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Violin - what to look for in purchase
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Cedstick
Canada3336 Posts
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rd
United States2586 Posts
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ArvickHero
10387 Posts
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arcfyr
Canada121 Posts
A violin can be a huge investment - to start off, you'll be fine with a cheaper violin while you make sure you really want to pursue this hobby. Check local classifieds for used violins, and check local music stores for a starter, factory-made violin. As far as used violins go, make sure that the violin comes with all four strings in decent condition and the bow doesn't need to be rehaired (i.e. the bow doesn't look like it's missing half its hair). New strings can cost you $50-80 for a set, rehairing will cost you at least $30 depending on where you get it, etc. Just remember to factor that into the potential cost when comparing used to buying from a store. I'd check Long & McQuade as a baseline (I see you're Canadian too). Of course, the best violins will be at your local luthier, but you'll probably pay more there. There's another option for you though, and if you do that, you'll also have a professional advisor in the future. Basically - don't buy expensive for your first violin. You'll sound awful for a long time - and trust me, a -lot- of people move on after the first few weeks to pursue the piano or something else. If you play for a year and find out you really like it, then look for something more expensive. Until then - as long as your violin isn't absolute garbage, your sound will definitely be limited more by your skill than the quality of your instrument. As for accessories - you'll need a case (should come with the violin) and rosin (google it if you don't know what it is). Rosin is cheap, you can get it for $5-10 for starter stuff. Some people consider a case humidifier a must-have too - I personally don't. Also, as the above poster said, if neighbors are an issue buy a practice mute. That'll really cut down on the sound - especially the very high-frequency squeaks that you'll be making. I don't really have anything to say about electric violins - I learned on a traditional (elitist: real) violin and I thus wouldn't recommend learning the instrument any other way. Feel free to PM if you want. | ||
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stalife
Canada1222 Posts
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imBLIND
United States2626 Posts
As for electric violins, the tone is definitely different and it's not exactly the best way to learn an instrument. You won't develop the ear necessary to play in tune because the sound goes through an amplifier rather than through the body and reverberations of the instrument itself. If you're a starting musician, you need an acoustic. If you come from a music background, then yeah an electric violin might work for you. Just buy a cheap factory made one with a shoulder rest, a new bow, rosin, and a working set of strings. Have a private teacher tune the instrument for you because it's gonna be out of tune for a long time (new set of strings need to be stretched to the correct length). | ||
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Doomblaze
United States1292 Posts
Skill is much more important than equipment. If a korean progamer uses a standard microsoft mouse and a chiclet keyboard, he will still own almost everybody, and if a bronze player uses a mechanical keyboard and a really nice mouse, he'll still be in bronze. Better instruments will sound better, certainly, but you will sound awful for the first few years of playing no matter what you get. Anything over ~$200 dollars should suffice, anything less than 150 and you run a large risk of having a faulty instrument, which nobody will be able to play properly. Try to find deals that come with a bow, case, and rosin, since you'll need those to play. Fine tuners are nice to have for beginners, since tuning the violin is an art, and some types of strings require fine tuners to tune properly. You'll need to buy a shoulder rest with it, shoulder rests are entirely preference, (my private teacher uses sponges, and hes one of the best teachers in michigan), just make sure its comfortable for you. If you want to buy a mute, heavy metal ones cut out almost all of the sound so you can practice at any hour of the night, but if they end up falling, they can damage your violin so you have to be careful. Try out different ones until you see what you like, I haven't experimented with anything other than cheap rubber ones, which cut out the resonance but not really the sound, so I don't know too much about mutes. | ||
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JFKWT
Singapore1442 Posts
On January 08 2012 18:07 13_Doomblaze_37 wrote: Adding and repeating what the above have said: Skill is much more important than equipment. If a korean progamer uses a standard microsoft mouse and a chiclet keyboard, he will still own almost everybody, and if a bronze player uses a mechanical keyboard and a really nice mouse, he'll still be in bronze. Better instruments will sound better, certainly, but you will sound awful for the first few years of playing no matter what you get. Anything over ~$200 dollars should suffice, anything less than 150 and you run a large risk of having a faulty instrument, which nobody will be able to play properly. Try to find deals that come with a bow, case, and rosin, since you'll need those to play. Fine tuners are nice to have for beginners, since tuning the violin is an art, and some types of strings require fine tuners to tune properly. You'll need to buy a shoulder rest with it, shoulder rests are entirely preference, (my private teacher uses sponges, and hes one of the best teachers in michigan), just make sure its comfortable for you. If you want to buy