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So many times I enter a chat channel that's "full" and it's around 80% people who are away, or busy, or who don't want to be disturbed or whatever. I can be in a "full" chat channel that only has half a dozen active people in it, and it seems that chat channels fill up very quickly. Does anyone else get that vibe? It doesn't seem to me like it'd be that hard to drastically increase the maximum limit of players in any given chat channel.
I remember when WOL first came out, people tended to describe the new Battlenet as "sterile." Still a fitting descriptor, I think.
The craziest thing was how Bnet 2.0 was when the game was first released. Remember a time with no chat channels? And as an arcade mapmaker, having a combination of no chat channels and no open games list made it so that the only way to get people to test your game was to enter an existing game and hijack the lobby chat in an attempt to sell your game like a greasy salesman! Crazy. At least that's gotten a bit better.
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Apparently you have not logged onto Broodwar lately...you might change your mind about wanting to be immediately imbued into a chat "experience." It consists mostly of bots that try to get you into clans or some other annoying message, spammed endlessly without remorse. Also, you failed to explain WHY social features would allow the game to succeed more...you state that people would want to "hang out" and not even play the game (is this really what you want?). Does Hearthstone even allow players to interact with each other at all?...yet I consistently see it at the top of Twitch games. Make friends and play 2's, get on skype = all is well.
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United States4883 Posts
On June 11 2015 00:02 qxc wrote:
One of the biggest uses for chat channels is forming a hangout spot where people know to return to to find their friends and so on. The problem with regular chat channels is that without moderation, a channel is bound to be overrun by malicious user(s) eventually. It only takes 1 person to ruin a channel. Thus, there is little reason for unmoderated channels to even exist in the first place. An unmoderated chat channel can never be 'home' for long while still allowing for new people to find it and participate. The only unmoderated channels could be the default ones that you are automatically placed in when you log in. Unmoderated channels are throwaway meet up spots.
I'm onboard with everything you said except for this. I come from a WC3 background, and personally, I had a lot of fun with being able to arbitrarily get into any chat channel I wanted with friends (or to hide from people I didn't want to talk to); the big long-term meet-up spots where public clan channels like Clan Naoc and Clan Rice and such, and those were moderated. To try and make everything moderated limits the amount of chat channels you can actually have, and thereby reduces the freedom of the user. I don't think it's necessary to enforce good behavior in public chat channels, and I'd rather have a system which allows plenty of room for the user to maneuver around toxic users.
Interestingly enough, SC2 avoids all of these problems by making P2P interaction basically nonexistent :p.
P.S. Sidenote on clans: I feel like clans really have no purpose at all in SC2. It just feels like another in-game chat with people I already have added on Skype. It's not like in WC3 where having a clan meant you had your very own moderated chat channel where you could meet up with clan members and friends and enjoy a peaceful setting with your own rules. Again, making all groups moderated would prevent this sort of drive to create clans and make them ever more obsolete than they already are.
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One concept I had was for Blizzard to have a weekly replay contest and to feature this game in the SC2 interface somehow. Like, we all know that Blizzard is not usually capable of doing something like this because the spotlighted arcade and news sections tend to be out of date (afaik), but I think this could easily be near-automated and done reliably. Possibly you could search for other people to watch the replay with together, and there might be a comment section after the replay where people could discuss strategy or complain about balance.
Just little things like this (I know it's a lot of work to implement) would have done wonders for SC2's social experience imo. People might get excited about their games because they could submit them to this contest etc.
This idea is somewhat based on chess servers, where you have a problem-of-the-day or game-of-the-day people can discuss.
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Another concept I want to have in the game is the ability to challenge your opponent after a defeat. I don't usually allow this when playing chess, but sometimes I do and it encourages you to start discussions or interactions with your opponent that might eventually lead to friendship or clan invites and such. Something else which exists on chess servers is a tab dedicated to the top-game being played at the moment, essentially the game by the two highest rated players, with its own chat channel where people can discuss the game. Again, just two examples from what is strictly a 1v1 game where people nevertheless have the option to interact with each other.
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New lotv chat system is just horrible.
You cant copy from the chat.
All chat windows are now in the same window. Its horrible....
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SC1 bnet was just so good and captivating the social experience. The thousands of nights we just spent hanging out chatting or playing are really a big part of my life. I just can't possibly feel the same about the way bnet currently works. I don't think it is nostalgia at all because I don't see any of the young gamers who never used the old bnet have such an experience. We are nearly 20 years later.
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On June 15 2015 22:13 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
SC1 bnet was just so good and captivating the social experience. The thousands of nights we just spent hanging out chatting or playing are really a big part of my life. I just can't possibly feel the same about the way bnet currently works. I don't think it is nostalgia at all because I don't see any of the young gamers who never used the old bnet have such an experience. We are nearly 20 years later.
I think we would make all the same assertion; however, a few people raised a few good points. You join any of the public b.net channels or let's just say logging in. If you aren't using a bot to run your channel or what have you end up in lets say USEAST - 1 and it's all bots spamming. That isn't to say some countries didn't have good hang out spots. Like Chile for example. All those guys were so close nit they usually just hung out in no. 1. So yes it has its perks but most people never knew about channels like rekrul on West, or Toyland or whatever channels you want to add heh.
We could definitely use more tools as well to help navigate prestigious channels/busy ones. Just another good feature to add and I agree with the other guy. Sounds like qxc is trying to get recruited with all these blogs heh.
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Pretty much what I've been saying for years. Not dropping players into chat rooms upon login was Bnet 2.0's biggest mistake.
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I think more emphasis on the social side of this game cannot be a bad thing. Like you said, 1v1 is not conducive to communication. We need something that brings the community together outside of the ladder. Something that rewards community building or (positive) social interaction is sorely needed.
