EPTCultured Mini Mafia
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gumshoe
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 00:04 suki wrote: I dislike Palmar so much that I will WotC him out of games that he's not even in. Also stop calling me suko it's annoying How about zuko? | ||
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gumshoe
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gumshoe
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If Suki isn't scum she's either a) nervous, or b) baiting. Suki, which explanation do you prefer? | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 10:01 suki wrote: lol what. ##vote Mocsta I never said anything you were doing so far was scummy, so who is twisting whose words? You, on the other hand, seem really intent on twisting the things I say to be scummy. Also I'm Harry Potter, of course I'm in the game. (and for the record I'm a different Harry Potter than the game rayn linked). It's kinda funny that this sentence is in the same post in which you vote for him, so I take it your voting for him purely for twisting your words, ignoring for a moment wether or not he is doing that (not sure if he is, because I'm seeing alot of the stuff hes pointing out) do you think town is incapable of doing that? More importantly, do you think Moc's actions hurting the thread right now or just you? | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 10:22 WaveofShadow wrote: Just establishing my dominance, honey. Yes gumshoe's post was reasonable, but also easy. It doesn't say a thing to me about yours or his alignment. I was curious as to whether or not he'd actually be playing this game as I'm used to him either playing his heart out, or lurking like crazy. That depends entirely on you people : P yall have to be worth my time. Also my lurking has nothing to do with my alignment, I lurk and play as scum or town, you asking wether or not I will adds nothing to the great discussion. | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 10:10 geript wrote: Hotdog. Now I really want to lynch gumshoe. I just want to point out that whatever this guy says my alignment is, it's usually the opposite : P | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 10:16 Toadesstern wrote: actually screw what I just said, this trolling shit sucks so let's get down to serious business, we have something to talk about and everyone's ignoring it. WoS/Holy I know you to are fairly smart, smart enough to answer the following question. What do you make of the conversation between Rayn, geript and me? I want to get some input on that from some more people. Should help me figure out if you guys are reading I feel it's important to note that Toads just come off a pretty brutal loss in default, he was outed as the mafia godfather night 1 and I cant help but suspect that either way, that blow will influence his play. The tone switch in this post is noteworthy, he played out the start pretty lightly (in contrast to default where he was somewhat tense throughout) and he feels the need to 'snap' out of it. Feels slightly odd, like hes trying to let us know that hes acting natural, but is intent on winning. | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 10:35 suki wrote: @gumshoe Any reads you'd like to share yet? I'm reading, dont bug me. | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 11:32 WaveofShadow wrote: Wormhole. Gumshoe, let's get a read from you on someone that doesn't depend mostly/solely on meta. , if I see something scummy I will let you know. I have pointed out a few things that have intrigued me because I felt they would generate discussion, and kept back a few others because it is early in the game and I rather see them unfold on there own. If your worried about contribution from me, don't be, I love posting try hard cases when I have them( and I will have them, I assure you that) even as scum. I will contribute when I have something to contribute. I am not going to call you out as scum just because your pressuring me ( not a bad thing on in of itself) but understand that rushing me to produce something that doesn't exist is likely to result in either me getting picked apart for a sloppy play( Something you've been witness to often enough) or me making a good one because I felt I had to ( it's not that difficult to make anyone look scummy if you set your mind to it) and getting someone mislynched. | ||
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gumshoe
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Same with toad, his serius change in tone felt abrupt, it felt odd, especially after a very serious scum game, so I tried to think of a motivation for it. I always combine and justify my reads with a combination of substance and meta, the substance provides actus reus , the meta providing men's reus. I fail to see your issue, what's more in past games we've played, you were aware of my lurker meta yet never treated me as hostilely as this. Have I pissed you off somehow? Because you came out of the gates swinging at me ( a target so easy that if I'm not being attacked I'm probably scum) and you haven't stopped, using every bit I post to reinforce your baseless confirmation bias. | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 11:52 Holyflare wrote: So tram, if you can post try hard cases as either alignment, what significant reasoning do we have to believe that you are town this game? Why even post the caveat that you can do that as scum as well? Also what does that mean??? Surely if you made a good one it would be on a scum...? Nothing, honestly I'm just writing down my thoughts, it's not for me to decide if I look townie or not : P ask yourself why I'm saying whatever I say, and if what I'm saying is hurting town. Then decide for yourself what I am, all I'm going to do is respond honestly and write try hard cases as they occur to me, I'm not gonna be making up bullshit to save myself if that's what you expect of me. | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 12:03 WaveofShadow wrote: Oh and by martyr-y post I meant gumshoe's, if that wasn't clear. The over-defensive 