey played good this game.
On March 08 2011 18:32 ArvickHero wrote: Early to early-midgame, I was seriously impressed at how well Soulkey prepared for this game. He knew the Sair/DT opening was coming, with the DT/+1 Speedlot followup attack and defended almost perfectly with minimal costs..
but in the end, Bisu is Bisu and his PvZ is just simply the best.. truly amazing play from both sides. Soulkey would've run over any other Protoss here.
Maybe you (or others) can educate me a bit here mate. I agree with what you're saying regarding SK and his early to mid game. I was impressed with his build and he adopted his usual defensive posture.
The thing I don't get is that when you set up a solid defence like that as Zerg, unless you rush to defilers, aren't you risking letting Toss expand easily and then ultimately just rolling over top of you?
Perhaps SK was rushing to defiler tech asap, and as Disciple said, Bisu just nailed that transition. It just felt to me like Bisu had a long time to macro up unhindered.
On March 08 2011 18:38 letian wrote: any ideas on alternative stream??? kiante lagging like hell gor me(
That's a pity =[ when it was Ustream many of us in the asia pacific region found it unwatchable but it's fine now =S. good luck i know how bad it feels to not be able to watch T.T
On March 08 2011 18:38 letian wrote: any ideas on alternative stream??? kiante lagging like hell gor me(
That's a pity =[ when it was Ustream many of us in the asia pacific region found it unwatchable but it's fine now =S. good luck i know how bad it feels to not be able to watch T.T
On March 08 2011 18:38 letian wrote: any ideas on alternative stream??? kiante lagging like hell gor me(
That's a pity =[ when it was Ustream many of us in the asia pacific region found it unwatchable but it's fine now =S. good luck i know how bad it feels to not be able to watch T.T
On March 08 2011 18:38 ]343[ wrote: let's go really!
(i am actually impressed with bisu's play vZ though... no holes whatsoever. almost like flash )
Ya, although ELO doesn't mean everything I think the fact that his vZ ELO is almost exactly the same as Flash's is just hyper impressive. He's THAT good at it.
On March 08 2011 18:32 ArvickHero wrote: Early to early-midgame, I was seriously impressed at how well Soulkey prepared for this game. He knew the Sair/DT opening was coming, with the DT/+1 Speedlot followup attack and defended almost perfectly with minimal costs..
but in the end, Bisu is Bisu and his PvZ is just simply the best.. truly amazing play from both sides. Soulkey would've run over any other Protoss here.
Maybe you (or others) can educate me a bit here mate. I agree with what you're saying regarding SK and his early to mid game. I was impressed with his build and he adopted his usual defensive posture.
The thing I don't get is that when you set up a solid defence like that as Zerg, unless you rush to defilers, aren't you risking letting Toss expand easily and then ultimately just rolling over top of you?
Perhaps SK was rushing to defiler tech asap, and as Disciple said, Bisu just nailed that transition. It just felt to me like Bisu had a long time to macro up unhindered.
In the past, a handful of lings would often shut down these expo attempts (which SK attempted). But Bisu was prepared here by keeping some units by his expos until his cannons finished lol..
From a Zerg perspective, I'm not that knowledgeable but it's just one of the cons to the defensive style of play on a 2 player map such as Benzene (no easy gas fourth, map designed for attacking). Though, had Bisu failed to pulled off that big attack at top left, Soulkey would've been in a pretty good position with Swarm/Plague.. Maybe the game would've been different had it been on Aztec or some 3+ player map lol
On March 08 2011 18:52 Vasoline73 wrote: This is what Boxer from 2004 playing 2011 Bisu would have looked like.
Kinda a compliment, depending on how you take that.
It's a compliment in the sense that I think it's cool Really is trying to be creative, but not one in the sense that his play style looks outdated and bad.
On March 08 2011 18:32 ArvickHero wrote: Early to early-midgame, I was seriously impressed at how well Soulkey prepared for this game. He knew the Sair/DT opening was coming, with the DT/+1 Speedlot followup attack and defended almost perfectly with minimal costs..
but in the end, Bisu is Bisu and his PvZ is just simply the best.. truly amazing play from both sides. Soulkey would've run over any other Protoss here.