a mute, heavy metal ones cut out almost all of the sound so you can practice at any hour of the night, but if they end up falling, they can damage your violin so you have to be careful. Try out different ones until you see what you like, I haven't experimented with anything other than cheap rubber ones, which cut out the resonance but not really the sound, so I don't know too much about mutes. The fat rubber mutes are usually more than enough unless your neighbour has super hearing and is perenially sleep deprived. Make sure there are no cracks and the tuning pegs can turn smoothly, and make sure there are fine tuners (you'll need them until you get really good with hearing the intonation/pitch of the notes and can control tuning via the pegs) Also, try the violin and make sure the chin rest and shoulder rest is comfortable. Different people need vastly differently shaped rests sometimes. One of my students who borrowed his aunt's violin has a very awkward holding position because of the the chinrest. Good luck! | ||
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Cedstick
Canada3336 Posts
stalife, I really like the prospects of playing the violin, whereas the cello just seems... I dunno, less flexible, I guess. Nice instrument, but I feel it's not something that could carry a song as well as the violin. That, and I'm totally inspired by some recent musical listenings! Edit: oh, and this doesn't seem like a bad set-up for the price! http://www.long-mcquade.com/products/14651/Band/Orchestral_Strings_-_Instruments/Stentor/Student_I_Violin_Outfit_4_4.htm Good ol' Long & McQuade! | ||
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Azera
3800 Posts
On January 08 2012 18:07 13_Doomblaze_37 wrote: Adding and repeating what the above have said: Skill is much more important than equipment. If a korean progamer uses a standard microsoft mouse and a chiclet keyboard, he will still own almost everybody, and if a bronze player uses a mechanical keyboard and a really nice mouse, he'll still be in bronze. What's wrong with a chiclet keyboard? I use one =( | ||
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SCPlato
United States249 Posts
On January 08 2012 16:45 arcfyr wrote: Basically - don't buy expensive for your first violin. You'll sound awful for a long time - and trust me, a -lot- of people move on after the first few weeks to pursue the piano or something else. If you play for a year and find out you really like it, then look for something more expensive. Until then - as long as your violin isn't absolute garbage, your sound will definitely be limited more by your skill than the quality of your instrument. I don't really have anything to say about electric violins - I learned on a traditional (elitist: real) violin and I thus wouldn't recommend learning the instrument any other way. Feel free to PM if you want. This is really the only thing you need to know. I would recommend renting one if possible depending on where you live. I have played for 8 years now and I rented for the first 4 years. As someone also stated, a lot of people stop playing after a few months to a year to play a different instrument, so renting is a good option to make sure you actually like playing the violin and want to learn, instead of just the "idea" of bieng a violinist. I have played on an electric violin, I think if people want them its fine to get, but I am of the same school of thought as arcfyr. I learned on a real violin, and I think that is the best option for beginners because electric does sound different imo. | ||
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SCPlato
United States249 Posts
On January 08 2012 18:28 Cedstick wrote: Thanks for the info, arcfyr and imBLIND. Any idea what kind of rate I can expect from a teacher? I'm not exactly wealthy XD but some introductory lessons would definitely be a good idea. I just don't think I'd be able to keep it up with so many other expenses I have to worry about. stalife, I really like the prospects of playing the violin, whereas the cello just seems... I dunno, less flexible, I guess. Nice instrument, but I feel it's not something that could carry a song as well as the violin. That, and I'm totally inspired by some recent musical listenings! Edit: oh, and this doesn't seem like a bad set-up for the price! http://www.long-mcquade.com/products/14651/Band/Orchestral_Strings_-_Instruments/Stentor/Student_I_Violin_Outfit_4_4.htm Good ol' Long & McQuade! depends on who you are learning from. I have seen rates as low as 10 dollars and it just keeps going up from there. You are a beginner so you don't need a super expensive teacher, just make sure that they are experienced and have a very solid understanding of fundamentals of strings because you don't want to learn any bad (read: wrong) habits. tldr: for a beginner I have seen lessons from 10-40 dollars. | ||
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mmp
United States2130 Posts
You can also get additional/superior fine tuner pieces, mutes, etc. for a few bucks, so don't take this into account in your purchase. Your bow MUST be wooden, do not use a cheap fiberglass bow -- there is a huge difference in flexibility, and it is demoralizing to play with a cheap/synthetic bow. One good bow can last forever. Bows can be rehaired for a moderate fee, so you just want a solid but flexible bow with a comfortable handle/frog, and a reliable-looking tightener. Your new hair will need a bit of rosin on it before it's going to have any grip. You shouldn't need a rehairing for quite a while unless you mistreat the hair or break it frequently. Remember to loosen the bow when you're done playing, and keep it rosined from frog to tip. Don't touch the hair with sweaty/greasy fingers. I'd say for a starter: ~$200 for the default violin (with cheap parts), $40 for a new bow if the violin comes with a shitty one, and $20-30 for decent strings (the violin will most likely come with cheap strings on it). Keep your old strings around in case one breaks. In summary, there are two things that you cannot tolerate, whatever your price range: shitty bow (plastic/fiberglass <$10) and shitty strings ("super sensitive"). It is extremely difficult to produce a nice warm sound when your bow is a toy and your strings sound like scraping metal. Of course, as a starter, you're going to sound awful anyway -- but it is a lot easier to be confident when your tools are supporting you. | ||
