|
I found there to be a lot of disagreement revolving around the Winter Arena Pay Per View event, and decided to layout, as clearly as I could, the positions of both sides. I think that both have legitimate arguments, and by reading both strong opinions, you can make up your own mind about their upcoming service.
The Case for MLG PPV:
MLG is an incredibly unique company. In the span of Starcraft 2’s release date, through hard work and dedication, it has become the leading North American E-sports event. Sure it’s had its ups and its downs, but at the forefront, weathering the storm, was their CEO, Sundance Digiovanni. Sundance has proven to be an extraordinarily passionate businessman when it comes to the world of E-sports, not resting until it becomes on par with other “more legitimate sports.” MLG is a company that cares deeply about their fans and their business, and their latest attempt at a pay per view model, continues their ongoing commitment to growing E-sports.
With their Winter Arena, MLG is offering the fans of Starcraft exactly what they asked for, a higher quality product. No other tournament, not even the Korean GSL, can match what MLG is offering for this tournament in terms of production. There will be 5 live 1080p streams, all viewable within MLG’s amazing user interface for on the fly stream and layout switching. MLG is even giving us the best of both worlds, offering near perfect stream quality with a near perfect players list, with everyone from Huk to Nestea to Grubby showing up for the fight. This fantastic player list is only possible because of MLG’s business decision to pay for the players trips to New York. We asked for the best players in the world, and MLG made it possible, it’s only fair for us to pay our share of the costs.
MLG is further showing its support for the community by giving everyone access to the behind the scenes stream and the first matches of the day. The behind the streams stream in particular is evidence of MLG listening to our suggestions; since the beginning we have asked MLG for more coverage of our favorite players, and as evidenced by Homestory Cup, that coverage leads to amazing quality results. MLG is finally going to have the behind the scenes feel that we have all demanded, offering a ton of content that I wouldn’t want to miss out on. I know, and MLG knows, that things didn’t go so smoothly last year, but they are clearly confident in their product, broadcasting the first matches of the day on Friday and Saturday. Being in the New York studio will insure that everything runs smoothly and in a quality that we have never seen before.
MLG has proven itself worthy of your twenty dollars next weekend in how it has handled not only this event, but past events as well. MLG has always been upfront about their costs, difficulties, and triumphs, offering a level of corporate transparency very rarely seen. They are a company that supports barcrafts and community created content, premiering film trailers like “Star Nation” and giving unknown community casters their shot at the big times. If you support MLG, you’re supporting the E-sports community as a whole.
In tandem of their business practices, CEO Sundance is a CEO unlike any other. He is upfront and honest with the community, and has done his absolute best to make himself available to answer questions. There is no other tournament or team leader that is as vocal as he is, and it’s clear that he is a man with a dream. I would want nothing more than to help make that dream realized. On Live on Three Sundance said it clearly, “someone had to do it.”
This pay per view model had to be implemented eventually, and I’m thankful that MLG is behind the helm of it. Despite their rocky beginning, MLG has proven itself the leader of North American E-sports, and if anyone is going to deliver content that is worth twenty dollars to view, it is them. Their tournaments have only gotten better over time, with lag and sound problems being issues of the past. They are an organization that is not afraid to take criticism, and then hastily fix their mistakes. They raised the prize pool when people asked, they provided more content when people asked, and they quickly adjusted their map issues. Even if this tournament goes wrong, I have comfort in knowing that MLG will be dedicated to putting my twenty dollars to work.
In sum, when you buy this arena pass, you’re getting the highest quality Starcraft 2 content to date, with the best players and production that has thus far been seen by the entire E-sports world. Your purchasing of a ticket is not just access to that content, but is an investment into the continued growth of North American E-sports, and creating a sustainable future. Sundance is an unbelievably hard worker, who gets much more hate than he deserves. I know that with him, my twenty dollars is going to give me not only an amazing weekend, but many more in the future.
_________________________________________________________________________________
The Case Against MLG
MLG is a company that puts out inconsistent results year after year. On Live on Three last week, CEO Sundance Digiovanni stated that, “last year was a clusterfuck.” Sundance is the outspoken head of a multimillion dollar business, but I think he sometimes forgets that, stating later in the same interview that he “doesn’t care about PR.” MLG has decided to force a charge of twenty dollars in order to view their “Winter Arena” event. As you continue reading, you will see that in this maneuver MLG has taken advantage of its loyal fan base, and engaged in poor business practices, making it unworthy of your hard earned money.