Maybe you (or others) can educate me a bit here mate. I agree with what you're saying regarding SK and his early to mid game. I was impressed with his build and he adopted his usual defensive posture.
The thing I don't get is that when you set up a solid defence like that as Zerg, unless you rush to defilers, aren't you risking letting Toss expand easily and then ultimately just rolling over top of you?
Perhaps SK was rushing to defiler tech asap, and as Disciple said, Bisu just nailed that transition. It just felt to me like Bisu had a long time to macro up unhindered.
In the past, a handful of lings would often shut down these expo attempts (which SK attempted). But Bisu was prepared here by keeping some units by his expos until his cannons finished lol..
From a Zerg perspective, I'm not that knowledgeable but it's just one of the cons to the defensive style of play on a 2 player map such as Benzene (no easy gas fourth, map designed for attacking). Though, had Bisu failed to pulled off that big attack at top left, Soulkey would've been in a pretty good position with Swarm/Plague.. Maybe the game would've been different had it been on Aztec or some 3+ player map lol
Yeah, I noticed a few times where SK tried to harass with Lings but Bisu handled it well.
On March 08 2011 18:56 ShadeR wrote: Bisu should expo more agressively.
I don't know, I just think aggressive expansions are too easily punished on Icarus. If Bisu kept pumping units, he could easily prevent T from taking a third, why risk it?
bisus pvp is no trash, lol. he only lost any pvps to stork and kal this season. stork is in one of the best forms of his life and kal somehow has bisus numbers in pvp at the moment. also dont forget that there is quite a lot of luck involved in the bo lottery that are mirrors.
Soulkey can't ZvP well. Light can't TvP at all. Really's TvP is worse than his TvZ lately. Free's worst MU is PvP. Guemchi will take a while to return to form (not that he was great outside of WL anyway). And Zero's greed will get him punished. Zero hardly ever goes for aggressive builds in ZvP.
On March 08 2011 19:23 ArvickHero wrote: Still, Bisu is doing pretty well for being down 2 bases.. wonder if he practices often in situations where he's down a base
maybe its because he didn't know ? i mean once you figured out you were down 2 bases for such a long time, you started to lose motivation and played poorly ... also it's because free double expanded so his unit count at that moment wasn't as high ...
Lmfao, Bisu... He's not gonna be happy once he learned what happened. Great for Free though, his first victory after his break was against Bisu! That's going to be a definite mood-lifter.
Did you see Bisu's jaw drop when he saw the endgame screen, he had no idea until then. Gotta give it to Free though knew he couldn't win straight up so pulled out the double hidden expo build.
I don't get how Free can smile like he played like a champ in that game. If Bisu were smarter with the scouting, he would've gotten steamrolled. His micro wasn't on par with Bisu's and in any Bo3 he would've lost. But still, for having the balls to double ninja expo, that was pretty baller.
On March 08 2011 19:23 ArvickHero wrote: Still, Bisu is doing pretty well for being down 2 bases.. wonder if he practices often in situations where he's down a base
maybe its because he didn't know ? i mean once you figured out you were down 2 bases for such a long time, you started to lose motivation and played poorly ... also it's because free double expanded so his unit count at that moment wasn't as high ...
bisu is so predictable in PvP, its absolutely frustrating to see him lose to players that basically find various ways of knowing exactly how he is going to play
well at least skt is in a decent position. fantasy next will take care of free. even if zero beats fantasy, 2 skt zergs and ace curse will take out zero
On March 08 2011 19:23 ArvickHero wrote: Still, Bisu is doing pretty well for being down 2 bases.. wonder if he practices often in situations where he's down a base
maybe its because he didn't know ? i mean once you figured out you were down 2 bases for such a long time, you started to lose motivation and played poorly ... also it's because free double expanded so his unit count at that moment wasn't as high ...
hmm true.. still, free had way more gateways than Bisu, and his army was bigger in those fights Bisu won.. but in the end macro won for free -0-
On March 08 2011 19:27 Xstatic wrote: I don't get how Free can smile like he played like a champ in that game. If Bisu were smarter with the scouting, he would've gotten steamrolled. His micro wasn't on par with Bisu's and in any Bo3 he would've lost. But still, for having the balls to double ninja expo, that was pretty baller.
