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I'm a pretty avid cyclist and have been since ~97 or so. Been competing in both road races and mtb but not "that" serious since I have other sports (xc-skiing) that I value higher.
Anyway people ask me about advice when they want to buy a bike and I try to help them since it's fun and one can always use another training partner.
Recently I've been aproached by two friends who were going to buy a road bike. They said what they wanted to pay (both were the same pricerange around 700€) and I told them to look for second hand bikes since the new ones under 1200€ or so are pretty bad and you can get really nice used bikes if you take your time and look around.
So I spent hours talking to them, showing sites and bikes that seemed ok so they would not get ripped off. I also told them what component groups they should look for and all about that jungle.
A week after I helped the first friend he tells me that he just bough a brand new bike that was pretty much shit on wheels 1,5kg heavier than acceptable and exactly what I told him not to buy.
Two weeks later the other friend that I've been talking about bikes with for over a year (I guess that "recently" as I put above was not that correct but meh) goes out and buy the exact same bike.
I dont know what I did wrong, I spent hours giving advice based on all mistakes I've made myself and everything I have learned these 15years and they just did the exact opposite. When it comes to friend #2 I think her mother is somehow involved in her bad decisionmaking since she was about to buy a computer a while ago. I told her to tell me when she was going to buy it and I'll ask some friends what she should get. Pretty much the same as asking me about bikes, I aske friends that know more than me what hardware to get. Well all of a sudden she went out with her mother, bought a really bad computer, almost instantly realised that it indeed sucked and that she'd have to buy a new one.
Her mother payed for some of the bike and it was a really quick thing.
As a bonus to the story I have good connections with the local dealers one of them selling that exact brand they choosed. So if they had asked me I could get a discount on the bikes since they know me and I just got them two more customers. I might add that these friends dont live in the same city as I do.
Anyway I just had to get this out since it just annoyed me so much. Putting time and effort trying to help someone and then they do the exact thing I told them not to do.
Anyone have any input how to become more trustworthy or should I just tell the next person to fuck off when they ask me for advice?
 
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Deep breaths buddy.
Experience is the teacher, not always another person. Don't take it personally.
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In your scenario, I would just forget about it
You're the one that put the effort into helping your friends. You gave a damn about them so you tried, but if they don't listen, then theyre just the crappy friends that are gonna be stuck with a shitty product
I like to think of helping people as something I do because I care about others, not because I get a satisfaction from people listening to me.
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It's possible you gave them too much, albeit good, information. Given their recent purchases, it sounds like your friends still know next to nothing about good bikes. All the specifics you offered may have only flown over their heads without sinking in. Good advice is one thing, but good advice that's tuned to the specific audience will resonate much more clearly. They probably wanted something simple.
One thing you might try next time is offering your expertise as a packaged service. Say something like,"Give me a budget and a couple requirements and I'll find you a kickass bike." At that point, they can say, "yeah, i'll be safe handing the decision off to an expert."
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Stop giving a shit. If you're experienced and they didn't liesten to you it's their mistake.
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On May 22 2012 04:27 nanoscorp wrote:
It's possible you gave them too much, albeit good, information. Given their recent purchases, it sounds like your friends still know next to nothing about good bikes. All the specifics you offered may have only flown over their heads without sinking in. Good advice is one thing, but good advice that's tuned to the specific audience will resonate much more clearly. They probably wanted something simple.
One thing you might try next time is offering your expertise as a packaged service. Say something like,"Give me a budget and a couple requirements and I'll find you a kickass bike." At that point, they can say, "yeah, i'll be safe handing the decision off to an expert."
Yep, this is the most likely explanation imo. You always have to keep in mind what the advice you're giving is supposed to do. They probably just want a simple "get this bike" rather than learn in detail about what you should look for in a bike and why it's good, what are the tradeoffs and so on. Considering so many options is great if you're informed, and terrible if you're not. If you have so many factors to think about but you don't have the experience and comfort with judging them, you look at all these options and say "fuck it I have no idea what I'm doing, I'll go to the store, the salesman there will tell me what to get".
Similar situations in the future, probably offer 2-3 options (no more) and give simple classifications like "this one's cheaper" "this one's more durable/reliable" etc. And not go into a ton of detail.
But again, that depends on who you're giving the advice to.
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When it comes to friend #2 I think her mother is somehow involved in her bad decisionmaking since she was about to buy a computer a while ago.
Lol, while reading the first half all I could think about is how similar it was to when people ask for advice about computers haha. Far too often when people ask for advice, what they're really asking for is someone to tell them that what they want to do is right. And if you tell them otherwise, they won't care and will just buy whatever they initially wanted to anyway. I guarentee you everyone has at least one idiot friend like this.
