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On October 05 2010 00:19 Lea wrote:Show nested quote +On August 07 2010 19:03 Klockan3 wrote:
Why is it considered rude by starcraft players to say gg first when you win? It's bad manners. Of course it was a good game for you BECAUSE YOU WON. No need to rub it in to the loser. Just be happy that you won but keep it to yourself. People who just killed me and gg piss me off to no end. I just did this 1v1 against a terran who marine rushed me, and then as he realized I was losing, he says gg (I had to pull off my probes to fight him and but he killed them, and it was so early in the game I could only be on one base). Saying gg in this context as the winner, only implies one thing, especially when the opponent stands little to no chance of winning at all: "haha you lost you sucker". I'm the one supposed to say gg, not them, because when I say gg as the loser, I show respect that they won over me. Then give me the same courtesy in turn by not saying gg. Bad sportsmanship.
Actually, it probably means just that, good game. I'm quite sure that people would say 'haha you lost faggot' if that's what they were going for. No one enjoys playing an idiot who is still in the game, battling with nothing but probes and hiding shit. Get out when you lose.
Imagine a football tourney and then the winners of the tourney says something like "haha you lost you suckers" to the losing team. It's about the same deal saying gg as a winner in SC2, especially when the opponent stood little to no chance of winning that game. The ONLY exception where I think saying gg as a winner is ok is if the game is very long, very even and both players do their best, because then it was a TRULY good game.
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Actually, no it's not at all. You'd say haha you lost instead of gg....
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Actually, it probably means just that, good game. I'm quite sure that people would say 'haha you lost faggot' if that's what they were going for. No one enjoys playing an idiot who is still in the game, battling with nothing but probes and hiding shit. Get out when you lose.
Did I ever say I did that? I pulled off my probes on my mineral line to kill his marines, I had not proxy'd a single pylon outside my base because the game was so early I had just researched warpgates! It was obvious that when I was forced to pull off my probes, I had lost the game, and I lost it badly. I had no chance of winning because I didn't 4gate, I did 1gate robo. I had 1 sentry and 2 stalkers up, and he had like 10+ marines.
He roflstomped me because I failed to anticipate a marine rush, and then he gg's. How am I to not take this any other way than offensive? If he was intending to say, "better luck next time, man" then why not type it out? I had a zerg player giving me the courtesy that I played well when I fended off his 6pool and then killed him back. That's good manners.
Actually, no it's not at all. You'd say haha you lost instead of gg....
Contexts, implied meanings. You can say a lot of things with one word, like "idiot". What gg ultimately does is that you take away the will from the winner to decide when the game is over. You decide it for them. And it thus comes off as highly arrogant when you are clearly winning the game.
I found it incredibly tasteless when I did a random 3v3 and we decided to rush, and then I see my team mates gg'ing despite that the opposing team stood little to no chance, just when they had just a few buildings left. Why they did do it? It wasn't a good game. It was if anything one-sided. And it's when people gg during these contexts that makes me angry, because it's bad sportsmanship at that point. It's not a good game when you rushed and the opponent failed to defend, making the battle one-sided. A good game is a good game when both opponents fought well to their best abilities and the outcome of the game is highly uncertain. Not when you won, because obviously, any game when you win is inherently a good game TO YOU.
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But as I said, Starcraft is the only game were I have seen that saying gg as the winner is offensive, in other games it is standard curtsey to say gg at the end of the game even if you win. GG means "Good game", everything else is just in your head. If a guy in a soccer game shouted "Good game!" I don't think that anyone would see him as bm.
People do that in sports all the time, after each game the players shake hands and say "good game", it is always like that, it doesn't matter who won or if it actually were a good game, you always say that. The winner doesn't wait for the loser to say it first or avoid saying it if he thinks it would hurt the loser or whatever, it is always said.
So if you come from a real life sport environment and learns that "gg" means "good game" it is just natural to always say it at the end of the game.
"Furthermore, it doesn't take that much brain power to figure out what the acroym could possibly stand for, like hfgl."
Yeah, it stands for "good game" and nothing else. To you it might stand for "Please leave, fucker", but that is just your interpretation of the "gg".
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It is definitely BM, not sure why anyone would say otherwise. It's up to your opponent to forfeit the game when they are ready. You can tell that anyone who offensive GG's certainly isn't doing it in a respectful manner anyway. It really annoys me when people do it.
