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SC2 is fun in the arcade and single player modes. The ladder isn't fun.
But playing competitively isn't supposed to be fun, it's about excitement and trying to win.
Not everything needs to be fun to be "good", there are other qualities to a good game (or book or movie or anything, Citizen Kane isn't a "fun" movie but still considered a masterpiece.).
I'm not a competitive minded person, so I've stopped playing SC2 ladder, and when I played WoW I preferred raiding over PvP. For competitive minded people, I am sure the ladder is engaging and fulfilling (and rage-inducing when you lose).
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for me sc2 is fun cause after every game i want to "fix" my mistake i did last game. It pushes me...
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Starcraft made me a better person. Its fun if you want to push your capabilities. Its like training for a marathon, slowly improving yourself, climbing up the ladder. :D
(but blizzard ruined it....hey lets nerf stuff so people can only win a game playing safe and getting a lucky clusterfuck in the lategame, bye bye strategy)
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Most fun part for me is playing with friends of course and just doing random crazy strats. Of course, the same could be said of almost any game. Being with people can make pretty much anything fun (and we probably end up playing more Arcade than actual SC2 games).
But I much prefer playing Starcraft solo as opposed to say League of Legends. In both cases, they're intensely skilled matches that I view more as a competition than a fun game, but I much prefer Starcraft's 1v1 to League's soloQ. The simple reason for this is that in LoL, you have to play with other people, and this can hinder my experience in 2 major ways:
1)When I play bad (not uncommon haha), it negatively affects my team. This makes losing feel awful
2)One of my teammates could be a jerk (not uncommon). I don't mind if my opponent is BM, but when it's my ally, it's not a cool experience.
In SC2 laddering, there's nothing like that that really detracts from the game.
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On November 29 2013 17:51 ninazerg wrote:
I really don't know why people play SC2. I guess there are a lot of masochistic people who are into gaming.
lol Nina, this is one of the best / and most true post's that I have ever seen on this website........
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It combines twich/mechanics of FPS games with strategy. Best of both worlds in my opinion and that's what makes it fun for me. I like the 1v1 competitive aspect. Also, I find it incredibly fun analyzing and trying to improve my play by going over replays and seeing what mistakes I or my opponent did, optimizing build orders, working on macro and mirco etc etc etc and all that good stuff. Believe it or not, I find all this incredibly fun.
When I want to have some "mindless" fun or "easier" fun, I play games like Diablo 3, Skyrim, Path of Exile or Counterstrike GO.
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No it is not fun for me anymore, for more than two years. The game is just too stressfull and you feel lonely.
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On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:
(but blizzard ruined it....hey lets nerf stuff so people can only win a game playing safe and getting a lucky clusterfuck in the lategame, bye bye strategy)
lol... such a retarded attitude. Luck doesn't play much of a role in late game (the better player usually wins). SC2 is far less luck based now than early WoL and there's plenty of strategy. Though I guess you can keep calling it a no strategy, coinflip clusterfuck so you don't feel bad about sucking.
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On November 30 2013 10:15 Scarecrow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:
(but blizzard ruined it....hey lets nerf stuff so people can only win a game playing safe and getting a lucky clusterfuck in the lategame, bye bye strategy) lol... such a retarded attitude. Luck doesn't play much of a role in late game (the better player usually wins). SC2 is far less luck based now than early WoL and there's plenty of strategy. Though I guess you can keep calling it a no strategy, coinflip clusterfuck so you don't feel bad about sucking.
Nah, SBT is actually right, and insulting him doesn't make you right.
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tbh i felt the times playing aoe2 were more fun to me. maybe because i played it with my friends of the university in a pc bang, so the atmosphere was better.
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On November 30 2013 19:15 ninazerg wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2013 10:15 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:
(but blizzard ruined it....hey lets nerf stuff so people can only win a game playing safe and getting a lucky clusterfuck in the lategame, bye bye strategy) lol... such a retarded attitude. Luck doesn't play much of a role in late game (the better player usually wins). SC2 is far less luck based now than early WoL and there's plenty of strategy. Though I guess you can keep calling it a no strategy, coinflip clusterfuck so you don't feel bad about sucking. Nah, SBT is actually right, and insulting him doesn't make you right.
Nope, reading his post and applying logic makes me right, the insult was superfluous. Surprised anyone tried to defend a post that stupid.
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Quite simple: I love 1v1. I love competition. I love using my brain. I can move my fingers quickly.