He was smiling because he just pulled off a really crazy ninja move on Bisu, and didn't bring it down to an all or nothing for Woongjin. Don't think it really had anything to do with "I just outplayed fucking Bisu lololol"
On March 08 2011 19:23 ArvickHero wrote: Still, Bisu is doing pretty well for being down 2 bases.. wonder if he practices often in situations where he's down a base
maybe its because he didn't know ? i mean once you figured out you were down 2 bases for such a long time, you started to lose motivation and played poorly ... also it's because free double expanded so his unit count at that moment wasn't as high ...
On March 08 2011 19:27 MountainDewJunkie wrote: They don't need to send fantasy right away, though... save him for last.
Better send him now so his hands will be warmed up for vs Zero, not to mention that there will be more chances to snipe Zero if Fantasy's notoriously unreliable TvZ should make a showing.
On March 08 2011 19:27 Xstatic wrote: I don't get how Free can smile like he played like a champ in that game. If Bisu were smarter with the scouting, he would've gotten steamrolled. His micro wasn't on par with Bisu's and in any Bo3 he would've lost. But still, for having the balls to double ninja expo, that was pretty baller.
The audacity of some players, smiling after winning games.
Bisu had 0 clue Free took the entire map. He focused so much on trying to break Free at the start he didn't even realize Free took 7 and eventually 2 ol clock.
Every time they switched to Bisu's view, it showed on his mini map he had NO idea. You think after free just completely mass produced after every engagement Bisu would scout the sides.
His PvP is really slipping. Maybe losing to Stork 5 times in a row really hurt his PvP game sense.
On March 08 2011 19:27 Xstatic wrote: I don't get how Free can smile like he played like a champ in that game. If Bisu were smarter with the scouting, he would've gotten steamrolled. His micro wasn't on par with Bisu's and in any Bo3 he would've lost. But still, for having the balls to double ninja expo, that was pretty baller.
It's kinda hard to build units when you're investing in building nexi and probes all over the map *and* getting both reaver and templar tech. Free had "better macro" (more units) once his tech was up and those bases fully kicked in...
On March 08 2011 19:28 vishrut wrote: well at least skt is in a decent position. fantasy next will take care of free. even if zero beats fantasy, 2 skt zergs and ace curse will take out zero
I'm glad you're confident that our Zergs will get the job done. I'm not with you on that one!
On March 08 2011 19:31 MountainDewJunkie wrote: Stork goes ninja expo vs flash (ex: HBR EVER OSL) omg so brilliant Free goes double ninja vs bisu omg how dare he cheese how dare he smile
On March 08 2011 19:28 vishrut wrote: well at least skt is in a decent position. fantasy next will take care of free. even if zero beats fantasy, 2 skt zergs and ace curse will take out zero
I'm glad you're confident that our Zergs will get the job done. I'm not with you on that one!
Only if it's Kwanro, only if it's Kwanro I say. Speaking of Kwanro, was he on the bench today?
On March 08 2011 19:31 MountainDewJunkie wrote: Stork goes ninja expo vs flash (ex: HBR EVER OSL) omg so brilliant Free goes double ninja vs bisu omg how dare he cheese how dare he smile
On March 08 2011 19:27 Xstatic wrote: I don't get how Free can smile like he played like a champ in that game. If Bisu were smarter with the scouting, he would've gotten steamrolled. His micro wasn't on par with Bisu's and in any Bo3 he would've lost. But still, for having the balls to double ninja expo, that was pretty baller.
It's kinda hard to build units when you're investing in building nexi and probes all over the map *and* getting both reaver and templar tech. Free had "better macro" (more units) once his tech was up and those bases fully kicked in...
Agreed, free's micro was good. That engagement where he had one reaver+shuttle and bisu had 2 reavers in a shuttle. Free's reaver survived with the shuttle, all bisu had left was a handful of goons. Saved his ass that did.
On March 08 2011 19:28 vishrut wrote: well at least skt is in a decent position. fantasy next will take care of free. even if zero beats fantasy, 2 skt zergs and ace curse will take out zero
I'm glad you're confident that our Zergs will get the job done. I'm not with you on that one!