On October 05 2010 00:52 Klockan3 wrote:
But as I said, Starcraft is the only game were I have seen that saying gg as the winner is offensive, in other games it is standard curtsey to say gg at the end of the game even if you win. GG means "Good game", everything else is just in your head. If a guy in a soccer game shouted "Good game!" I don't think that anyone would see him as bm.
People do that in sports all the time, after each game the players shake hands and say "good game", it is always like that, it doesn't matter who won or if it actually were a good game, you always say that. The winner doesn't wait for the loser to say it first or avoid saying it if he thinks it would hurt the loser or whatever, it is always said.
So if you come from a real life sport environment and learns that "gg" means "good game" it is just natural to always say it at the end of the game.
"Furthermore, it doesn't take that much brain power to figure out what the acroym could possibly stand for, like hfgl."
Yeah, it stands for "good game" and nothing else. To you it might stand for "Please leave, fucker", but that is just your interpretation of the "gg".
It's fine to say it once your opponent has given up. You never try and shake hands or insist you've already won before the game is over in any sport or game. Doing beforehand when you are winning or especially when you did some lame rush is just clearly deliberately BM. Do you seriously think when someone offensive GG's you they are just trying to genuinely say its a good game?
Example: You are not going to GG before kill limit is actually reached in Quake, you arn't going to GG when its 85 minutes into a game of FIFA and its 4-0. It's just plain rude.
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On October 05 2010 00:52 infinity2k9 wrote:
It's fine to say it once your opponent has given up. You never try and shake hands or insist you've already won before the game is over in any sport or game. Doing beforehand when you are winning or especially when you did some lame rush is just clearly deliberately BM. Do you seriously think when someone offensive GG's you they are just trying to genuinely say its a good game?
Example: You are not going to GG before kill limit is actually reached in Quake, you arn't going to GG when its 85 minutes into a game of FIFA and its 4-0. It's just plain rude.
No, of course not, but the situations in an RTS are usually a lot less remediable compared to FPS and in an RTS it is a huge hassle to speak to people after they have left so you say GG when you think that it is impossible for your opponent to win.
Also you would have a lot less frustration playing online if you imagined that everyone saying "gg" was doing so with good intentions even if some of them actually were rude as long as you think that they are not then you are fine. And If someone is actually BM then he would do more than just gg first as the winner so I think that in most of the cases a plain gg first as winner is mostly just a nicety from him but of course not always.
On October 05 2010 00:52 infinity2k9 wrote:
You can tell that anyone who offensive GG's certainly isn't doing it in a respectful manner anyway.
How in hell do you do that, are you psychic or something? GG is just two letters...
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I know that because i've been in games, seen people offensive gg in team games, had it done to me etc and when you talk to them they are never doing it in a respectful way because any respectful player actually waits till you gg. I think you're being naive if you think anyone is genuine about it. You can see right in this thread people saying they do it solely to be BM. It's considered BM in SC no doubt about it, i remember when IdrA did it (acting like a dick like usual) in a casted game and the commentators mentioned it as definitely being bad mannered. Maybe it's different elsewhere but in SC it's BM, and if you want to be a well mannered player then you won't do it, simple as that.
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Its BM to say GG first when you're winning. I also hate teammate that says GG to our opponents when we're owning them in team game.
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On October 05 2010 00:48 Lea wrote:
I found it incredibly tasteless when I did a random 3v3 and we decided to rush, and then I see my team mates gg'ing despite that the opposing team stood little to no chance, just when they had just a few buildings left.
quit instead of sitting there, watching your dick get kicked in and you won't have to hear people ruin your day by saying 'gg'
if someone's that dumb that they don't leave when they are dead in the water, they deserve it every time
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i didnt read the whole thread but there was a match where Idra in Bw did this offensive GG as he made his final push. he was pushing against a protoss it was pvt at the time..
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What in the hell is this discussion still around for?
The fact of the matter is that gg, the old acronym meaning good game, now has a different connotation due to the context in which it's most commonly used. Players most commonly say gg in situations where they're surrendering and as such, the acronym itself has become associated with giving in and defeat. In no way does GG still mean "good game" and "good game" alone as the letters would imply.
While there are many reasons why an offensive gg would irritate someone, most of those reasons stem from the fact that players don't like to feel like they're out of control. To the very end, players would rather have the option of surrendering (or rage quitting). I know that personally as my base is getting rolled after a long game, sometimes I'll close my eyes and take a couple of deep breaths to prep me for the next game.