Other reasons: Team games suck, MOBAs are boring and the weather is always shitty in Germany.
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On December 01 2013 20:42 Scarecrow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2013 19:15 ninazerg wrote:On November 30 2013 10:15 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:
(but blizzard ruined it....hey lets nerf stuff so people can only win a game playing safe and getting a lucky clusterfuck in the lategame, bye bye strategy) lol... such a retarded attitude. Luck doesn't play much of a role in late game (the better player usually wins). SC2 is far less luck based now than early WoL and there's plenty of strategy. Though I guess you can keep calling it a no strategy, coinflip clusterfuck so you don't feel bad about sucking. Nah, SBT is actually right, and insulting him doesn't make you right. Nope, reading his post and applying logic makes me right, the insult was superfluous. Surprised anyone tried to defend a post that stupid.
I played starcraft for a big deal in the past before i quit. I got to high masters and even beaten high GM players in tournaments.
In a strategy game you are supposed to have options, blizzard took them away, its not about strategy anymore, its how well you can multitask for 15 minutes to decide the game in one big clusterfuck. I really dont care whether you insult my intelligence or not man, i guess after all this is the internet, where little people suddenly become big men. Enjoy your day.
(If you want to start an agrument, do it without the insults)
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I can think of quite a few games that are more fun than starcraft 2
there are also games that are both more fun and also have a similarly high skill curve. Unless you're really fascinated by the idea of RTS games or are seriously trying to make money playing video games, I think there's a lot better options for gaming.
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On December 02 2013 01:10 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2013 20:42 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 19:15 ninazerg wrote:On November 30 2013 10:15 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:
(but blizzard ruined it....hey lets nerf stuff so people can only win a game playing safe and getting a lucky clusterfuck in the lategame, bye bye strategy) lol... such a retarded attitude. Luck doesn't play much of a role in late game (the better player usually wins). SC2 is far less luck based now than early WoL and there's plenty of strategy. Though I guess you can keep calling it a no strategy, coinflip clusterfuck so you don't feel bad about sucking. Nah, SBT is actually right, and insulting him doesn't make you right. Nope, reading his post and applying logic makes me right, the insult was superfluous. Surprised anyone tried to defend a post that stupid. I played starcraft for a big deal in the past before i quit. I got to high masters and even beaten high GM players in tournaments. I really dont care whether you insult my intelligence or not man, i guess after all this is the internet, where little people suddenly become big men. Enjoy your day. (If you want to start an agrument, do it without the insults)
On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:can only win a game playing safe
well that's just simply not true, there are plenty of ways to win by being aggressive
You also said winning takes: On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:a lucky clusterfuck in the late game
Taeja must be so lucky to win all those tourneys. How the hell was Rain's late game PvP so good? He must be just really lucky too.... Seriously, late game is the culmination of everything either player has done leading up to it and winning it requires better control, scouting, composition, decisionmaking or positional play. Luck or randomness is hardly a significant factor in late game.
On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:bye bye strategy
By this I assume you mean there is no strategy in late game (or the game in general)
hmmm... no strategy in late game SC... maybe there's less of the 'special tactics' variety but to say it's gone once late game comes around defies logic.
I'm also masters, so what, your rank doesn't automatically make your posts valid. I wasn't looking for an argument, I was just irritated to see a post so out of touch with reality. If you can defend any of the 3 statements above I'd be stunned. It just seems like you're bitter and developed this warped view of the game to justify your quitting.
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On December 02 2013 02:45 Scarecrow wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 01:10 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:On December 01 2013 20:42 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 19:15 ninazerg wrote:On November 30 2013 10:15 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:
(but blizzard ruined it....hey lets nerf stuff so people can only win a game playing safe and getting a lucky clusterfuck in the lategame, bye bye strategy) lol... such a retarded attitude. Luck doesn't play much of a role in late game (the better player usually wins). SC2 is far less luck based now than early WoL and there's plenty of strategy. Though I guess you can keep calling it a no strategy, coinflip clusterfuck so you don't feel bad about sucking. Nah, SBT is actually right, and insulting him doesn't make you right. Nope, reading his post and applying logic makes me right, the insult was superfluous. Surprised anyone tried to defend a post that stupid. I played starcraft for a big deal in the past before i quit. I got to high masters and even beaten high GM players in tournaments. I really dont care whether you insult my intelligence or not man, i guess after all this is the internet, where little people suddenly become big men. Enjoy your day. (If you want to start an agrument, do it without the insults) Show nested quote +On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:can only win a game playing safe well that's just simply not true, there are plenty of ways to win by being aggressive You also said winning takes: Show nested quote +On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:a lucky clusterfuck in the late game Taeja must be so lucky to win all those tourneys. How the hell was Rain's late game PvP so good? He must be just really lucky too.... Seriously, late game is the culmination of everything either player has done leading up to it and winning it requires better control, scouting, composition, decisionmaking or positional play. Luck or randomness is hardly a significant factor in late game. By this I assume you mean there is no strategy in late game (or the game in general) hmmm... no strategy in late game SC... maybe there's less of the 'special tactics' variety but to say it's gone once late game comes around defies logic. I'm also masters, so what, your rank doesn't automatically make your posts valid. I wasn't looking for an argument, I was just irritated to see a post so out of touch with reality. If you can defend any of the 3 statements above I'd be stunned. It just seems like you're bitter and developed this warped view of the game to justify your quitting.
