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Well, I'm taking the GRE Tuesday afternoon (3pm or so). I posted this blog about it in November... I started studying about 4.5 weeks ago (before Thanksgiving), taking a brief 9 day interlude when my gf came to LA to visit me.
Over the past week I've put in 3 hours per day, last night I did about 5 hours, and today I studied almost 11 hours (rahh). The other three weeks I was putting in about 8-10 hours per week.
Here's the sort of problem I'm encountering... I've memorized (flash cards n shit) almost 300 vocab words, but on the verbal section there are still always a small handful of words I don't know that will cause me to get questions wrong. I feel like I'm destined to get 2 analogies wrong and 2 antonyms wrong at least on every test just because regardless of how many words I seem to learn, there are always a few that comes up on the test that I don't know.
Is it just a matter of luck? Should I pray that I just happen to not get words I don't know on Tuesday, does anyone have any ideas as to what I could possibly do to tighten it up I guess? I'm not having any trouble at all on reading comp or sentence completion (maybe in those 2 sections I'll only get 1 wrong in total)... but analogies and antonyms seem to trip me up regardless of how much I practice.
Sorta ditto for math. I'll maybe come across 1-2 problems at most on a test that I don't know how to do, but then I'll always get a small handful of problems wrong due to careless mistakes. That hasn't really changed either. I'll get a few wrong, then when I go review the answers I realize it was just something dumb (like forgetting to plug in a fraction to check if the two columns are equal in all cases, etc).
Basically, I feel like the only thing preventing me from performing how I want is something that continued studying can't really help - if that makes sense.... has anyone else ever dealt with this / remedied it?
To try and describe my problem, it's as if I don't have that precision and consistency. Even though I generally know all the material and all the words, I'm forever bound to make a few errors. Think I can fix that problem in the 1.5 days left until the test?
I have 2 practice exams left that I plan on doing tomorrow, then just a few review sections, and I dunno what else ....
Just felt like BLAWGIN IT UP
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It's more or less SAT version #2.
If you studied your butt off for SATs and got similar stuff wrong it's likely you'll get similar stuff wrong on GREs. It is a bit of the luck of teh draw in the words and analogies you get though... the more you know the easier it will be obviously. Don't overthink it too much. Get lots of quality sleep. etc. You know the drill.
I wouldn't worry about GREs too much becuase any graduate program is going to be moreso looking at your grades and letters of rec and essays.
As long as you have average or above average GRE for acceptance to any program you apply for you should be more than fine if your other stuff holds up well (essays, rec letters, college grades).
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i didn't study for the SAT for more than 30 minutes.
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I'm taking the GRE on Wednesday. I am pretty worried about the verbal. From what I've seen, there will be a lot of words I don't know. I'm also not sure how to feel about the adaptive testing method, and the fact that there are only 30 questions for verbal. Have you ever taken the test before? Apparently one has to spend more than an hour on the writing sections before seeing any multiple choice questions. Given that the writing scores are the least important.. this arrangement seems inconvenient to me.
I studied a lot more for the SAT and I did quite well on it. I definitely liked the opportunity to check/rethink all my answers in the last 10 or so minutes of allotted time. In the GRE however, there is no going back at all. It frustrates me that you can't take a realistic practice test because of some of these factors. I'm worried that my score will be terrible =/
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I took it and got a 1320, ideally I want 1500, but realistically aiming for at 1400 ...
Problems I had on the GRE (that I don't think I'll have now after practice) : being short on time. I get caught up in the fact that you can't skip questions and such, but my pacing has gotten a lot better (although it hasn't affected my accuracy at all apparently).
I like being able to jump around on tests, or go back and change answers, etc. Sorta an added twist that complicates the GRE.
I'm also more worried about verbal than math even though I'm technically better at verbal, but kljeglek!
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Words are pretty much luck. Math should be something you should be able to get 800 easy, or at least 780 which is one careless mistake. By this point in time you should have gotten a pretty good feel for the format and strategies for solving each verbal problem and have a good idea on how to solve any quant problem if you've taken a good number of practice tests.
In 1.5 days there's not much you can do besides do practice tests to get comfortable with the time constraints and format and cram a few more words that might show up on the test. Just fyi, percent matters just as if not more than score. I got 800 quant, 740 verbal when I took it (lucky with words) and 800 quant is 94 percentile while 740 verbal is 99 percentile. If you get a 660 its still in the 94 percentile for verbal while its 62 for quant.