MLG is becoming the company that cried wolf. Last year on State of the Game, Sundance was practically begging for people to buy MLG T-shirts and gold memberships in order to support E-sports; in response to this plea, many fans (including myself) did just as Sundance requested. In their official Arena announcement, all too familiar pleas were heard: “if you truly want to support the industry and players…participate in the MLG premium offerings,” and “we can’t do this without your help.” These desperate pleas are more akin to a charity’s cries for donations than that of a business with a product to sell. It is in this regard that MLG is taking advantage of the deep love of this sport than fans around the world have, trying to guilt trip you into buying a product.
MLG is further attempting to manipulate us in blowing off pay per view off as “not a big deal.” I, for one, was disgusted at this post being cited on their website as official news. How about treating your community with some basic respect, addressing their concerns professionally rather than with a quick laugh? Furthermore, MLG is drawing false parallels to other mediums in this attempt to belittle a major decision, stating nonchalantly that the cost of a PPV ticket is, “the same cost as a trip to the movies, a large pizza, a small venue concert, or a round of drinks.” These comparisons are vastly inadequate. For instance Netflix is fifteen dollars a month for unlimited video streaming (by their hour calculations that is infinite value), and a month of the GSL (which Sundance himself described as, “the best tournament in the world”) is twenty dollars. Trying to blow off such a major decision at a price point that is too high is treating your fans with disrespect.
MLG’s largest disservice to their fans, beyond a doubt, is their treatment of gold members. On Live on Three, Sundance was making comments that made me feel insulted as a gold member, saying, “no one bought gold memberships,” and then mocking that we all complain about the ads. As I pointed out earlier, following Sundance’s plea for money on State of the Game many of us went and bought a gold membership. Only after he couldn’t defend himself from the onslaught of legitimate outcries from these very same members did Sundance surrender a five dollar discount. For me, this was a slap in the face. A five dollar “discount” does not equate to the dedication that we, the gold members, put forth in purchasing a years’ worth of tickets in advance. For a company that claims to be, “more mature in our [MLG’s] thinking,” they really have a far way to go in regards to treating their fans with respect.
Before I wrap up, even if MLG wasn’t blatantly manipulating their fans, they are still engaging in very poor business practices. First, even major multimillion dollar corporations don’t hold conferences in New York City because the cost of travel is too expensive. The announcement states that “it costs roughly $100,000 just for travel, accommodations, and other expenses for all 32 players to get to NYC for our Arena event” almost as if it’s our fault that it does. No one asked for MLG to fly out all of the players rather than the teams, and no one asked them to hold it in New York City, so they shouldn’t expect us to allow them to play the victim.
When asked about the price point, Sundance continuously dodged a legitimate answer, never giving a definitive response to “why twenty dollars?” He sarcastically said “we didn’t just pull numbers out of a hat” and yet it seems as though he did just that. With the majority of major teams opting out of the referral program, it seems that the price point is something that no one in the community supports. Despite their overly optimistic outlook on their past in their announcement, “we have done a good job of delivering a quality broadcast multiple times a year” and “the highly polished content you’ve come to expect from the Pro Circuit,” MLG has not proven to be a consistent provider of high quality content worth your twenty dollars. Sundance almost makes the argument for me in stating that “last year was a clusterfuck,” and that it was “poorly conceived and poorly executed.”
In this single move, MLG has managed to both disrespect their fans and prove that they are company that does not make smart business decisions. They have begged for our money enough times, and have done nothing to earn our respect as loyal customers. They have guilt tripped us, advertised falsely, and tried to manipulate us into buying a product that is poorly thought out and is overpriced. They deserve our criticism, and attempting to blow us off and “not care about PR” is only going to make things worse. In the end, they do not deserve our twenty dollars.
  
|
You don't really explain their positions; seems more like hypothetical justifications from a potential fan on why they may or may not buy the ticket.
|
They can charge whatever they wanna charge for their content. I think the pay-per-view model could work - but not $20 for a weekend of content. I would pay a $5 - maybe $10 - for a weekend of content. Remember that MLG is a business and if they think they can make money this way they are going to do it.
The only problem I have is that they said the Arena would be part of Gold memberships and turns out that it isn't. They have said that it was an error and that the guy was fired - but that still doesn't change the fact that gold members got screwed over.
|
T.O.P.
Hong Kong4685 Posts
The PPV model is not right for esports. Do you know why MLG had to pay for travel for every player? It's because teams expect there to be an insignificant amount of viewers. Because of the low amount of viewers, they can't justify paying travel expenses when their sponsors aren't even getting views.
