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mdb
Bulgaria4059 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/a2afd8v.jpg) After all we are living in 21st century and things like these belong to the past and this persistance of proving that they are the alpha and omega of the world is leading to nothing but tension between the countries in the Bolkans. I really hope that our western neighbors get some common sense and stop this and instead try to find out what is really important in the times we live in. /rant   | ||
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
You realise even their name is stolen from our history, they are not macedonians, they are just a slabic race, like the rest of the eastern balkanians. So, as a first step you should stop calling them macedonians. But yeah, propaganda in their country is making the north korean one seem like a playground, lol. | ||
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thezanursic
5500 Posts
On May 23 2013 20:40 Steveling wrote: As a greek I find your post extremely ironic. You realise even their name is stolen from our history, they are not macedonians, they are just a slabic race, like the rest of the eastern balkanians. So, as a first step you should stop calling them macedonians. But yeah, propaganda in their country is making the north korean one seem like a playground, lol. What's a slab? Yes the current the ethnic group that we call the Macedonians have a lot of Slavic ancestry, but you do realize that they are a mix of the people who used to reside there are the people who migrated there later in history (Aka the Slavs). Yes they should properly recognize their heritage, but you do realize they also have ancestors from the original inhabitants of Macedonia ( Aka the ethnic group that YOU regard as Macedonian). History is not nearly as simple as it seems. I mean should you really call yourself a Greek?!? That must be blasphemy you surely must have some Roman ancestry and various others. Maybe you could count in the Persians, Turks, Huns and basically any other ethnical group that was anywhere near Greece like EVER. Do you even realize how little you have in common with the Greeks from antiquity (especially the current Macedonians since they are so close in proximity)? Every person on Earth shares a more common ancestor with you that you do with anybody who lived in antiquity. http://tedlab.mit.edu/~dr/Papers/Rohde-MRCA-two.pdf. Anyway I am just trying to say that your arguing is pointless. | ||
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mdb
Bulgaria4059 Posts
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
On May 23 2013 20:53 thezanursic wrote: What's a slab? Yes the current the ethnic group that we call the Macedonians have a lot of Slavic ancestry, but you do realize that they are a mix of the people who used to reside there are the people who migrated there later in history (Aka the Slavs). Yes they should properly recognize their heritage, but you do realize they also have ancestors from the original inhabitants of Macedonia ( Aka the ethnic group that YOU regard as Macedonian). History is not nearly as simple as it seems. I mean should you really call yourself a greek?!? That must be blasphemy you surely must have some Roman ancestry and various other. Yes, their ancestors are off two major lines. One being the natives that lived there since ancient times and the other which is by far the biggest part of the population, a slavic group, that came to the general balkan area during the 7th-8th century with the rest of the slavs. So the slavic group can not be called macedonian for obvious reasons. As for the other line, the thing is they were never considered greeks by ancient greeks, lol. There were many subgroups of different ethnicities around the greek groups, one of them being the one under discussion. Now, these people(we call them scopians) are trying to separate the macedonian element from the greek civilization. The most obvious tell of their false theory, is that they don't speak greek and they don't have the greek traditions that the rest of the greek groups share. But as we know from our ancient historians the macedonians were another greek subgroup, just like the athenians, the spartans, the cretans etc. Some sources for this + Show Spoiler + 1) Homer himself refers to some north greek subgroups that resided in general macedonian area, in the Illiad, as greeks. 2) The ancient historian Stravon says " Naturally, macedonia is a part of greece ". 3) The ancient historian Irodotos says " The descendants of Perdikas, the first king of the macedonians, are greeks, like they consider themselves and as I have come to know myself ". 4) The ancient historian Thoukididis says " Macedonians consists of various greek subgroups and kings ". 5) The ancient historian Polyvios says " Dear and high honor must be given to the macedonians, which for the better part of their lives never stopped fighting against the barbarians for the safety of greeks ". 6)The ancient historian Arrianos says in his book, Alexander's ascend, that after the battle of Granikos against the persians, Alexander the Great did as such " He sent to Athens, the first city of all greeks and not Pella the prime city of the macedonians, 300 full body armors as well as other persian trophies, to be given to the guardian goddess Athena, with the following inscription, < By Alexander son of Philip and all Greeks, except the spartans, taken from the barbarians living in Asia. > It's also apparent from many historians that Alexander considered himself Greek. Oh and another thing, only greeks were allowed to take part in the Olympics in which macedonians were invited so.. So it's really easy for someone who studies history to not believe in the skopian propaganda. I hope I didn't offend any fellow skopians by writing this, may your eyes be opened. | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
You don't actually need to pay attention to bullshit. | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
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[UoN]Sentinel
United States11320 Posts
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mdb
Bulgaria4059 Posts