Only if it's Kwanro, only if it's Kwanro I say. Speaking of Kwanro, was he on the bench today?
well zero's weakest matchup by far is zvz which is already a coinflip. so there is about a 75% chance that one of the zergs will take out zero. not to mention the chance that fantasy might have
On March 08 2011 19:32 Doraemon wrote: bisu's pvp makes me sad these days.
i know right?
back in 2009 he was like what 80% PvP ? ... nowadays it's not bad by any means, but it's just depressing that he pretty much ran into Stork and Kal all the times and got BO losses 7/10 of his games against these two ... and when he got to play someone else, he got cheese raped into :O'ing at mini-map ...
On March 08 2011 19:31 MountainDewJunkie wrote: Stork goes ninja expo vs flash (ex: HBR EVER OSL) omg so brilliant Free goes double ninja vs bisu omg how dare he cheese how dare he smile
I mean really, people.
people?
it was just one person.
There will be more, just you wait.
We'll be littered with those....SKT Fans...
*narrows eyes*
I think you mean Bisu fans, lololololz. I personally thought that Free successfully pulled off a ballsy move, and pull it off he did.
On March 08 2011 19:32 Doraemon wrote: bisu's pvp makes me sad these days.
i know right?
back in 2009 he was like what 80% PvP ? ... nowadays it's not bad by any means, but it's just depressing that he pretty much ran into Stork and Kal all the times and got BO losses 7/10 of his games against these two ... and when he got to play someone else, he got cheese raped imo :O'ing at mini-map ...
im a sad panda ;;
The days of BvP were pretty fucking awesome.. one day it'll come back :<
On March 08 2011 19:28 vishrut wrote: well at least skt is in a decent position. fantasy next will take care of free. even if zero beats fantasy, 2 skt zergs and ace curse will take out zero
I'm glad you're confident that our Zergs will get the job done. I'm not with you on that one!
Only if it's Kwanro, only if it's Kwanro I say. Speaking of Kwanro, was he on the bench today?
well zero's weakest matchup by far is zvz which is already a coinflip. so there is about a 75% chance that one of the zergs will take out zero. not to mention the chance that fantasy might have
this is SKT zergs we are talking about. If they don't send the Kwanroller (which they wont because he's been rolling everyone in practice and they are sore losers like that.) I'd wager that Zero would own the whole zerg line.
On March 08 2011 19:28 vishrut wrote: well at least skt is in a decent position. fantasy next will take care of free. even if zero beats fantasy, 2 skt zergs and ace curse will take out zero
I'm glad you're confident that our Zergs will get the job done. I'm not with you on that one!
Only if it's Kwanro, only if it's Kwanro I say. Speaking of Kwanro, was he on the bench today?
well zero's weakest matchup by far is zvz which is already a coinflip. so there is about a 75% chance that one of the zergs will take out zero. not to mention the chance that fantasy might have
Why is everyone forgetting about Light? He can TvT Fantasy pretty evenly, and would crush any zerg thrown at him. Best is slumping and Light has a decent record vs him.
On March 08 2011 19:31 MountainDewJunkie wrote: Stork goes ninja expo vs flash (ex: HBR EVER OSL) omg so brilliant Free goes double ninja vs bisu omg how dare he cheese how dare he smile
I mean really, people.
people?
it was just one person.
There will be more, just you wait.
We'll be littered with those....SKT Fans...
*narrows eyes*
I think you mean Bisu fans, lololololz. I personally thought that Free successfully pulled off a ballsy move, and pull it off he did.
On March 08 2011 19:36 sixfour wrote: how are there 7 no's on that poll?
oh wait, bisu lost
I almost made option 3
"Bisu lost, I'm mad" but I felt like I should keep it official.
to be fair, that was not a good game ... free ninja expo'd and ran over Bisu with 3 times income ... it's recommended for ballsy strategy but nothing more imo :/ and i'm not speaking from a Bisu's fanboy pov here
How could you say his pvp is bad after that game. That game had nothing to do with pvp, it had to do with cleverness. Lol... Not scouting doesnt make you bad at a matchup ...
