• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 10:47
CET 16:47
KST 00:47
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Rongyi Cup S3 - RO16 Preview3herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational10SC2 All-Star Invitational: Tournament Preview5RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0
Community News
Weekly Cups (Jan 12-18): herO, MaxPax, Solar win0BSL Season 2025 - Full Overview and Conclusion8Weekly Cups (Jan 5-11): Clem wins big offline, Trigger upsets4$21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7)19Weekly Cups (Dec 29-Jan 4): Protoss rolls, 2v2 returns7
StarCraft 2
General
[Short Story] The Last GSL StarCraft 2 not at the Esports World Cup 2026 Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued Stellar Fest "01" Jersey Charity Auction PhD study /w SC2 - help with a survey!
Tourneys
OSC Season 13 World Championship $21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7) $70 Prize Pool Ladder Legends Academy Weekly Open! SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-18 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[A] Starcraft Sound Mod
External Content
Mutation # 509 Doomsday Report Mutation # 508 Violent Night Mutation # 507 Well Trained Mutation # 506 Warp Zone
Brood War
General
[ASL21] Potential Map Candidates BW General Discussion Gypsy to Korea Which foreign pros are considered the best? BW AKA finder tool
Tourneys
Azhi's Colosseum - Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Current Meta Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Game Theory for Starcraft
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason Awesome Games Done Quick 2026!
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread NASA and the Private Sector Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How Esports Advertising Shap…
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1463 users

How we relate. streamers & viewers, men & women

Blogs > Todie
Post a Reply
Todie
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Sweden46 Posts
August 23 2013 11:27 GMT
#1
What the entry is about and why:
Recently stumbling upon lininpink's interview with Tara Babcock actualized the recently hot(-or-not?) topic of "women in E-sports" for me - i must have missed the discussion on it while i was disconnected for a few weeks. Hearing mention of Taras video "a sober view of both sides" as well as her appearance on unfiltered #16 for a wider discussion on the topic made me curious enough to check them both out: Finally, livinpink's recent vlog-entry about "getting involved in a new community" pushed me over the edge to attempt compiling some thoughts of my own on the subject in this blog entry.

In rational discussions about how female contributors in Esports are treated, there seems to be an agreement about women being treated differently than men. Not just because they are / expected to be / different, but because they are quite few, at least when it comes to players and casters.

Two sides of the coin
Just to make some clear distinctions, how are women treated differently than men? In browsing unknown content, a viewer will use the limited information about the contributor that is thrown at them to form an opinion about them, in a not necessarily concious attempt to decide if they are interested and how they will relate to them. In the discussions, two sides of the same coin stand out clearly. Firstly, women get noticed much more easily, their very gender will grab attention of the average male viewer; By contrast, there are few-if-any enticing conclusions - good or bad - to come to about your average unknown male stacraft streamer, (unless you are patient enough to stick around and interact/relate to what he does ingame)...

The other side of the coin is that after getting noticed, females seem to have a harder time getting their contributions taken seriously. I believe this has to do with the limited information, or potentially faulty conceptions, that viewers base their opinions on. She got our attention because she's different; because she's a she. some give her casual attention because some feminine individuality is a nice change. some because they find her attractive, some get bothered by the previous and like to continually make a fuss about it, some out of jealousy / sense of entitlement... These things may obstruct attention to this female for any aspirations of being a serious contributor. In the end, its like everywhere else; first impressions are important and sometimes hard to change.

Understanding the viewer

Contributors have some idea about how they are perceived. While it might be rare for contributors to take as excessive notice of trending sources of viewer opinions as Destiny outlines in the mentioned episode of unfiltered, it seems reasonable to assume that many contributors do actively relate to their image; those that take in any amount of feedback certainly continually improve their understanding of it.

But how do they use it? They aught to use it by taking to heart constructive criticism that helps them get perceived in a way that more closely resembles their own honest outlook on who they are as a contributor, what they aim to accomplish and how to communicate this to viewers.

... i presume this might be easier said than done, both for the aspiring male contributor that struggles to get noticed at all and for the female contributor that is lucky to find anything of real relevance to serious aspirations in her pile of love- and hate-mail.

Conclusive statements

Arguably, there is always a degree of complexity in interaction between the genders. Complexity that in this scene, is further accentuated by the history of significant gender stigma in gaming at large. I want to make two conclusive statements in this blog entry:

#1 regardless of gender, direction of aspirations and degree of seriousness, contributors will have a better experience if they start out accepting their relative ignorance about how they are perceived and WHY, and from there, gradually work to improve that knowledge and to more effectively communicate their true image.

#2 conceptions and expectations go both ways; male viewers quickly notice female contributors, but often have a harder time relating to them as serious contributors. There is prejudice, but i believe there is also a mutual failure to bridge, undermine and preempt this prejudice: Yes, that female streamer you just stumbled upon is probably different from you in her experiences - maybe in her identity - as a gamer, and you might jump to judgement about it, but unless those differences are actually talked about, and those baseless judgements somehow challenged, why would things change?

Thank you for reading.

*
Petter Rudberg @Todie #3264 on Discord /u/Todie on reddit
TreK
Profile Joined August 2004
Sweden2089 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-23 13:09:16
August 23 2013 11:54 GMT
#2
Bergkamp ftw!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 13m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 534
ProTech140
TKL 106
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 5666
Horang2 1788
Larva 835
BeSt 660
GuemChi 640
Snow 426
ggaemo 363
Jaedong 324
firebathero 267
Shuttle 232
[ Show more ]
hero 198
Sharp 193
JYJ 185
Soulkey 155
Mong 152
Hyuk 142
Killer 112
Shine 68
Hyun 58
Backho 38
Barracks 36
Shinee 35
Hm[arnc] 27
ToSsGirL 24
Terrorterran 24
scan(afreeca) 23
Yoon 19
Free 19
910 19
Sexy 15
Dota 2
singsing2614
qojqva2276
syndereN347
420jenkins164
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1889
fl0m1738
zeus1150
markeloff121
Other Games
crisheroes378
Hui .320
XaKoH 111
QueenE86
Mew2King80
djWHEAT79
ArmadaUGS53
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• poizon28 192
• StrangeGG 73
• iHatsuTV 14
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• Laughngamez YouTube
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 3
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 5089
League of Legends
• Jankos3451
• TFBlade1503
Upcoming Events
Big Brain Bouts
1h 13m
Percival vs Gerald
Serral vs MaxPax
TKL 106
RongYI Cup
19h 13m
SHIN vs Creator
Classic vs Percival
OSC
21h 13m
BSL 21
23h 13m
RongYI Cup
1d 19h
Maru vs Cyan
Solar vs Krystianer
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 20h
BSL 21
1d 23h
Wardi Open
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
OSC
3 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-01-20
OSC Championship Season 13
NA Kuram Kup

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Rongyi Cup S3
Underdog Cup #3
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025

Upcoming

Acropolis #4 - TS4
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Nations Cup 2026
Tektek Cup #1
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.