In an normal MLG event, MLG doesn't have to pay for travel and good players will still come. They can save a lot of money right there.
Plus I don't see how 5 1080p streams improve my experience. I don't want 5 streams. I want one good stream. One good stream without any downtime between games.
|
On February 20 2012 05:24 T.O.P. wrote:
In an normal MLG event, MLG doesn't have to pay for travel and good players will still come. They can save a lot of money right there.
They won't? There has always been very few europeans and about koreans, a donation drive was necessary to bring MKP.
|
Canada1637 Posts
On February 20 2012 05:24 T.O.P. wrote:
The PPV model is not right for esports. Do you know why MLG had to pay for travel for every player? It's because teams expect there to be an insignificant amount of viewers. Because of the low amount of viewers, they can't justify paying travel expenses when their sponsors aren't even getting views.
In an normal MLG event, MLG doesn't have to pay for travel and good players will still come. They can save a lot of money right there.
You're just talking out of your ass here. They'd be paying for travel regardless, its the only way to consistently get European/Korean players, sure EG and TL will always be happy to fly players like PuMa, HerO and so on to every event, but even for Providence the only reason NesTea/MVP showed up is because they won a paid trip with the Global Invitational.
Sure MLG can go to the 'we don't pay travel' model, and as you say good players will still come, but they won't get the pool of players that can make their tournament comparable to GSL in terms of difficulty.
|
On February 20 2012 05:24 T.O.P. wrote:
The PPV model is not right for esports. Do you know why MLG had to pay for travel for every player? It's because teams expect there to be an insignificant amount of viewers. Because of the low amount of viewers, they can't justify paying travel expenses when their sponsors aren't even getting views.
In an normal MLG event, MLG doesn't have to pay for travel and good players will still come. They can save a lot of money right there.
Plus I don't see how 5 1080p streams improve my experience. I don't want 5 streams. I want one good stream. One good stream without any downtime between games.
by saying ppv isnt right for esports, you are just saying that no one in the real world should take it seriously. its counterproductive. if "esports" wants to make it mainstream, you are going to need people showing interest and you will need to monetize it. otherwise it will just be a niche that the mainstream doesnt care about.
probably not the best example, but that street fighter (black, fat dude who got beat down by a guy with pink hair; kimbo slice?) on youtube had youtube followers and was popular on youtube, but until he made it to PPV MMA, he was a nobody. esports is the same.
|
On February 20 2012 05:22 divito wrote:
You don't really explain their positions; seems more like hypothetical justifications from a potential fan on why they may or may not buy the ticket.
Yeah this, it seems to cover the emotional/drama aspect but doesn't give anything concrete. There's no mention of sustainability, or the exclusivity/bubble problem. No comparison of the product to other events like IPL's which has a similar stream setup but was entirely free. No mention of the lack of live audience etc.
|
On February 20 2012 05:24 T.O.P. wrote:
The PPV model is not right for esports. Do you know why MLG had to pay for travel for every player? It's because teams expect there to be an insignificant amount of viewers. Because of the low amount of viewers, they can't justify paying travel expenses when their sponsors aren't even getting views.
In an normal MLG event, MLG doesn't have to pay for travel and good players will still come. They can save a lot of money right there.
Plus I don't see how 5 1080p streams improve my experience. I don't want 5 streams. I want one good stream. One good stream without any downtime between games.
sharp thoughts put in the right words.
PPV is the wrong way to go and MLG will realise it after this event. (hopefully) If they don`t, that`s bad for the whole scene. From everything I heard MLG must have serious money issues, but this isn`t the way to cash in. First we have to grow and stabilize the esport scene. Sundance said "someone just had to try this" and he is right, but this is years too early.
|
On February 20 2012 06:28 L3gendary wrote:Show nested quote +On February 20 2012 05:22 divito wrote:
You don't really explain their positions; seems more like hypothetical justifications from a potential fan on why they may or may not buy the ticket. Yeah this, it seems to cover the emotional/drama aspect but doesn't give anything concrete. There's no mention of sustainability, or the exclusivity/bubble problem. No comparison of the product to other events like IPL's which has a similar stream setup but was entirely free. No mention of the lack of live audience etc.