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Verbal is pretty much luck if you don't know the words already.
As far as silly errors: as long as you can keep vaguely decent track of time (I actually couldn't), you shouldn't be averse to ignoring the fact that there is normally a "trick" and just do the fucking math properly. Write out what you're given, what you need to know, make it a formula, and just solve that shit.
But pay attention to the timer. Missed questions are penalized incredibly heavily.
[edit] Also the adaptive testing method, from a psychometric perspective, is fucking stupid when you look at its performance over only an individual test. Over thousands of tests it will outperform written tests in terms of accuracy/time required, but for certain individuals (namely, people who are prone to careless errors sometimes) it will generate wildly variant scores because it simply doesn't have the number of questions it would need to judge their skill accurately.
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Braavos36372 Posts
On December 27 2010 17:11 Xeris wrote:
Sorta ditto for math. I'll maybe come across 1-2 problems at most on a test that I don't know how to do, but then I'll always get a small handful of problems wrong due to careless mistakes. That hasn't really changed either. I'll get a few wrong, then when I go review the answers I realize it was just something dumb (like forgetting to plug in a fraction to check if the two columns are equal in all cases, etc).
Basically, I feel like the only thing preventing me from performing how I want is something that continued studying can't really help - if that makes sense.... has anyone else ever dealt with this / remedied it?
To try and describe my problem, it's as if I don't have that precision and consistency. Even though I generally know all the material and all the words, I'm forever bound to make a few errors. Think I can fix that problem in the 1.5 days left until the test?
It's not really "something dumb" when you get stuff wrong on the GRE math section because avoiding careless mistakes is exactly what it's testing. None of the problems are particularly difficult, you just have to be focused and consistent. That's what it's testing you. If you get stuff wrong because you overlooked something, that's not an anomaly, you're just not as good as you want to be at the test.
A few people can just perfect the math section always, their brains are wired like this. For us regular people, there's really no way to remedy this except to practice until you get everything right. Practice, practice, and more practice. Practice until you can do all the GRE type math questions in your sleep. That way you will never make careless mistakes.
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When the universe of test material is so large, I don't think you can cram it all in shortly before the exam -- a good exam is resistant to hard cramming because there is so much to understand.
I haven't taken the GREs - probably will in the future (senior in college but not going for grad school now). Skimming through a list of GRE-level vocab, I think I know lots of them and recognize some others, but it is primarily from memory of experienced literature and conversations that I can confidently recall the meaning of a word. Looking back at SAT study, I have since forgotten many of the words that I crammed and retained the ones that appeared in candid experience. The only tough words that I know from the list are ones that I've picked up listening and reading news, politics, philosophy, debate, etc.: rarely from a personal conversation but definitely a routine experience nonetheless. You cannot cram for that kind of knowledge, and flash cards especially have been shown to be good in the short run but retain poorly in the long run.
As for last second study, I think just about every clinical study on memory and performance says that if you don't have it in your head 24 hours before the exam, you're probably not going to be able to recall it anyway (at least not if the exam is tough). Also consider that another few hours is a drop in the bucket considering how much time you've already spent. The additional hours of study aren't worth as much as a good night's sleep and a good breakfast.
If you're not recalling information that you think you know, then it at least means that the knowledge isn't second nature to you. Learning knowledge involves a commitment from tenuous short-term memory to long-term memory and this is a physical transfiguration that is best made by experience and conceptualization.
One of the reasons why the multiple-choice format is controversial is that it clues tenuous understanding. So if you have forgotten a word's definition but have an idea of how it is used you won't be totally lost, but it doesn't discriminate between weak understanding and strong understanding as some "open-ended" exam formats might. And it rewards cramming since you can get smart shortly before the exam and forget everything years later.
If you're looking for an alternative way to approach studying or answering, maybe try just picking up a wordy piece of classic literature from Project Gutenberg and try to paint a larger cognitive picture of how words might appear.