'woe is me I'ma get mislynched' I find is usually more likely to come from town (or scum jaybrundage), but yeah, gonna go read a scumgame. Whoa, this shoe has claws. Where do you get confirmation bias from anything I've said? And my 'lurker attack' of you has nothing to do with me coming up with a scumread on you at first that is now threatening to devolve. Please stop talking about how easy of a mislynch you are, because you're just going to make it a self-fulfilling prophecy. And Rayn, as I said before, you don't have marv to back you up here with baseless shit so you're gonna have to try harder than that if you want me to swing this time around. I will talk about how easy a mislynch I am all day everyday, so I can bitch about it later on when I get mislynched XD I see no reason to differentiate myself between games, being consistent overall makes me harder to read, which benefits my overall play, Also last nail bite, I don't like how you came into the game threatening me over my activity and then proceeded to berate me for said play, honestly I feel like you had me as a fixed target no matter what I'd do, and although you claimed to want responses from me you were eager to start pushing me in my brief absence, so that when I did return I would be arguing from lower ground. Very particular of you / : the more I think about it the more I feel like a bump on the agenda. | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 12:11 Holyflare wrote: Just find scum, don't defend! Questions can come later. I'm reading you bastards, not posting unless I have something XD | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 12:10 Mocsta wrote: Guess I was supportive of Gumshoe originally because he gave me confidence at a time I felt I was against everyone active (i.e. Wave + Suki) But in hindsight having read his reasoning for calling me town, its very generic but is written as fact. Similar to how Gumshoe treated my scum claim in GSL (written very factually). Then when reading stuff like the "marketing crap" thats indicative of the type of fluff I took issue with Suki in the first place. The main difference was, Suki could be trolling etc as the post had no direct impact on the game. Whereas gumshoe used the fluff to substantiate a push onto a read. So yes, it is heavily related to the "marketing crap". Regarding the martyr, I dont take value in that. These days, ppl can pull those cards as they please. Having played scum with Gumshoe recently, I know he is self-aware of his meta, so its not out of question that he could play the card as town or scum. As town, if anything I think hes playing the card prematurely. But thats a personal opinion, and not something I would validate towards a read. You misunderstand, my read of you is not similar to the gsl game, it is a product of the gsl game, I feel I have a good grip on your state of mind after it, the way your playing to figure things out and pressure but at the same time adjust your reads, all while doing so in a reasonable manner, is totally opposite from your play in gsl. I cannot reconcile this Mocsta with the one who scum claimed in thread three times while under no pressure whatsoever, if you consider that a "matter of fact read" then what can I say / : I'm pretty much 100 percent sure your town this game, but you might surprise me( I will turn on anyone if they set my imagination on fire) as things stand, I would not be capable of voting for you today. | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
On February 26 2014 12:31 raynpelikoneet wrote: Now this is exactly what gumshoe does. His scumplay is actually far better than his townplay because he realizes what town wants to hear and contributes towards that. As town he makes absolutely awful posts (sorry gumshoe ^^) that might not say anything at all or have one thought which might be "i don't know what X is doing" and there are 1000 words around it that explain his thoguht process and where he found that information that was in the end useless. He literally posts exactly what is in his mind at that time and it ends up in terrible posts that are like the easiest thing ever to attack. Now the green part in the quote makes me 100% sure WaveofShadow knows this. I also went to check on last couple of games where i remember both of gumshoe and Wave being town and gumshoe making his typical posts: Quiet game mini mafia: EOD1, we have outed mafia. gumshoe comes in 20min before the deadline, ignores the outed mafia and makes a hugeass case on Wave. Wave does not even consider gumshoe being mafia, in fact based on his N1 posting he says the opposite. TL Mafia LXIV: gumshoe makes terrible posts on D1 (like "vote me for mayor because i am so bad") and says nothing all D1. Wave never talks about gumshoe on D1, at all. Now both of these games in addition to my first quote from Wave support my argument that Wave knows gumshoe's meta pretty well. However, in this game, here is Wave's reasoning for voting for gumshoe: Here is the post in question: See, a big fucking thought process that ends in somewhat bad conclusion (that really says nothing). Now Wave's reasoning for calling this conclusion scummy is really terrible. First of all there is nothing scummy to not think about a conclusion you didn't think of because... YOU DIDN'T THINK OF IT! Second of all this is all characteristic to gumshoe's townplay, which Wave very well knows taking account he correctly described gumshoe's town!meta earlier on. This case on gumshoe is horrible and is not from a townie Meta flys both ways Rayn, to play devils advocate, as much as I have a habit of shoddy play as town, you have one for lynching me as scum/wrong townie. You are also a fairly terrific player who is aware of his own meta and history, a history in which as scum you destroyed me and as town you were wrong about me. By positioning yourself on my side and smacking my attackers, you lend yourself a silent authority, quietly asserting to the rest of town that your on the right side. Problem is I'm not sure if Wos is scum for his actions. He might just be really frustrated with me(last game we played was a lurk I