On March 08 2011 19:36 sixfour wrote: how are there 7 no's on that poll?
oh wait, bisu lost
I almost made option 3
"Bisu lost, I'm mad" but I felt like I should keep it official.
to be fair, that was not a good game ... free ninja expo'd and ran over Bisu with 3 times income ... it's recommended for ballsy strategy but nothing more imo :/ and i'm not speaking from a Bisu's fanboy pov here
I meant it in a joking sense. I voted no as well, and I'm neither SKT or Bisu fan.
Just as a little stab at the Bisu fanboys that are inevitably going to trash Free like there's no tomorrow for that game.
On March 08 2011 19:32 Doraemon wrote: bisu's pvp makes me sad these days.
i know right?
back in 2009 he was like what 80% PvP ? ... nowadays it's not bad by any means, but it's just depressing that he pretty much ran into Stork and Kal all the times and got BO losses 7/10 of his games against these two ... and when he got to play someone else, he got cheese raped imo :O'ing at mini-map ...
im a sad panda ;;
The days of BvP were pretty fucking awesome.. one day it'll come back :<
On March 08 2011 19:40 Keftes wrote: How could you say his pvp is bad after that game. That game had nothing to do with pvp, it had to do with cleverness. Lol... Not scouting doesnt make you bad at a matchup ...
scouting and game sense is integral at being good at a matchup, regardless of what it is.
On March 08 2011 19:40 Keftes wrote: How could you say his pvp is bad after that game. That game had nothing to do with pvp, it had to do with cleverness. Lol... Not scouting doesnt make you bad at a matchup ...
scouting and game sense is integral at being good at a matchup, regardless of what it is.
bisu had none in that game
Yes that means you have to comment on bisu's overall quailty. Call him a bad sc player. Not a bad pvper. Everyone here is saying his pvp is bad... If a zerg 4 pools and bisu loses, he didnt lose because he is bad at pvz, its because he didn't scout it.
On March 08 2011 19:36 sixfour wrote: how are there 7 no's on that poll?
oh wait, bisu lost
I almost made option 3
"Bisu lost, I'm mad" but I felt like I should keep it official.
to be fair, that was not a good game ... free ninja expo'd and ran over Bisu with 3 times income ... it's recommended for ballsy strategy but nothing more imo :/ and i'm not speaking from a Bisu's fanboy pov here
I meant it in a joking sense. I voted no as well, and I'm neither SKT or Bisu fan.
Just as a little stab at the Bisu fanboys that are inevitably going to trash Free like there's no tomorrow for that game.
On the contrary, it's usually the non-Bisu fans who constantly take stabs at him for any of his losses.
Free was LOL. You use a very clever greedy build to take out a boss player knowing you could abuse his lack of game sense THEN by your own lack of game sense lose to Hydra bust.
On March 08 2011 19:51 mnesthes wrote: Free was LOL. You use a very clever greedy build to take out a boss player knowing you could abuse his lack of game sense THEN by your own lack of game sense lose to Hydra bust.
It's possible that free spent all his time preparing for Bisu.
On March 08 2011 19:36 sixfour wrote: how are there 7 no's on that poll?
oh wait, bisu lost
I almost made option 3
"Bisu lost, I'm mad" but I felt like I should keep it official.
to be fair, that was not a good game ... free ninja expo'd and ran over Bisu with 3 times income ... it's recommended for ballsy strategy but nothing more imo :/ and i'm not speaking from a Bisu's fanboy pov here
I meant it in a joking sense. I voted no as well, and I'm neither SKT or Bisu fan.
Just as a little stab at the Bisu fanboys that are inevitably going to trash Free like there's no tomorrow for that game.
On the contrary, it's usually the non-Bisu fans who constantly take stabs at him for any of his losses.
More an Anti-fan of his rabid fanboys than anything else.
I don't really anti-fan any players. Except for Baby for ruining Ace's RAK last night. He's my current hate target. Haha
On March 08 2011 19:28 vishrut wrote: well at least skt is in a decent position. fantasy next will take care of free. even if zero beats fantasy, 2 skt zergs and ace curse will take out zero
I'm glad you're confident that our Zergs will get the job done. I'm not with you on that one!