For math, I think you just gotta go back and study this stuff in its entirety because if you don't know your shit then you just don't know your shit, and they can choose any little fact out of an entire curriculum to quiz you on (although most of the advanced math questions appear to be conceptual in nature based on an understanding of the symbols and terminology). I just read through an 08-09 math section and it looks pretty straightforward (I'm secure with my linear algebra) but there are definitely a few terminology-based questions that I could look up in hindsight. Really, only taking more math classes would be the most efficient way to prepare for the unexpected. I've taken a fair share of college level math so most of these questions have pretty "intuitive" answers to me, or I at least know how I would approach them. Others, I just don't know, and I know Wikipedia isn't going to explain it comprehensively enough.
In response to your worry about stupid mistakes... I don't entirely buy that for the math section at least. From what I read most of the questions appear to be more about seeing the underlying concept and translating that into a straightforward answer (or easily discarding the wrong solutions). If you're off by a coefficient on a solution then it could mean that you slogged through the math mechanically and got a mistake that they bait you with in one of the wrong solutions -- but the correct solution might have been more easily discovered by a quicker or more thorough grasp on the background material. Sometimes knowing side facts can help you quickly reduce the problem down to something simpler. Other times a good strategy is to lay down some hard facts you are certain of that you can use as constraints to knock out wrong answers.
At this point you've already worked so hard, just rest, get good sleep and breakfast, and just warm your brain up before the exam with a couple of thinking problems but don't expect to conceptualize new information overnight. Finally, don't stress about the effort you're putting in now. Your success on this kind of an exam is mostly determined by how you've spent your last ~4 years, not what you've done in the last couple of months.
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From what grad students I've talked to have told me - the GRE is basically a math test that happens to have vocab on it. Don't miss anything on the math, don't worry about the vocab. Nobody does well on the english sections.
Honestly, I don't think there's any point in worrying about it. Either you know stuff or you don't and no amount of cramming is going to change that. Just have a good mindset going into the test and focus on the math. The GRE is about as important as the SAT, which is to say, not very as long as you don't completely fail on it.
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My only advice is to look online for leaked questions... GRE is an ability test so there is probably very little you can do in two days
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On December 27 2010 20:15 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2010 17:11 Xeris wrote:
Sorta ditto for math. I'll maybe come across 1-2 problems at most on a test that I don't know how to do, but then I'll always get a small handful of problems wrong due to careless mistakes. That hasn't really changed either. I'll get a few wrong, then when I go review the answers I realize it was just something dumb (like forgetting to plug in a fraction to check if the two columns are equal in all cases, etc).
Basically, I feel like the only thing preventing me from performing how I want is something that continued studying can't really help - if that makes sense.... has anyone else ever dealt with this / remedied it?
To try and describe my problem, it's as if I don't have that precision and consistency. Even though I generally know all the material and all the words, I'm forever bound to make a few errors. Think I can fix that problem in the 1.5 days left until the test? It's not really "something dumb" when you get stuff wrong on the GRE math section because avoiding careless mistakes is exactly what it's testing. None of the problems are particularly difficult, you just have to be focused and consistent. That's what it's testing you. If you get stuff wrong because you overlooked something, that's not an anomaly, you're just not as good as you want to be at the test. A few people can just perfect the math section always, their brains are wired like this. For us regular people, there's really no way to remedy this except to practice until you get everything right. Practice, practice, and more practice. Practice until you can do all the GRE type math questions in your sleep. That way you will never make careless mistakes.
Yea, my biggest problem is that consistency T__T
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gl xeris!
I think there's a magical state of mind where you can start answering verbal questions completely accurately...at least, it happened to me after I did about 8 practice tests (SATs, though, not GRE  ) and could see the basic pattern behind how test-writers write their multiple choice answers. Maybe if you spend a little bit of time looking at real tests and finding the pattern, it'll help you bypass some of the verbal?
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On December 28 2010 03:07 hazelynut wrote:gl xeris! I think there's a magical state of mind where you can start answering verbal questions completely accurately...at least, it happened to me after I did about 8 practice tests (SATs, though, not GRE ) and could see the basic pattern behind how test-writers write their multiple choice answers. Maybe if you spend a little bit of time looking at real tests and finding the pattern, it'll help you bypass some of the verbal?
I've figured out reading comp and sentence completion totally, and have a MUCH better feel for analogies, but still manage to get 1-2 wrong somehow grahhh!
