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On December 13 2010 02:03 Ryo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2010 00:03 BlackMagister wrote:On December 12 2010 20:49 Ryo wrote:On December 12 2010 15:53 BlackMagister wrote:On December 12 2010 15:32 Ryo wrote:On December 12 2010 15:28 Zona wrote:+ Show Spoiler [Related to other match] +
hite climbs to 2nd place with this win!
I don't think this was the team that SKT should have experimented against...
But then again round 2 is probably the best time to train your rising potentials
Which is why I was rooting for SKT... + Show Spoiler +Had SKT won, MBC would be 2nd place! I would think you would still root against SKT as they're the first place team unless you're content to just fight over 2nd place. Sure first place would be nice but right now all the teams are bunched up together. It is in MBC's interest that their closest rivals lose to SKT, making it easier to secure a play-off spot. If other teams beat SKT, it puts even more pressure on MBC to do the same or face dropping down the league rankings. I'll worry about first place after they've pulled away from the bottom 6 teams. Are Playoff next month? This is only Round 2 all the teams have a long way to go before worrying about playoffs. Every match counts towards the overall placing at the end of the season. That's the whole point of proleague. I don't know what your issue is when you're the one who brought up the idea of being "content to just fight over 2nd place".
If you want first place then hoping that SKT1 loses would seem most logical as SKT1 is in first place by a lot at the moment. If SKT1 keeps winning it secures their first place spot. Other teams that want first place should want all the other teams to do about the same making it easier to rise to the top, if one team consistently dominates like SKT1 is doing than first place should be hard to achieve.
However if you don't care about getting first place than cheering for them to beat every other team besides your favorite is fine. I understand that all these games matter, I just don't understand why you would care about 2nd ranking placing so early on in the season unless that's your long term goal.
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On December 13 2010 02:14 BlackMagister wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2010 02:03 Ryo wrote:On December 13 2010 00:03 BlackMagister wrote:On December 12 2010 20:49 Ryo wrote:On December 12 2010 15:53 BlackMagister wrote:On December 12 2010 15:32 Ryo wrote:On December 12 2010 15:28 Zona wrote:+ Show Spoiler [Related to other match] +
hite climbs to 2nd place with this win!
I don't think this was the team that SKT should have experimented against...
But then again round 2 is probably the best time to train your rising potentials
Which is why I was rooting for SKT... + Show Spoiler +Had SKT won, MBC would be 2nd place! I would think you would still root against SKT as they're the first place team unless you're content to just fight over 2nd place. Sure first place would be nice but right now all the teams are bunched up together. It is in MBC's interest that their closest rivals lose to SKT, making it easier to secure a play-off spot. If other teams beat SKT, it puts even more pressure on MBC to do the same or face dropping down the league rankings. I'll worry about first place after they've pulled away from the bottom 6 teams. Are Playoff next month? This is only Round 2 all the teams have a long way to go before worrying about playoffs. Every match counts towards the overall placing at the end of the season. That's the whole point of proleague. I don't know what your issue is when you're the one who brought up the idea of being "content to just fight over 2nd place". If you want first place then hoping that SKT1 loses would seem most logical as SKT1 is in first place by a lot at the moment. If SKT1 keeps winning it secures their first place spot. Other teams that want first place should want all the other teams to do about the same making it easier to rise to the top, if one team consistently dominates like SKT1 is doing than first place should be hard to achieve. However if you don't care about getting first place than cheering for them to beat every other team besides your favorite is fine. I understand that all these games matter, I just don't understand why you would care about 2nd ranking placing so early on in the season unless that's your long term goal.
My comment on 2nd place was a response to Zona's post on the current rankings. Like I explained, the broader aim is just to pull away from the bottom 6 teams, that is all.
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this is disappointing  i hope this won't happen again skt.
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To all you fanboys saying that it was SKT1s B teamers, Hite still had had  Snow,  HoGiL and Horang2. Two of which are protoss snipers and Snow is arguably the best player on Hites Team (ranked sixthedON the Power poll). Horang2 has been playing extremly well, and could take a Game against Bisu.
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LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
What a good thing to wake up to after watching GSP destroy Koschek.
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On December 13 2010 03:03 pugowar wrote:To all you fanboys saying that it was SKT1s B teamers, Hite still had had Snow, HoGiL and Horang2. Two of which are protoss snipers and Snow is arguably the best player on Hites Team (ranked sixthedON the Power poll). Horang2 has been playing extremly well, and could take a Game against Bisu.