Ok. now we can talk.
Yea i will not disagree that the winner of the game is the one who makes the least mistakes.
Its the fact that the game must be taken to the lategame that annoys me. Yea you can be aggresive early and midgame, but it will all be to have a winning edge in the late game. In chess, if your opponent isnt careful you can finish the game straight away after a few moves, thats strategy. You can agrue that you can do the same in starcraft, which you can if your opponent makes big mistakes (but it would need to be a major screw up).
Fact is simply that an attacking player in the early and mid stages of the game has to commit more resources into units and give up more economy then the defending player to do anything meaningful. They made it really easy to sit back and macro all day long. I dont find that intresting. Basic logic should dictate that if i put more resources in an attack then my opponent that i should win, but that rarely happens because of units like the mothershipcore etc. Hey lets spawn a cheap unit while i macro and spawn no units to stop an attack thats worth 10 times my units.
This used to be a very unforgiving game that could be decided in the first few minutes, i liked that about starcraft, but its not that same game anymore. I still respect the game because its a hard one, and it has a high skill ceiling, but strategy wise it feels dumbed down, it still is a very complex game, but its not the unforgiving game anymore....its an accumulation of mistakes that make you lose a game, not just 1 mistake (if people make mistakes its their fault, game shouldnt be so forgiving).
And i dont need to justify my quitting, i simply dont have time to play any games at all anymore these days.
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On December 02 2013 03:21 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 02:45 Scarecrow wrote:On December 02 2013 01:10 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:On December 01 2013 20:42 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 19:15 ninazerg wrote:On November 30 2013 10:15 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:
(but blizzard ruined it....hey lets nerf stuff so people can only win a game playing safe and getting a lucky clusterfuck in the lategame, bye bye strategy) lol... such a retarded attitude. Luck doesn't play much of a role in late game (the better player usually wins). SC2 is far less luck based now than early WoL and there's plenty of strategy. Though I guess you can keep calling it a no strategy, coinflip clusterfuck so you don't feel bad about sucking. Nah, SBT is actually right, and insulting him doesn't make you right. Nope, reading his post and applying logic makes me right, the insult was superfluous. Surprised anyone tried to defend a post that stupid. I played starcraft for a big deal in the past before i quit. I got to high masters and even beaten high GM players in tournaments. I really dont care whether you insult my intelligence or not man, i guess after all this is the internet, where little people suddenly become big men. Enjoy your day. (If you want to start an agrument, do it without the insults) On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:can only win a game playing safe well that's just simply not true, there are plenty of ways to win by being aggressive You also said winning takes: On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:a lucky clusterfuck in the late game Taeja must be so lucky to win all those tourneys. How the hell was Rain's late game PvP so good? He must be just really lucky too.... Seriously, late game is the culmination of everything either player has done leading up to it and winning it requires better control, scouting, composition, decisionmaking or positional play. Luck or randomness is hardly a significant factor in late game. On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:bye bye strategy By this I assume you mean there is no strategy in late game (or the game in general) hmmm... no strategy in late game SC... maybe there's less of the 'special tactics' variety but to say it's gone once late game comes around defies logic. I'm also masters, so what, your rank doesn't automatically make your posts valid. I wasn't looking for an argument, I was just irritated to see a post so out of touch with reality. If you can defend any of the 3 statements above I'd be stunned. It just seems like you're bitter and developed this warped view of the game to justify your quitting. Ok. now we can talk. Yea i will not disagree that the winner of the game is the one who makes the least mistakes. Its the fact that the game must be taken to the lategame that annoys me. Yea you can be aggresive early and midgame, but it will all be to have a winning edge in the late game. In chess, if your opponent isnt careful you can finish the game straight away after a few moves, thats strategy. You can agrue that you can do the same in starcraft, which you can if your opponent makes big mistakes (but it would need to be a major screw up). Fact is simply that an attacking player in the early and mid stages of the game has to commit more resources into units and give up more economy then the defending player to do anything meaningful. They made it really easy to sit back and macro all day long. I dont find that intresting. Basic logic should dictate that if i put more resources in an attack then my opponent that i should win, but that rarely happens because of units like the mothershipcore etc. Hey lets spawn a cheap unit while i macro and spawn no units to stop an attack thats worth 10 times my units. This used to be a very unforgiving game that could be decided in the first few minutes, i liked that about starcraft, but its not that same game anymore. I still respect the game because its a hard one, and it has a high skill ceiling, but strategy wise it feels dumbed down, it still is a very complex game, but its not the unforgiving game anymore....its an accumulation of mistakes that make you lose a game, not just 1 mistake (if people make mistakes its their fault, game shouldnt be so forgiving). And i dont need to justify my quitting, i simply dont have time to play any games at all anymore these days.