Only if it's Kwanro, only if it's Kwanro I say. Speaking of Kwanro, was he on the bench today?
well zero's weakest matchup by far is zvz which is already a coinflip. so there is about a 75% chance that one of the zergs will take out zero. not to mention the chance that fantasy might have
Why is everyone forgetting about Light? He can TvT Fantasy pretty evenly, and would crush any zerg thrown at him. Best is slumping and Light has a decent record vs him.
On March 08 2011 19:51 mnesthes wrote: Free was LOL. You use a very clever greedy build to take out a boss player knowing you could abuse his lack of game sense THEN by your own lack of game sense lose to Hydra bust.
It's possible that free spent all his time preparing for Bisu.
Progamers are still expected to have fundamentals.
On March 08 2011 19:45 a7choi wrote: please send out light... not zero
Light has worse TvP than Firebathero. Please don't ask again to send Light against Protoss player.
light's tvp isn't even as horrendous as everyone says. everyone's so swayed by the recent results from a particular match up.. it's so stupid. and also, light has a better chance of taking out s2 and fantasy... a much better chance. zero's not so hot these days against topnotch players
I think Zero is still a logical choice nevertheless. Light is autoloss against Toss which can be either Rain or Best. Meanwhile ZvZ is a coinflip and Zero can beat Fanta and very likely any Toss SKT got left; which means he's not autoloss against anyone.
On March 08 2011 19:58 mnesthes wrote: I think Zero is still a logical choice nevertheless. Light is autoloss against Toss which can be either Rain or Best. Meanwhile ZvZ is a coinflip and Zero can beat Fanta and very likely any Toss SKT got left; which means he's not autoloss against anyone.
I take it you haven't seen any of Light's games against Best.
On March 08 2011 19:58 mnesthes wrote: I think Zero is still a logical choice nevertheless. Light is autoloss against Toss which can be either Rain or Best. Meanwhile ZvZ is a coinflip and Zero can beat Fanta and very likely any Toss SKT got left; which means he's not autoloss against anyone.
On March 08 2011 19:28 vishrut wrote: well at least skt is in a decent position. fantasy next will take care of free. even if zero beats fantasy, 2 skt zergs and ace curse will take out zero
I'm glad you're confident that our Zergs will get the job done. I'm not with you on that one!
On March 08 2011 19:28 vishrut wrote: well at least skt is in a decent position. fantasy next will take care of free. even if zero beats fantasy, 2 skt zergs and ace curse will take out zero
I'm glad you're confident that our Zergs will get the job done. I'm not with you on that one!
Clearly I should have more faith
i'm happy to be proven wrong.
but like i said before the games started, no sun and no soo is always a good thing
On March 08 2011 20:06 Ryo wrote: Woongjin coach so silly. Didn't he buy Light to make up for Zero's ZvZ?
but then light would promptly fail to best, sun, paralyze,... whereas Zero has a good chance against anyone SKT throws against him.
People keep saying this but Light actually has a decent record vs Best and Best has been slumping recently so it would be more of a coinflip than you think, not an autoloss.
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
Light didn't even get sent out, so Flash could still be right. Stars just happened to fail to Zerg today, which is what they have always been weak against.
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
I'd like to think that Spica, I really would. Problem is I can't see anybody capable of beating Flash. Bisu and Fantasy are our most in-form players, and both stick with him for a while, but ultimately can't seem to find the win against him. Fantasy in particular has had some great TvTs against Flash, but Flash invariably comes out on top.
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
Light didn't even get sent out, so Flash could still be right. Stars just happened to fail to Zerg today, which is what they have always been weak against.
Even if Light was sent out, his chances of winning a TvP would be reduced even further due to the next set's map being Aztec. He miiiiiiiight've won on there, but eh, luck would have to play a big factor for him as well.
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
Light didn't even get sent out, so Flash could still be right. Stars just happened to fail to Zerg today, which is what they have always been weak against.
Even if Light was sent out, his chances of winning a TvP would be reduced even further due to the next set's map being Aztec. He miiiiiiiight've won on there, but eh, luck would have to play a big factor for him as well.
Best is 1-2 on Aztec, with vT 0-1. Light is 1-1 on Aztec with vP 0-1. It's still a tossup!