This is meant to address why you should or shouldn't buy the ticket, not if they should or shouldn't have a paper view event.
|
On February 20 2012 06:33 confusedcrib wrote:Show nested quote +On February 20 2012 06:28 L3gendary wrote:On February 20 2012 05:22 divito wrote:
You don't really explain their positions; seems more like hypothetical justifications from a potential fan on why they may or may not buy the ticket. Yeah this, it seems to cover the emotional/drama aspect but doesn't give anything concrete. There's no mention of sustainability, or the exclusivity/bubble problem. No comparison of the product to other events like IPL's which has a similar stream setup but was entirely free. No mention of the lack of live audience etc. This is meant to address why you should or shouldn't buy the ticket, not if they should or shouldn't have a paper view event.
I think those are all legitimate reasons for buying/not buying. A big draw of past mlg events was the atmosphere created by the live audience which will not be present. Comparing their production to free events is also relevant, people wanna know if they're getting their money's worth. You touched on the gsl pricing but didnt go into any detail or compare it to IPL and other events. You said that the production will be the best thing in esports to date but didn't talk about how it stalks up to other tournaments. There's also the issue of supporting ppv, by buying this pass you're supporting future ppv events and similar prices.
The majority of your concerns were entirely emotional. why should we pay him when he backstabbed the gold members etc. rather than focusing on the product.
|
On February 20 2012 06:49 L3gendary wrote:Show nested quote +On February 20 2012 06:33 confusedcrib wrote:On February 20 2012 06:28 L3gendary wrote:On February 20 2012 05:22 divito wrote:
You don't really explain their positions; seems more like hypothetical justifications from a potential fan on why they may or may not buy the ticket. Yeah this, it seems to cover the emotional/drama aspect but doesn't give anything concrete. There's no mention of sustainability, or the exclusivity/bubble problem. No comparison of the product to other events like IPL's which has a similar stream setup but was entirely free. No mention of the lack of live audience etc. This is meant to address why you should or shouldn't buy the ticket, not if they should or shouldn't have a paper view event. I think those are all legitimate reasons for buying/not buying. A big draw of past mlg events was the atmosphere created by the live audience which will not be present. Comparing their production to free events is also relevant, people wanna know if they're getting their money's worth. You touched on the gsl pricing but didnt go into any detail or compare it to IPL and other events. You said that the production will be the best thing in esports to date but didn't talk about how it stalks up to other tournaments. There's also the issue of supporting ppv, by buying this pass you're supporting future ppv events and similar prices. The majority of your concerns were entirely emotional. why should we pay him when he backstabbed the gold members etc. rather than focusing on the product.
Here is what we "know" about the product: 5 streams is more than anyone else, behind the scenes is cool, and 1080p is great, but that's pretty much it. We have no idea what the actual quality of the product is going to be like until it happens. I think that the main thought that will influence your decision to spend 20 dollars on a ticket is going to be if you should trust MLG to give you a high quality product, hence an argument dealing with how they act as a business, and how they treat their fans.
Also, it's nice to have a civil discussion with someone about content, rather than the flaming that often occurs. Thank you sir <3
|
Since there are sites out there that stream NBA and NHL game live for free. Wonder if there is going to be the same with in the esprots community where individuals decided to stream the PPV events for free to the rest of the fans out there. I mean if it can happen to sports live basketball and hockey it can definitely happen to starcraft 2 events such as the MLG winter arena.
Of course, there are rules and regulations regarding the re-stream and redistribution of the pay per view content regarding real life sports. But does that apply to gaming as well? 
I Wouldn't mind if some generous fellow decided to restream the MLG winter arena free of charge on some site somewhere. I am sure a lot of people would love it
|
In this single move, MLG has managed to both disrespect their fans and prove that they are company that does not make smart business decisions. They have begged for our money enough times, and have done nothing to earn our respect as loyal customers. They have guilt tripped us, advertised falsely, and tried to manipulate us into buying a product that is poorly thought out and is overpriced. They deserve our criticism, and attempting to blow us off and “not care about PR” is only going to make things worse. In the end, they do not deserve our twenty dollars.
I enjoyed this closing.
|
|
|
Korea (South)1897 Posts
I think this was very well written. Good job.
|
I just don't know if Sundance is the right guy going forward for e-sports.
|
|
|
On February 22 2012 10:45 Doriboi wrote:
I just don't know if Sundance is the right guy going forward for e-sports.