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It's not that you did anything wrong, it's just that your friends weren't able to properly appreciate it and through their bad purchases will pay the price for that. Whether they actually notice that they're worse off is another thing though.
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I agree with what's been said above, you gave to much info probably. A friend of mine always gives me advice on which computer parts to get but as soon as he starts talking about sandy bridges (or whatever the hell it's called) I stop listening. In the end I just ask him to tell me which exact part to get. Do that with your friends. Be decisive and tell them "Get this one, you stupid noob!"
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Maybe you can help create a follow-up, like if you could pick a date that you two would go and look for a bike together so you can use your expertise in person and also explain things in real time. It would prevent them from getting into these shitty deals and they'd almost be forced to follow your advice.
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Just wait for the moment they start complaining about how much their new bike sucks, and then "told ya so... idiots".
I dunno in what way they approached you and how much they were expecting from you. But they seem stupid to ask advice and not listen to it then. If they actually cared while listening to your advice (and weren't bored or annoyed by it  ) then it's totally their fault.
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They'll eventually learn and listen to you from now on. It happened to me a couple of time. Also don't take it personally, chances are they just lazy and buy whatever they think it's cool instead of listening to you since they have 0 experience and have no idea how bad the stuff they're buying are.
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On May 22 2012 05:14 imPermanenCe wrote:Just wait for the moment they start complaining about how much their new bike sucks, and then "told ya so... idiots". I dunno in what way they approached you and how much they were expecting from you. But they seem stupid to ask advice and not listen to it then. If they actually cared while listening to your advice (and weren't bored or annoyed by it ) then it's totally their fault.
Well they had me fooled since it really seemed like they cared and the girl even took notes on what components to get/not to get. It'll be interesting to see how it turns out. It would really suck if they quit after a year or so due to shitty equipment being heavy/boring/broken ect.
I think the main reason I got a bit pissed is that I'm a somewhat "I'm right and people who disagree are morons". Naturally I believe that I have friends that are not morons and hmz ----> Insert some psychological stuff here.
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you cant reason logically with most women.
User was warned for this post
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This happens to me sometimes, and I have learned that my advice can be too complicated. Years of knowledge does not always deliver as smoothly as you think when dealing with beginners.
Though I play guitar, it doesn't make a difference when we are talking about students. My advice, you need to cut things down alot. The fact that you took several hours with each of them, tells me right away that they were both overwhelmed with the amount of information you were giving them; and by then, probably not retaining any of your advice.
I sometimes get very excited, and speak enthuastically when approached about one of my favourite subjects. Just keep in mind, you will probably have many conversations with this person in the future, you do not need to let them know it all at once.
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You did everything you could to help them out besides holding their hands while they pee. At that point you shouldn't feel bad if they do something that ultimately only hurts themselves. As for wasting your time, it sucks but a lot of time investments don't pan out in life.
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Not too much people are good listeners. Most of them are just simple (no offence) stupid to understand good and professional advice. Simply let them do everything their way, next time don`t even try to explain them the same problem again.
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This has happened to me in the past when a couple of my friends wanted to upgrade their desktop comps. I layed out everything within their price range, even offered to help put them together.
Both of them went to bestbuy and bought shitty hps. ARGH!
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yea just don't give a shit. You should give advice because you like giving advice, not because you want people to do the things that you want them to do. Let people make their own decisions as long as it doesn't affect you. my friends (note, multiple) often give relationship to one of my friends because he's kind of an idiot. It's like really black and white stuff, but he never takes our advice. It's obviously frustrating, but you really just have to let people do their own thing.
Also, some people just ask for advice, but never plan on taking any of it. While it may seem stupid, that's just the way some people are. in some scenarios, they're just looking for confirmation.
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Well, salespeople, or people in authoritative positions who don't know they're wrong about what they're talking about, are really good at convincing buyers to throw away all their notes and make a bad purchase.
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Haha, people have been asking me about computer builds/what to buy for a long time; and regardless of how eager they seem to get your advice, they rarely listen.
Don't take it personally.
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Their fault they don't have ears...
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On May 22 2012 05:54 Eatme wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2012 05:14 imPermanenCe wrote:Just wait for the moment they start complaining about how much their new bike sucks, and then "told ya so... idiots". I dunno in what way they approached you and how much they were expecting from you. But they seem stupid to ask advice and not listen to it then. If they actually cared while listening to your advice (and weren't bored or annoyed by it ) then it's totally their fault. I think the main reason I got a bit pissed is that I'm a somewhat "I'm right and people who disagree are morons". Naturally I believe that I have friends that are not morons and hmz ----> Insert some psychological stuff here.
That's a rather poor mindset for giving advice.
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Tell them that they've annoyed you and you'll get all the answers you need.
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EPT