I can see what you're saying but surely making games last longer actually leaves more room for strategy? You have to have follow-ups and anticipate each other's next moves after doing damage rather than simply killing them in early WoL. The game was far simpler strategically when if you missed a forcefield you die... now you get behind but you can fight back. The game used to have so many 1 base all-ins that were very successful because of small maps, limited scouting and less defender's advantage. That made for short games decided by one fuck up with little opportunity for players to show off strategies like sOs and Naniwa do today. Basic logic might dictate that more resources in an attack should beat less resources defending but that makes for a shitty rts where you can get a slight build order/scouting edge and snowball it into a win. MSC can't hold 10 times as much stuff (you seem to like hyperbole) and becomes far less relevant after the early game whilst allowing for some tech/greed that makes the game more complex.
Basically, a game based on the accumulation of mistakes (rather than one) allows for more comebacks and back and forth with less lucky insta-wins. One of the things that made BW so great is that it was very hard to outright kill someone, and better players could almost always fight back due to long rally distances, pathing and high ground advantage. I agree that the mocore has made SC2 a little too passive in the early game but players are finding ways to work around it and it has vastly improved the quality of PvP.
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On December 02 2013 09:08 Scarecrow wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 03:21 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:On December 02 2013 02:45 Scarecrow wrote:On December 02 2013 01:10 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:On December 01 2013 20:42 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 19:15 ninazerg wrote:On November 30 2013 10:15 Scarecrow wrote:On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:
(but blizzard ruined it....hey lets nerf stuff so people can only win a game playing safe and getting a lucky clusterfuck in the lategame, bye bye strategy) lol... such a retarded attitude. Luck doesn't play much of a role in late game (the better player usually wins). SC2 is far less luck based now than early WoL and there's plenty of strategy. Though I guess you can keep calling it a no strategy, coinflip clusterfuck so you don't feel bad about sucking. Nah, SBT is actually right, and insulting him doesn't make you right. Nope, reading his post and applying logic makes me right, the insult was superfluous. Surprised anyone tried to defend a post that stupid. I played starcraft for a big deal in the past before i quit. I got to high masters and even beaten high GM players in tournaments. I really dont care whether you insult my intelligence or not man, i guess after all this is the internet, where little people suddenly become big men. Enjoy your day. (If you want to start an agrument, do it without the insults) On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:can only win a game playing safe well that's just simply not true, there are plenty of ways to win by being aggressive You also said winning takes: On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:a lucky clusterfuck in the late game Taeja must be so lucky to win all those tourneys. How the hell was Rain's late game PvP so good? He must be just really lucky too.... Seriously, late game is the culmination of everything either player has done leading up to it and winning it requires better control, scouting, composition, decisionmaking or positional play. Luck or randomness is hardly a significant factor in late game. On November 30 2013 02:34 SupplyBlockedTV wrote:bye bye strategy By this I assume you mean there is no strategy in late game (or the game in general) hmmm... no strategy in late game SC... maybe there's less of the 'special tactics' variety but to say it's gone once late game comes around defies logic. I'm also masters, so what, your rank doesn't automatically make your posts valid. I wasn't looking for an argument, I was just irritated to see a post so out of touch with reality. If you can defend any of the 3 statements above I'd be stunned. It just seems like you're bitter and developed this warped view of the game to justify your quitting. Ok. now we can talk. Yea i will not disagree that the winner of the game is the one who makes the least mistakes. Its the fact that the game must be taken to the lategame that annoys me. Yea you can be aggresive early and midgame, but it will all be to have a winning edge in the late game. In chess, if your opponent isnt careful you can finish the game straight away after a few moves, thats strategy. You can agrue that you can do the same in starcraft, which you can if your opponent makes big mistakes (but it would need to be a major screw up). Fact is simply that an attacking player in the early and mid stages of the game has to commit more resources into units and give up more economy