Ya, I think that a lot of people's decisions will come down to what they think about him. His handling of being a CEO is very much a love it or hate it kind of deal.
|
One does not simply "legitimize" eSports and put it on par with other professional sports by throwing money at it. Or, in this case, rake in money from it. Either way, you don't simply create a recreational/business/sports culture (oh, for God sakes, whatever you people want to call it) in a matter of few months over a couple events. Yes, it's been there in Korea for over a decade now. Here, or elsewhere in the world? Maybe not.
I'm definitely not against the growth of eSports and gaming culture in general. I'm against how corporations are attempting to skip several steps at a time to get ahead in the business. They're throwing dollars here and there hoping they'd hit the mark somewhere down the line. Not only does the fanbase need to grow larger and become stable, the very culture has to settle in as a norm. How do you expect a couple-year-old gaming event to "be on par" with professional sports like baseball and football, which go decades and even centuries back in history?
To majority of people today, video gaming isn't a new thing around the block. However, eSports is. You've got to give it time. Instead of trying to one-up each other with even more sensational changes, people have to work together to build it up a block at a time.
|
On February 23 2012 03:18 OpticalShot wrote:
One does not simply "legitimize" eSports and put it on par with other professional sports by throwing money at it. Or, in this case, rake in money from it. Either way, you don't simply create a recreational/business/sports culture (oh, for God sakes, whatever you people want to call it) in a matter of few months over a couple events. Yes, it's been there in Korea for over a decade now. Here, or elsewhere in the world? Maybe not.
I'm definitely not against the growth of eSports and gaming culture in general. I'm against how corporations are attempting to skip several steps at a time to get ahead in the business. They're throwing dollars here and there hoping they'd hit the mark somewhere down the line. Not only does the fanbase need to grow larger and become stable, the very culture has to settle in as a norm. How do you expect a couple-year-old gaming event to "be on par" with professional sports like baseball and football, which go decades and even centuries back in history?
To majority of people today, video gaming isn't a new thing around the block. However, eSports is. You've got to give it time. Instead of trying to one-up each other with even more sensational changes, people have to work together to build it up a block at a time.
Replace "legitimize" with "viabilize", then it is all about raking in money from it.
MLG is 10 years old.
Charging for a product does not correspond with being on par with major sports, but with common business sense.
We don't know "the right time" until someone does it. If they are wrong, they'll fail.
Throwing dollars here and there is what everyone is doing, if you want them to stop then there's no scene to grow.
|
MLG said sales are ahead of prediction. That's good news.
Now, let's not beat a dead horse.
|
I can't bring myself to pay for that kind of stuff because when I buy TV all the high production value shows are free for me
|
Right or wrong, it's one things for sure, a model that won't make them financially successful. I don't see how there are "arguments." There's no right or wrong as I see it. I'm guessing not many will pay for PPV and MLG will lose money. The kind of big expense tournament they are trying to run might just not be sustainable in the current e-sports market if ads are not creating enough revenue (which from FXOBoss's recent post, they don't.)
Personally, I'm busy. I watch sc2 occasionally but never have and likely never will pay to watch a stream, at least I doubt it. I did however, go to a live MLG event which was awesome, but paying for a stream when there is so much free sc2 to watch doesn't make sense to me.
edit: I should add that I hope MLG does have success and makes money off this. It's just my feeling (albeit I don't have much any expertise) feels it won't.
|
On February 24 2012 08:41 Divinek wrote:
I can't bring myself to pay for that kind of stuff because when I buy TV all the high production value shows are free for me
Really? Where in Canada?! Can I come to your place and watch the next UFC or Boxing match? Hey, do you have HBO and the movie network? What about HD.NET and all these other speciality channels?
Nothing is free. It might just be engrained into your mind that you pay for these things regardless..
Anyway.. I enjoyed with a lot of what was posted. For me, the #1 thing for me is that I will NOT feel bad about anything any longer. I will pay for something when I feel like it meets my expectations and my schedule.. Not going to buy MLG shirts to help them keep afloat. If I miss a UFC because it is a sluggish fight card, I don't feel guilty.. MLG will not make me feel guilty if I don't want to pay for what they are offering.
That being said, I am going to pay for this arena lol > _ <
|
The problem isn't the $20 for the weekend which is ridiculous. The problem isn't the 5 1080p streams which are completely pointless, you can't watch 5 game at once.
The problem is this is the only tournament that doesn't have a "Free Low Quality Stream".
|
Well its all about the content and tbh an mlg that isnt a live event isnt an MLG and they shouldnt try to pretend that its better now that players are in a studio.
At the very least they should do MLG like dreamhack valencia. Small venue <100ppl maybe? Big production and amazing location.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