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And then there's the people like me that studied for a grand total of 0 minutes, and got a 2320 (on a 2400 scale). To be honest half of what they test, and the way the test is designed, is if you can find the patterns. The math section is obviously a huge example of that, as even the most complex of problems they can give you can logic your way through. As for verbal, and "crazy words", the biggest help is learning prefixes and affixes. Paying attention to those takes you so far with big words. At no point will you be asked something you need a specific formula for, or a word that can't be broken down.
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How does the SAT compare to the GRE? I just finished taking the SAT, and I don't want to restress about the GRE when I'm in college.
College sounds scary ;;
Edit: well, obviously I'm going to HAVE to restress about the GRE because I have to take it :'<
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I feel like the vocabulary in the GRE is much more difficult than it was on the SAT, but that's my opinion. The math is slightly more difficult - actually I guess the GRE is just trickier than the SAT imo, I did pretty well on the SAT without any studying, but have struggled with GRE stuff a bit oo~
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Personally if I were looking at the GRE as an evaluator, I'd look at the writing section more. Being able to cohesively identify holes in arguments and come up with your own arguments in a set time limit and explain them clearly is a very important asset.
Honestly, I don't see why something more like the LSAT is used widely. Logical reasoning is critical to every field, whereas something like... vocabulary... seems pointless to test, especially under uncontrolled conditions (being able to study however long you want for it).
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Yeh I have no idea, speaking of which... another random thing that maybe others will find helpful... I've looked at a variety of GRE practice books and such
McPeterson's (practice exams)
Bigbook (verbal practice)
McGraw Hill (practice exams)
Princeton Review
Kaplan
I've found that the Princeton Review & Kaplan are more difficult than the actual GRE, especially Princeton review. The vocab they test in their practice problems and exams are much more advanced than anything I encountered on the actual exam (the hardest word I got on the real GRE was supercilious) ...
The real GRE tends to like to test words that you may be familiar with, but can't precisely define (from my experience), while Princeton review just likes to throw out hardass words.
The "Bigbook" verbal sections were the most comparable to the actual GRE, and McPeterson's was pretty good as well (but slightly more difficult). McGraw Hill's exams seem to be a bit easier than the real GRE.
Another tip/thing ... if you have a book with a bunch of practice exams, I've noticed that they make the last practice exam the easiest, which is a clever strategy so you end up getting a higher score than you did on the first one (which was more difficult) and feel as if the book actually helped (which it may or may not have).
So if you're planning on getting those books with like 4-6 practice exams, I'd work backwards and do the last test first...
That's all I got now, time for moar study
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On December 28 2010 06:02 Z3kk wrote:
How does the SAT compare to the GRE? I just finished taking the SAT, and I don't want to restress about the GRE when I'm in college.
College sounds scary ;;
Edit: well, obviously I'm going to HAVE to restress about the GRE because I have to take it :'<
I did the same on them with approximately the same amount of studying averaging around 1350-1400 usually getting 750-800 math, and 600-650 verbal.
Most grad programs you only need 1200 or better to be fine. they just want to know if you're above like 550 or 600 on each or whatever 80 or 90th percentile is. It's no big deal IMO which is why I didn't put a lot of time into it when applying for grad program I'm in.
Again, grades, rec letters, essays, and interviews are waaaaaaay more important as long as you get average or above average for GRE that they put on the website as the average to get into the program.
However, on the flipside a good GRE can help make up for deficiencies elsewhere, but don't expect it to be a world beater. For example, comparable to like 38+ MCAT when average to get in for med school is 31, but that won't make up for < 3.00 GPA
Now, if you did crappy on SAT then you better start putting in a lot more time....
The writing is a big thing thing you need to game but youc an structure the essay much like the normal 5 paragraph essay they told you to write in high school with the intro + 2-3 body paragraphs + conclusion.
Xeris,
if you're getting 1320 just focus on maxing out the math and not making silly mistakes and 1400 should be fairly easy to get (as long as you're not already getting like 800/520 or something like that.... much easier if it's like 700/620 just max out the math portion). That's the biggest thing. Also, for the words just learn more prefixes and suffixes like the other dude said... you can generally guess your way to a better score if you're a bit lucky but getting words you know is a big thing.