then the defending player to do anything meaningful. They made it really easy to sit back and macro all day long. I dont find that intresting. Basic logic should dictate that if i put more resources in an attack then my opponent that i should win, but that rarely happens because of units like the mothershipcore etc. Hey lets spawn a cheap unit while i macro and spawn no units to stop an attack thats worth 10 times my units. This used to be a very unforgiving game that could be decided in the first few minutes, i liked that about starcraft, but its not that same game anymore. I still respect the game because its a hard one, and it has a high skill ceiling, but strategy wise it feels dumbed down, it still is a very complex game, but its not the unforgiving game anymore....its an accumulation of mistakes that make you lose a game, not just 1 mistake (if people make mistakes its their fault, game shouldnt be so forgiving). And i dont need to justify my quitting, i simply dont have time to play any games at all anymore these days. I can see what you're saying but surely making games last longer actually leaves more room for strategy? You have to have follow-ups and anticipate each other's next moves after doing damage rather than simply killing them in early WoL. The game was far simpler strategically when if you missed a forcefield you die... now you get behind but you can fight back. The game used to have so many 1 base all-ins that were very successful because of small maps, limited scouting and less defender's advantage. That made for short games decided by one fuck up with little opportunity for players to show off strategies like sOs and Naniwa do today. Basic logic might dictate that more resources in an attack should beat less resources defending but that makes for a shitty rts where you can get a slight build order/scouting edge and snowball it into a win. MSC can't hold 10 times as much stuff (you seem to like hyperbole) and becomes far less relevant after the early game whilst allowing for some tech/greed that makes the game more complex. Basically, a game based on the accumulation of mistakes (rather than one) allows for more comebacks and back and forth with less lucky insta-wins. One of the things that made BW so great is that it was very hard to outright kill someone, and better players could almost always fight back due to long rally distances, pathing and high ground advantage. I agree that the mocore has made SC2 a little too passive in the early game but players are finding ways to work around it and it has vastly improved the quality of PvP.
I guess it depends on how you like to play. I know i would rather watch a short 8 minute game then a long macro game. When starcraft just got released it was amazing to see some of the wonky early game stuff being done, but it was this wonky stuff that made the game really fun to watch, to see players winning or losing a game with awesome unit control and crazy tactics in the first few minutes of the game....for me, that is starcraft. I know people dont like cheese and allins, but its that which makes starcraft interesting for me. Late game engagements are not only boring to watch, but unless you are a pro with 300 apm your not going to make alot of difference with your unit control when an engagement goes down. That doesnt mean pros dont do amazing stuff, and i respect the multitasking they are able to do at such high speed, but most games are just 15minutes of simcity with some harassment going on and subtleties that the average starcraft player doesnt even understand. For me its boring to watch and boring to play. But then again, i was the kind of player that would spent alot of time trying to figure out the perfect build order for the perfect 2-base allin, how i could make the strongest possible attack while still playing reactive to their build order. That was fun, and maybe thats the only reason why i managed to take some games from profesional players, because i did wonky stuff...but for me, thats the starcraft i grew up with and learned to love.
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I'll tell you what doesn't keep me playing... the arcade or it didn't I know that I haven't logged on to battle.net for a while, but I assume that the arcade is just as bad as it used to be.
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for me what makes it fun is when i start to beat my friends - fun and competitive.
Also another way to have fun is when you watch your replay and start to enjoy how bad or good you were after a long hectic game. I do that after a break. I really like it when the game goes to epic 30, 45 to an hour games.
Also last but the best of my reasons, is the BM some players produce. iI is really fun for me. I dont know about yall but when I see the rage I imagine their faces. With that you could check out the BM thread to see how entertaining BMs can be. More if you were the one's BMed. Unlike in dota its more of whining saying you are bad etc but in SC2 it is pure rage because they cant blame others but themselves 
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EPT