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+ Show Spoiler +On June 15 2015 22:13 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
The thousands of nights we just spent hanging out chatting or playing are really a big part of my life... I don't see any of the young gamers who never used the old bnet have such an experience. We are nearly 20 years later. I relate totally and furthermore have to add that I crave for this to happen again <3 !
Hate to sound my age but kids don't know how easy they have it, It was such a potent experience because the people were different not to mention the times were different. So while I wholeheartedly agree that bnet 1 > bnet 2, I however think the sc2 user base is really treated to a lot for the initial cost.
Blizzard still releases the editor, they opened the arcade and CUSTOMS MAPS are more present than ever before (not present as in a huge amount of people host them, but the tools (what blizz's thing is) are there).
HOSTING has disappeared! That is also a great clue as to what is going on / different from bnet1.
The players are too much in the now, too much privy to their own inadequacies and thriving on avoiding to ever confront them for real.
A community of starcraft 2 will arise like the sc1 did (who's to say who that will comprise right now is moot, I'll be there, I know it! Will YOU be is the relevant thing to ask yourself!). We are not at this point yet (even though the starbow outside ladder says it is possible for it to be "more" happening right now! RIGHT THIS MINUTE).
WE are sc, the fact that you "everything ez for me 2015 kids" let win/lose ratio disappear is the most obvious symptom I guess. WE are the game, we who spent thousands of hours thinking/feeling/living sc.
Please, the $ argumentation is moot, we are the game, and YOU let it escape your grasp because you don't know better.
In a time when windows is offering free stuff, in a time when china stops forbidding its citizen to make kids.. we have no time to lose.
All the tools are there.. so I'd like to say to
..all those bw whiners: sc2bw is here and YOU can add to it, make it crystalin pure! Make it so alive that blizz would feel even more embarrassed by it to the point that they would give us the keys to use their platform.+ Show Spoiler +YOU can make it happen, no petty excuses, just do it.
.. to all those iccup nostalgics: a separate sc2 ladder is do-able TODAY!
.. all sc lovers: never let the turkeys keep you down! sc will prevail!!!
Edit: + Show Spoiler [TLDR] +You kids have it too easy for your own good.
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I totally remember when the BW chat had trivia night or something like that where you had to guess which unit says the certain quote. If you get the right unit, you would win "bnet $" as your score indicator.
Sure, it's fluff, but sometimes, small things like these can really lighten the mood. So, it would be great, if the chat room interface was immediately accessible when you first start up battle.net.
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On June 19 2015 03:33 hansonslee wrote:
I totally remember when the BW chat had trivia night or something like that where you had to guess which unit says the certain quote. If you get the right unit, you would win "bnet $" as your score indicator.
Sure, it's fluff, but sometimes, small things like these can really lighten the mood. So, it would be great, if the chat room interface was immediately accessible when you first start up battle.net.
Nothing that a well rounded third party website linked to a custom mod community map pool on sc2 couldn't fix!
+ Show Spoiler [Rant?] +When I was young, + Show Spoiler [Why spoiler?] + and yes I do spoiler out of habit, people who profess to not reading can then not accuse me of taking too much of their time/forum screen space, from where I am sitting at any rate. we didn't have the luxury of making excuses when it came to computer or lan organization/logistics. In order to have a 24 hour week end of fun on sc or age quake bond footcha'ball etc, we bought extra hardware.. just in case. We had several rooms and threw stuff on the walls when the virtual fights were at their paroxysm.. + Show Spoiler +. The freedom from going from board to code was intoxicating. + Show Spoiler [More] + I can see why my kid would want soon to stop using legos, and that would be too far.. I would not let it get there.
Sculpting a map or using lego to shape a battle field is the same but different, he must do both for different results, but both! But other things were at work, and they seem to still be present to this day... People's inadequacies tend to keep them from what they will eventually get (this is making the callous assumption that everyone concerned or to whom it would "be/feel applicable to" would harbor at least a wish if not a calling)! Sc is an essence of an idea. RTS just like many other challenging things is a weird "medium", because it ultimately is not made to be in just "one" form (one platform, one concept, one game...). C and C, rage of the vam pires, sc .. who cares? The whole idea is that if the player is given all the parameters of the gameplay (all the things like "scourge can't attack ground units") at the start and that this start be deemed "fair", then real time strategy can ensue. Moreover, a series (best of 7 comes to mind) of games would determine skill. This (honestly) due to some cracks in the "unbalanced" and "imbalanced" safety net surrounding the engine. And indeed, besides blizzard's imba defender credo + Show Spoiler +a sad relic that makes all blizz game favor the defender) that is what the sc2 experience manages. Lotv seems less pure than hots (certainly less than sc2bw) while starbow is clearly exposing the gap in fun provided by hots and lotv. No diktat says that is how it should/will be forever, sc will prevail! + Show Spoiler [tldr:] +#Chill!
#No one is in control!
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chat channels made BW community one of the best of all games, because of chat channels we have gosugamers, teamliquid, and all the other great sites that were made by a bunch of friends that loved the game...
most of my best friends irl are people i meet in b.net channels playing bw togheter for years, now after like 12 years we are like a family. Because of that i hate to see what blizzard did with sc2, such a great project, a huge fan base and they fucked it up in less than 4 years...
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Hey Kevin,
I've been working on this aspect of the game a lot. I made this post on teamliquid to about how to improve the interface to better help community interaction and to develop the clan ladder.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/legacy-of-the-void/488611-community-development-in-3-key-areas
I agree with you the social aspect is difficult to work with in sc2. The way its designed, the social aspects are off in a corner, while the base game is not really designed for it. I wanted to have a whole tab just dedicated to this aspect of the game. There are a lot of custom pictures in the tab, so take time to see what you like and don't like. I'd really like to hear your opinion.
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EPT