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
I'd like to think that Spica, I really would. Problem is I can't see anybody capable of beating Flash. Bisu and Fantasy are our most in-form players, and both stick with him for a while, but ultimately can't seem to find the win against him. Fantasy in particular has had some great TvTs against Flash, but Flash invariably comes out on top.
Bisu, Best, or Fantasy could potentially beat Flash. If Bisu does as well as we know he can do, he is the one most capable. Though unless something changes, KT is probably more likely to win.
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
I'd like to think that Spica, I really would. Problem is I can't see anybody capable of beating Flash. Bisu and Fantasy are our most in-form players, and both stick with him for a while, but ultimately can't seem to find the win against him. Fantasy in particular has had some great TvTs against Flash, but Flash invariably comes out on top.
Never say never! The last match against KT was pretty close; Fantasy had to just slip up and let Flash come back with the advantage. If you're a SKT fan, you should stay optimistic. ;P
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
Light didn't even get sent out, so Flash could still be right. Stars just happened to fail to Zerg today, which is what they have always been weak against.
Even if Light was sent out, his chances of winning a TvP would be reduced even further due to the next set's map being Aztec. He miiiiiiiight've won on there, but eh, luck would have to play a big factor for him as well.
Best is 1-2 on Aztec, with vT 0-1. Light is 1-1 on Aztec with vP 0-1. It's still a tossup!
PerfectMan. I like Light, but his TvP is atrocious this season.
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
Light didn't even get sent out, so Flash could still be right. Stars just happened to fail to Zerg today, which is what they have always been weak against.
Even if Light was sent out, his chances of winning a TvP would be reduced even further due to the next set's map being Aztec. He miiiiiiiight've won on there, but eh, luck would have to play a big factor for him as well.
Best is 1-2 on Aztec, with vT 0-1. Light is 1-1 on Aztec with vP 0-1. It's still a tossup!
Rain can still play a solid PvT, especially with Carriers
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
I'd like to think that Spica, I really would. Problem is I can't see anybody capable of beating Flash. Bisu and Fantasy are our most in-form players, and both stick with him for a while, but ultimately can't seem to find the win against him. Fantasy in particular has had some great TvTs against Flash, but Flash invariably comes out on top.
Never say never! The last match against KT was pretty close; Fantasy had to just slip up and let Flash come back with the advantage. If you're a SKT fan, you should stay optimistic. ;P
Well I'm definitely that, I just find optimism hurts more when your boys let you down
But seriously, I'd love to see Fantasy beat Flash b/c he's had him on the ropes so many times but been unable to finish games. Admittedly part of that is due to Flash's brilliance, but still, those close games he lets slip away hurt.
On March 08 2011 20:10 Spica wrote: And looks like Flash is wrong; SKT is the one to fear more than Stars, proven by today's match.
Light didn't even get sent out, so Flash could still be right. Stars just happened to fail to Zerg today, which is what they have always been weak against.
Even if Light was sent out, his chances of winning a TvP would be reduced even further due to the next set's map being Aztec. He miiiiiiiight've won on there, but eh, luck would have to play a big factor for him as well.
Best is 1-2 on Aztec, with vT 0-1. Light is 1-1 on Aztec with vP 0-1. It's still a tossup!
He lost to Sun before, so he might have lost to him again if he was sent out on there. Unforeseen twist of events!
Edit: People like to emphasize Light's poor TvP but the fact is that he all-killed T1 last year and the year before he 3-killed them. And both times, Coach Park sent Best, Fantasy and Bisu.
On March 08 2011 20:25 Ryo wrote: The mistake was sending Really instead of Light.
Edit: People like to emphasize Light's poor TvP but the fact is that he all-killed T1 last year and the year before he 3-killed them. And both times, Coach Park sent Best, Fantasy and Bisu.
Perhaps the coach saw in practice that it wasn't going to happen?
On March 08 2011 20:25 Ryo wrote: The mistake was sending Really instead of Light.
Edit: People like to emphasize Light's poor TvP but the fact is that he all-killed T1 last year and the year before he 3-killed them. And both times, Coach Park sent Best, Fantasy and Bisu.
