• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 01:36
CEST 07:36
KST 14:36
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection2Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview5[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)7
Community News
[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June0Weekly Cups (May 25-31): Clem doubles, 2v2 circuit heads toward finale0StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th150Weekly Cups (May 18-24): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League6
StarCraft 2
General
My starcraft 2 changes The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser Valorant Anti-Cheat: New Measures Against Unfair StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event
Strategy
Melara Air Pillows: The Ultimate Sleep Solution [G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 528 Infection Detected Welcome to the External Content forum Mutation # 527 Hell Train
Brood War
General
FlaSh's ASL S21 Finals Review BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Tesagi Viewer - A new era of replay watching 14k games analyzed: Cross Spawn Nexus first good? VPN experiences
Tourneys
[ASL21] Grand Finals [BSL22] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CEST [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2
Strategy
Why doesn't anyone use restoration? Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread How cold is too cold to be outdoors? Dating: How's your luck? Trading/Investing Thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Esportsmanship: How to NOT B…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 5683 users

The TvZ OLD Thorzain opener with NEW

Blogs > buchaa
Post a Reply
buchaa
Profile Blog Joined September 2012
Pakistan77 Posts
May 07 2013 07:56 GMT
#1
So I've been a die hard fan of Thorzain around about when I saw his games against fruit dealer and the likes of boss tosses in TSL3. I followed him slump down to not being known, losing to Ret and Naniwa in the EURO series. But then I also saw him get back up in a close series against DRG later.

Anyways, this post aint about my Thorzain crush, rather about something he used to do very often as a mousesports player, but stopped doing it once he moved to EG.

In all TvZ matchups if you would perhaps remember correctly, he opened 3 command centers behind just the single marine, adding his 3rd before the 5min mark.


[image loading]

1 of the only problems he's face were from early roach aggression, or roach baneling busts. Don't we have the widow mine to stop that to quite an extent now?

The only reason I post this here in a blog rather than the sc2 strategy section as a guide is because I'm still Diamond. Don't intend to be for too long, but hey "NOT GOOD ENUFF YET" Otherwise this is my MMMM BUILD

This works in HOTS more than it did in WOL imo. That's why I think its so great.

So the build starts with 14 gas, only 2 in it till you get the OC. A rax between your gas and cc for 6 pool defense, and then the 3rd CC just before you get the hellions moving out.

[image loading]

I just blindly build 2 mines after the 4th hellion, and cancel them if I scout 3bases/a lot of macro/gasless zerg etc.

Before building Barracks 2 and 3, I prefer building Engy bays 1 and 2, depending on the scout of course, cuz you just gotta be as greedy as possible.

So the game's right down here where I was roach banes all-ind(not the best execution I've seen if I would say so myself), do post back if you want me to detail this post more or add replays .

And oh feel free to start with the, "YOU'RE DIAMOND!! YOU DON'T KNOW SHIT!! YOUR BUILD SUCKS!!!" All welcome

http://drop.sc/331570

BoxeR, Michael Schumacher, Michael Jordan (Legends never get old)
BEARDiaguz
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Australia2362 Posts
May 07 2013 12:29 GMT
#2
This was Thorzain's strategy pre queen range buff. faster hellion openers are much less useful against range 5 queens. So it's ok to get CC's faster which is what he does now. You will sometimes see terrans opening gas before expansion for hellions (gumiho comes to mind) and generally it's cuz they're doing something really funky.

I do remember this build too though. Fun times.
ProgamerAustralian alcohol user follow @iaguzSC2
Coriolis
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1152 Posts
May 07 2013 13:30 GMT
#3
I've been doing exactly this. You can hold off basically any aggression that comes at you via the widow mines, and the hellions are still pretty good even with 5 range queens.
Descolada in everything not TL/Starcraft
buchaa
Profile Blog Joined September 2012
Pakistan77 Posts
May 07 2013 15:41 GMT
#4
The hellions I still think provide great map control, and are great scouts as to what the zerg is doing, and what he's hitting you with. If I didn't make hellions, I'd probably never know if the zerg's taken a 3rd, or is coming at me with roaches or whatever else may be going on.

The reason I for one don't use reapers against zerg is because I just dont have the multi tasking
BoxeR, Michael Schumacher, Michael Jordan (Legends never get old)
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
WardiTV Mondays #83
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 165
Nina 82
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 5258
Calm 1418
Zeus 357
Tasteless 243
Leta 125
Bale 41
IntoTheRainbow 13
Icarus 8
Nal_rA 5
League of Legends
JimRising 721
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K229
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox581
Other Games
summit1g10566
PiGStarcraft576
WinterStarcraft508
C9.Mang0414
Hui .168
ViBE59
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis1774
• Rush1155
• Lourlo1044
• Jankos1028
• Stunt194
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
3h 24m
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
9h 24m
Maestros of the Game
9h 54m
Clem vs Lambo
Zoun vs SKillous
Replay Cast
18h 24m
Replay Cast
1d 3h
Solar vs Classic
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 9h
Grudge Match
1d 10h
FlaShFTW vs A.Alm
OSC
1d 15h
GSL
2 days
herO vs Rogue
Maru vs Cure
Patches Events
2 days
[ Show More ]
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
BSL
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
Maestros of the Game
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

KK 2v2 League Season 1
RSL Revival: Season 5
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
Maestros of the Game 2
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
2026 GSL S2
Murky Cup 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
Heroes Pulsing #3
Heroes Pulsing #2
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.