I honestly wouldn't favor anyone on Hentus against Bisu, not even Leta. Hogil would no doubt be defeated easily by Bisu, and unless he somehow played better than we're used to, Best would even beat him. Snow isn't anything close to resembling a favorite against SKT's tosses, neither is Horang honestly. SKToss, especially Bisu+Best, are really really good.
Basically, Best is an autoloss against a good zerg, but other than that both of them should win their games unless their opponent is S class or close to it.
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On December 13 2010 03:58 Lightwip wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2010 03:03 pugowar wrote:To all you fanboys saying that it was SKT1s B teamers, Hite still had had Snow, HoGiL and Horang2. Two of which are protoss snipers and Snow is arguably the best player on Hites Team (ranked sixthedON the Power poll). Horang2 has been playing extremly well, and could take a Game against Bisu. I honestly wouldn't favor anyone on Hentus against Bisu, not even Leta. Hogil would no doubt be defeated easily by Bisu, and unless he somehow played better than we're used to, Best would even beat him. Snow isn't anything close to resembling a favorite against SKT's tosses, neither is Horang honestly. SKToss, especially Bisu+Best, are really really good. Basically, Best is an autoloss against a good zerg, but other than that both of them should win their games unless their opponent is S class or close to it.
Its not like they have no chance either.
Regardless, SKT needed someone other than BB to win. That someone didn't
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On December 13 2010 03:58 Lightwip wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2010 03:03 pugowar wrote:To all you fanboys saying that it was SKT1s B teamers, Hite still had had Snow, HoGiL and Horang2. Two of which are protoss snipers and Snow is arguably the best player on Hites Team (ranked sixthedON the Power poll). Horang2 has been playing extremly well, and could take a Game against Bisu. I honestly wouldn't favor anyone on Hentus against Bisu, not even Leta. Hogil would no doubt be defeated easily by Bisu, and unless he somehow played better than we're used to, Best would even beat him. Snow isn't anything close to resembling a favorite against SKT's tosses, neither is Horang honestly. SKToss, especially Bisu+Best, are really really good. Basically, Best is an autoloss against a good zerg, but other than that both of them should win their games unless their opponent is S class or close to it.
no one would favor movie against fantasy and yet, he won
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On December 13 2010 05:51 Jackal03 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2010 03:58 Lightwip wrote:On December 13 2010 03:03 pugowar wrote:To all you fanboys saying that it was SKT1s B teamers, Hite still had had Snow, HoGiL and Horang2. Two of which are protoss snipers and Snow is arguably the best player on Hites Team (ranked sixthedON the Power poll). Horang2 has been playing extremly well, and could take a Game against Bisu. I honestly wouldn't favor anyone on Hentus against Bisu, not even Leta. Hogil would no doubt be defeated easily by Bisu, and unless he somehow played better than we're used to, Best would even beat him. Snow isn't anything close to resembling a favorite against SKT's tosses, neither is Horang honestly. SKToss, especially Bisu+Best, are really really good. Basically, Best is an autoloss against a good zerg, but other than that both of them should win their games unless their opponent is S class or close to it. no one would favor movie against fantasy and yet, he won
You should know that Fantasy has a 20% chance of doing something utterly stupid in any given situation and losing to the weakest of players. Bisu and Best are less known for that. When they're on top of their game, they aren't going to lose like that. Fantasy always does and makes his fans cry.
Basically, Fantasy did something risky when he had no real need to, so he lost.
Not that it matters though, one of the zergs or Sun should've won. The fact that SKT took so many risks is very questionable.
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guess SKT wanted to spot the rest of the league a few games??? Why play Soo, Sun???
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On December 13 2010 06:07 amazingoopah wrote:
guess SKT wanted to spot the rest of the league a few games??? Why play Soo, Sun???
To be fair, Soo and s2 would've probably won if they faced the other opponent. Also, Sun is really skilled, he just can't end games. Honestly, Sun's games look like those of a dragon who's a bit off his game rather than those of a decent rookie. He just needs to fix that one problem and he can be a good player.
Soo is bad ZvZ and he keeps getting that match.
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Maybe I'm wrong but T1 Zergs started losing all together (s2, soO, Kwanro and Hyuk) after they brought a lot of wins, they started to get one loss after another.... s2 did win a game but team Zergs are like 1-2 wins and ~8 losses in their last 10 games.
Sun has this problem of not finishing his opponent but he is a rookie and it makes games more entertaining to watch :D
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On December 13 2010 06:31 Hazard wrote:
Maybe I'm wrong but T1 Zergs started losing all together (s2, soO, Kwanro and Hyuk) after they brought a lot of wins, they started to get one loss after another.... s2 did win a game but team Zergs are like 1-2 wins and ~8 losses in their last 10 games.