On May 23 2013 22:07 Steveling wrote: Yes, their ancestors are off two major lines. One being the natives that lived there since ancient times and the other which is by far the biggest part of the population, a slavic group, that came to the general balkan area during the 7th-8th century with the rest of the slavs. So the slavic group can not be called macedonian for obvious reasons. As for the other line, the thing is they were never considered greeks by ancient greeks, lol. There were many subgroups of different ethnicities around the greek groups, one of them being the one under discussion. Now, these people(we call them scopians) are trying to separate the macedonian element from the greek civilization. The most obvious tell of their false theory, is that they don't speak greek and they don't have the greek traditions that the rest of the greek groups share. But as we know from our ancient historians the macedonians were another greek subgroup, just like the athenians, the spartans, the cretans etc. Some sources for this + Show Spoiler + 1) Homer himself refers to some north greek subgroups that resided in general macedonian area, in the Illiad, as greeks. 2) The ancient historian Stravon says " Naturally, macedonia is a part of greece ". 3) The ancient historian Irodotos says " The descendants of Perdikas, the first king of the macedonians, are greeks, like they consider themselves and as I have come to know myself ". 4) The ancient historian Thoukididis says " Macedonians consists of various greek subgroups and kings ". 5) The ancient historian Polyvios says " Dear and high honor must be given to the macedonians, which for the better part of their lives never stopped fighting against the barbarians for the safety of greeks ". 6)The ancient historian Arrianos says in his book, Alexander's ascend, that after the battle of Granikos against the persians, Alexander the Great did as such " He sent to Athens, the first city of all greeks and not Pella the prime city of the macedonians, 300 full body armors as well as other persian trophies, to be given to the guardian goddess Athena, with the following inscription, < By Alexander son of Philip and all Greeks, except the spartans, taken from the barbarians living in Asia. > It's also apparent from many historians that Alexander considered himself Greek. Oh and another thing, only greeks were allowed to take part in the Olympics in which macedonians were invited so.. So it's really easy for someone who studies history to not believe in the skopian propaganda. I hope I didn't offend any fellow skopians by writing this, may your eyes be opened. Ok, but by your logic the country Macedonia should be part of Bulgaria, as they have the same language as us, the same traditions as us etc, not to mention that Ohrid was the captial of Bulgaria just over a thousand years ago... Why cant the greeks get over this and just accept that there is a country called Macedonia, there are people who live there and consider themselves macedonian and want to have Macedonian nation. Yeah, they have nothing to do with the ancient macedonians, but so what? After all the most important aspect of creating a nation or a country is what the people who live there consider themselves. If they want it to be Macedonia, let it be. For example Moldova and Romania are two separate countries but are the same nation, same goes to Greece and Cyprus. | ||
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Orome
Switzerland11984 Posts
On May 23 2013 23:15 mdb wrote: Ok, but by your logic the country Macedonia should be part of Bulgaria, as they have the same language as us, the same traditions as us etc... Why cant the greeks get over this and just accept that there is a country called Macedonia, there are people who live there and consider themselves macedonian and want to have Macedonian nation. Yeah, they have nothing to do with the ancient macedonians, but so what? After all the most important aspect of creating a nation or a country is what the people who live there consider themselves. If they want it to be Macedonia, let it be. For example Moldova and Romania are two separate countries but are the same nation, same goes to Greece and Cyprus. I had a discussion with a Bulgarian about this 4 weeks ago and he actually was saying that Macedonia should be a part of Bulgaria again (rather than a part of Albania, which is where he thought Macedonia was heading). I'm glad you wrote this post so I don't have to have the same argument with you. :p | ||
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bonifaceviii
Canada2890 Posts
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Gorribal
Canada186 Posts
On May 23 2013 22:54 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Everybody likes to pretend they have the biggest dick in the room. As long as nobody's getting shot at as a result of this, everything will be fine. lolable location to post ratio | ||
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MorpheasGR
Greece1 Post
Macedonia is known to be an ancient northern Greek kingdom.They spoke Greek, had Greek Gods and Greek customs. They did had wars with other Greek city states just like Athens vs Sparta. At some point Alexander the Great manage to become the king of all Greek states and goes to war with Persia and stops at India. All historic data from that time (texts, coins, cities, architecture culture) says that Macedonians are Greek. Actually they are responsible for spreading the Greek culture to the known world back then. When Romans conquer Greeks the area above the ancient kingdom had no real owner so the named the whole province Macedonia way bigger than the actual Greek kingdom. Slav tribes came to the area around 600 AD almost 900 years after Alexander. The Slav tribes of course never said that they are now Macedonians. The mordern so called ''Macedonians'' were part of Yugoslavia = United Slavs. In 1991 if you remember was the year Yugoslavia broke into pieces and had civil war. ''Macedonia'' has 35% Albanian population and the rest 65% are Slavs that speak a Bulgarian dialect. Now after all that why on earth should Greece give up the name of its current largest province? PS They do not only steal Greek history but all the nearby countries as well . Czar Samuel Bulgarian king , Mother Teressa Albanian desent , Queen Elizabeth, even 11 USA presidents according to them are ''Macedonians'' If you see their capital they have statues of Alexander the Great, his father Philip, Czar Samuel , and as a bonus Winston Churchill!!!! After all they got the name kitsch capital of Europe. Sorry if i tire you with a wall of text . | ||
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