You simply cannot approach an emotional problem (people getting offended) in a logical manner (hurr durr good game just means good game, you're stupid if you think otherwise).
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I will only offensively gg in 2 situations:
1) My opponent has been BMing me
2) They stay in the game WAYYYYYY too long (like they have no army and no economy and I'm destroying their base and they still refuse to leave)
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Seems like people assume offensive GGers are trying to be BM, but for alot of offensive ggers they probably just aren't aware that its considered BM. When I first started playing SC2 i just knew that gg meant good game and that you are supposed to say it at the end of the game, so thats what i did, win or lose. I offensive gg'd but thats just because i thought you were expected to when the game is clearly over. But then i saw a thread like this on TL and stopped offensive gg'ing.
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I offensive GG when I know I've clearly won the game, and the opponent is refusing to leave. It's rude to say GG? Well, it's also rude to waste my time. And the usual result is them saying something along the lines of "fuck you BM" and then leaving. Mission accomplished.
Note that the circumstances in which I do this involve me having vision of pretty much the whole map, and having them contained, and building 20 engineering bays to float them into their base to get them to take a hint. Sorry, but if you haven't left at that point, you are displaying bad manners.
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You mean you wish to surrender to me? Very well, I accept.
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On October 05 2010 01:05 Klockan3 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2010 00:52 infinity2k9 wrote:
It's fine to say it once your opponent has given up. You never try and shake hands or insist you've already won before the game is over in any sport or game. Doing beforehand when you are winning or especially when you did some lame rush is just clearly deliberately BM. Do you seriously think when someone offensive GG's you they are just trying to genuinely say its a good game?
Example: You are not going to GG before kill limit is actually reached in Quake, you arn't going to GG when its 85 minutes into a game of FIFA and its 4-0. It's just plain rude. No, of course not, but the situations in an RTS are usually a lot less remediable compared to FPS and in an RTS it is a huge hassle to speak to people after they have left so you say GG when you think that it is impossible for your opponent to win. Also you would have a lot less frustration playing online if you imagined that everyone saying "gg" was doing so with good intentions even if some of them actually were rude as long as you think that they are not then you are fine. And If someone is actually BM then he would do more than just gg first as the winner so I think that in most of the cases a plain gg first as winner is mostly just a nicety from him but of course not always. Show nested quote +On October 05 2010 00:52 infinity2k9 wrote:
You can tell that anyone who offensive GG's certainly isn't doing it in a respectful manner anyway. How in hell do you do that, are you psychic or something? GG is just two letters...
Yeah, so you wait until the game is declared over (it's not over until either one player resigns or you destroy all his buildings), and then say your thing. It's a well-established custom that a losing player saying gg means "I resign" so therefore, after he makes his resignation (combined with his good game) it's time to respond with your good game because now one of the game ending conditions is met. Name me one competitive activity where it's customary for a winning team to say "It was a good game." before it's declared over.
Also it's not that hard or much of a hassle to whisper someone gg through match history if you are so concerned with not getting a chance to.
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I get annoyed when people offensive GG simply because half the time, I'm not - or I don't feel like I'm 100% out yet.
Sometimes I'll get guys who take out my nat and they're like GG and they haven't even come near my ramp...half the time I've got a ball of reinforcements + bunker or whatever where I could potentially hold off the attack and make a counter. Or maybe not. But if I don't feel like it's time for the game to be over, it isn't. Granted, I don't run around with one worker and be all IM STILL IN IT I HAVE 500 MIN.
I dunno. I think it's always going be a 50/50 controversy whether it's right or wrong. It's a personal thing.
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On August 08 2010 11:25 itzbrandnew wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I offensive gg when the other person qualifies for either of the following...
1) Lifts base to prolong the loss
2) Talks shit
pretty much this, sometimes both parties talked shit and this is just mockery and fun, but in general I hate offensive gg
but: lifting your base and stuff like that is just ridiculus
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I once thought I was going to lose in a zvt (bw) when my main force got wiped out by ultras on python an my third was very open to attacks. I typed in gg and he acknowledged, but shortly after I decided to continue and play on and see how it works out. I managed to defend my third and destroy his base for the win. Hahaha he was obviously mad and confused at the end.
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What annoys me about the negativity in an offensive gg is that I feel like there's no way to compliment an opponent who played well, but lost. Most people gg and then leave instantly - leaving no time to say gg back or wp or whatever.
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EPT