believe) While I will give you the credit of quickly grasping my townieness in several games, I cant help but feel your posturing is too perfect. Afterall, if I can abuse my meta why cant you? If we assume your scum, this case buys you town rep(defending the meek and pushing bullys) secures a mislynch, makes a potential ally out of me and plays to your meta. It's a far better move than just pushing me as well cause gumshoe. Do you think youd be capable of something like this Rayn? | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 12:47 raynpelikoneet wrote: gumshoe of course i would be capable of doing something like that as scum. However that does not make me mafia. I actually know very well how you post as town and having played with you in GSL as mafia and as we talked in TS during the game i know how you operate as scum. Fair point, any accusation against you is preliminary right now at best. I agree with you WOS's posting is a bit shit, but I think he made some of those posts to get the ball rolling, something he does as town. his behaviour atm is proactive, something I dont want to lose right now, if hes scum hell give us more to work with. | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 13:02 raynpelikoneet wrote: In case is unclear to someone: My case on Wave is that he made a terrible case on gumshoe based on some scenario gumshoe "should have thought about as town" when in fact if he didn't think about it he possibly couldn't have thought about it in the first place. That's making something out of nothing, especially considering how gumshoe posts as town - yes, he makes all sorts of mistakes like this. For reference: In Extractor trick mafia gumshoe has even said "rayn claimed cop as town but not because of what he is saying but because of something else". Yes, that's our gumshoe. <3 Dont hate me cause I'm beautiful : P Is anybody finding Geript really hard to read? His thoughts feel really convoluted, and I really hate stuff like this. Mental note: Rayn and Toad very unlikely to be scum together. This is the opposite of scum hunting, he allows for 1 scum 1 town, 2 town, but not 2 scum. Whenever hes called out on this 'read' he only has to explain why they cant both be scum, not why one of them is, an explanation that really doesnt put him at risk at all, and doesn't help town in almost any way. Later on he gets to do just that. A few things. One is how chummy they are early makes it unlikely they'd be together. Second, Rayn is probably town for his geript cop joke; it took me like 3 minutes to get that one The neutrality of the post also allows him to swing either way as he pleases, he pressures toad(offering no evidence for doing so at the time), but still bothers rayn @Rayn. Your townread on JJD... You got some essplainin to do. (Note, Geript could you go into detail on your jj read?) Also his eventual case on toad is just awful. It's like some of the same reasoning for why I'm still scum on Toad (regarding the JJD comment). Like, Toad hasn't ever said that his townread on you then was baiting and I don't believe his was counter-trolly. So coming from that perspective it feels really odd that his defense of why I'm red on Toad is that post hoc townread on you is because of how you didn't respond to it. I mean your townread on him initially seemed super trolly so no scum would take that seriously for an reason. But the counter townread makes complete sense as scum especially on Rayn who's one of the "names" in this game. Like, apparently it looks like I ignored the millers thing because well, not important; I do understand the miller read which makes me feel better about toad. It's just how it's panning out doesn't feel like town on town to me. Toad is scum because he buddied with Rayn in a trolly way 0_o it's the first hour man, people troll then sober up, besides, do you honestly think Rayn would act oblivious to a scummy Toad just cause he was friendly? Do you think Toad would be dumb enough to ever think that? | ||
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gumshoe
Canada3602 Posts
On February 26 2014 13:17 WaveofShadow wrote: I literally respond to his post here. His response isn't good enough for me on its own, especially because it doesn't address the problem I have with that post of his to begin with. Saying a post is 'crafted' on its own is silly; what would it being a forethought have to say about suki's alignment to begin with, and even then every post is 'crafted' to some degree. I also mention multiple times that I don't appreciate his use of meta here; specifically how he bases his reads heavily on mindset that he believes people should have 'coming off of their last game.' Your vote can stay on me for all I care Rayn, but my vote stays on gumshoe until I feel better about him. Crafted( very deliberate purposeful game call back) but sloppy(easily called out by Mocsta) made me think it was planned in a quick span of time, a mafia role pm would be ample motivation for production of such a rough intro post. The arguments not bad, just not necessarily right, but it is there / : also as for the two options I shoe horned her in, you imply both are bad and serve as a trap, they dont, theres no motivation for trapping her into an answer if those answers arent scummy. I picked those two because they seemed most likely and would provide more discussion than "I'm just having fun". | ||
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gumshoe
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On February 26 2014 13:28 JarJarDrinks wrote: I think my statement is pretty self explainitory. I think it's scummy that gumshoe sheeped mocstas terrible case. Nothing cryptic about it. The suki case was bad. First day man, we bring up bad cases(which they almost all are at this point) then move on or evolve those cases. The only people who are scared of working through possibilities are scum, because it incriminates them and brings town closer to the truth. Also if you want you can sheep wos's complaints with the Suki's case, otherwise back up your declarations of war. | ||
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