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freelander
Hungary4707 Posts
i have a big family, and almost all of us played violin at one time or other. my two little sisters play very seriously, in orchestra etc. One of them got a 6k violin made for her recently. but when we started, all of us had rented instruments. we got them from our music school or from other sources. don't buy one just yet. | ||
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Cedstick
Canada3336 Posts
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SCPlato
United States249 Posts
On January 08 2012 22:10 Cedstick wrote: I've looked in to local rentals, and $12 a month seems to be the starting rate. Not bad, so I will definitely consider that as a primary option! Now I just have to find a teacher. Would be convenient if I could find a store with instructors charging decent rates, but I'm guessing at places like Long & McQuade it's a bit more expensive than someone you find on Craigslist not sure where you live or what options are available, but you could try contacting a orchestra teacher at any local school and ask them to get you in touch with some teachers. That is about all I can give for advice though, GL and hf playing the violin! | ||
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arcfyr
Canada121 Posts
I cannot believe I forgot about shoulder rests - I've been using this newfangled semi-bean-bag thing lately, but I'd say that it's a must-own to start with. Look at Kun shoulder rests for a good starting point. As far as teachers go, it's really hard to judge - just like looking for a tutor or anything else where anyone can be hired to do the job. You might end up with a brilliant teacher, or you might end up with someone that barely knows more than you and works at the studio because he's the owner's son (sadly, this situation happens). The best way to quantify a classical violinist's experience would probably be the RCM system (this is Canadian, the Americans have a ABRSM or something like that, same difference.) Most of the kids I grew up with that played the violin were pretty gung-ho about getting their RCM exams done - I think that it's a fairly universal standard for classical violinists in Canada to put a grade on their progress. It's a system where you test up to Grade 10, and ARCT levels after that. You could try asking for teacher credentials - I'd ask for a minimum of Grade 8 or so, perhaps. Just a thought. Good luck there, a good teacher is important. gl hf | ||
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The_Pacifist
United States540 Posts
You'll have to ask the store in question if they have a deal like this, though. It's not universal. EDIT: As in, it might just be "rent" and the instrument will still cost full price if you decide to buy it. | ||
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Dubzex
United States6994 Posts
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PenguinWithNuke
250 Posts
Basically what mmp said. Carbon fiber bows are for hamfisted two-year olds. | ||
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babylon
8765 Posts
 You'll need to buy all the rest of the parts too: the bow (get a cheap wooden one if you can), rosin (cheap), shoulder rest (don't get a spongy one, please), etc. If you're really gung-ho you might want to look into some quality strings too, but honestly, they only pay off on non-crappy violins, which you won't buy for a while.Once you get a bit more experienced and feel like sticking for it for a few years, you'll want to look at the wood, the shape, the sound/timbre/tone of the actual instrument, which means going into a shop and trying all of them out and possibly renting them for a week to see how they feel. And you'll want to get better strings (mix and match different brands, some brands produce very bright sounds that work well for A & E, but I prefer deeper Ds and Gs, for instance) and a decent bow, which can easily go into the hundreds depending (you'll want to try out balance and weight for bows, lots of people have multiple bows they use depending on whether they want a heavier or lighter sound). Very, very generally, the older the instrument, the better; older instruments tend to have better sound quality, and in the hands of a professional, they sound absolutely heavenly. Even if you only plan to play as a hobby, if you want to play for a longish time, I'd say it'd be a good idea to get a violin upwards of at least $1000. $2000 is when you start getting pretty decent instruments. Also, if you want to go even a little serious, consider getting a private teacher. Don't get a private teacher for the basics, ofc -- you can teach yourself that -- but once you get to the slightly-less-shitty stage, you'll want to start refining your technique, and the difference between trained and non-trained musicians is like the difference between night and day. | ||
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HardMacro
Canada361 Posts
I have a (quite wealthy) friend who wanted to learn the violin, so he bought a Laura VIGATO 2008 which cost him around ~$13000 at the time, practiced for 3 weeks, only to never touch the violin again. It's still sitting in his condo somewhere collecting dust mostly likely. Rent > Practice 1+ years > Buy cheapest acceptable beginner violin > Practice 1+ years > Think about a real purchase. | ||
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fatfail
United States386 Posts
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