A player a year ago and a player now are usually a lot different. Last year, Bisu had his Yongtaek spell and lost games in the worst fucking manner. Couple years back, Sea had some of the best SK Terran lategame (Sea vs Jaedong Andromeda anyone?). To say that Light is still pretty good at TvP atm (at least on these maps) is just denial :\
On March 08 2011 20:25 Ryo wrote: The mistake was sending Really instead of Light.
Edit: People like to emphasize Light's poor TvP but the fact is that he all-killed T1 last year and the year before he 3-killed them. And both times, Coach Park sent Best, Fantasy and Bisu.
pretty sure his tvp looked a bit hotter back then:
On March 08 2011 20:25 Ryo wrote: The mistake was sending Really instead of Light.
Edit: People like to emphasize Light's poor TvP but the fact is that he all-killed T1 last year and the year before he 3-killed them. And both times, Coach Park sent Best, Fantasy and Bisu.
A player a year ago and a player now are usually a lot different. Last year, Bisu had his Yongtaek spell and lost games in the worst fucking manner. Couple years back, Sea had some of the best SK Terran lategame (Sea vs Jaedong Andromeda anyone?). To say that Light is still pretty good at TvP atm (at least on these maps) is just denial :\
Since when did I say Light is pretty good at TvP? He just plays well against SKT, MBC players in general do.
On March 08 2011 20:25 Ryo wrote: The mistake was sending Really instead of Light.
Edit: People like to emphasize Light's poor TvP but the fact is that he all-killed T1 last year and the year before he 3-killed them. And both times, Coach Park sent Best, Fantasy and Bisu.
A player a year ago and a player now are usually a lot different. Last year, Bisu had his Yongtaek spell and lost games in the worst fucking manner. Couple years back, Sea had some of the best SK Terran lategame (Sea vs Jaedong Andromeda anyone?). To say that Light is still pretty good at TvP atm (at least on these maps) is just denial :\
Since when did I say Light is pretty good at TvP? He just plays well against SKT, MBC players in general do.
hmm I guess.. but he's still 0-2 against Rain, who probably would've won easily on Aztec
On March 08 2011 20:25 Ryo wrote: The mistake was sending Really instead of Light.
Edit: People like to emphasize Light's poor TvP but the fact is that he all-killed T1 last year and the year before he 3-killed them. And both times, Coach Park sent Best, Fantasy and Bisu.
A player a year ago and a player now are usually a lot different. Last year, Bisu had his Yongtaek spell and lost games in the worst fucking manner. Couple years back, Sea had some of the best SK Terran lategame (Sea vs Jaedong Andromeda anyone?). To say that Light is still pretty good at TvP atm (at least on these maps) is just denial :\
Since when did I say Light is pretty good at TvP? He just plays well against SKT, MBC players in general do.
hmm I guess.. but he's still 0-2 against Rain, who probably would've won easily on Aztec
Hence Light should have been sent out instead of Really on Icarus. Since Really's TvP is terrible anyway these days.
On March 08 2011 20:25 Ryo wrote: The mistake was sending Really instead of Light.
Edit: People like to emphasize Light's poor TvP but the fact is that he all-killed T1 last year and the year before he 3-killed them. And both times, Coach Park sent Best, Fantasy and Bisu.
It was a mistake. agree with you. they should send Light instead of really. yes, his TvP is not good now but somehow Light is really good when play against SKT.
free win and I'm happy. s2 = he really surprise me today with his 2 kills.
On March 09 2011 08:52 ArvickHero wrote: wow, SKT taking on Hite and KT next.. Hopefully SKT can go 2-0 next week (and Bisu revenges against Hydra and Action)
For my team, hite, to make the WL playoffs, SKT needs to 0-2. PLEASE MAKE THAT HAPPEN, hite and KT!!!!
On March 09 2011 08:52 ArvickHero wrote: wow, SKT taking on Hite and KT next.. Hopefully SKT can go 2-0 next week (and Bisu revenges against Hydra and Action)
And Flash! It is within our sights to look forward to an epic clash. :D
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/rsc4p.png)
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Woongjin Stars vs. SK Telecom T1 ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/teams/icons/uniforms/1.png){kind=icon}
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Soulkey < Benzene > 
Bisu![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/B20gW.jpg)
Really < Icarus > ![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/odlom.jpg)
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> ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/BlXhI.jpg)
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