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ETS (the company that administrates the GRE) has an exclusive set of study materials available here: http://www.ets.org/gre/general/prepare. The GRE was harder than the SAT in terms of math or verbal; of course, it's tailored for graduate-seeking students, not undergraduates. However, the crutch with the test isn't so much the problems, as is the stress of the individual.
The highest challenge is overcoming your personal anxiety. For example, the verbal section routinely tests on your pre-existing knowledge, meaning you will have a hard time "ramping" up your proficiency for the test. The math portion entirely consists of a MA153/154 class in college, without the advanced graphing or any parts that especially need a calculator (since you can only use pencil and paper).
For math I would study a few things:
All algebraic properties
Properties of fractions, ratios, powers, roots and square roots
Geometrical equations for triangles, circles, rectangles and other stuff like three-dimensional objects
Decimals
Quantities, less or more than, types of numbers (irrational, rational etc)
Negative numbers: add, subtract, multiply, divide, etc.
Basic (y=mx+b) line equations
Properties of perpendicular lines
Percentages
For verbal:
All you can study is *approved* GRE vocabulary lists
Make sure you know how to write a solid argumentative essay, where you either agree, disagree or do both with contemporary issues... (Group A wants to build a building, but Group B disagrees, here are some facts... make a case on why or why not you would agree to build there or not) or (Why do you think it's important to conserve energy and tighten down on resources? Why is it important to be a hero?) Usually they like to insert some silly little generalized statement like the ones above and have you write about it as persuasively as you can (yeah I know).
GRE vocab use in reading comprehension, antonyms, synonyms and analogies
That's all I have of which I can remember.
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btw, what program are you applying to?
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My top choice is Georgetown MSFS , secondary would be SAIS , third would be McGill , fourth Tufts MALD, then either American / George Washington .
I really want to go to DC (because its my favorite city, since I worked at a think tank there last year I have wanted to move back... my gf also lives in DC), but I also love Montreal (<3 TT1 and Sami) and McGill is a great school. Also, my favorite scholar (my academic idol I guess you could say) is a professor at Tufts, and after meeting him and chatting with him last year I've wanted to go to Tufts (Vali Nasr is his name).
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Just took a practice test , 1450 (but I really feel like the McGraw Hill tests are too easy, but maybe I'm just paranoid?). Here's an example of silly mistakes that I make ...
There were 2 graphs and I had to calculate percent increase from 1 to the other... Numbers were
7% of 135 (year A), and ... 13% of 210 (year B)
so I calculated, got 9.45 for year A , year B should have been.. 27.3 , but I made a dumb arithmetic mistake, and ended up with 23.3 (forgot that 3x2 = 6 , and I wrote down a 3, gg) ... so I ended up with the wrong % and picked the wrong answer.
GRAHHH! I missed 3 math ones on this, and all 3 of my wrong answers were equally careless.
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Braavos36372 Posts
Georgetown MSFS looks pretty good for you, 1300-1350 GRE and 25% admission rate is all very doable. If you get 1400 you should be pretty easily in if you had good GPA from undergrad or w/e.
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That's what I'm hoping.. I got a 3.7 at UCSD and I had a 3.4 at CC (I spent 1 year at CC and transferred to UCSD). I'm just hoping to get 1400 or slightly higher to solidify my chances because that's where I really want to go.
SAIS and McGill are probably a bit of a reach, but AU and GWU are probably sure bets.
I'm gonna take 1 more practice test tonight and 1 in the mornning (test at 4pm tomorrow) @_@!
rahhhhhhhhh
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I feel if you study that much you should be able to get 800 on Q pretty easily, but I think V is a pretty big crapshoot with a ton of variance. I just took the GRE for the second time like 3 weeks ago or so. First time got 1290 (780Q 510V). Second time I got 1410 (800Q 610V), I don't think my vocab improved at all, I'm pretty sure I just got really lucky.
gl
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just got 1320 on princeton review practice exam (590Q 730V) ~_~
lul , I SEEM TO HAVE THE OPPOSITE PROBLEMMM T__T ;; stupid math mistakes.
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On December 28 2010 09:42 Xeris wrote:
My top choice is Georgetown MSFS , secondary would be SAIS , third would be McGill , fourth Tufts MALD, then either American / George Washington .