I think the problem is that the zergs don't really have anyone to look up to, and so a lot of their wins are basically driven by momentum. Sun/Paralyze have the current best protoss duo on their team, so they do have someone to look up to. Zergs really have no one, so they can suck easily.
Also, no new terrans because frankly, SKT only has one terran that's actually capable of being good.
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Somehow I had the impression that CJ was doing poorly...
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On December 13 2010 06:16 Lightwip wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2010 06:07 amazingoopah wrote:
guess SKT wanted to spot the rest of the league a few games??? Why play Soo, Sun??? To be fair, Soo and s2 would've probably won if they faced the other opponent. Also, Sun is really skilled, he just can't end games. Honestly, Sun's games look like those of a dragon who's a bit off his game rather than those of a decent rookie. He just needs to fix that one problem and he can be a good player. Soo is bad ZvZ and he keeps getting that match.
How is this true? Soo, with his awe inspiring 47% winrate vs terran? You guys act like no matter what T1 never loses a game. Ever. Like they are the best BW players on the planet. Also, lets let Sun play more then 41 games (with a stunning 39% winrate) before we call him a "dragon". If 39% is so much better then a decent rookie...what would a decent rookie's numbers look like, 25%? And being able to finish games is not just one problem dude. If he cannot handle three bases at once and attacking multiple places at once he will probably peak at 39%.
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Wow, can't believe I missed this game - just watched the vods and wow. What an unexpected result, maybe Hite is not a team to be counted out? They seem to be slowly recovering from the loss of EffOrt and might just have the potential to be as good as (and similiar in many ways to) STX.
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On December 13 2010 07:42 pugowar wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2010 06:16 Lightwip wrote:On December 13 2010 06:07 amazingoopah wrote:
guess SKT wanted to spot the rest of the league a few games??? Why play Soo, Sun??? To be fair, Soo and s2 would've probably won if they faced the other opponent. Also, Sun is really skilled, he just can't end games. Honestly, Sun's games look like those of a dragon who's a bit off his game rather than those of a decent rookie. He just needs to fix that one problem and he can be a good player. Soo is bad ZvZ and he keeps getting that match. How is this true? Soo, with his awe inspiring 47% winrate vs terran? You guys act like no matter what T1 never loses a game. Ever. Like they are the best BW players on the planet. Also, lets let Sun play more then 41 games (with a stunning 39% winrate) before we call him a "dragon". If 39% is so much better then a decent rookie...what would a decent rookie's numbers look like, 25%? And being able to finish games is not just one problem dude. If he cannot handle three bases at once and attacking multiple places at once he will probably peak at 39%.
With rookies, you really can't look at their stats because throughout most of those games they will be mediocre. You really have to look at how they play. And Sun/Soo are better than their stats say they are(most of the time).
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Grats to HEntus. They thoroughly deserved their win, and while it wasn't against SKT's strongest line-up, it definitely wasn't against their B team either. With the exception of s2, all of the players who played have been regular starters this season.
I'm disappointed not to see Bisu and BeSt play, but my guess is BeSt is still recovering from his sickness.
All teams have off days, and yesterday was one of them for SKT. Back to the drawing board, and move on to the next one. The PL season's a marathon not a sprint.
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On December 12 2010 23:59 Simplistik wrote:Show nested quote +On December 12 2010 23:07 corumjhaelen wrote:On December 12 2010 22:16 MisteR wrote:On December 12 2010 21:39 Simplistik wrote:On December 12 2010 18:33 Lightwip wrote:On December 12 2010 18:29 Adr4melecH wrote:damn nooo SKT Also i wonder if the players are pre-determined before the match or not. Can anyone clarify this for me please? Yes they are. You don't know the opposing lineup until a few minutes before starting though. Only ace match isn't predetermined. It's chosen when the time comes. Lightwip, could you please point me to where you got that information from? I've been wondering about this for a while, but so far I've been unable to verify it. I've heard this story before but I've yet to see evidence. I think that it's a misunderstanding grown from the sudden change from a predetermined lineup to an unpredetermined one. There are no rules, as far as we know, that force the teams to predetermine their lineups. Rather, the matchups are decided on the spot, and the coaches send in little notes with their choice. That the coaches often do predetermine their lineups is their own business, but is not compulsory. Correct me if I'm wrong, though. When the change happened last year, what I understood from the translated article was that the lineups were still predetermined, and that the referee was the only one to know both. Now if you could point to some piece of writing somewhere that confirms it that would be great!
Not sure if this is what you're looking for, but it does talk about the changed format a bit: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=118744
(this was when PL was bo5)
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EPT