I really want to go to DC (because its my favorite city, since I worked at a think tank there last year I have wanted to move back... my gf also lives in DC), but I also love Montreal (<3 TT1 and Sami) and McGill is a great school. Also, my favorite scholar (my academic idol I guess you could say) is a professor at Tufts, and after meeting him and chatting with him last year I've wanted to go to Tufts (Vali Nasr is his name).
McGill? I am pretty sure they don't care about your GRE score.
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Make sure to pace yourself during the exam, if it takes you a little longer on 1 problem it's probably fine because you'll probably plow through 5-6 of the early ones in no time
For each of my sections I finished more than 20 minutes early, didn't end up mattering for math but I probably should have spent more time on the verbal section lol
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Yeh timing isn't a huge problem for me lately... I usually find myself with 8-10 minutes left. If I don't make silly errors I'll be a baller, if not... mediocrity in standardized testing awaits.
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Wooo ~~~
GRE in 1 hour, lets dooo it!!!
Hoping for 1400+ , I'll prolly just do the same lul, BUT HERE GOES NOTHIN~
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United States2095 Posts
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Hahahah I actually did worse! So kool :D
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Man, I put like 0 effort into GRE the first time, and quite a bit this time and did worse. Conclusion ... never study? Either that or I'm just bad at standardized tests, period. ! oh well, I'm done!
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On December 29 2010 12:43 Xeris wrote:
Man, I put like 0 effort into GRE the first time, and quite a bit this time and did worse. Conclusion ... never study? Either that or I'm just bad at standardized tests, period. ! oh well, I'm done!
These tests are designed such that studying actually shouldn't make a damn bit of difference. I didn't study for the SAT and I'm not going to for the GRE.
In fact in general, I've found very little correlation between how much I study for something and how well I do. My last final this past semester I got an A on, but it was the final I did the least preparation for of my engineering finals.
I wouldn't worry about GREs too much anyways. Standardized testing means very little in the end since small mistakes lead to huge variance.
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Braavos36372 Posts
What did you get the first time and what did you get this time?
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Aww D: I thought you were kidding in your email. How many times can you take the GRE, and is it composite score like SAT? I'm probably going to take it this summer if you're not in DC working/studying already by then.
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1320 --> 1280 .
My math stayed the same but verbal dropped 20 points. Which is actually funny because I didn't 'study' math, aside from doing problems on my practice exams, but I put a ton of effort into verbal (memorized 300 words, etc)... @_@! S'all good.
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Hmm, incontrovertible evidence that giving a damn is a waste of time. :p
Don't worry about it dude, s'all good.
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Braavos36372 Posts
On December 30 2010 02:56 Xeris wrote:
1320 --> 1280 .
My math stayed the same but verbal dropped 20 points. Which is actually funny because I didn't 'study' math, aside from doing problems on my practice exams, but I put a ton of effort into verbal (memorized 300 words, etc)... @_@! S'all good.
do you have test nerves or something? because if you score 1400+ on your practice tests you shouldn't be getting that low. maybe next time you should just do more under real test conditions? try to simulate them exactly.
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oftentimes I have test anxiety (like, I actually had a panic attack in the middle of the LSAT) , but I felt relatively calm and cool...
I know on math for example, there was 1 problem that I picked an answer then IMMEDIATELY after I clicked 'submit' realized that it was a different answer, and on the final question, my time expired as I was about to select the answer - so that's 2 questions that I really should have gotten right, but didn't.
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Who can help me overcome GRE test stress I took GRE paper based in November. It seemed to me that it was far more difficult than GRE CAT. Math section had 60 questions in 60 minutes and Verbal section had 74 questions in 60 minutes, which drove me completely crazy. Of course, I could not take a good result at that time so next week I am taking the GRE CAT.
Now, I have a questio: I am an english major, what the average points I shall take in Math section. I know it is easy, but time pressure forces you to make stupid mistakes.
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I personally dislike the GRE because any test you can study for isn't a true test of your intellect. I took the GRE once without studying and got 1100, I studied for 2 and a half weeks for the second try and got just over 1400. The GRE offers an online math review, I just went over that review it was about 60 pages long nbd. Then I just memorized a princeton vocabulary review book (30 pages / day).
Anyway, good luck man... I'm sure it will be fine.
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EPT
